McDonalds; another planning application

Annasopra

And from Lidls point of view this planning application will probably be easy enough as they wont have too many objections.

loyatemu

Joeytheparrot wrote:

And from Lidls point of view this planning application will probably be easy enough as they wont have too many objections.

Maybe that was their plan all along :pac:

Cerco

I expect the expanded Lidl will require additional staff. They would benefit from the new policy of paying a " living wage". I expect this would be more than McD's would have paid.

recedite

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Yes but if the PP is conditional on lidl ceding the land then if Lidl write to WCC to say they are not then the PP is invalid. Lidl could change its mind subsequently but then A) it would be a massive PR own goal and in that case McDs would have to restart planning all over again.

I see your point there, but I'm not sure that its correct. I'd assume a PP is valid for 5 years until it expires, regardless of how often the people involved changed their mind about going ahead with the project. Or until it is superseded by some alternative development being built on the same site.

swingking

The parents won't object to this new LIDL being built even though it's going to put extra pressure on the traffic in the area. I find this very hypocritical

loyatemu

swingking wrote: »

The parents won't object to this new LIDL being built even though it's going to put extra pressure on the traffic in the area. I find this very hypocritical

there's already a Lidl there, I'm not sure it would generate as many extra trips as a McDs.

Anyway I think this is a good result, gonna head into town for a Big Mac to celebrate later.

d31b0y

The new Lidl in Gorey is lovely.

Jimjay

So if lidl build a new store there what will go where the old store is? mcdonalds?

loyatemu

Jimjay wrote: »

So if lidl build a new store there what will go where the old store is? mcdonalds?

If they're planning to expand the current store ever the existing carpark, they'll probably use the McDs site for car parking; but I don't think anyone has seen the plans yet.

Annasopra

recedite wrote: »

I see your point there, but I'm not sure that its correct. I'd assume a PP is valid for 5 years until it expires, regardless of how often the people involved changed their mind about going ahead with the project. Or until it is superseded by some alternative development being built on the same site.

It doesnt really matter anyway McDs withdrew

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/mcdonald-s-outlet-beside-co-wicklow-school-ruled-out-1.2444654

pixbyjohn

The most important bit>
“McDonald’s Ireland engaged extensively with both Lidl and Wicklow County Council in advance of obtaining planning permission for a Drive-Thru restaurant."

Wicklow County Council would have had it in writing from Lidl as the owners of the site that they were selling/cedeing the site to McDonalds. So I can see a court claim over this turnaround by Lidl.
Fair play to Temple Carrig School Greystones for going it alone on the court action.

Mahogany

swingking wrote: »

The parents won't object to this new LIDL being built even though it's going to put extra pressure on the traffic in the area. I find this very hypocritical

Better a Lidl then a McDonalds

Alan_P

pixbyjohn wrote: »

Wicklow County Council would have had it in writing from Lidl as the owners of the site that they were selling/cedeing the site to McDonalds. So I can see a court claim over this turnaround by Lidl.

The letter from Lidl is available on the County Council site, it's page 15 of the planning application. All it says is that they are the legal owners of the site, and :-

"We hereby consent to McDonalds Ireland Limited making a planning application at this site for the development".

Not a word about selling, ceding or even leasing the site to McDonalds.

I'd be reasonably confident that if Lidl think they can walk away without repercussions, they can.

2011

swingking wrote: »

The parents won't object to this new LIDL being built even though it's going to put extra pressure on the traffic in the area. I find this very hypocritical

The impact on traffic has never been the main issue for me or anyone else that I talked to. Even the "pro McDonnalds" people seem to accept that there are more suitable locations in the area.

Obesity is a serious problem in Ireland, it is about time we treat it as such.

red_bairn

2011 wrote:

The impact on traffic has never been the main issue for me or anyone else that I talked to. Even the "pro McDonnalds" people seem to accept that there are more suitable locations in the area.

