IW/Anything Water Related-Warning in OP

Falthyron

DamagedTrax wrote: »

if, given the above and after all the bad will FG & mini FG have managed to produce for themselves, do you honestly think this protest is done?

the government got the message, they know their time is up.

Yes, the protest's momentum is gone now. As I said before, the 100,000 (if accurate) was the peak of the movement. The government made a step-back in response, has there been an announcement of a further step-back made today? No.

"Their time is up"? Really. I mean, inflating the numbers is one thing, but vacuous, grandiose statements is pushing the limit. Has the government resigned? And if their time is up, when is it exactly you expect them to resign? Fabricating success and significance does not make it a reality. The government didn't crumble. Enda Kenny hasn't announced his resignation, so where do you mark the success of yesterday's campaign? At least the last protest yielded a result; the step-back. What has yesterday's done, exactly?

Timberrrrrrrr

shinzon wrote: »

I believe he means this video and yes im well aware what it says underneath it but you did ask, 1 minute 30 in

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10152508713593091

Shin

I see highly trained K9 units, Where are the "Attack dogs" though?

Grayson

DamagedTrax wrote: »

and our rents are shooting back up to pre crash rates...

we'll be the fastest falling again soon enough.

america is on the brink, if they fall again we're properly bolloxed.

Rents in Dublin are rising. And that's good to an extend. However we don't want them rising too fast or too much. That's why the government is releasing houses from NAMA and taking other measures.

However it does take a real pessimist to view positive economic change as a precursor of a crash. If they price of rents were dropping you'd say it's a recession. if they were static you'd say the economy is stagnant.


America's not as bad as everyone makes out. Employment there is at a 7 year low. it's at 5.8% unemployed. there are issues with that. it doesn't talk about the people who are in employment but still poor, however it does mean that the economy over all is improving= in the US. A crash there isn't too likely.

DamagedTrax

Falthyron wrote: »

Yes, the protest's momentum is gone now. As I said before, the 100,000 (if accurate) was the peak of the movement. The government made a step-back in response, has there been an announcement of a further step-back made today? No.

"Their time is up"? Really. I mean, inflating the numbers is one thing, but vacuous, grandiose statements is pushing the limit. Has the government resigned? And if their time is up, when is it exactly you expect them to resign? Fabricating success and significance does not make it a reality. The government didn't crumble. Enda Kenny hasn't announced his resignation, so where do you mark the success of yesterday's campaign? At least the last protest yielded a result; the step-back. What has yesterday's done, exactly?

im sorry i need to spell it out clearly to you, i wasnt aware you needed a simplistic subtext to understand.

their time is up in the eyes of the movement, their time is up in the eyes of a huge amount of the electorate.

lets not waste anymore internets on trying to prove your intelligence with word play, yea?

shinzon

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I see highly trained K9 units, Where are the "Attack dogs" though?

What do those dogs do if given a specific command by its handler its not hard to see what he meant tbh.

Shin

Tony EH

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Nothing like a snarling German shepherd and a face full of tear gas to bring muppets like Eirgre to heel.

Be careful what you wish for. :rolleyes:

Falthyron

DamagedTrax wrote: »

im sorry i need to spell it out clearly to you, i wasnt aware you needed a simplistic subtext to understand.

their time is up in the eyes of the movement, their time is up in the eyes of a huge amount of the electorate.

lets not waste anymore internets on trying to prove your intelligence with word play, yea?

"In the eyes of the movement", so that would be the 30,000-40,000 that turned up yesterday? "A huge amount of the electorate", perhaps a source, some figures? Or are you just throwing around grandiose statements with no evidence? If your 100,000 estimate is accurate, that would equate to 2.17% of the population of Ireland. Where is the 'huge' in that number, exactly?

The 2.17% is achieved through maths, by the way. Just in case you didn't understand the subtext or number play.

DamagedTrax

Grayson wrote: »

.
However it does take a reall pessimist to view positive economic change as a precursor of a crash. If they price of rents were dropping you'd say it's a recession. if they were static you'd say the economy is stagnant.

economists world wide are holding their heads in their hands at whats happening currently. america's possible default hasnt gone away, they just brushed it under the carpet for a few months. ireland, as we seen during the last recession, is completely reliant on the US economy being stable (due to massive holdings by UK banks in both countries).

and by the way, if rent prices were stagnant it would most likely come about thru capping. if that was the case i'd be very happy.

Timberrrrrrrr

shinzon wrote: »

What do those dogs do if given a specific command by its handler its not hard to see what he meant tbh.

Shin

The dog is trained to do a job, calling it an attack dog is sensationalizing the dogs function, If you have a police dog hanging from your arm chances are you deserve it.

ROCKMAN

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I see highly trained K9 units, Where are the "Attack dogs" though?

The breed of dog 99% of the time is a fair indicator of the role of the Dogs within these K9 units ..
They sure didn't look like drug dogs to me....

