IW/Anything Water Related-Warning in OP

Rubber_Soul

gandalf wrote: »

The Dublin City website page has been amended. A couple of days ago it did say that you had to get the approval of Irish Water before you installed a rainwater harvesting system.

This is true, it also gave the reason why.

http://i.imgur.com/5jM8TLF.png

Not sure why it's been amended in the meantime.

Wurly

SwiftJustice wrote: »

Taken from DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE, FOOD AND THE MARINE
MINIMUM SPECIFICATION FOR RAINWATER HARVESTING EQUIPMENT

THANKS!!

Ring the council then for clarification. A number of us did and we were all told the same. We needed to seek permission from IW.

Don't shoot the messenger with your 'haven't a clue what you're talking about' crap. It seems i've done more research than you've bothered to do!

SwiftJustice

Wurly wrote: »

THANKS!!

Ring the council then for clarification. A number of us did and we were all told the same. We needed to seek permission from IW.

Don't shoot the messenger with your 'haven't a clue what you're talking about' crap. It seems i've done more research than you've bothered to do!

Well it took me 20sec to look up the legislation rather then you who posted crap from a facebook page and then backed up your shoite from a commercial website who has no affliation with Irish Water/DCC.

gandalf

StarshipPooper wrote: »

This is true, it also gave the reason why.

http://i.imgur.com/5jM8TLF.png

Not sure why it's been amended in the meantime.

I'm assuming its because it was referenced on one of the protest Facebook pages and it was a knee jerk reaction. I saw it initially on the protest page that a friend shared and I doubled checked it was accurate on the Dublin city.ie site at the time to verify it.

Wurly

SwiftJustice wrote: »

Well it took me 20sec to look up the legislation rather then you who posted crap from a facebook page and then backed up your shoite from a commercial website who has no affliation with Irish Water/DCC.

Well round of applause for your insinuations.

Care to comment on this??

http://i.imgur.com/5jM8TLF.png

2moreMinutes

Wurly wrote: »

Ring the council for clarification then. I did. And they told me I needed permission from Irish Water. If you don't believe me, then call them yourself.

That's grand. I've no reason to believe they told you any different or that that's what you understood from what they told you.
It's just that the links you posted don't actually confirm or come close to confirming what you said earlier about not bring allowed these type of systems.
Needing permission from IW isn't exactly as dramatic as you tried to make it out earlier either (arrests etc in US, OMG the drama).

Roger Hassenforder

First link sets out criteria to be met to receive a particular grant for farmers. Second is a kick to touch.

There is no law against collecting rainwater for yourself, subject to compliance with planning, if not exempted.

Muahahaha

ronsh2000 wrote: »

I don't think it's illegal to leave an open container out in your back yard to collect rain water; correct me if I'm wrong. I think this whole controversy is about water infrastructure, rather than the rain that falls out of the sky. If you think the water that falls out of the sky somehow, magically, makes it way, purified, into your tap, and then wends it way safely into the ocean after you're done processing it, without cost, then maybe you need to grow up and start living in the real world.

Its very politically naive of you to think that Irish Water inserting a clause claiming ownership of all water isn't a copperfastening to make them immune from legal challenge further down the track. We already have evidence of this from other countries, if you're too blind to see it then you're beyond help because it has been debated and linked to ad nauseum right here in this very thread.

But of course you still won't believe me. To which I ask cui bono? Who gains by inserting a clause stating that Irish Water claims ownership rights on all water in Ireland? Who gains? The private company who eventually buy it out, that's who. So explain to me if it isn't to facilitate the privitisation of water then why exactly was the clause inserted ? Why even put it in in the first place if someone somewhere wasn't thinking of future events. These decisions don't happen in a vacumn, it's naive to think they do IMO.

Wurly

2moreMinutes wrote: »

That's grand. I've no reason to believe they told you any different or that that's what you understood from what they told you.
It's just that the links you posted don't actually confirm or come close to confirming what you said earlier about not bring allowed these type of systems.
Needing permission from IW isn't exactly as dramatic as you tried to make it out earlier either (arrests etc in US, OMG the drama).

