Gardai proposals to ban firearms

tikkahunter

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Was into the airsoft shop in Limerick this afternoon,where I had left in a few petition sheets before Xmas .Apart from the Polish lads who owned the shop and want the 1joule restriction lifted on airsoft had signed the petition.Not ONE other person in the airsoft scene in Limerick who goes to that shop signed the petition.: Thanks!!! Really appreciated Limerick airsofters.:(:mad:

it is typical though,no body gives a crap till licences are revoked and firearms are banned then the uproar how can they do that to us .I sent out 32 petition sheets I received from nargc to club members .I even sent a stamp addressed evenlope with it so they could return it.1 came back.17 of them members shoot with semi auto shotguns.

gunhappy_ie

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Was into the airsoft shop in Limerick this afternoon,where I had left in a few petition sheets before Xmas .Apart from the Polish lads who owned the shop and want the 1joule restriction lifted on airsoft had signed the petition.Not ONE other person in the airsoft scene in Limerick who goes to that shop signed the petition.: Thanks!!! Really appreciated Limerick airsofters.:(:mad:

tikkahunter wrote: »

it is typical though,no body gives a crap till licences are revoked and firearms are banned then the uproar how can they do that to us .I sent out 32 petition sheets I received from nargc to club members .I even sent a stamp addressed evenlope with it so they could return it.1 came back.17 of them members shoot with semi auto shotguns.

I visited 2 Airsoft shops and they made it clear that they were not interested. I even emailed an Irish airsoft association but didnt get a reply.... I can do no more to help them.

Cass

Said this over 3 months ago in this thread, and dozens of times in hundreds of threads over the years:

Cass wrote: »

As for doing anything at all it might surprise some as to the number of people that will not have an interest or see this as affecting them. I have read all the posts from this thread about how everyone will/could be effected, but the simple truth is there is a set number of people that will not see any changes as a problem or simply won't care. Even at the possible loss of their firearm(s).

tikkahunter

Cass wrote: »

Said this over 3 months ago in this thread, and dozens of times in hundreds of threads over the years:

Very true

no12

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/garda-pistol-club-criticises-gunban-attempts-31013316.html

Tea drinker

no12 wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/garda-pistol-club-criticises-gunban-attempts-31013316.html

William is spot on, and a decent bloke he is. Wish we had more people like this!

Grizzly 45

Nice to see that now the shooting side of AGS speaking up and calling it like it is.
Good bunch of pro comments on the article too.

Sparks

That article may do more than pretty much any of the rest of them really, given the emphasis being placed on his career with the AGS.

OzCam

Airsofters are not informed about this issue, and mostly think that their (our) position was secured with the last set of changes to the legislation.

I'm very sad to see that there are still people wishing (after all these years) for the 1J limit to be increased. It will make imports far easier, in that guns won't need to be downgraded. Unfortunately some people still can't get it into their heads that the power limit is far more likely to be decreased in the current political atmosphere.

There are some airsofters who realise that we're in the same queue as shooters, albeit a bit behind. Some of us are trying to help, mostly those who also shoot what we call Real Steel, but we are very few.

BTW the IAA has been a dead loss for several years. I tried - and I failed miserably - to make it something better. Save your breath.

Sorry lads & ladies.

Sparks

OzCam wrote: »

I'm very sad to see that there are still people wishing (after all these years) for the 1J limit to be increased. It will make imports far easier, in that guns won't need to be downgraded. Unfortunately some people still can't get it into their heads that the power limit is far more likely to be decreased in the current political atmosphere.

Yeah, but I'd still like to see it increased to either 7.5 or 17 joules - that'd not only secure airsoft but also paintball and most airguns in Ireland in general, it'd give the RFDs a much-needed economic shot in the arm and from the Minister's point of view, it'd reduce the number of firearms in the country, firstly by taking a whole section of them out of one regulatory framework into another, and secondly: what farmer wants to pay eighty euro and fill in a nine-page form for a shotgun to use on rats in the barn when he can spend forty or fifty euro on a second-hand break-barrel daisy and just go shoot them with an airgun? So you would see a gradual reduction over time (though there would be a limit to that, obviously enough). And the economic effects of the boost the sports that use airguns would feel would be fairly positive too.

