Acceptable punishment in crèche?

Murray007

Strangely, we fumed, vented, debated but in the end just didn't allow our son to go to the house again despite their son being one of his good friends. In fact, he still is but their son now always comes to us. We felt it would be water of a ducks back to someone who would do this in the first place if we challenged it. They many times asked for our son to come down to theirs and I hope that they understood why we would not let that happen again. Our son wouldn't go back anyway it effected him so badly.

Chocolate fiend

I could not imagine letting him back into their care tomorrow. Time out is never a good punishment, never, the poor little guy, I would be so upset if he was my little fella. Don't let them get away with it, this is just what you saw, you have no real idea what else has gone on.

dixiefly

Personally, I would be reluctant also without a meeting with the manager and getting an assurance that it wouldnt happen again.

OP, What did yo decide for today?

Sweet Rose

Murray007 wrote: »

I want to give an example of how children can be effected by this kind of thing.

My son was eight, very outgoing and slept out in one of three friends houses at his request at least once a week. He vomited one night at a friend house and wanted to go home. The mother was out in the car collecting teenagers from a disco so the Dad made him go to bed. He vomited again late in the night and asked to go home again, the dad in the house drove him to our house, obviously he was annoyed cause he pulled up at the house, in a very rural area, let him out and drove off. The house lights were all off and it left him in the complete dark. We heard the car pull up and started to get dressed, our son panicked started banging on the front door then the back door and because we were getting dressed headed off in panic to run down the road to make it to the neighbours which is over a mile away. We didn't know who had been at the door and despite being unsettled headed back to bed. The neighbour arrived up a few minutes later with our son.

People do stupid things with others children that they would never do with their own, there is no emotional attachment. My son didn't go out anywhere for three years after that without us. He was socially crippled by it for that period of time. Thank goodness he is now back to his normal self.

It is no small thing what has happened to your son in professional childcare. Treat it in that way. Tell the child care provider and say you will be making a report to the health authority then look for another provider.

What that man did was very wrong but if I had an 8 year son I would not let him stay at his friend's house one night per week! At that age your child should be under the parent's supervision the majority of time, outside of school and clubs.

SusieBlue

Sweet Rose wrote: »

What that man did was very wrong but if I had an 8 year son I would not let him stay at his friend's house one night per week! At that age your child should be under the parent's supervision the majority of time, outside of school and clubs.

But he was under his parents care the majority of the time, 6 evenings out of 7 he was at home, no?

Things like that should be decided on a case by case basis, making blanket statements like that about 8 year olds is ridiculous, especially when you don't even know the 8 year old in question.

For example, at 12 years old, the idea of a weekly sleepover with a friend would have me in a cold sweat. My 7 year old niece would jump at the chance because she is far more confident, self assured, and outgoing than I was at 12 years old. It all depends on the child. Certainly, some 8 year old's wouldn't be able for a weekly sleepover, but I know plenty who would.

No harm in an 8 year old spending an evening a week with his buddy. There are far worse things he could be upto. :rolleyes:

Sweet Rose

WhiteRoses wrote: »

But he was under his parents care the majority of the time, 6 evenings out of 7 he was at home, no?

Things like that should be decided on a case by case basis, making blanket statements like that about 8 year olds is ridiculous, especially when you don't even know the 8 year old in question.

For example, at 12 years old, the idea of a weekly sleepover with a friend would have me in a cold sweat. My 7 year old niece would jump at the chance because she is far more confident, self assured, and outgoing than I was at 12 years old. It all depends on the child. Certainly, some 8 year old's wouldn't be able for a weekly sleepover, but I know plenty who would.

No harm in an 8 year old spending an evening a week with his buddy. There are far worse things he could be upto. :rolleyes:

I would never trust anyone outside of my family to care for my child for a night on a weekly basis.

What exactly are they up to or who are they in contact with? You don't have a clue because you're not with them. What happens if the child gets sick, as above? Who looks after them? Are they looking up stuff on the Internet unsupervised? What films/music are they watching/listening to? Are they at home or out somewhere else? What kind of food are they eating?

