IW/Anything Water Related-Warning in OP

Busted Flat.

BoatMad wrote: »

What's this got to do with IW, start another thread

Go back and criticize the post I replied too, instead of lying in the long grass.

BoatMad

shruikan2553 wrote: »

Last time Ive been paying attention to IW was when I went to sign up in Oct to find the deadline has been put back. When talking to my mother she told me the entire thing has changed. When the **** did this happen?

Now from my understanding a house with 2 or more adults pays at most 260 a year and 100 is given back later in the year. You also do not need your PPSN and have until Feb to sign up. Is this all correct?

Yes that's basically correct , have you been hiding under a rock lately

shruikan2553

BoatMad wrote: »

Yes that's basically correct , have you been hiding under a rock lately

As good as when it comes to water charges. Dont watch RTE and this thread was my source of info on it. Stopped paying attention when all we were getting was the same people giving out about protesters and how much they love paying charges, other people saying the government is going to be overthrown and people being called shinnerbots.

Surprised to see how much the government has gone back on.

I don't expect the 100 euro thing to go through. Conveniently they won't know until April and there's a chance it won't be allowed. They can claim they tried but pass on the blame.

eug87

shruikan2553 wrote: »

As good as when it comes to water charges. Dont watch RTE and this thread was my source of info on it. Stopped paying attention when all we were getting was the same people giving out about protesters and how much they love paying charges, other people saying the government is going to be overthrown and people being called shinnerbots.

Surprised to see how much the government has gone back on.

Dont be surprised if an election is called early next year.

Check if your registered to vote...
http://www.checktheregister.ie/PublicPages/Default.aspx?uiLang=

Thurston?

Tinkersbell wrote: »

... I posted the EU water directive, including article 9.4 which clearly shows that Ireland wasn't legally obliged to bring in a water tax.
Right there in black and white on the screen

What it 'clearly shows' is that our 'established practices' could only continue 'where this does not compromise the purposes and the achievement of the objectives of this Directive' (Recovery of costs for water services)

It couldn't be that our established practices might be falling a bit short in this regard now, could it?

Highflyer13

BoatMad wrote: »

I find this amusing , you expect us to stay in ecomonic deprivation , just to prove a point. I want to see the economy improving , I want to see my kids get jobs here.

"It is the economy stupid "

Your right, it is the economy stupid. Come back to me in 10-15 years when most likely the same mistakes have been repeated by a FF/FG government and your crying over your kids being on the other side of the world and we are in even more s**t than we are have been for the last few years. Listen I dont want a SF or mix mosh of Indos in Government either but something has to change and I'm willing to give it a chance.

As Einstein said "Insanity, doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results"

In our case it is electing FF and FG governments time and time again.

foggy_lad

Highflyer13 wrote: »

Tough spot for FG. Id say the strategists don't know what the hell to do. Enda is toxic for sure but do you leave him and hope the protests fizzle out and people begin to comply or do they replace him with Leo Varadker or Richard Bruton I would think or indeed call a general election. Dec 10th is d-day for them.

Leo vradkar is ten times worse than Kenny! He would not be one for giving in to peoples protests at all!

foggy_lad

shruikan2553 wrote: »

Last time Ive been paying attention to IW was when I went to sign up in Oct to find the deadline has been put back. When talking to my mother she told me the entire thing has changed. When the **** did this happen?

Now from my understanding a house with 2 or more adults pays at most 260 a year and 100 is given back later in the year. You also do not need your PPSN and have until Feb to sign up. Is this all correct?

Correct now but likely to change because the €100 rebate might be abolished and the cap on price may be raised after a year. The whole thing might be scrapped or changed to a water boarding tax for the yanks passing through Shannon. Anything can happen when Inda Kenny and his boss Denis the menace are in charge.

Tinkersbell

BoatMad wrote: »

If one uses the discussions on here as any yardstick , I don't hold out much for social media telling us the truth or explaining anything

LOL.
Not all social media is controlled in the way this site is.

Tinkersbell

BoatMad wrote: »

What's this got to do with IW, start another thread

You have to apply or be asked to be a moderator before you can moderate.

Streetwalker

Stargate wrote: »

Indeed . Couldn't agree more .