I've posted more evidence above if you care to look for it.

Re your 'OMG the drama' comment... Do you not think it's a drama that people ANYWHERE are being arrested for collecting rainwater? That IS a drama.

How can you trust that the same won't happen here as it did in the US? If there is even a shred of doubt in your mind, then that is too much. This issue is just too important to dismiss.

How Soon Is Now

waking dreams wrote: »

What are the pro water charges people on here getting out of being pro water charges? What is the good side to these charges? Genuine interest.

Lol I still don't know where this "pro water charges" thing came from!

I doubt many people actually want to pay any taxs.

I think it's more a lot of people don't have issue paying for water if it's of benefit in the long run.

For me that's the main issue here we don't get anything in return for what our taxs go into like other country's do.

Our property tax basically goes no where when it should go straight into local areas etc.

God knows where the water tax money will go someone's back pocket anyway!

No one wants to pay these taxs but at the same time why shouldn't we pay for water?

One of my main issues with this constant protest is that so many of the people fighting the issue don't want anything other than to keep there own comfort s intact and to give themselves an even bigger stage to rant from!

I've seen nothing but bull**** online today from people patting themselves on the back for a "great" and "successful" day out today. Nothing has changed ffs.

Whoever replaces the current government the same people praising them now will hate them a few years down the line!

Why? Because it makes no ****ing difference who's in charge once there in there they become corrupt or buried under the ****e left for them!

Rubber_Soul

Wurly wrote: »

People have been arrested in the states for collecting rainwater

Can you provide links to these cases please.

Idbatterim

I watched the video that was posted on youtube, this was the caption!

This is what really goes on when there's no cameras around you won't here about this on Rte

I will be damned if this is the kind of person who will put in some joke of a party that will damage the country even more. They should have a literacy test, that you have to pass before you vote. The funny thing is, how many were out opportunistically demonstrating against IW and causing trouble? and how many of them will actually vote when push comes to shove?

Little CuChulainn

I'm pretty sure rainwater harvesting is restricted by UK councils and across the U.S. too. There are two main reasons. The first is to ensure that the process it goes through does not result in excessive amounts of harmful substance being released back into the water system. I'd imagine this is for commercial and industrial users. The second is for large scale collection and storage systems which can effect local environment. If you are collecting it to water your plants or flush your toilets its not something that will affect you.

waking dreams

How Soon Is Now wrote: »

Lol I still don't know where this "pro water charges" thing came from!

I doubt many people actually want to pay any taxs.

I think it's more a lot of people don't have issue paying for water if it's of benefit in the long run.

For me that's the main issue here we don't get anything in return for what our taxs go into like other country's do.

Our property tax basically goes no where when it should go straight into local areas etc.

God knows where the water tax money will go someone's back pocket anyway!

No one wants to pay these taxs but at the same time why shouldn't we pay for water?

One of my main issues with this constant protest is that so many of the people fighting the issue don't want anything other than to keep there own comfort s intact and to give themselves an even bigger stage to rant from!

I've seen nothing but bull**** online today from people patting themselves on the back for a "great" and "successful" day out today. Nothing has changed ffs.

Whoever replaces the current government the same people praising them now will hate them a few years down the line!

Why? Because it makes no ****ing difference who's in charge once there in there they become corrupt or buried under the ****e left for them!

Thanks! I know, Pro water sounds very silly. I agree with you. We should pay for water that we can trust to drink and water to flush it away. And that is the reason why I took a day off to protest today.

2moreMinutes

Wurly wrote: »

I've posted more evidence above if you care to look for it.

Re your 'OMG the drama' comment... Do you not think it's a drama that people ANYWHERE are being arrested for collecting rainwater? That IS a drama.

How can you trust that the same won't happen here as it did in the US? If there is even a shred of doubt in your mind, then that is too much. This issue is just too important to dismiss.

