IW/Anything Water Related-Warning in OP

Red Pepper

Phoebas wrote: »

Irish Water are employing people with experience in water service consultancy?
That's awful! :rolleyes:

You're obviously too naive to miss the point Phoebe.:)

ThinkAboutIt

ThinkAboutIt wrote: »

If you didn't buy a newspaper three days a week, you would have enough money to pay for unlimited water for the year.

If you took one less Dublin Bus journey a week and walked instead, you would have enough money to pay for unlimited water for the year.

I could go on. People are being totally unreasonable about this. You just can't talk sense into them it seems.

For the next 7 years these charges will just about cover the setting up of IW, never mind even a drop of water. Sense?

smash

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

What experience is this now?

None. They've also taken on staff from all the councils plus more. They're over staffed!

_Kaiser_

ThinkAboutIt wrote: »

If you didn't buy a newspaper three days a week, you would have enough money to pay for unlimited water for the year.

If you took one less Dublin Bus journey a week and walked instead, you would have enough money to pay for unlimited water for the year.

I could go on. People are being totally unreasonable about this. You just can't talk sense into them it seems.

You're missing the point...

It's not about the amount at all for most people. Most people realise that services have to be paid for, and have no issue with contributing to that - it's why most people pay their taxes.

The problem people have here is the incompetence, waste, and cronyism (as so ably highlighted by Red Pepper above) that's surrounded IW from the start - and which Kenny and his cabinet are arrogantly determined to force though regardless, first by threats and intimidation, then by trying to split the protesters, and now by trying to buy people off with "special introductory offers"

It's another wasteful HSE-like quango set up by a Government that promised to eliminate such things but which has proven that that too was just another lie to get them into power.

People have had enough of it - the lies, the spin, the corruption, waste, and incompetence by a government that has actually managed to make the last lot look competent at this stage!

Banjo String

ThinkAboutIt wrote: »

Happy with €160 a year for unlimited water. Great value for the service. I'm sure there's a lot of things people waste €3.08 a week on, I'd much rather not get one pint every two weeks and use the money for unlimited water at home, far healthier too!

ThinkAboutIt wrote: »

If you didn't buy a newspaper three days a week, you would have enough money to pay for unlimited water for the year.

If you took one less Dublin Bus journey a week and walked instead, you would have enough money to pay for unlimited water for the year.

I could go on. People are being totally unreasonable about this. You just can't talk sense into them it seems.

They said that about the HHC too......

Now check out LPT rates.....


Sadly there are some people that will be fooled some of the time.

gandalf

Chinasea wrote: »

That is the problem, no matter what, there are people who just want to skive.

I believe we should ALL pay for water consumption. No waivers either. What incentive is there to stop people wasting. If you don't pay your water consumption, your "free" supply should be reduced to a mere trickle (if even). Water does need to be collected, cleaned and piped to your kitchen sink.

If you don't want to pay for the service than collect the water yourself. I don't agree with the way Irish Water was set up, and I don't agree with how much consultants, judges, lawyers, CEO's of charities, top civil servants and so on. but that is a SEPARATE issue.

Sorry but you are absolutely and TOTALLY WRONG!

Firstly we are already paying for this service via multiple streams of taxation.

Secondly they have not secured water resources into public ownership at all yet. The option to sell off to the highest bidder is still there.

The set up of Irish Water has been flawed from day one with the organisation being filled at the top with the same characters who couldn't manage the infrastructure in the councils. Now they have their nice big pensions and a lovely new private sector wage on top of it. This is the reality of the FG promises to reform the PS and Government.

I believe we should pay for water consumption as well just not via a fatally flawed organisation like Irish Water. My father always said to me you don't throw good money after bad, you need to learn when to walk away.

dav3

With the water meters now redundant (there won't be enough money taken in to fix the leaks anyway), why are they ploughing ahead with installation?

Banjo String

dav3 wrote: »

With the water meters now redundant (there won't be enough money taken in to fix the leaks anyway), why are they ploughing ahead with installation?

I am wondering about this on the estates that are protesting (donaghmede) for example? Whats the point in antagonising the people that clearly do not want a meter installed, if said meternow, doesn't need to be installed?

