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IW/Anything Water Related-Warning in OP

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    #4832
    Highflyer13
    Closed Accounts Posts: 954 ✭✭✭Highflyer13


    With all due respect, what do people living abroad know about the day to day situation of actually living in Ireland? Its got a whole lot worse and harder to make ends meet the last few years. Just last week public transport costs went up again despite declining passenger numbers. Every year they creep up the fares.

    At least in the likes of the Netherlands people are happy to pay taxes as they get good services on return. We pay our taxes a lot of it goes to a bloated welfare system and waste in public sector. Id would be delighted to hand over 50% of my income in tax if I seen a good health system, good education system, fair transport pricing, welfare going to the right people, efficent and functioning public services. Measures that will reduce the day to day cost of living. I would be delighted to pay high taxes then.

    Imagine for a first world country 30% of the people dont have the price of a doctor at the end of the month. Laughable.


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    #4833
    shinzon
    Registered Users Posts: 5,460 ✭✭✭shinzon


    denhaagenite wrote: »
    No I'm saying the U- turn outcome of flat rate charge is worse than the pay by use system. So well done.

    well once its dead and buried for good you must be in line for a monumental mental collapse.

    and don't forget the other 249,999 protestors and every march that goes unreported as well that got that u turn because tbh under the old system IW would be scurrying to cer every 5 minutes and saying "Can we have some more sir"

    you keep saying that the pay for useage system is fair, its only fair if its implemented fairly which it wasn't so the government and the quango needed to and still does need to be put in its place

    you honestly have no idea how big a bullets been dodged here but anyways as you were.

    Shin


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    #4834
    denhaagenite
    Registered Users Posts: 1,169 ✭✭✭denhaagenite


    Highflyer13 wrote: »
    With all due respect, what do people living abroad know about the day to day situation of actually living in Ireland? Its got a whole lot worse and harder to make ends meet the last few years. Just last week public transport costs went up again despite declining passenger numbers. Every year they creep up the fares.

    We're only an hour away!! Add to that we both have large families living in Ireland, visit rural and urban areas in Leinster, Munster and Connaught at least once each per year and are going back for six months in a few weeks. So probably more than most to be fair.
    Highflyer13 wrote: »
    At least in the likes of the Netherlands people are happy to pay taxes as they get good services on return. We pay our taxes a lot of it goes to a bloated welfare system and waste in public sector. Id would be delighted to hand over 50% of my income in tax if I seen a good health system, good education system, fair transport pricing, welfare going to the right people, efficent and functioning public services. Measures that will reduce the day to day cost of living. I would be delighted to pay high taxes then.

    But can you imagine how long they've actually been paying all these costs for? They've also privatised a lot of public services here. A good standard of living doesn't just appear overnight. As a side, the public transport and health systems are just the same if not more than in Ireland. How exactly would it reduce the day to day cost of living??
    Highflyer13 wrote: »
    Imagine for a first world country 30% of the people dont have the price of a doctor at the end of the month. Laughable.

    That is shocking, and it's true that the health system in Ireland is a shambles. We pay mandatory private health insurance, PRSI and the own risk and I would be very annoyed if we were served up the HSE for those costs.


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    #4835
    gladrags
    Registered Users Posts: 6,028 ✭✭✭gladrags


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Give us YOUR ideal Government then, please. We hear how "corrupt" this lt are, yet not one of you have offered a crediable alternative. I mean ones with well thought out workable plans, that won't send us back into the bad old days of buying elections resulting in austerity to dig us out of the mire.

    You already have one,you just don't know
    it.

    Until you look.


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    #4836
    keithclancy
    Registered Users Posts: 9,208 ✭✭✭keithclancy


    Highflyer13 wrote: »
    With all due respect, what do people living abroad know about the day to day situation of actually living in Ireland? Its got a whole lot worse and harder to make ends meet the last few years. Just last week public transport costs went up again despite declining passenger numbers. Every year they creep up the fares.