I seen that pic after I posted. It still doesn't mean they're not allowed. They need approval which is fair enough.

Tbh, I have little or no interest in what people are getting arrested in America over. A young girl won a Nobel Peace prize today as she was shot due to speaking out over education. Another guy also won it due to his fight against (I believe) child exploitation. I'm as concerned about these two issues arising in Ireland as I am about rainwater harvesters being arrested.

Little CuChulainn

Wurly wrote: »

I've posted more evidence above if you care to look for it.

Re your 'OMG the drama' comment... Do you not think it's a drama that people ANYWHERE are being arrested for collecting rainwater? That IS a drama.

How can you trust that the same won't happen here as it did in the US? If there is even a shred of doubt in your mind, then that is too much. This issue is just too important to dismiss.

Are you referring to the Oregon case? Wasn't that man diverting water meant for the public supply system to his own reservoir?

Muahahaha

StarshipPooper wrote: »

Can you provide links to these cases please.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=arrested+in+the+states+for+collecting+rainwater

:rolleyes:

Wurly

StarshipPooper wrote: »

Can you provide links to these cases please.

Sure. Here you go

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/man-sentenced-30-days-catching-rain-water-own-property-enters-jail

I'll find more tomorrow but now, bed.

Idbatterim

I have been very clear in my reasons for opposition to Irish Water

1. Data Protection - has been addressed in a very waffly way by the company eventually to a query I sent into them over two months ago.
2. PPS Numbers - gone
3. Guarantee that public ownership is enshrined in the constitution so a future government cannot "sell the family" jewels. - Doesn't look like it's coming (yet!) - That's a biggy for me.
4. Cronyism - The whole setup for Irish Water stinks to high heaven. From the awarding of the Water meter installation, the consultant fees, jobs for ex Public Servants who failed in the maintenance of the water network when they had responsibility for it in the County Councils.
5. We already pay for Water through multiple other tax streams. Significantly reduce or remove those and then I we can talk about this new consumption based tax.

They are my major issues. The Government have dealt with some of the minor ones but they have not dealt with the major ones. The pivotal one for me is the enshrining of the public ownership in the constitution via a referendum.

On point 3 given what has happened, I would put the chances of future privitisation at near non existant.

on point 4, yeah cronyism, lack of accountability, poor value for money, I absolutely agree with you. IW is the tip of the iceberg on this though...

on point 5, we are still borrowing billions. So where do you want to cut or increase taxes to address this. This we are already paying for it lark, you can apply that statement to to more than just the water charges!

Some people are paying over E2000 a year in motor tax and the pittance that is the water charges is causing uproar? LOL!

2moreMinutes

waking dreams wrote: »

What are the pro water charges people on here getting out of being pro water charges? What is the good side to these charges? Genuine interest.

I'm in favour of water charges for the same reason I was in favour of the LPT. Although not necessarily a tax, it broadens the tax base which should help avoid any one particular tax head or group of people from shouldering the brunt of any future tax increases should we find ourselves in another disaster situation like the last few years. I'd prefer metered charges but an introductory flat charge at least gets the ball rolling.

Roger Hassenforder

Wurly wrote: »

Sure. Here you go

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/man-sentenced-30-days-catching-rain-water-own-property-enters-jail

I'll find more tomorrow but now, bed.

Ah here, not exactly a butte
" The Oregon Water Resources Department, claims that Harrington has been violating the state’s water use law by diverting water from streams running into the Big Butte River"

Rubber_Soul

Muahahaha wrote: »

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=arrested+in+the+states+for+collecting+rainwater

:rolleyes:

I did google, all I could find was the case Wurly linked here.

Wurly wrote: »

Sure. Here you go

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/man-sentenced-30-days-catching-rain-water-own-property-enters-jail

I'll find more tomorrow but now, bed.

The problem with this is that he wasn't arrested for collecting rainwater, he was arrested and jailed for diverting at least 13 million gallons of water from streams running into a river meant for public supply.

