ICT Specialists (Executive Officer level) in Civil Service

2RockMountain · 07-09-2016 8:59pm

Chris24567890 wrote: »

Do you what legislation covers this? I am in a similar position, I have 10 years service in the Defence Forces and placed well in the top 10 on the Dublin Infrastructure Panel.

If service doesn't carry when considering pay, then unfortunately for me this would be a deal breaker!!

Update: ht*tp://hr.per.gov.ie/starting-pay-on-recruitment/ ....interesting
[remove the star, wouldn't let me post links]

Thanks, that's very clear, and in line with my understanding posted above - here's the full link;

http://hr.per.gov.ie/starting-pay-on-recruitment/

xECompanyx · 07-09-2016 10:30pm

Calina wrote: »

ITguru wrote: »

So before a dept offer a job to a candidate, they would go through the CV of the candidate and see whether he or she fits in?

I'm not sure how they do it because I have never been that side. Only that I anecdotally people have in two departments at least been siphoned in a directon that fits their background.

Suitably for the role/job is a huge new venture in my Dept. as part of the Civil Service Renewal plan

TestLink · 08-09-2016 12:21pm

May I know which all departments recruit candidates from this ICT panel?

xECompanyx · 08-09-2016 12:28pm

ITguru wrote: »

May I know which all departments recruit candidates from this ICT panel?

Only PAS can answer that I'd imagine but down my neck of the woods, DPER, Revenue, Justice come to mind..

Murzo · 08-09-2016 12:35pm

Public service is not recognised by Civil service. That's definite.

Murzo · 08-09-2016 12:43pm

Anyone any idea how many they will recruit regionally....is there a drive on to get the civil service more digitalised. I hope this panel is well utilised....and not just an exercise to waste people's time.

2RockMountain · 08-09-2016 12:53pm

Murzo wrote: »

Public service is not recognised by Civil service. That's definite.

Did you bother to read the D.PER ruling linked above?

TestLink · 08-09-2016 12:53pm

The msg I got from Public Jobs mentions that , everyone on Dublin ICT panel would get a job. I dont know what is the case with Regional panel.

TestLink · 08-09-2016 12:56pm

When you say Regional, is it only Leinster?

Would there be recruitment to Dublin from the Regional panel or all counties except Dublin?

IloveIT · 08-09-2016 1:44pm

Did anyone get an offer yet ?

crossbeauty · 08-09-2016 2:12pm

ITguru wrote: »

When you say Regional, is it only Leinster?

Would there be recruitment to Dublin from the Regional panel or all counties except Dublin?

Regional = other counties outside Dublin are split into Regions. I think there's around 12 eg Sligo/Leitrim/Longford is Region 12. Region 11 is Kerry.

not sure of them all off the top of my head.

Murzo · 08-09-2016 2:46pm

Sorry just read it....They used NOT recognise public service but that has obviously changed.

2RockMountain wrote: »

Did you bother to read the D.PER ruling linked above?

Sup08 · 08-09-2016 3:29pm

2RockMountain wrote: »

Did you bother to read the D.PER ruling linked above?

I see it has changed and I am now wondering can my service be applied retrospective of this ruling. I hope so!!

kerberos2506 · 09-09-2016 10:16am

In my message it said ' everyone on Dublin ICT panel would get a job ', can anyone fill me in on this, as it was only one interview and they come out with this.

Dothehustle · 09-09-2016 10:48am

kerberos2506 wrote: »

In my message it said ' everyone on Dublin ICT panel would get a job ', can anyone fill me in on this, as it was only one interview and they come out with this.

That's the process finished they will take people in order of the merit.. They must have a bit of demand to guarantee everyone on the panel a job . Might move quite quick

2RockMountain · 09-09-2016 2:27pm

Sup08 wrote: »

I see it has changed and I am now wondering can my service be applied retrospective of this ruling. I hope so!!

Probably not - unless your appointment came after the date of the circular.

Sup08 · 09-09-2016 2:36pm

2RockMountain wrote: »

Probably not - unless your appointment came after the date of the circular.

I don't think departments would be allowed, by CPSU, to overlook a new entrant to the civil service with some previous public service bypass an existing civil servants pay-scale, when the existing civil servant that may have had more service than the new entrant should this be applied retrospective.

2RockMountain · 09-09-2016 3:28pm

Sup08 wrote: »

I don't think departments would be allowed, by CPSU, to overlook a new entrant to the civil service with some previous public service bypass an existing civil servants pay-scale, when the existing civil servant that may have had more service than the new entrant should this be applied retrospective.

Honestly, I'm confused by this. Would you like to spell it out with an example perhaps?

xECompanyx · 09-09-2016 3:38pm

2RockMountain wrote: »

Sup08 wrote: »

I don't think departments would be allowed, by CPSU, to overlook a new entrant to the civil service with some previous public service bypass an existing civil servants pay-scale, when the existing civil servant that may have had more service than the new entrant should this be applied retrospective.

Honestly, I'm confused by this. Would you like to spell it out with an example perhaps?

This is what I take from it. A new entrant with a lot of public service experience would not be allowed to pass existing civil servants on the payscale. E.g. I'm 6 years in the CS and Joe Bloggs who started last week in the same grade as me is suddenly on a higher point than me on the payscale. I'm in the CS 17 years and I have never come across that scenario.

Sup08 · 09-09-2016 3:39pm

Civil Servant 1 has 5 full years previous Public Service and 2 years Civil Service and is on pay-scale 2, as they joined civil service before the DPER announcement.

Civil Servant 2 has 3 full years previous public Service and joined Civil Service in January 2016 they would be on pay-scale 4.

Civil Servant 1 (PS) 5 + (CS) 2 = 7 years total but on Pay-scale 2
Civil Servant 2 (PS) 3 + (CS) 1 = 4 Years total but on Pay-scale 4, 2 years on the officer with more total service.

Somehow I can't see that being a runner with the CPSU.

Sup08 · 09-09-2016 3:47pm

Anyway that was getting a little away from the thread topic, although very useful for some people joining the Civil Service from Public.

Has anyone had any offer from either stream yet?

2RockMountain · 09-09-2016 3:47pm

xECompanyx wrote: »

This is what I take from it. A new entrant with a lot of public service experience would not be allowed to pass existing civil servants on the payscale. E.g. I'm 6 years in the CS and Joe Bloggs who started last week in the same grade as me is suddenly on a higher point than me on the payscale. I'm in the CS 17 years and I have never come across that scenario.

Sup08 wrote: »

Civil Servant 1 has 5 full years previous Public Service and 2 years Civil Service and is on pay-scale 2, as they joined civil service before the DPER announcement.

Civil Servant 2 has 3 full years previous public Service and joined Civil Service in January 2016 they would be on pay-scale 4.

Civil Servant 1 (PS) 5 + (CS) 2 = 7 years total but on Pay-scale 2
Civil Servant 2 (PS) 3 + (CS) 1 = 4 Years total but on Pay-scale 4, 2 years on the officer with more total service.

Somehow I can't see that being a runner with the CPSU.

Thanks for the clarifications and I get your point, though I disagree with it. Why do you see public service experience as some way inferior to CS?

If the CPSU have an issue with the circular, they need to take to PER. They could well find themselves up against IMPACT, SIPTU and other public service unions, who may well have an issue with any approach that treats public service experience as inferior.

Sup08 · 09-09-2016 4:10pm

2RockMountain wrote: »

Thanks for the clarifications and I get your point, though I disagree with it. Why do you see public service experience as some way inferior to CS?

If the CPSU have an issue with the circular, they need to take to PER. They could well find themselves up against IMPACT, SIPTU and other public service unions, who may well have an issue with any approach that treats public service experience as inferior.

CPSU is one of the unions and I don't see it as different but the Civil Service does, or at least now they did!

Calina · 09-09-2016 4:35pm

Meanwhile, private sector experience is totally ignored.

Sup08 · 09-09-2016 5:18pm

Calina wrote: »

Meanwhile, private sector experience is totally ignored.

People with private sector experience can apply for higher positions with greater pay. All options including pay are known before they apply to the civil/public service.

They can choose to stay in private sector where they can command a higher wage but with the risk of shorter term employment.

This is going way off topic for the thread.

TestLink · 09-09-2016 7:31pm

Considering ICT Infrastructure and Operations role, what sort of tools and technologies are used in public sector?

For eg email and all would be done by local exchange server or would be hosted on exchange cloud? Would some of these operations be outsourced to private companies?

I would be happy doing a desktop support role at a dept as I was doing it most of the time in my early jobs. But dont know much about Exchange Server admin / Linux scripting / VMware Esxi etc.

I am bit skeptical and dont want to be in a situation where I accept the offer from a dept and the technology used there is alien to me. Would I be able to talk to a person who is in charge of IT at a dept where I have a job offer and decide whether to accept the offer or not?

What sort of support I can expect?

strangel00p · 09-09-2016 7:46pm

Calina wrote: »

Meanwhile, private sector experience is totally ignored.

What do you mean by totally ignored?

TestLink · 09-09-2016 8:04pm

wrote:

Hours of attendance
Hours of attendance will be fixed from time to time but will amount to not less than 43 hours 15 minutes
gross per week.

Even in private sector, hours of work is max 40 hrs per week. Could some one explain what is this 43 hrs and 15 mins?

Is the working time 9.00 am to 6 p.m?

Sup08 · 09-09-2016 9:11pm

ITguru wrote: »

Considering ICT Infrastructure and Operations role, what sort of tools and technologies are used in public sector?

Vary by department, so can't really say. Social Welfare for instance have their own software and is soooooo outdated.

For eg email and all would be done by local exchange server or would be hosted on exchange cloud? Would some of these operations be outsourced to private companies?

Some departments use lotus notes and some are Microsoft email clients using local exchange servers but a lot of desk side support is outsourced.

I would be happy doing a desktop support role at a dept as I was doing it most of the time in my early jobs. But dont know much about Exchange Server admin / Linux scripting / VMware Esxi etc.

I am bit skeptical and dont want to be in a situation where I accept the offer from a dept and the technology used there is alien to me. Would I be able to talk to a person who is in charge of IT at a dept where I have a job offer and decide whether to accept the offer or not?

What sort of support I can expect?

Lots of support I would like to believe and I would assume the information you put on your application form will be best matched with the requirements of a department where possible.

Sup08 · 09-09-2016 9:12pm

ITguru wrote: »

Even in private sector, hours of work is max 40 hrs per week. Could some one explain what is this 43 hrs and 15 mins?

Is the working time 9.00 am to 6 p.m?

43 hours 15 minutes less lunches of 5 x 1.15 hours = 37 hours net.

Depending on the department, Flexi time maybe available and you start late or early in the mornings and leave late or early in the evenings. As long as your flexi clock balances out and you work the core hours.

Can't recall the core hours right now as I don't currently have flexi.

ICT Specialists (Executive Officer level) in Civil Service

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