Social media is playing a huge part in highlighting everything that is NOT reported in newspapers and TV.

Again which is why governments the world over are desperate to bring in laws against free speech and giving one's opinion online. The coming broadcast charge will be a Trojan horse for this. Can't afford it? Well then you can't voice your opinion.

shinzon

Streetwalker wrote: »

. The coming broadcast charge will be a Trojan horse for this. Can't afford it? Well then you can't voice your opinion.

The broadcasting charge has been scrapped loads of sites reporting on that yesterday

Shin

Graces7

A brief last message on this thread...

Early yesterday I learned that one of my family has died in intensive care... she was 46, and had spent her whole life working selflessly for others.

She had recently joined others in India. gathering in abandoned new born babies and although she had been advised, when she was offered a cup of tea, accepted it. It was contaminated with chemicals. Causing death.

Coming at this time here in ireland the utter irony...and I feel ashamed of the element here who have clean water and so much else.

SO you must excuse me. I wish all well here and hope that there will be enough respect for there to be no replies to this post. I will not see them if there are.. too heartsick and full of grief

Tears flowing for a wonderful person killed for lack of what we take for granted

Someone said days ago that you were fighting for what you believe in. So am I in my small way, much abed fingers at work making to sell at craft fairs..

Yesterday I was at a fair in a rural village. A PTA fund raising to found a breakfast and after school club so that no child goes hungry.

Not marching or protesting but actually doing something to alleviate the problem.

That I respect and admire and was glad to support with the fee for the table.

Just my take on it all as I let the hubbub settle in my heart.. thinking and praying and caring and that no harm will come of any event here now;;will light a candle for you all.

Blessings and peace..

twowheelsgood

BoatMad wrote: »

I find this amusing , you expect us to stay in ecomonic deprivation , just to prove a point. I want to see the economy improving , I want to see my kids get jobs here.

"It is the economy stupid "

It is pretty bizarre if you take a step back from all of this.

There was no coherent and sustained protest to any of the austere measures introduced in the last few years. Nor with us being lumbered with the banking debt.

But now, with our economy growing at pace again, our deficit almost under some measure of control, employment growing, our credit rating improving etc., now, now, we decide its a good time to protest!

There certainly is real and understandable anger in relation to water provision, the setting up of IW is part of that but there was always going to be an attitude of “selling sand to the Arabs” in the mix however well IW was set up. And as you see from here, there is a fair amount of hysteria around too.

But the notion that our economic recovery doesn’t count or doesn’t matter or isn’t real, as has been articulated by a few here is not, I am confident, shared by most Irish people. Most have a better grip on economic reality than that.

And they don’t have a simplistic all good or all bad view of the government. The can recognise that they can get some things like IW badly wrong but also see that there is a lot of good news as well.

DrumSteve

rocoso wrote: »

enda my bollicks ....look at the video that fine gael produced for the 1916 commeration....some form of ****e that was with the english queen and james cameron featuring so much....what identidy is this for irish people ...what are these people allinged to

Stupid James Cameron... Coming here, taking our terminators.

Plates

twowheelsgood wrote: »

It is pretty bizarre if you take a step back from all of this.

There was no coherent and sustained protest to any of the austere measures introduced in the last few years. Nor with us being lumbered with the banking debt.

But now, with our economy growing at pace again, our deficit almost under some measure of control, employment growing, our credit rating improving etc., now, now, we decide its a good time to protest!

There certainly is real and understandable anger in relation to water provision, the setting up of IW is part of that but there was always going to be an attitude of “selling sand to the Arabs” in the mix however well IW was set up. And as you see from here, there is a fair amount of hysteria around too.

But the notion that our economic recovery doesn’t count or doesn’t matter or isn’t real, as has been articulated by a few here is not, I am confident, shared by most Irish people. Most have a better grip on economic reality than that.

And they don’t have a simplistic all good or all bad view of the government. The can recognise that they can get some things like IW badly wrong but also see that there is a lot of good news as well.

It's a shame that well thought out and sensible posts like this get lost amongst the repetitive, sensationalist and often sanctimonious sh*t that appears across hundreds of pages.

Annasopra

Stargate wrote: »

Indeed . Couldn't agree more .

Social media is playing a huge part in highlighting everything that is NOT reported in newspapers and TV.