Idbatterim

Riddle me this, how many of you who are now bemoaning the lack of reform, voted Labour, oh the irony?!

How Soon Is Now

waking dreams wrote: »

Thanks! I know, Pro water sounds very silly. I agree with you. We should pay for water that we can trust to drink and water to flush it away. And that is the reason why I took a day off to protest today.

For me the protest should be directed towards the right changes being made and things that will benefit us all now and for the future but it's gone way beyond that unfortunately!!

It's just an excuse for certain people to show there crack pot side now.

mojesius

Just home after being out all day at the protest then bringing my mam to Peter Gabriel. What a day!

I marched from garden of remembrance and joined up with the army group at the GPO. The march was similar to the last two big ones, until the crowd got to Kildare Street to see the entire street blocked off with loads of gardai. This antagonised a lot of people including myself as there was really no need for such heavy policing, but most kept on marching to the Merrion Square entrance. I joined a group from Athy and there were 3 or 4 young girls roaring their heads off - Got the surrounding crowd going including myself!

When we got to Merrion Square, people started climbing the barriers to attach their signs to the Dail gates. There was one garda ripping off a few signs and the whole crowd starting booing him so he eventually went away.

Great speeches, music, turnout and atmosphere. Huge effort put into some of the signs!

However, I couldn't understand why the city was still shut down for public transport after 7pm. The protest was more-or-less finished by 5pm and there were no luas or buses running at all, even on the northside as far up as the IFSC, until close to 8pm. No reason for it at that stage in that part of town other than to piss commuters off and cause a divide, in my opinion. It's just bad city management.

I didn't mind the walk to Peter Gabriel anyway!

waking dreams

2moreMinutes wrote: »

I'm in favour of water charges for the same reason I was in favour of the LPT. Although not necessarily a tax, it broadens the tax base which should help avoid any one particular tax head or group of people from shouldering the brunt of any future tax increases should we find ourselves in another disaster situation like the last few years. I'd prefer metered charges but an introductory flat charge at least gets the ball rolling.

But sure that makes no sense at all. The charge is being apparently used to pay back debt, I feckin hope. Once the debt is paid it goes private. Then the money goes out of our control. So we all shoulder the brunt for no return from day one. Are ya mad?

Rubber_Soul

mojesius wrote: »

However, I couldn't understand why the city was still shut down for public transport after 7pm. The protest was more-or-less finished by 5pm and there were no luas or buses running at all, even on the northside as far up as the IFSC, until close to 8pm. No reason for it at that stage in that part of town other than to piss commuters off and cause a divide, in my opinion. It's just bad city management.

I didn't mind the walk to Peter Gabriel anyway!

You can blame the handful of Eirigi clowns that decided to block O'Connell Bridge for that one. See here http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=93391940&postcount=6215

waking dreams

How Soon Is Now wrote: »

For me the protest should be directed towards the right changes being made and things that will benefit us all now and for the future but it's gone way beyond that unfortunately!!

It's just an excuse for certain people to show there crack pot side now.

Fully agree. I joined in because I know that if the public refuse to pay this water charge they will see that they can actually have a say in how this rock works. It's a start anyways.

How Soon Is Now

waking dreams wrote: »

Fully agree. I joined in because I know that if the public refuse to pay this water charge they will see that they can actually have a say in how this rock works. It's a start anyways.

Ireland as a country won't unite when it comes to something like refusing to pay a tax because for everyone who doesn't pay there will be double that who will out of fear or there own personal reasons.

Government know this everyone knows this its why the country is the way it is. Things don't follow threw most of the time here.

waking dreams

How Soon Is Now wrote: »

Ireland as a country won't unite when it comes to something like refusing to pay a tax because for everyone who doesn't pay there will be double that who will out of fear or there own personal reasons.

Government know this everyone knows this its why the country is the way it is. Things don't follow threw most of the time here.

Defo! I have been saying for ages that in order for something like that to happen that people need to make the decision to look at life and ask is this as good as it gets? You cant make someone do something unless they want to.