But for right now, it's just not the more pressing concern. If the Minister goes for a proper legislative rewrite, we might be able to do it then; but if she goes for a straight ban...

nastros

Sparks wrote: »

Yeah, but I'd still like to see it increased to either 7.5 or 17 joules - that'd not only secure airsoft but also paintball and most airguns in Ireland in general, it'd give the RFDs a much-needed economic shot in the arm and from the Minister's point of view, it'd reduce the number of firearms in the country, firstly by taking a whole section of them out of one regulatory framework into another, and secondly: what farmer wants to pay eighty euro and fill in a nine-page form for a shotgun to use on rats in the barn when he can spend forty or fifty euro on a second-hand break-barrel daisy and just go shoot them with an airgun? So you would see a gradual reduction over time (though there would be a limit to that, obviously enough). And the economic effects of the boost the sports that use airguns would feel would be fairly positive too.

But for right now, it's just not the more pressing concern. If the Minister goes for a proper legislative rewrite, we might be able to do it then; but if she goes for a straight ban...

Would make it so much easier to get people into shooting sports as well join a range and shoot air rifles etc. Then they could decide whether to move on to rimfire or centrefire or stick with the air rifle or pistol but maybe upgrade. Same for Airsoft not having to have someone effectively take apart a new airsoft gun to reduce it to 1 joule would be nice.

OzCam

I absolutely agree that a properly-written set of "firearms" laws might contain several classes (for want of a better word) around the 1-1.2J, 7.5 to 17, and higher energies.

My fear is that in the current political atmosphere it's more likely to be banned completely. Which can happen with a Ministerial Order.

Sparks

Yup. To call this a sensitive time for firearms is like saying that it would be unlikely to win the lotto five times in a row on consecutive weeks while also winning the euromillions each week.

mrbrianj

Good article alright
and comments bar the one about "Olympic style pistols"!

They should ban bikes unless they are the type used in Olympic track event.

Gormley85

Sparks wrote: »

Yup. To call this a sensitive time for firearms is like saying that it would be unlikely to win the lotto five times in a row on consecutive weeks while also winning the euromillions each week.

Ah now come on Sparks, where's your optimism

Sparks

Gormley85 wrote: »

Ah now come on Sparks, where's your optimism

Gormley85

^^^ Im not sure about everyone else, but so far Im pretty happy with how this is going. The committee (well most of them) seem to be genuine people who are looking at this from both sides.

An Garda Siochana are been called to task with their figures (amongst other things).

The general media isnt too bad on the subject either.

And now today we see the Garda pistol team giving their take on it- a very positive take I might add.

I dont think its all doom and gloom.

Nekarsulm

Finian got some less than glowing publicity in the Irish Times, on Saturday 14 Feb.

"McGrath in firing line over guns

On Thursday morning, members of the Dáil’s justice and defence committee took themselves off to Garda headquarters to look at their forensic labs. Then they repaired to a firing range in Kildare to play soldiers. Or Garda emergency response unit officers.

Independent TD Finian McGrath decided not to go.

Probably a wise move.

Finian found himself in the firing line this week when he asked for stricter control of firearms. The Dublin Bay North deputy was speaking following committee hearings about the issuing of licences.

“My concern is the accessibility of firearms in some quarters, particularly where handguns and pump- action shotguns are concerned. I was told by the Garda that there are 150,000 unlicensed firearms in the country. My worry is that people leave them lying around in sheds and suchlike, which is extremely dangerous.”

However, Finian wasn’t prepared for the reaction to his comments.

“I’m still reeling from the onslaught,” he said yesterday. “I never realised the gun lobby is so strong here.”

He said he has no problems with members of sporting clubs or people who use guns for their work.

“I just want tougher regulations.”

As part of their trip, those committee members who travelled also met private gun owners.

“On balance , I thought it best not to go,” said a queasy Finian."

Article by Miriam Lord.

Deaf git

I see Enda Kenny and Joan Burton will be heading to the US for St Patrick's Day.
Do any of you find it annoying that our politicians fall over each other to visit the US having been so critical of the so called 'gun culture' over there?

