Dog ate poop, puked it up and ate it again?????

ShaShaBear

I have literally never had to deal with this before. No idea how he did it or where he got it. We pick up after him in the garden and he is well fed (we have him on Burns puppy (chicken and rice) and I would have imagined it nutritious enough? I let him out at 6.30 this morning, he was only out for about 2 minutes, and then I took him back upstairs. He started gagging, and then puked up an entirely undigested, perfectly-formed poop.
And to make matters worse, as I jumped out of bed to clean it up, he wolfed it back down like he was afraid I would take it off him? (We're working on this with food possessiveness).

Any ideas why he might have eaten it? He's had accidents in the house and not eaten his own poop, and we only cleaned the garden yesterday so there is none of our foster dog's poop left lying about... too big for a cat!

looking_around

I've seen dogs eat poop before. and it's quite common for them to eat what they've thrown up.

don't ask me why, I'm sure someone else with explain that, I just wanted to reassure you it's probably ok, and just try and watch that he doesn't find other poop to eat.

minipink

Are you sure it's his poop (I'm not sure how you would be)As a puppy, Lola used to think that Rio our cat was leaving her luxurious truffles if you get my drift. Maybe he picked up some cat poop in the garden from during the night. For lola, we caught her in the act and told her no and that was that she no longer is tempted by truffle de Rio

ShaShaBear

minipink wrote: »

Are you sure it's his poop (I'm not sure how you would be)As a puppy, Lola used to think that Rio our cat was leaving her luxurious truffles if you get my drift. Maybe he picked up some cat poop in the garden from during the night. For lola, we caught her in the act and told her no and that was that she no longer is tempted by truffle de Rio

Oh I'm assuming it's his poop, what I mean is that we don't leave it outside (pick up as he goes) and we know it isn't a cat's because of the size and we know it isn't the foster dog's as we cleaned up the yard after she left. He was inside all night so I can only assume he pooped, ate it, and then got sick. What I'm wondering about is why, since we dont and have never punished him for accidents in the house. He's receiving what I assume to be adequate nutrition so I don't think it's that. The real weird thing is how he wolfed it down to stop me from taking it off him!!

thegreatiam

Ive heard, but have never investigated the facts, that dog (and other animals) eat their own poop because their digestive system isn't that effective. So they are often inclined to run it through the process twice. so even though they get good food in they instinctively eat it twice to make sure they get as much as they can.

Just something someone told me as a kid when our dog went to town on his 2nd lunch of the day, so i dont know how true it is.

odckdo

Hopefully it is a once off with your pup.

I used to feed my dogs Burns and two of them would eat the other dogs poo. Since I changed brand this has stopped.

Off lead along the canal sometimes another dog would tuck into a sloppy poo if I wasn't watching. As I was cursing him I wondered if it was a lower quality food with high cereal content?

Burns has over 60% rice if that was the cause. Though it probably differs between dogs and there are loads of dogs on Burns without any problems.

keno-daytrader

Might be time to worm also, if you havent recently.

secman

Our daughter has a cross between a schitzu and a beigon, (excuse my spellings here) and he eats his poo too, apparently those breeds are prone to doing so. The food passes through them that quickly it still smells of food..... apparently !

And excuse the pun on schitzu !

DBB

Coprophagia, aka poop eating, can have a number of causes, someimes interlinked. To the dog, it's normal enough behaviour. But that's not much consolation to us!
Some of the factors that cause it:
Copying mother when she was cleaning up after the pups.
An inadequate diet... Sorry SSB, I know there are huge Burns fans here, but I don't rate it at all. There was a time it was one of the best, but it has been far, far eclipsed by better, more nutritious foods. High carbs are implicated in coprophagia, and Burns is stuffed with carbs.
A malabsorption problem... Your vet will help you with this.
Hunger... Unlikely in his case, but maybe as he ate it early in the morning he hadn't been fed yet? So maybe it's a factor?
Boredom... Again, maybe he was awake for a while and looking for something to do?
Previous punishment.. maybe wherever he came from had people who were rough on the pups when they pooped.

Dogs who resource guard their food will often guard their vomit, because it's the next best thing to a food item.
There are a few ways of dealing with it, some more effective than others.
Some people add pineapple or courgette to the diet... This works occasionally, but I would not be relying on it. Others have had success by spiking the fresh poop with Tabasco, but dogs get wise to this very quickly, often smelling which poops smell Tabasco-y and those which don't!
Teach a leave it cue, and supervise him relentlessly when he has any opportunity to poop. When he poops, ask him to leave it, then call him back to you really excitedly, for a lovely treat.
But my own first action would he a diet change. Get rid of cereals, and try to get more fresh meat into him too.
This, in combination with the distraction training above, tend to work well, though some owners have to use a muzzle for a while too.