That's a whole lot of trust to place in someone.

I've been around enough children in my job to know what kind of things goes on at sleepovers these days.

I'm the parent so I'll parent, that's the role I took on. It's not up to my child to choose what she wants to do at that age.

Sleepovers can happen with trusted family members or way down the track when she has a lot more sense!

JimiTime

I often wonder if there will be consequences in years to come in terms of Children being raised in childcare facilities. I have friends who drop their children off at 8am and don't pick them up until 6pm. Kids are then in bed by 8. What a horrible circumstance for both the children and the parents. I think its horrible that someone would choose that for themselves and their children IF they have an alternative, and I think its horrible also when parents feel that there is no alternative but to do it YOu can be as professional and by the book as they come, but you wont substitude a parents love and concern.

m'lady

Sweet Rose wrote: »

I would never trust anyone outside of my family to care for my child for a night on a weekly basis.

What exactly are they up to or who are they in contact with? You don't have a clue because you're not with them. What happens if the child gets sick, as above? Who looks after them? Are they looking up stuff on the Internet unsupervised? What films/music are they watching/listening to? Are they at home or out somewhere else? What kind of food are they eating?

That's a whole lot of trust to place in someone.

I've been around enough children in my job to know what kind of things goes on at sleepovers these days.

I'm the parent so I'll parent, that's the role I took on. It's not up to my child to choose what she wants to do at that age.

Sleepovers can happen with trusted family members or way down the track when she has a lot more sense!

What kind of things do you think go on at these sleep overs? I'm interested to know.

My daughter would have a friend over or stay in a friends at any given opportunity if I allowed it, however when these sleepovers do happen they eat popcorn, watch (an appropriate) movie and have a giggle, and likewise if she stays in her friends.
Am I worried or concerned when she goes on a sleepover? No, because I know the parents of her friends and trust them, and they trust me, I also trust my daughters judgement.
The majority of my friends and I did it when we were younger and had innocent fun.

Why the sinister slant on something that most kids do and most adults have very fond memories of?

Sorry as I know this post is off topic but I felt the need to comment.

SusieBlue

Sweet Rose wrote: »

I would never trust anyone outside of my family to care for my child for a night on a weekly basis.

What exactly are they up to or who are they in contact with? You don't have a clue because you're not with them. What happens if the child gets sick, as above? Who looks after them? Are they looking up stuff on the Internet unsupervised? What films/music are they watching/listening to? Are they at home or out somewhere else? What kind of food are they eating?

That's a whole lot of trust to place in someone.

I've been around enough children in my job to know what kind of things goes on at sleepovers these days.

I'm the parent so I'll parent, that's the role I took on. It's not up to my child to choose what she wants to do at that age.

Sleepovers can happen with trusted family members or way down the track when she has a lot more sense!

It is obviously your prerogative not to allow your children take part in sleepovers but that doesn't mean they are unsafe or detrimental for ALL children.

Sleepovers can go wrong as highlighted in the case made by PP but that doesn't mean that no sleepovers should ever happen again for any children, just in case. It was one isolated case, no need for them to be banned forever.

Age appropriateness is the key point here, as I said already. Some 8 year olds wouldn't be mature or confident enough to have a sleepover at that age, but many would. Hence I said it should be decided on a case by case basis, depending on the child. Not your blanket statement of "no 8 year old in the whole world should be allowed spend a night away from their family".

I don't think anyone here is suggesting we all send our children off with random strangers to an unknown destination, getting up to god knows what. I would have presumed anyone here talking about childhood sleepovers would have a rapport with the other set of parents, have contact details, and have established a level of trust before leaving their child in their care.

You are making what is a very normal, positive childhood experience out to be some form of dangerous torture for the child.

LegacyUser

Working in a creche myself, I think people here need to realise that your child in a creche is just another child. We will generally do whatever it takes for an easy day and if a child is being disruptive, then this may happen.

No one will care about your children as much as you do, sad but true.

I don't have children yet, but I will be looking after them myself for certain.