I have asked this many times, and have yet to get an answer that makes sense.

gandalf

Phoebas wrote: »

Irish Water are employing people with experience in water service consultancy?
That's awful! :rolleyes:

Irish Water employing people who couldn't manage the job in the County Councils is at best stupidity. At worst it is incompetence, jobs for the boys and borderline corruption.

_Kaiser_

dav3 wrote: »

With the water meters now redundant (there won't be enough money taken in to fix the leaks anyway), why are they ploughing ahead with installation?

Banjo String wrote: »

I have asked this many times, and have yet to get an answer that makes sense.

That's easy.. Siteserv (and it's FG friendly owner) has to be paid

Daith

gandalf wrote: »

Irish Water employing people who couldn't manage the job in the County Councils is at best stupidity. At worst it is incompetence, jobs for the boys and borderline corruption.

No, no. Apparently we only have terrible infrastructure because of under funding. Nothing at all to do with the people doing the job.

gandalf

BTW the charge for Irish Water is €260 with a €100 rebate from the DSP. The Government have stated that the charge won't go up until 2019, they haven't said that the rebate will be in place until then though??

I fully expect the charge to ramp up majorly in 2019 to double what it is now.

Odyssey 2005

The government must be running scared,so far this morning we've had. Ministers Covney, Kelly and moan Burton is on the PK show. End must have given them a right good kick in the hole to save his job..

dav3

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

That's easy.. Siteserv (and it's FG friendly owner) has to be paid

Denis 'Siteserv' O'Brien? Denis who buys up media outlets enabling him to influence public opinion. Denis who donates to FG because he loves shirts and the colour blue so much, and is not in any way trying to influence policy-making decisions.

I don't believe it.

Leroy42

gandalf wrote: »

BTW the charge for Irish Water is €260 with a €100 rebate from the DSP. The Government have stated that the charge won't go up until 2019, they haven't said that the rebate will be in place until then though??

I fully expect the charge to ramp up majorly in 2019 to double what it is now.

This is what I am asking. Why is everyone peddling the 160 line that the government is stating?

The charge for a single person is 160, for more than that it is 260. This is actually up from the previous costs. Enda Kenny stated a few months ago that the average for a family would be 248, it is now 260.

The 100 rebate, well that can be done away with whenever they like. At best it will stay the same regardless of how much the rates go to after 2018. I would suspect that after the next election it will be reduced, maybe given as a tax credit, maybe only paid paid upon claiming on your annual tax return (most PAYE workers don't do this).

The 260 is what we need to be focused on, not the smoke and mirrors 160.

They removed the house allowance of 30k litres as well, so every drop needs to be paid for. Make no mistake, the figures are all based on getting IW off balance sheet, they are just moving numbers around. If enough people fall for this three card trick, and it seems from here that certain people are, then we really do deserve everything the government and the EU throw at us.

Stargate

Banjo String wrote: »

I am wondering about this on the estates that are protesting (donaghmede) for example? Whats the point in antagonising the people that clearly do not want a meter installed, if said meternow, doesn't need to be installed?

I have asked this many times, and have yet to get an answer that makes sense.

I think this is a very important point.

It beggars belief to be honest.

I mean surly it would have been a lot easier to "sell" this whole IW pony if they already had been installed elsewhere peacefully.
Nope , instead they ploughed head on into the areas with most resistance.

Yeah that's what they paid the top notch consultants the big money for :rolleyes:

Banjo String

Carrots on sticks....


Charges capped at "€260", €100 of which must be claimed back from DSW.


In order for the DSW to process this "rebate" I presume you will first have to register, and agree to bcome an Irish Water customer, and all the terms and conditions that go with it.


The trap has been set, it has yet to be snared.

Odyssey 2005

Burton is sickening with Shane Coleman

Haxelrm

up sligo

Foxhound38

Banjo String wrote: »

I am wondering about this on the estates that are protesting (donaghmede) for example? Whats the point in antagonising the people that clearly do not want a meter installed, if said meternow, doesn't need to be installed?

I have asked this many times, and have yet to get an answer that makes sense.