The problem with that is that cranks spouting nonsense are amplified and believed. With social media there is no verification involved. Sorry but its a propagandists dream.

Red Pepper

twowheelsgood wrote: »

It is pretty bizarre if you take a step back from all of this.

There was no coherent and sustained protest to any of the austere measures introduced in the last few years. Nor with us being lumbered with the banking debt.

But now, with our economy growing at pace again, our deficit almost under some measure of control, employment growing, our credit rating improving etc., now, now, we decide its a good time to protest!

There certainly is real and understandable anger in relation to water provision, the setting up of IW is part of that but there was always going to be an attitude of “selling sand to the Arabs” in the mix however well IW was set up. And as you see from here, there is a fair amount of hysteria around too.

But the notion that our economic recovery doesn’t count or doesn’t matter or isn’t real, as has been articulated by a few here is not, I am confident, shared by most Irish people. Most have a better grip on economic reality than that.

And they don’t have a simplistic all good or all bad view of the government. The can recognise that they can get some things like IW badly wrong but also see that there is a lot of good news as well.

You should visit Galway A&E some day to see how our economic recovery is doing. An economic recovery that is in spite of our government rather than as a result of anything they did. You should visit the mental health services up and down the country to see how many vital programs have been cut. You should see how stretched social services are at the moment especially in relation to caring for vulnerable children.
And it isn't because the HSE don't get enough funding, its because they have too much middle management and admin staff and bureaucratic systems wasting all that money. Setting up an IW in the same vein was just too much.

Autonomous Cowherd

twowheelsgood wrote: »

It is pretty bizarre if you take a step back from all of this.

There was no coherent and sustained protest to any of the austere measures introduced in the last few years. Nor with us being lumbered with the banking debt.

But now, with our economy growing at pace again, our deficit almost under some measure of control, employment growing, our credit rating improving etc., now, now, we decide its a good time to protest!

There certainly is real and understandable anger in relation to water provision, the setting up of IW is part of that but there was always going to be an attitude of “selling sand to the Arabs” in the mix however well IW was set up. And as you see from here, there is a fair amount of hysteria around too.

But the notion that our economic recovery doesn’t count or doesn’t matter or isn’t real, as has been articulated by a few here is not, I am confident, shared by most Irish people. Most have a better grip on economic reality than that.

And they don’t have a simplistic all good or all bad view of the government. The can recognise that they can get some things like IW badly wrong but also see that there is a lot of good news as well.

I think perhaps you overestimate the effects of the recovery and perhaps underestimate the effects of the shell-shock that prevented people from mobilising themselves when our 'betters' told us we had to dump our citizens best interests in favour of bailing out anonymous bondholders (gamblers on bank stocks).

This is not just about IW, though it is also about IW. People seem to forget the billions of Irish citizens money that have gone into the building and maintenance of a water system over decades. It is not the governments to hand over to anyone to manage, must less to be used as an off balance sheet back up for loans to continue paying off gamblers. Do people not understand that the government is our servant? They do not ''own'' what we have paid for. They serve us as custodians.

People like Enda Kenny and Leo Varadkar and etc etc and all the commentators in the media with their weekly salaries have not been touched by the recession. I laugh to hear Marion Finucane moan week in week out about the recession as if it has come near her. There are plenty fo us who do not light the stove anymore until after 6 pm no matter how cold it is. Plenty of us who haven't been to the dentist in 5 years or longer because we cannot afford it. Plenty of us who measure the cost of every car journey and make it count by doing everything possible on that barely afforded amount of petrol.

Perhaps some of yiz had a bigger cushion to fall back on, but those of us who didn't would have to pay for water from the grocery allotment. Which grows tighter and tighter per week. I for one will be out on December 10th and hoping to bring down an elitist government that has no clue what it is like to scrimp and struggle in the real world.

Tinkersbell

Plates wrote: »

It's a shame that well thought out and sensible posts like this get lost amongst the repetitive, sensationalist and often sanctimonious sh*t that appears across hundreds of pages.