Sweet Rose

I never said I was against sleepovers, I just think that at 8 years old, sleepovers on a weekly basis is just ridiculous. Not to mention unfair on the hosting family every single week. It would take a lot for me to trust another person to look after my daughter that much especially at such a young age. Not to mention I wouldn't be giving my daughter over every single week at what must be weekends as I would want to spend the time with her then.

pwurple

Sweet Rose wrote: »

I never said I was against sleepovers, I just think that at 8 years old, sleepovers on a weekly basis is just ridiculous. Not to mention unfair on the hosting family every single week. It would take a lot for me to trust another person to look after my daughter that much especially at such a young age. Not to mention I wouldn't be giving my daughter over every single week at what must be weekends as I would want to spend the time with her then.

I think the child was going to a different friend each week, like a rotating thing.

lazygal

JimiTime wrote: »

I often wonder if there will be consequences in years to come in terms of Children being raised in childcare facilities. I have friends who drop their children off at 8am and don't pick them up until 6pm. Kids are then in bed by 8. What a horrible circumstance for both the children and the parents. I think its horrible that someone would choose that for themselves and their children IF they have an alternative, and I think its horrible also when parents feel that there is no alternative but to do it YOu can be as professional and by the book as they come, but you wont substitude a parents love and concern.

I have loving parents who placed me in a creche over 30 years ago, followed by my sister. My husband was also raised by two parents who worked outside the home. Children being minded by others is not an odd, new concept. Maria Montessori started out her practice of early childhood education because she wanted to improve the lot of women who worked outside the home and paid others to mind their children.
I think its horrible to expect that a man or a woman should have to stay at home, regardless of their own feelings and thoughts on whether that's right for them. I and my husband are better parents because we work outside the home. I feel I got the best of both worlds growing up, some independence from being cared for by others and supportive parents at home who could afford some of the things we wouldn't have had otherwise, such as music and dance lessons.
We are not substituting our love and concern for our children to the person who cares for them. We are still their parents, we will decide where the go to school, what we feed them, what method of discipline we employ and how we raise them to be productive members of society. Me and my husband can be good parents and work outside the home, as our parents were.

Hannibal Smith

crecheworker1981 wrote: »

Working in a creche myself, I think people here need to realise that your child in a creche is just another child. We will generally do whatever it takes for an easy day and if a child is breing disruptive, then this may happen.

No one will care about your children as much as you do, sad but true.

I don't have children yet, but I will be looking after them myself for certain.

Why on earth would someone open a childcare facility, or even go into childcare as a career if you want an easy day? Surely you go through enough training and child development education to know that not every child is going to follow the rules and there will be days where they will act up?

I can understand a creche having some sort of a discipline policy, you can't have kids thinking they can push each other, but leaving a kid on its own when its getting dark and crying is just so uncaring and cold.

lazygal

crecheworker1981 wrote: »

Working in a creche myself, I think people here need to realise that your child in a creche is just another child. We will generally do whatever it takes for an easy day and if a child is being disruptive, then this may happen.

No one will care about your children as much as you do, sad but true.

I don't have children yet, but I will be looking after them myself for certain.

Can you PM me the name of the place you work? I want to avoid using anywhere that the staff describe their jobs in such a cold and negative way.

abff

crecheworker1981 wrote: »

Working in a creche myself, I think people here need to realise that your child in a creche is just another child. We will generally do whatever it takes for an easy day and if a child is being disruptive, then this may happen.

No one will care about your children as much as you do, sad but true.

I don't have children yet, but I will be looking after them myself for certain.

If that's the way you feel about your job, maybe you're in the wrong job. Does your employer know how you feel and is that attitude prevalent among your fellow workers?

monflat

crecheworker1981 wrote: »

Working in a creche myself, I think people here need to realise that your child in a creche is just another child. We will generally do whatever it takes for an easy day and if a child is being disruptive, then this may happen.

No one will care about your children as much as you do, sad but true.

I don't have children yet, but I will be looking after them myself for certain.

You love your job anyways....
Maybe you should consider to work away from human being s????

Such a caring compassionate statement...



You do whatever it takes for an easy day.........

Do you realise parents pay thousands a year to have their children minded.
And who also keep you in a job. But with an attitude like that you be better off doing nothing because that's what you want " an easy life "

Penny Tration

crecheworker1981 wrote: »

Working in a creche myself, I think people here need to realise that your child in a creche is just another child. We will generally do whatever it takes for an easy day and if a child is being disruptive, then this may happen.

No one will care about your children as much as you do, sad but true.

I don't have children yet, but I will be looking after them myself for certain.

What you're saying goes completely against what you learn doing childcare in college. I hope to god no kids I know are in your creche.

abff

I've just noticed that crecheworker1981 logged in as a guest. I think we need to take what was posted with a grain of salt.

monflat

So as not to derail the thread

How did op get on approaching management?

LegacyUser

Sorry to reiterate but I'm a former crèche worker and I can verify everything the other poster has said is true. I don't have an account but I'm a frequent reader and felt compelled to comment.

Working with numerous children all day every day is immensely stressful and it's only human to cut corners sometimes to make your working day easier. Not a nice thing for a parent to hear but the honest truth is it's not all Mary Poppins day in, day out.

I'm sure a lot of parents would be surprised to know what really goes on all the time. Nothing horrific/neglectful (in my experience) thankfully but far, far from what would be considered best practice and what is presented to parents every evening. Just enough for me to know I would live on beans before leaving my own daughter in a crèche. A harsh statement but true nonetheless.

On the other hand, I think it's unfair and hypocritical for a parent to expect somebody else to give their everything to your child if you can't even give it yourself. You might argue that you pay a lot of money to your childcare facility but the person minding your child only receives a minimum wage.

Would you exhaust yourself mentally, emotionally and physically every day for 9 quid an hour? Because that's how I felt before I quit at the crèche I worked in last year. Créches have a huge staff turnover for a reason.

The main reason being that it's not easy to work with demanding children every day. If it was, more parents would be doing everything they could to ensure they raise their children themselves as opposed to someone just trying to make a living and get through their day.

indigo twist

crecheworker1981 wrote: »

Working in a creche myself, I think people here need to realise that your child in a creche is just another child. We will generally do whatever it takes for an easy day and if a child is being disruptive, then this may happen.

No one will care about your children as much as you do, sad but true.

I don't have children yet, but I will be looking after them myself for certain.

The bolded part. Please do not say "we", as though you're speaking on behalf of childcare workers in general. It is an insult to all of the wonderful committed professional childcare workers out there.

Just to counter your post: I have many family members and close friends who work in different areas of childcare - au pairs, creche workers, montessori workers, childminders, etc. From knowing them, and from knowing their circles of friends and colleagues in similar roles, it's just lovely to see how overwhelmingly passionate they are about their career.

I know creche workers who regularly meet up in groups in their spare time to prepare artwork projects etc and share ideas. They are constantly looking for imaginative new ways to entertain "their" children. They are members of Irish childcare/montessori/creche groups for Irish people, which exist just so that the teachers and carers can share ideas and experiences. When I meet these people, they are full of stories and anecdotes about the children in their care. Listening to them and seeing how enthusiastic they are about their jobs is really inspiring - and also comforting to me, as I have a child in an (excellent) creche.

You really need to reconsider your career, as I'm pretty much certain childcare is not for you. There are loads of jobs out there where you're only expected to do the minimum and tick boxes - and these jobs are paid just as well (if not better) than childcare. You are clearly not suited for childcare, and I'm pretty sure that, having read your post, very few (if any) parents here would be happy to leave their child in your care. Thankfully you are, I believe, in a small minority. No one works in childcare for the money, so those not passionate about the work do usually move on quite quickly.

Would you be happy to have, say, a medical professional, who would take shortcuts and go for the lazy option, for the sake of a "lazy day"? Would you be happy for you or a family member to be in their care? There are certain professions that require people skills and compassion and a genuine interest in the field. Childcare is certainly one of these.