Bacause meters are apparently still the best way to detect leaks. At present we're losing 50%of the entire water supply through leaks. Meters identify and find leaks. So far through metering IW have identified 22 individual homes who have leaks amounting to 1 million litres a day - enough to serve a large rural town.

I also think there is something about being able to beat the cap through metering although I am not sure how true that is, as I havent heard enough on it.

BoatMad

I mean surly it would have been a lot easier to "sell" this whole IW pony if they already had been installed elsewhere peacefully.
Nope , instead they ploughed head on into the areas with most resistance.

I see, they should not install meters where a protest is, you mean you can stop something lawful. Meters have nothing to do with the current problem, meters are actually a great idea

Charges capped at "€260", €100 of which must be claimed back from DSW.


In order for the DSW to process this "rebate" I presume you will first have to register, and agree to bcome an Irish Water customer, and all the terms and conditions that go with it.

I presume, if you don't want the rebate you needn't apply, furthermore if you are the " can't pay wont pay......" brigade , none of this concerns you at all.

BoatMad

They removed the house allowance of 30k litres as well, so every drop needs to be paid for. Make no mistake, the figures are all based on getting IW off balance sheet, they are just moving numbers around. If enough people fall for this three card trick, and it seems from here that certain people are, then we really do deserve everything the government and the EU throw at us.

The allowance for Kids is still there

Banjo String

Foxhound38 wrote: »

Bacause meters are apparently still the best way to detect leaks. At present we're losing 50%of the entire water supply through leaks. Meters identify and find leaks. So far through metering IW have identified 22 individual homes who have leaks amounting to 1 million litres a day - enough to serve a large rural town.

I also think there is something about being able to beat the cap through metering although I am not sure how true that is, as I havent heard enough on it.

So meter the estates that want to be metered (of which the govt and siteserv tell us there are many thousands not objecting) first.

No?

_Kaiser_

Foxhound38 wrote: »

I also think there is something about being able to beat the cap through metering although I am not sure how true that is, as I havent heard enough on it.

Ah yes, "beat the cap" - they really are trying to market this as some sort of Supermarket giveaway. :rolleyes:

As some in the media, and posters here, have already shown though once you look past the spin it actually is a worse deal than what was already rejected by people.

Larbre34

Foxhound38 wrote: »

Bacause meters are apparently still the best way to detect leaks. At present we're losing 50%of the entire water supply through leaks. Meters identify and find leaks. So far through metering IW have identified 22 individual homes who have leaks amounting to 1 million litres a day - enough to serve a large rural town.

Why is this still being peddled? Meters are only useful to find leaks on the private side of a meter, AFTER the water has passed through, if it is noticed that the rate of consumption is a multiple of what a house of such a size should be using.

The great majority of the infrastructure, the pipelines and pumps and junctions lie under the roads, meters will do nothing whatsoever to find the holes in that decrepit system

Leroy42

BoatMad wrote: »

The allowance for Kids is still there

I never mentioned the kids allowance. i mentioned the basic household allowance that was 30k

Odyssey 2005

Odyssey 2005 wrote: »

The government must be running scared,so far this morning we've had. Ministers Covney, Kelly and moan Burton is on the PK show. End must have given them a right good kick in the hole to save his job..

Still haven't heard one minister comment on sorting out the cronyism and corruption, I don't think many people will pay attention until they do.

Phoebas

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

What experience is this now?

This:

Red Pepper wrote: »

Both Jerry Grant, Irish Water’s head of asset management, and Elizabeth Arnett, head of communications and corporate services, previously worked for RPS Group, a consultancy firm that had advised the state in the setting up of Irish Water

tigger123

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

Still haven't heard one minister comment on sorting out the cronyism and corruption, I don't think many people will pay attention until they do.

Where's the corruption?

Tony EH

DamagedTrax wrote: »

looks like some of the lads down in limerick have had enough of enda & co.



http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/business/business-news/fine-gael-members-in-limerick-quit-in-protest-at-amateur-party-1-6426222#.VG0CTvQtIa4.twitter

If the protesters are "unreasonable" people, I wonder what FG thinks of these guys.

:pac: