Mart Site Sold

Mankbag

catbear wrote: »

How do we know that investors won't be local? After yer ones cribbing about insomnia moving into Market Cross it turned out it was business owned by a local!

Yes, we are capable of business success despite local negativity.

Ah Catbear, was wondering how long it'd take you to get your tuppenceworth in...

Read my post again, please. The investors are not local. In this case it's an outside fund(s). NTMA, ISIF. Nothing to do with Bobby Kerr trying to open an Insomnia in the Market Cross.

To repeat, although I really shouldn't have to: the Borough Council have embarked on a joint venture with an outside investment fund. The outside investment fund are naturally in this to make and maximise their profits. Redeveloping the Brewery site for the express benefit of Kilkenny people is, as such, not part of their agenda.

This isn't complicated. Kindly desist from spurious nonsense about coffee shops in the Market Cross. There is no comparison.

Mankbag

http://www.independent.ie/business/government-controlled-fund-to-finance-redevelopment-of-historic-smithwicks-brewery-31088471.html

Perhaps it will include a branch of Insomnia with a special loyalty card for Catbear.

Captain Havoc

Mankbag wrote: »

Ah Catbear, was wondering how long it'd take you to get your tuppenceworth in...

I don't see what makes your tuppence worth more than theirs.

Mankbag

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I don't see what makes your tuppence worth more than theirs.

Did I say, or even imply, it was?

catbear

Well the NTMA is national, belonging to you and I so is as good as local.

Mankbag

catbear wrote: »

Well the NTMA is national, belonging to you and I so is as good as local.

Yes - with wholesale opportunities for you, me, Captain Havoc and everyone else here to invest and make a fortune.

catbear

Mankbag wrote: »

Yes - with wholesale opportunities for you, me, Captain Havoc and everyone else here to invest and make a fortune.

Make a fortune? Have you no civic sense?

I'd almost think you'd see government merely existing for you to live at everyone else's expense!

Mankbag

catbear wrote: »

Make a fortune? Have you no civic sense?

I'd almost think you'd see government merely existing for you to live at everyone else's expense!

Arf!

PaulKK

Threadhead wrote: »

Does anyone know when exactly the bridge is due to open?

February I believe.

road_high

Mankbag wrote: »

Ah Catbear, was wondering how long it'd take you to get your tuppenceworth in...

Read my post again, please. The investors are not local. In this case it's an outside fund(s). NTMA, ISIF. Nothing to do with Bobby Kerr trying to open an Insomnia in the Market Cross.

To repeat, although I really shouldn't have to: the Borough Council have embarked on a joint venture with an outside investment fund. The outside investment fund are naturally in this to make and maximise their profits. Redeveloping the Brewery site for the express benefit of Kilkenny people is, as such, not part of their agenda.

This isn't complicated. Kindly desist from spurious nonsense about coffee shops in the Market Cross. There is no comparison.

Wow imagine someone wanting to develop something and make a profit. The sheer neck of them! If it's developed and new private business opens, then naturally the people of Kilkenny will gain through increased employment opps. Turning this valuable area into nampy pampy taxpayer funded "public spaces" will do nothing only serve as a drain. We need to get sustainable private sector development in there. It's the only sane use of prime space like this.

road_high

catbear wrote: »

How do we know that investors won't be local? After yer ones cribbing about insomnia moving into Market Cross it turned out it was business owned by a local!

Yes, we are capable of business success despite local negativity.

Which is surprising when you read some comments here etc- you'd think wanting to develop business in a derelict area was akin to setting up concentration camps really. As a Kilkenny resident I'll welcome all new development on these two sites with open arms, so long as they fit in with all planning laws and integrity of the city.

road_high

PaulKK wrote: »

February I believe.

Seems to have shut up for the holidays. Still a lot to be done at the Vicar st end. No tarmac laid and still looking very unfinished. New bridge looks very pedestrian and bike friendly.

road_high

PaulKK wrote: »

February I believe.

catbear wrote: »

Make a fortune? Have you no civic sense?