Good post ok, however this thread is about the screw up that is the water tax and the quango set up to administer it.
There's threads on the economy elsewhere.

gandalf

LOL now we have become a Lawless Utopia

http://www.thejournal.ie/labour-senator-lawless-utopia-1796003-Nov2014/

A LABOUR SENATOR has warned that Ireland’s image as a “lawless utopia” will damage its ability to attract foreign direct investment.

She does realise what she has said is an oxymoron ?

Another prime example on why the country should have voted for the abolishment of the Senate.

gladrags

BoatMad wrote: »

Look away to exactly whom, SF , a party with more skeletons in the closet then most, or a ragtag bunch of Independents, most of whom can hardly agree it's the same time.

The solution is not some " other" fairy godmother , political parties can't actually " set better standards for Irish people " , money does that.

Is that anything to do with the fact that both are poll toppers,and could form the next government?

Plates

gladrags wrote: »

Is that anything to do with the fact that both are poll toppers,and could form the next government?

That's not going to happen. In todays "140 character or less" generation people are won over by soundbites. What matters is momentum going into an election. In the absence of a new political party, the next Government may well be a FF/FG coalition, just in time for the 1916 anniversary.

Autonomous Cowherd

gladrags wrote: »

Is that anything to do with the fact that both are poll toppers,and could form the next government?

Refering to SF

The best political stroke they could pull would be for Gerry Adams to announce during an election that he will be retiring from public life (which i think is what will happen), and I can tell you any hesitancy on behalf of people like me would evaporate and tens of thousands more would vote for Sinn Fein. And with people like McDonald and Doherty and allies like Clare Daly I cannot see how they could possibly be more of a f*ck up than the generations of wheeler dealer dopes that we have had.

Banjo String

Plates wrote: »

That's not going to happen. In todays "140 character or less" generation people are won over by soundbites. What matters is momentum going into an election. In the absence of a new political party, the next Government may well be a FF/FG coalition, just in time for the 1916 anniversary.

I'm crossing my fingers.

The public would then finally realise they're that FF and FG are two cheeks from the one arse, then hopefully both party's would spend a bit of time out in the political wilderness.

Streetwalker

gandalf wrote: »

LOL now we have become a Lawless Utopia

http://www.thejournal.ie/labour-senator-lawless-utopia-1796003-Nov2014/



She does realise what she has said is an oxymoron ?

Another prime example on why the country should have voted for the abolishment of the Senate.

It already is lawless for the establishment, laws are only for the little people.

Tinkersbell

Plates wrote: »

That's not going to happen. In todays "140 character or less" generation people are won over by soundbites. What matters is momentum going into an election. In the absence of a new political party, the next Government may well be a FF/FG coalition, just in time for the 1916 anniversary.

Although I detest both FF and FG equally, I hope that's the outcome of the next GE.
It'll be progress to put the 'two different parties' sh1te to bed once and for all and might create politics of the left and right in our country giving people a real choice.

gandalf

Autonomous Cowherd wrote: »

Refering to SF

The best political stroke they could pull would be for Gerry Adams to announce during an election that he will be retiring from public life (which i think is what will happen), and I can tell you any hesitancy on behalf of people like me would evaporate and tens of thousands more would vote for Sinn Fein. And with people like McDonald and Doherty and allies like Clare Daly I cannot see how they could possibly be more of a f*ck up than the generations of wheeler dealer dopes that we have had.

Just take a look at Sinn Fein in Government up across the border and I can see that they have the potential to be even bigger **** ups than the current parties.

What is needed is a new centre right party, non-religious affiliated to really get the winds of change going.

As our politicial system is currently configured we will get a rag tag of left parties who will probably implode within a year on one side or FF/FG with the remaining embers of the Labour party on the other.

BoatMad

foggy_lad wrote: »

Correct now but likely to change because the €100 rebate might be abolished and the cap on price may be raised after a year. The whole thing might be scrapped or changed to a water boarding tax for the yanks passing through Shannon. Anything can happen when Inda Kenny and his boss Denis the menace are in charge.

... and you are living in la-la land like the poster here

BoatMad

Tinkersbell wrote: »

Although I detest both FF and FG equally, I hope that's the outcome of the next GE.
It'll be progress to put the 'two different parties' sh1te to bed once and for all and might create politics of the left and right in our country giving people a real choice.

I agree with that too. Th problem for both parties is that they know, the final outcome of that decision will be one party.