ShaShaBear

Thanks DBB, seeing someone else had the same problem with Burns, so glad I bought the wee small bag to try out! I'll switch to something else! I'm not exactly sure it was boredom as he had been sound asleep in the bed when I woke. I'd be inclined to think diet as this is the first time he's done it, and he has had accidents and has never done it!

DBB

Oh! One more thing to be aware of. If he thinks he's going to get a game of chasing out of you when he does it, this may sustain the behaviour. That's one reason why using the leave it, followed by return to you, is a better option

ShaShaBear

DBB wrote: »

Oh! One more thing to be aware of. If he thinks he's going to get a game of chasing out of you when he does it, this may sustain the behaviour. That's one reason why using the leave it, followed by return to you, is a better option

We're actually just pricing the Taste of the Wild puppy food! €60 would be a *bit* on the steep side, he should be getting about 1.5 cups a day on that - any idea how much that is in grams (for anyone that has used it?). Just trying to compare and work out how long we would get out of the bag!

DBB

ShaShaBear wrote: »

We're actually just pricing the Taste of the Wild puppy food! €60 would be a *bit* on the steep side, he should be getting about 1.5 cups a day on that - any idea how much that is in grams (for anyone that has used it?). Just trying to compare and work out how long we would get out of the bag!

I buy it on the two bag deal on zooplus.de, it costs just about €50 that way.
I feed it to one of my GSDs, she's 27kg and gets 3 teacups per day... I'll weigh that for you later so you know what that equates to

ShaShaBear

DBB wrote: »

I buy it on the two bag deal on zooplus.de, it costs just about €50 that way.
I feed it to one of my GSDs, she's 27kg and gets 3 teacups per day... I'll weigh that for you later so you know what that equates to

Thanks, just trying to get an idea of value and regularity of purchase if you get me. I loved it (it actually smelled delicious) and I remember Shadow literally adored it. Is there anything a tad lower in price that might be around the same in quality? (We couldn't afford to order two bags in one go )

DBB

Ok, my small GSD is putting on weight being fed 300-350g per day. So a 13.6kg bag lasts 40-45 days for my very active 27kg dog.
The two bag deal offers a good chunk of a discount, one single bag will set you back €57ish. Not sure how that compares with Burns. But I suspect you'd have to feed more Burns to sustain weight.

ShaShaBear

DBB wrote: »

Ok, my small GSD is putting on weight being fed 300-350g per day. So a 13.6kg bag lasts 40-45 days for my very active 27kg dog.
The two bag deal offers a good chunk of a discount, one single bag will set you back €57ish. Not sure how that compares with Burns. But I suspect you'd have to feed more Burns to sustain weight.

Just looking at JWB as well, bit lower in price and I've heard it's quite good? I was maintaining Shadow's weight on 230g a day of TotW so the bag lasted us about 60 days. Obviously I don't know this lad's grown weight, he's already as big as Shadow was fully grown and he's only 14 weeks

DBB

Yes, my little fusspot spaniel x is on cereal-free JWB, she really likes it, and my Sheps love it as treats!
Though kilo for kilo it comes in at about the same price as TOTW, as the bags contain only 10kg, compared to TOTW's 13.6kg

tk123

DBB wrote: »

Dogs who resource guard their food will often guard their vomit, because it's the next best thing to a food item.

Yep Bailey's guards his puke >_< It can be challenging...not to mention dangerous when we're trying to get him away from whatever's making him sick before he eats it again and get's sick again...and again. I can usually trade him for something raw/tasty like a neck but we have to be really careful - especially since Lucy came along!

ShaShaBear

Well we watched him like a hawk on his potty outings and can safely say he isn't eating it outside. But he puked it up again this morning! Which only leaves that he is doing it in our bedroom at night. Which baffles me, as he gets his last feed at 6, gets a 20 minute walk about half an hour after it (and can poop two or three times on that walk) and obviously still gets out 5 or 6 times before we go to bed. We don't give him any snacks or scraps so I'm wondering how on earth he still has the ability to poop in the room (it had to have been after 4am and before 6.30am when he woke me up to be let outside).

Now I have to wonder if I can even honestly say that he is accident-free in the house and if he constantly eats it!

maggiepip

That seems a bit odd, are you certain its poo hes eating at all? I would have thought if he was eating it he would be eating some out in the garden as well.

ShaShaBear

maggiepip wrote: »

That seems a bit odd, are you certain its poo hes eating at all? I would have thought if he was eating it he would be eating some out in the garden as well.