I'd almost think you'd see government merely existing for you to live at everyone else's expense!

You're not the only one to think that from his her posts...clearly views private sector business as an inherent evil out to destroy everything.

road_high

eoinfitzokk wrote: »

Is the Mart site not privately owned? I don't see how or why the locals should have such a big input if it's privately owned.

Exactly. But being Kilkenny a few too many people with too much time on their hands will think differently...they'll likely prefer it be turned into "homeless" shelters, cultural spaces for the unemployed and what's left then into yet more green spaces ( as if the Castle park is not enough for a small city like us). And of course spaces for community groups, can never have enough of those can we ? (So long as someone else is paying for them).
God forbid it might be a place of enterprise and business where people might get jobs or avail of services!

Mankbag

road_high wrote: »

Wow imagine someone wanting to develop something and make a profit. The sheer neck of them! If it's developed and new private business opens, then naturally the people of Kilkenny will gain through increased employment opps. Turning this valuable area into nampy pampy taxpayer funded "public spaces" will do nothing only serve as a drain. We need to get sustainable private sector development in there. It's the only sane use of prime space like this.

You're going to be very disappointed, Road High, when you discover that half of the brewery site is being turned into gardens, a riverside walk and new streets. All funded by the taxpayer.

What a waste of prime space, huh?!

Mankbag

road_high wrote: »

Exactly. But being Kilkenny a few too many people with too much time on their hands will think differently...they'll likely prefer it be turned into "homeless" shelters, cultural spaces for the unemployed and what's left then into yet more green spaces ( as if the Castle park is not enough for a small city like us). And of course spaces for community groups, can never have enough of those can we ? (So long as someone else is paying for them).
God forbid it might be a place of enterprise and business where people might get jobs or avail of services!

Ahem. Other than hoping for a cinema there, has anybody here complained about what will become of the mart site, given that - as has been pointed out - it's privately owned?

Mankbag

road_high wrote: »

Wow imagine someone wanting to develop something and make a profit. The sheer neck of them! If it's developed and new private business opens, then naturally the people of Kilkenny will gain through increased employment opps. Turning this valuable area into nampy pampy taxpayer funded "public spaces" will do nothing only serve as a drain. We need to get sustainable private sector development in there. It's the only sane use of prime space like this.

You are aware that all of the sustainable private sector development in Kilkenny is located on or near the ring road, I assume? And that there are many more acres there zoned for business development? And that there is absolutely loads of vacant office space in MacDonagh Junction as well as around town?

Carried out properly, the redevelopment of the brewery site could be a gamechanger for the city. But if all it amounts to is an investment fund sticking offices there in order to maximise their profit, Kilkenny is unlikely to benefit in the way it might.

road_high

Mankbag wrote: »

You're going to be very disappointed, Road High, when you discover that half of the brewery site is being turned into gardens, a riverside walk and new streets. All funded by the taxpayer.

What a waste of prime space, huh?!

Once it's landscaped into include offices and commercial stuff etc it'll be positively lovely, hopefully successful and encourage new enterprise into the site. There's bound to be a certain amount of green spaces and walks into the river. That sounds like good planning to me. Once the focus is mainly commercial (and therefore real world stufff) I'll be very happy.

Mankbag

road_high wrote: »

You're not the only one to think that from his her posts...clearly views private sector business as an inherent evil out to destroy everything.

Au contraire: the problem is that we haven't had enough private sector business in Kilkenny over the decades. The city and county have suffered badly as a consequence.

Mankbag

road_high wrote: »

Once it's landscaped into include offices and commercial stuff etc it'll be positively lovely, hopefully successful and encourage new enterprise into the site. There's bound to be a certain amount of green spaces and walks into the river. That sounds like good planning to me. Once the focus is mainly commercial (and therefore real works stufff) I'll be very happy.

You're clearly happy to trust the Borough Council on this. I'm not. Let's wait and see which of us was right, shall we?

road_high

Mankbag wrote: »

You are aware that all of the sustainable private sector development in Kilkenny is located on or near the ring road, I assume? And that there are many more acres there zoned for business development? And that there is absolutely loads of vacant office space in MacDonagh Junction as well as around town?