    At least in the likes of the Netherlands people are happy to pay taxes as they get good services on return. We pay our taxes a lot of it goes to a bloated welfare system and waste in public sector. Id would be delighted to hand over 50% of my income in tax if I seen a good health system, good education system, fair transport pricing, welfare going to the right people, efficent and functioning public services. Measures that will reduce the day to day cost of living. I would be delighted to pay high taxes then.

    Imagine for a first world country 30% of the people dont have the price of a doctor at the end of the month. Laughable.

    In all fairness that's a trick question because nobody knows your personal circumstances.

    Just as you don't know what its like to live in my life either.


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    #4837
    KomradeBishop
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,981 ✭✭✭KomradeBishop


    Not been following any IW stuff - but just saw this on Brian M. Lucey's (Trinity econ professors) blog - a question from the TD Catherine Murphy:
    In a PQ reply on June 12th 2013, Minister Hogan confirmed that the end of that month would be the closing date for bidders to apply to be considered for the metering contract. GMC/SIERRA, company number 530230 was one of the successful bidders yet that same company number did not come into legal existence until the 15th of July 2013. Fifteen days after the closing date for bids. How can it be that a company that did not exist when the deadline for bids closed could be awarded a contract? It would appear that GMC/SIERRA, a company with Denis O’Brien as a vested party, was somehow awarded a contract before it even existed?
    https://brianmlucey.wordpress.com/2014/12/04/questions-raised-regarding-the-awarding-of-irish-water-metering-contract/

    If there's truth to the facts in that question, and if there's no good explanation for that, then that could be an extremely significant indication of corruption in the selection process.


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    #4838
    Highflyer13
    Closed Accounts Posts: 954 ✭✭✭Highflyer13


    KomradeBishop wrote: »
    Not been following any IW stuff - but just saw this on Brian M. Lucey's (Trinity econ professors) blog - a question from the TD Catherine Murphy:

    https://brianmlucey.wordpress.com/2014/12/04/questions-raised-regarding-the-awarding-of-irish-water-metering-contract/

    If there's truth to the facts in that question, and if there's no good explanation for that, then that could be an extremely significant indication of corruption in the selection process.

    This is blowing up in a big way on twitter. Its a very serious question that needs to be answered. What we have all suspected about IW being set up for certain people to line their pockets may well turn out to be true.


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    #4839
    Chucken
    Registered Users Posts: 9,459 ✭✭✭Chucken


    KomradeBishop wrote: »
    Not been following any IW stuff - but just saw this on Brian M. Lucey's (Trinity econ professors) blog - a question from the TD Catherine Murphy:

    https://brianmlucey.wordpress.com/2014/12/04/questions-raised-regarding-the-awarding-of-irish-water-metering-contract/

    If there's truth to the facts in that question, and if there's no good explanation for that, then that could be an extremely significant indication of corruption in the selection process.

    As Miley would say....Well Holy God.


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    #4840
    hju6
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,432 ✭✭✭hju6


    KomradeBishop wrote: »
    Not been following any IW stuff - but just saw this on Brian M. Lucey's (Trinity econ professors) blog - a question from the TD Catherine Murphy:

    https://brianmlucey.wordpress.com/2014/12/04/questions-raised-regarding-the-awarding-of-irish-water-metering-contract/

    If there's truth to the facts in that question, and if there's no good explanation for that, then that could be an extremely significant indication of corruption in the selection process.

    Here's the timeline, http://www.broadsheet.ie/2014/01/30/thicker-than-uisce/

    DOB, SITESERV, HOGAN, IW, all in a nice timeline of events.


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    #4841
    Chucken
    Registered Users Posts: 9,459 ✭✭✭Chucken


    Someone posted very early on the thread that IW tax clearance cert had expired.
    These show that they were operating for 2 weeks without one.

    http://www.water.ie/docs/IrishWater-TaxClearanceCertificateNovember2013.pdf

    http://www.water.ie/docs/IRISH-WATER-Tax-Clearance-Certificate.pdf


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    #4842
    Highflyer13
    Closed Accounts Posts: 954 ✭✭✭Highflyer13


    Full statement by deputy Murphy.
    http://us5.campaign-archive2.com/?u=a0e3e2f17814c5b5feb9a1b04&id=25f497d86d

    Im happy to say she is my local T.D and she is intent on asking the right questions. Fair play to her.