Timberrrrrrrr

Falthyron wrote: »

"In the eyes of the movement", so that would be the 30,000-40,000 that turned up yesterday? "A huge amount of the electorate", perhaps a source, some figures? Or are you just throwing around grandiose statements with no evidence? If your 100,000 estimate is accurate, that would equate to 2.17% of the population of Ireland. Where is the 'huge' in that number, exactly?

The 2.17% is achieved through maths, by the way. Just in case you didn't understand the subtext or number play.

Sure do you not know? That's the majority of citizens in the eyes of the anti water lads/lasses

Banjo String

keithclancy wrote: »

Would you prefer they dressed up as Barney the Dinosaur and had poodles ?

Like This one ?

DamagedTrax

Falthyron wrote: »

"In the eyes of the movement", so that would be the 30,000-40,000 that turned up yesterday? "A huge amount of the electorate", perhaps a source, some figures? Or are you just throwing around grandiose statements with no evidence? If your 100,000 estimate is accurate, that would equate to 2.17% of the population of Ireland. Where is the 'huge' in that number, exactly?

for the very last time. the numbers that turned out yesterday were just a fraction of the overall figure of people willing to protest (in any format) against IW.

the 900,000 returned packs are proof of this.

that means 600,000 homeowners didnt even bother returning them, that doesnt even touch on the amount of people that just returned them to sender with no info.

Tony EH

Falthyron wrote: »

There are 350,000 people on Social Welfare. That is 350,000 people who have the time to protest and who can not afford the Water charges, and are generally angry at the government for lack of employment opportunities. Why is it that the protest can only muster up 30,000-40,000? If your ballpark and laughable figure of 100,000 is accepted, where are the other 250,000 people? Is it possible they actually agree/understand with what is necessary?

Would love a response to that question.

What an utterly stupid post.

Cantona's Collars

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/04/06/article-1374014-0B81A4F300000578-853_634x436.jpg

Too close for comfort for some of the posters here?

Falthyron

DamagedTrax wrote: »

for the very last time. the numbers that turned out yesterday were just a fraction of the overall figure of people willing to protest (in any format) against IW.

the 900,000 returned packs are proof of this.

that means 600,000 homeowners didnt even bother returning them, that doesnt even touch on the amount of people that just returned them to sender with no info.

Oh, so it is a matter of convenience then? It was convenient for those to send back the 900,000* packs, but inconvenient for them to turn up to protest. Sorry, I thought we were talking about a tangible measurement for protest. My mistake. I guess those who don't pay their TV license are also currently undertaking a campaign of protest against the government. Do you have any info on that protest and when they meet?

*Unverified.

Care to explain why the 900,000 didn't turn up to the protest yesterday? Without grandiose and vacuous statements though, I prefer something more concrete, not hot air.

Timberrrrrrrr

ROCKMAN wrote: »

The breed of dog 99% of the time is a fair indicator of the role of the Dogs within these K9 units ..
They sure didn't look like drug dogs to me....

Really?

Highflyer13

zerks wrote: »

Did anybody hear the email read out on TodayFM earlier,some woman complaining that it pisses her off the people were protesting about water charges instead of care homes (which are being investigated,but she forgot that)Her argument became pretty invalid when she said she was financially comfortable and water charges wouldn't affect her unlike many many more who simply can't stretch to paying another bill.

I heard it in the car. She read out a ton of them. I had to turn it off as I was fuming. I do agree that we need state of the nation protests though that cover IW, health, corruption, cronyism, lack of accountability, media interference etc

2moreMinutes

waking dreams wrote: »

But sure that makes no sense at all. The charge is being apparently used to pay back debt, I feckin hope. Once the debt is paid it goes private. Then the money goes out of our control. So we all shoulder the brunt for no return from day one. Are ya mad?

Wha? I'm surely missing something here?

Falthyron

Tony EH wrote: »

What an utterly stupid post.

Forgive my ignorance, perhaps a reason for this description could be provided? Again, specifics seem to be a problem for anti-IW members, so I would implore you to elaborate on what exactly is 'stupid' about that post. Oh, and as a pre-cursor, check out the conversation that continued on from that original post, it might shed some light on the rationale being used.

Tony EH

keithclancy wrote: »

I think there are very very few that are Pro Irish Water in it's current form, I can only speak for myself but I don't think burning the whole thing down (IW) and kicking out the existing Government is the best way to resolve problems.

Then YOU ARE Pro Irish Water.

Hoping that things will just get better, with everything that's on the table, is simply stupid.

Irish Water is a complete and utter disaster and WILL NOT improve. It needs to be gotten rid of and a new, clean, transparent situation put in it's place.

Until that happens there will always be a cloud over this farce of a company and all the hopes and government backflips in the world won't make any difference.

shinzon

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

The dog is trained to do a job, calling it an attack dog is sensationalizing the dogs function, If you have a police dog hanging from your arm chances are you deserve it.