I wonder if Finian would risk it?

Grizzly 45

Nekarsulm wrote: »

Finian got some less than glowing publicity in the Irish Times, on Saturday 14 Feb.

"McGrath in firing line over guns
."

On the balance it shows the man is an utter craven coward and misinformed fool.He has no belif in his arguements and no willingness to defend them or be proven right or wrong either way. Next he goes on in the Journal.ie about how hard a time he is having with his fellow stinky and poisionous smokers by being oppressed in the pubs of Ireland by the Fascist health police prohibiting him from puffing his cancer sticks.We dont do much right in Ireland but this was one good thing we did do right.Smoking kills more people a year than 160 years of private gun ownership in Ireland has managed,and this utter clown wants ciggies back in the pub??
Best to ignore him...Maybe he'll just go away by himself.Hopefully to the country of his dreams...Cuba!

kowloon

I seem to have missed out on the petition, is there anyone in particular it would be worth writing to/e-mailing? I have a shotgun that would be affected and a few other bits I'm sure they'll come after next. Who should I be directing my objections towards?

Grizzly 45

Deaf git wrote: »

I see Enda Kenny and Joan Burton will be heading to the US for St Patrick's Day.
Do any of you find it annoying that our politicians fall over each other to visit the US having been so critical of the so called 'gun culture' over there?

I wonder if Finian would risk it?

Called "backstabbing" and as a race unfortunatly we are very good at it,amongst our friends and ourselves.:(
Cromwell summed up this delightful chacteristic of us in "Put an Irishman on a spit,and you'll soon find another Irishman to turn it ."

Grizzly 45

kowloon wrote: »

I seem to have missed out on the petition, is there anyone in particular it would be worth writing to/e-mailing? I have a shotgun that would be affected and a few other bits I'm sure they'll come after next. Who should I be directing my objections towards?

Mass email all the TDs with a polite email on your views on this matter.Download a petition sheet from the sports colation website sign it and get as many people to sign it and send it back.The petition is still open,the submissions are closed.

homerhop

"On balance , I thought it best not to go,” said a queasy Finian."


Wow that man sure is full of his own importance. Once again Finian McGrath makes a statement showing how little he thinks of sports shooters. Any one who was there on the day were treated with great respect. Time was taken to show and explain target shooting. Everybody they spoke to on the day were were polite and well mannered and in no way let themselves down or gave any reason to hold the shooting community in a bad light.

Witcher

He should be relieved of his place on that committee.

Cass

Correct. A preconceived and biased opinion has no place on a committee for open debate.

However chances of it happening?

kowloon

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

The petition is still open,the submissions are closed.

Ah, I saw the submissions date and assumed there was no point.

yubabill1

looks like a healthy debate is taking place between Min Fitzgerald and senior Gardaí RE: whistleblowing.

Read through the histrionics in the article and the Minister looks like she is genuinely determined to root out the old guard.

We should support this. Better still, seeing as how the firearms proposals came from the old guard, can we read something further into this divide?

catastrophy

yubabill1 wrote: »

looks like a healthy debate is taking place between Min Fitzgerald and senior Gardaí RE: whistleblowing.

Read through the histrionics in the article and the Minister looks like she is genuinely determined to root out the old guard.

We should support this. Better still, seeing as how the firearms proposals came from the old guard, can we read something further into this divide?

While the GRA may have "senior" Gardai amongst its executive, they are just that... Gardai. This whole issue is a Garda management issue.

The GRA are highlighting the fact that if a member of Garda rank can choose to disobey an order from a higher rank it will have far reaching implications.

yubabill1

catastrophy wrote: »

While the GRA may have "senior" Gardai amongst its executive, they are just that... Gardai. This whole issue is a Garda management issue.

The GRA are highlighting the fact that if a member of Garda rank can choose to disobey an order from a higher rank it will have far reaching implications.

I think the context is in relation to whistleblowers and egregious orders. surely, someone who is trained to enforce Irish statute law would know roughly what is right from what is clearly and unimpeachably unjust and apply the benefit of the doubt for anything in between.