It's without question poo, the smell gives it away, but without being too graphic it comes out of his mouth perfectly formed, as it would out of his bottom. There's no mistaking it!

I'm wondering if it really is the food at all, and it's the free range and boredom at night giving him nothing to do but poop and eat it? We're picking up a crate from Argos either Monday or Tuesday, so that will help narrow it down I hope!

maggiepip

If hes eating it though how can it be coming back up fully formed? Would it not be vomited back up mushy, unless hes swallowing it whole, which is a bit unlikely? (sorry!) Im just wondering there couldn't be some other problem could there?

ShaShaBear

maggiepip wrote: »

If hes eating it though how can it be coming back up fully formed? Would it not be vomited back up mushy, unless hes swallowing it whole, which is a bit unlikely? (sorry!) Im just wondering there couldn't be some other problem could there?

Well there was a teeny bit of mush this morning, but yesterday morning it was fully formed. I cant possibly think what else would come up looking like that. And it smells EXACTLY like his actual poop, which is even more curious. He's not in the slightest bit out of form, still fully alert and with a great appetite. The only reason I could think for it coming up solid is if he ate it very shortly before he puked it up, and it didn't get a change to digest at all?

maggiepip

Yeah possibly, Im sure if he seems bright and is eating and toileting normally hes grand, and thats just what hes doing. I have read that a dog who vomits poo could have an internal blockage, but I would imagine if that was the case the dog would also be very ill and have other symptoms alongside, so Im sure that rules that out!! My collie was a bigtime poo eater when we adopted her and , in agreement with what dbb said, it stopped when I put her on a high quality grain free diet. I had actually changed her diet due to her sensitive tummy but the ceasing of poo snacking was an added bonus!

Nody

ShaShaBear wrote: »

Thanks, just trying to get an idea of value and regularity of purchase if you get me. I loved it (it actually smelled delicious) and I remember Shadow literally adored it. Is there anything a tad lower in price that might be around the same in quality? (We couldn't afford to order two bags in one go )

Markus Muhle Black Angus junior comes close; has some grain but relatively limited and it's a bit over 1 EUR / kg less. Nutrivet Instinct Growth is in between the two in price and is completly grain free.

DBB

It may be coming back up fully formed if he's gulping it down in one go.
He poops 2 or 3 times on walks? Really?! And presumably he poops once or twice more during the day? That's a LOT of pooping!
I think you need to start videoing him to try to get to grips with what's going on here. I'd worry that he'll poop in his crate and eat it in there anyway. I'd also be tempted to stick a half buster collar on him, so that there's a "shelf" under his chin but it's not too intrusive, to stop him getting access to his poops. That might just tell the tale!
Obviously there is a chance he's a closet poop eater, and if he is that'll have to be addressed.

tk123

Have you a camera that you could record him with? Even a laptop/ipad etc would do it..although you may need to need a light on? You could either have him on continuous record or install an app that records when it detects movement. I observed Lucy one night with a webcam just taking photos to find out if she was sliding down on top of Bailey during the night and making him get up... The photos I ended up with were hilarious lol

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=90451933&postcount=8663

ShaShaBear

DBB wrote: »

It may be coming back up fully formed if he's gulping it down in one go.
He poops 2 or 3 times on walks? Really?! And presumably he poops once or twice more during the day? That's a LOT of pooping!
I think you need to start videoing him to try to get to grips with what's going on here. I'd worry that he'll poop in his crate and eat it in there anyway. I'd also be tempted to stick a half buster collar on him, so that there's a "shelf" under his chin but it's not too intrusive, to stop him getting access to his poops. That might just tell the tale!
Obviously there is a chance he's a closet poop eater, and if he is that'll have to be addressed.

Yep, he usually goes in the morning after his first feed (usually about half an hour after as I get him to play for a bit to get him moving). Sometimes he doesn't go after the second feed and waits till after the third. I was hoping that would change with the food, but so far it hasn't. I couldn't record him, we don't have any of that fancy-smanshy stuff But in any case, couldn't leave a light on as the baby sleeps in the room with us, and he is in his bed on the floor beside us
I'm a very light sleeper, even more so since Abi was born, so I'm guessing (and I can only guess) that he isn't making much of a rucus when he does it. If I brought his last feed back a bit, do you think that might help ensure he is empty?

Mr_Red

Dogs tend to eat cat poop

ShaShaBear

Mr_Red wrote: »

Dogs tend to eat cat poop

Trust me, it 'aint cat poop :pac:

Mr_Red

Lion , Tiger?

lol