What happened after the march yesterday was codology and I don't agree with it but to publicly say on a forum somebody deserves to have a dog hanging off them is disgusting

Ill probably get banned for this but I get an infraction yesterday for apparently baiting keith clancy but yet this is allowed, seems a bit skewed to me

Shin

Tony EH

Falthyron wrote: »

Forgive my ignorance, perhaps a reason for this description could be provided? Again, specifics seem to be a problem for anti-IW members, so I would implore you to elaborate on what exactly is 'stupid' about that post. Oh, and as a pre-cursor, check out the conversation that continued on from that original post, it might shed some light on the rationale being used.

What? You're really having trouble understanding why tarring 350,000 people with the same brush is stupid?

REALLY?

:pac:

DamagedTrax

Falthyron wrote: »

Oh, so it is a matter of convenience then? It was convenient for those to send back the 900,000* packs, but inconvenient for them to turn up to protest. Sorry, I thought we were talking about a tangible measurement for protest. My mistake. I guess those who don't pay their TV license are also currently undertaking a campaign of protest against the government. Do you have any info on that protest and when they meet?

*Unverified.

Care to explain why the 900,000 didn't turn up to the protest yesterday? Without grandiose and vacuous statements though, I prefer something more concrete, not hot air.

im sorry, ive tried but the above clearly shows your comprehension of the subject to be on par with that of a child, at best. good luck to you.

Timberrrrrrrr

shinzon wrote: »

What happened after the march yesterday was codology and I don't agree with it but to publicly say on a forum somebody deserves to have a dog hanging off them is disgusting

Ill probably get banned for this but I get an infraction yesterday for apparently baiting keith clancy but yet this is allowed, seems a bit skewed to me

Shin

So the guards should continue to use kid gloves on these idiots and let them disrupt the lives of hundreds of thousands of people? They should have been told to move and if they refused then the guards should have used WHATEVER force necessary to move them, Whether that force is batons, tear gas or K9 units then so be it but no way should they be let hold a city of over a million to ransom.

Falthyron

Tony EH wrote: »

What? You're really having trouble understanding why tarring 350,000 people with the same brush is stupid?

REALLY?

:pac:

Hmm.. I didn't tar anyone with the same brush. I asked a question. I asked why did the protest struggle to hit more than 40,000 when people on Social Welfare amount to 350,000. Many of the anti-IW people blame this government for the high unemployment, surely if that is the case, those 350,000 would be out marching with them? Or is there another reason for the lack of numbers? Again, a question.

gladrags

Well done to all who attended yesterdays event.

I was a day to remember.
Although it was mainly sunny,there was a bitter wind,and I was amazed to see such a cross section of people attend.

So many families with young kids,people from all parts of Ireland,and from London,and other parts of the UK.Older citizens,in wheelchairs,and on crutches ,marching through the bitter wind, defiant.

The good humour and sense of determination, rang through.You could get a sense of pride from many,that their voices were,and will be heard.

In spite of the negative press coverage,the ugly campaign to smear the right to protest,
has failed.And yesterdays march was another example ,that the vast majority of people have had enough,of the continuous dysfunctional political systems,that offer more of the same.

Shattered trust,and a broken failed system,needs to be replaced by democratic viable alternatives.

The total failure of successive governments,to upgrade and modernise,the water system over the last 50 years,on for example,a step by step basis.Is another example,of lack of vision and planning.

The water protests have given people real hope,and reflect other critical issues,such as the crisise in health and housing,to which I heard many refer to yesterday.

Irish Water has failed,through mismanagement,and the same lack of vision apparent to successive FF and FG cabals.Trust is gone,another HSE in waiting.

Never choose a cowards explanation,that hides behind the cause and the effect.

Well done.

Falthyron

DamagedTrax wrote: »

im sorry, ive tried but the above clearly shows your comprehension of the subject to be on par with that of a child, at best. good luck to you.

There, there. You tried to explain your case with big statements lacking evidence, and empty words without meaning.

9/10 for a fiction-piece, would read again.

Tony EH

Falthyron wrote: »

Hmm.. I didn't tar anyone with the same brush. I asked a question. I asked why did the protest struggle to hit more than 40,000 when people on Social Welfare amount to 350,000. Many of the anti-IW people blame this government for the high unemployment, surely if that is the case, those 350,000 would be out marching with them? Or is there another reason for the lack of numbers? Again, a question.

That's not "asking a question", don't try and pass off that bollocks with me.

You're making an insinuation.

Banjo String

Falthyron wrote: »

Hmm.. I didn't tar anyone with the same brush. I asked a question. I asked why did the protest struggle to hit more than 40,000 when people on Social Welfare amount to 350,000. Many of the anti-IW people blame this government for the high unemployment, surely if that is the case, those 350,000 would be out marching with them? Or is there another reason for the lack of numbers? Again, a question.

How many people in support of Irish Water took to the streets in a show of support?

Organise your own, anti - anti Irish Water meter protests, report back on how you get on.