Carried out properly, the redevelopment of the brewery site could be a gamechanger for the city. But if all it amounts to is an investment fund sticking offices there in order to maximise their profit, Kilkenny is unlikely to benefit in the way it might.

No reason why we can't get office space etc into the site. With your negative approach well of course nothing would happen.
Maybe all these vacant properties you're crabbing on about arent suited to companies that may want to locate here.
Well if a company is operating a development here profitably, then of course the city would be benefiting as it would the development is trading successfully. People are allowed invest in the city for a profit ya know. It's not a dirty concept, it's what makes the world go around. In fact any town or city would love the potential Kk has going forward but as usual there's a cohort who want to knock every single detail.

road_high

Mankbag wrote: »

You're clearly happy to trust the Borough Council on this. I'm not. Let's wait and see which of us was right, shall we?

The borough council are gone to the best of my knowledge and yes I do trust the Co Council. Kilkenny on the whole is very well run. Probably because I dont buy into the negativity and conspiracy theories surrounding everything they do.

Mankbag

road_high wrote: »

No reason why we can't get office space etc into the site. With your negative approach well of course nothing would happen.
Maybe all these vacant properties you're crabbing on about arent suited to companies that may want to locate here.
Well if a company is operating a development here profitably, then of course the city would be benefiting as it would the development is trading successfully. People are allowed invest in the city for a profit ya know. It's not a dirty concept, it's what makes the world go around. In fact any town or city would love the potential Kk has going forward but as usual there's a cohort who want to knock every single detail.

No need to worry: there's nothing BUT office space planned for the site.

And you're bang on, any town or city would absolutely love to have Kilkenny's potential. All the more reason to get this development absolutely right. (And to repeat, I'd have loved to see a micro-brewery or a museum on the site. Entities that - yes! - are run for profit and employ people.)

I very much hope that your faith in the County Council is proved justified.

PaulKK

road_high wrote: »

Seems to have shut up for the holidays. Still a lot to be done at the Vicar st end. No tarmac laid and still looking very unfinished. New bridge looks very pedestrian and bike friendly.

I'd say they'll be on time. Doesn't take long to lay a bit of tarmac..

February is technically still a couple of months away after all.

catbear

Mankbag wrote: »

No need to worry: there's nothing BUT office space planned for the site.

And you're bang on, any town or city would absolutely love to have Kilkenny's potential. All the more reason to get this development absolutely right. (And to repeat, I'd have loved to see a micro-brewery or a museum on the site. Entities that - yes! - are run for profit and employ people.)

I very much hope that your faith in the County Council is proved justified.

i thought a condition of diagio giving the council the site was that there wouldn't be a brewery there after they left. Petty of diagio I know but it was their call to make.

road_high

catbear wrote: »

i thought a condition of diagio giving the council the site was that there wouldn't be a brewery there after they left. Petty of diagio I know but it was their call to make.

They gave it to the city for free I think so it was quite a goodwill gesture. Some kind of micro brewery would have been a nice idea, tied into their Visitor experience.

Comerman

road_high wrote: »

They gave it to the city for free I think so it was quite a goodwill gesture.

DIAGEO have never given anything away for free http://www.kilkennycityonline.com/news-d.asp?ART_ID=73

road_high

Comerman wrote: »

DIAGEO have never given anything away for free http://www.kilkennycityonline.com/news-d.asp?ART_ID=73

I stand corrected...I thought they had for some reason

Comerman

road_high wrote: »

I stand corrected...I thought they had for some reason

Sorry about that Diageo held on to the front building where the tours etc.are now, I suppose they needed to keep some bit of revenue for themselves eh?

road_high

Comerman wrote: »

Sorry about that Diageo held on to the front building where the tours etc.are now, I suppose they needed to keep some bit of revenue for themselves eh?

I'm glad they did. They're doing a great job with the Visitor Experience to be fair, only a shame they didn't when it was a working brewery!