You say that you'd look after your own children yourself, if you ever have any. But really, you're working full time in childcare yourself, and obviously dislike it. What makes you think being a stay-at-home parent (one of the most challenging jobs, and certainly not for everyone) would be any more enjoyable to you? Even if it's your own child, it's still the same work you'd be doing ... if you'd take shortcuts for a "easy day" now, do you really think your (future) child is better off in your care full-time?

I'm just amazed that someone in your position and with your attitude would even consider being a stay-at-home parent! It makes no sense to me.

byhookorbycrook

crecheworker1981 wrote: »

Working in a creche myself, I think people here need to realise that your child in a creche is just another child. We will generally do whatever it takes for an easy day and if a child is being disruptive, then this may happen.

No one will care about your children as much as you do, sad but true.

I don't have children yet, but I will be looking after them myself for certain.

I hope this is a troll. as a primary teacher I am HORRIFIED.

abff

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

I hope this is a troll. as a primary teacher I am HORRIFIED.

I'm pretty sure it is. One post as a guest and never heard from again.

zefer

crecheworker1981 wrote: »

Working in a creche myself, I think people here need to realise that your child in a creche is just another child. We will generally do whatever it takes for an easy day and if a child is being disruptive, then this may happen.

No one will care about your children as much as you do, sad but true.

I don't have children yet, but I will be looking after them myself for certain.

You don't deserve to have kids with an attitude like that. You are an absolute disgrace.
The girls in creche where my son goes are the nicest, most caring, dedicated people. They hug and kiss the kids as if they are their own and the kids love being there. I really really hope this poster is a troll

ene

i am really upset this thread has turned into a troll... i have been thinking about the op all day wondering has this been resolved!

hope your child is ok!

sari

I think that childcare worker post is a troll too but honestly how many of you at work will cut corners to make your day easier? It happens in all lines of work, your having a bad day, tired, fed up, stress at home etc etc and you will do things at work to make your day easier. To think that this never happens in childcare is pretty niave. I would say that working in a creche would be very emotionally, physically and mentally draining job. Parents will know how tough it can be, parents with multiple children know even more, now imagine you are in a room of 10+ kids a day all say, imagine how tough that it can be so to me it's no wonder issues like the ops happen. I'm not condoning it or saying it's acceptable but I'm just saying it's not surprising. I mean really are you really so shocked that stuff like this happens?
OP hope you got on well at creche and that your lo is OK. It can't be easy to have to worry about the care of your child while you are at work.

rainemac

But putting the child inside when hitting, to me, under no supervision isnt making life easier or cutting corners (i would be worried and stressed about said child being alone) cutting corners in childcare is perhaps not doing an afternoon activity and letting them free play for the afternoon. I would not want people reading this thinking it happens in all creches, never would my creche that i work in put a child in danger like this or neglect a child.

LegacyUser

indigo twist wrote: »

I'm just amazed that someone in your position and with your attitude would even consider being a stay-at-home parent! It makes no sense to me.

In fairness, how you feel about your own children is very different to how you feel about other people's. I love my two but I am indifferent to all others.

Hannibal Smith

sari wrote: »

I think that childcare worker post is a troll too but honestly how many of you at work will cut corners to make your day easier? It happens in all lines of work, your having a bad day, tired, fed up, stress at home etc etc and you will do things at work to make your day easier. To think that this never happens in childcare is pretty niave. I would say that working in a creche would be very emotionally, physically and mentally draining job. Parents will know how tough it can be, parents with multiple children know even more, now imagine you are in a room of 10+ kids a day all say, imagine how tough that it can be so to me it's no wonder issues like the ops happen. I'm not condoning it or saying it's acceptable but I'm just saying it's not surprising. I mean really are you really so shocked that stuff like this happens?
OP hope you got on well at creche and that your lo is OK. It can't be easy to have to worry about the care of your child while you are at work.

Yeah I am shocked when this happens. Its not naive. You pay for child CARE the least you can expect is the care part.