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    #4843
    shinzon
    Registered Users Posts: 5,460 ✭✭✭shinzon


    KomradeBishop wrote: »
    Not been following any IW stuff - but just saw this on Brian M. Lucey's (Trinity econ professors) blog - a question from the TD Catherine Murphy:

    https://brianmlucey.wordpress.com/2014/12/04/questions-raised-regarding-the-awarding-of-irish-water-metering-contract/

    If there's truth to the facts in that question, and if there's no good explanation for that, then that could be an extremely significant indication of corruption in the selection process.

    Lets see the usual suspects spin this and defend it but of course IW is corrupt but we still want to give our money to them for water

    Lol

    Shin


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    #4844
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    gladrags wrote: »
    You already have one,you just don't know
    it.

    Until you look.

    Please enlighten me.


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    #4845
    Alun
    Registered Users Posts: 21,464 ✭✭✭✭Alun


    shinzon wrote: »
    Lets see the usual suspects spin this and defend it but of course IW is corrupt but we still want to give our money to them for water.
    In my own experience in large IT projects, it's actually not unusual for consortium members to not set themselves up under a new company name, but still be able to bid for the contracts. GMC and Sierra were two separate companies long before all this remember.


  • Options
    #4846
    gladrags
    Registered Users Posts: 6,028 ✭✭✭gladrags


    Alun wrote: »
    In my own experience in large IT projects, it's actually not unusual for consortium members to not set themselves up under a new company name, but still be able to bid for the contracts. GMC and Sierra were two separate companies long before all this remember.

    So it is all legit.


  • Options
    #4847
    Little CuChulainn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,624 ✭✭✭Little CuChulainn


    Would it not simply be the case that the companies lodged a joint bid and then formed a single company for the purposes of running it?


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    #4848
    gladrags
    Registered Users Posts: 6,028 ✭✭✭gladrags


    Little CuChulainn wrote: »
    Would it not simply be the case that the companies lodged a joint bid and then formed a single company for the purposes of running it?

    There are all sorts of possibilties,given the murky water that has passed under the bridge.

    If that is the case,surely there is evidence,
    to support your point of view.


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    #4849
    Little CuChulainn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,624 ✭✭✭Little CuChulainn


    gladrags wrote: »
    There are all sorts of possibilties,given the murky water that has passed under the bridge.

    If that is the case,surely there is evidence,
    to support your point of view.

    Most likely.


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    #4850
    Phonehead
    Registered Users Posts: 1,406 ✭✭✭Phonehead


    Ah Lads, let's be honest here and stop trying to fight square pegs into a round hole! I'm pretty sure the Public tendering process has some pretty strict legislation and I'd be very surprised if going in with the "promise" of setting up a company meets the criteria.


  • Options
    #4851
    gladrags
    Registered Users Posts: 6,028 ✭✭✭gladrags


    Little CuChulainn wrote: »
    Would it not simply be the case that the companies lodged a joint bid and then formed a single company for the purposes of running it?

    There are all sorts of possibilties,given the murky water that has passed under the bridge.

    If that is the case,surely there is evidence,
    to support your point of view.


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    #4852
    Little CuChulainn
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,624 ✭✭✭Little CuChulainn


    Phonehead wrote: »
    Ah Lads, let's be honest here and stop trying to fight square pegs into a round hole! I'm pretty sure the Public tendering process has some pretty strict legislation and I'd be very surprised if going in with the "promise" of setting up a company meets the criteria.

    You wouldn't have to promise anything though. You can simply lodge a joint bid. It's completely up to the two companies if they wish to form a separate joint company for the purpose of it. Wasn't the Bord Gais successful bid from a group of three companies who decided to go their separate ways with different parts of the company afterwards?


  • Options
    #4853
    keithclancy
    Registered Users Posts: 9,208 ✭✭✭keithclancy


    Alun wrote: »
    In my own experience in large IT projects, it's actually not unusual for consortium members to not set themselves up under a new company name, but still be able to bid for the contracts. GMC and Sierra were two separate companies long before all this remember.

    Yup, something like that I think.

    Vendors like HP and T-Systems do it all the time.
    Number 352921
    Name GMC CIVIL & MECHANICAL ENGINEERING LIMITED
    Address GMC GROUP, GMC HOUSE,
    MILLENNIUM BUSINESS PARK,
    BALLYCOOLIN,
    DUBLIN 15
    Registered 05/02/2002
    Status Normal

    Effective Date 05/02/2002
    Last AR Date 30/09/2014
    Next AR Date 30/09/2015
    Last Accounts to Date 31/12/2013

    Company Registration is easy, GMC Existed long before that.
    It's not like it popped up out of nowhere, its just a CRO Listing.


  • Options
    #4854
    Phonehead
    Registered Users Posts: 1,406 ✭✭✭Phonehead


    Little CuChulainn wrote: »
    You wouldn't have to promise anything though. You can simply lodge a joint bid. It's completely up to the two companies if they wish to form a separate joint company for the purpose of it. Wasn't the Bord Gais successful bid from a group of three companies who decided to go their separate ways with different parts of the company afterwards?

    It should be quiet easy to clear up then when we see support for this joint bid... this isn't a new story though and so far we haven't seen this simple evidence provided.


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    #4855
    DamagedTrax
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,277 ✭✭✭DamagedTrax


    Phonehead wrote: »
    I'm pretty sure the Public tendering process has some pretty strict legislation.

    luas.. TE...


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    #4856
    Highflyer13
    Closed Accounts Posts: 954 ✭✭✭Highflyer13


    Im surprised Denis hasn't deleted this from the INM archives. Lets not forget lightening can strike twice.

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/so-whos-afraid-of-denis-obrien-enda-kenny-is-26782500.html


    A quote from Enda Kenny in 2011
    Lets sever the links between politics and business once and for all and, in so doing, achieve three fundamental goals: stop the further pollution of our society; re-establish a moral code and order regarding public life

    Giving a contract for installation of meters to a company owned by a tax exile at massive cost to the public. FFS like.


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    #4857
    branie2
    Registered Users Posts: 10,301 ✭✭✭✭branie2


    How long does it take to install a water meter?


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    #4858
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,279 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Tony EH wrote: »
    Who?
    denhaagenite wrote: »
    This dude

    Wrong.

    Try again.


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    #4859
    Banjo String
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,380 ✭✭✭✭Banjo String


    branie2 wrote: »
    How long does it take to install a water meter?


    Apparenlty 50 times longer than it takes to remove one.


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    #4860
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,279 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Give us YOUR ideal Government then, please. We hear how "corrupt" this lt are, yet not one of you have offered a crediable alternative. I mean ones with well thought out workable plans, that won't send us back into the bad old days of buying elections resulting in austerity to dig us out of the mire.

    I don't have an "ideal" government. Such an idiotic wish doesn't exist.

    Speaking on behalf of myself, there is at the moment noboby in this country that I can vote for.

    However, I (and many, many others) DO know that the current lot is definitely not what I have in mind and when election time comes around, I'll make an informed choice as to who my vote will eventually go to.

    They had the best wishes of the people and they blew it spectacularly.


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    #4861
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,279 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Phonehead wrote: »
    Ah Lads, let's be honest here and stop trying to fight square pegs into a round hole! I'm pretty sure the Public tendering process has some pretty strict legislation and I'd be very surprised if going in with the "promise" of setting up a company meets the criteria.

    Especially when you had a crowd offering to do it for free.

    :pac:


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