It may not have been traffic but it was footfall for "us" (when I was on the Rathdown Residents Association). There were no real problems for me personally.

swingking

2011 wrote: »

Obesity is a serious problem in Ireland, it is about time we treat it as such.

People have this belief that because McDonalds is not going to be there, then the kids won't be eating junk food. This is far from the truth.

I have seen first hand of kids going to LIDL and buying loads of pastries and sweets.

This problem needs to be tackled at the source Where are the kids getting the money ? How many are being given a packed lunch?

loyatemu

swingking wrote: »

People have this belief that because McDonalds is not going to be there, then the kids won't be eating junk food. This is far from the truth.

I have seen first hand of kids going to LIDL and buying loads of pastries and sweets.

This problem needs to be tackled at the source Where are the kids getting the money ? How many are being given a packed lunch?

Nobody thinks is a magic bullet solution to obesity - teenagers will always have money, and they'll continue to spend it on junk. Are you seriously suggesting no kid should be given pocket money until they're 18?

There's a big difference between a general supermarket and a fast-food joint who's entire business model is based on selling to kids and teenagers.

LEIN

loyatemu wrote: »

Nobody thinks is a magic bullet solution to obesity - teenagers will always have money, and they'll continue to spend it on junk. Are you seriously suggesting no kid should be given pocket money until they're 18?

There's a big difference between a general supermarket and a fast-food joint who's entire business model is based on selling to kids and teenagers.

That's a serious statement. Can you back that up?

Sweets at checkouts are aimed at adults?

loyatemu

LEIN wrote: »

That's a serious statement. Can you back that up?

Sweets at checkouts are aimed at adults?

Are you asking can I backup that McDs business model is primarily aimed at kids? Their mascot is a clown!

swingking

loyatemu wrote: »

Are you asking can I backup that McDs business model is primarily aimed at kids? Their mascot is a clown!

I would disagree with you on this.

I think McDonalds has a very large target market, not just kids. Take the McCafe for instance. Do you see many kids going here to get a cup of coffee ?

They serve salads as well. Again this are not aimed towards children.

loyatemu

swingking wrote: »

I would disagree with you on this.

I think McDonalds has a very large target market, not just kids. Take the McCafe for instance. Do you see many kids going here to get a cup of coffee ?

They serve salads as well. Again this are not aimed towards children.

they've broadened their market somewhat, I'd argue the McCafé is there to encourage parents to bring their kids in though

If I was going for a coffee on my own, McDs would be literally at the bottom of my list, I'd rather go to Costa, and I hate Costa.

Annasopra

swingking wrote: »

People have this belief that because McDonalds is not going to be there, then the kids won't be eating junk food.

I've never seen or heard anyone say that.

recedite

Anyone can eat at McDonalds, but it is true that teenagers tend to use it as a social venue. They are too young to get into the pub.
However, you could say the same thing about pubs being used as social venues by adults; there is a downside to alcohol consumption just as there is a downside to fast food.
In the absence of "society" providing any better venue for teenagers, Mc Donalds should be commended for providing a safe and affordable venue for them to meet each other socially.
BTW there is no shortage of Templecarrig uniforms in the Bray McDonalds when they are on a half day

Annasopra

I musy say the campaign against McDs impressed me. It stood its ground. It did its background research well. It was positive in its presentation. It got great media coverage and strong allies in the political, educational and media fields.

I know there was criticism of the campaign from supporters and opponents of the campaign but I think it has literally proved them all wrong.

Eponymous

It hasn't proved anything or anyone wrong. Because the JR is not now going ahead, you can't say for sure that the decision was in any way flawed.

Only thing you can "literally" prove is that Lidl decided against proceeding with the project.

What it has done is saved a lot of people a lot of money in legal fees. Less money in a lawyer's pocket is a good result!

pixbyjohn

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

I musy say the campaign against McDs impressed me. It stood its ground. It did its background research well. It was positive in its presentation. It got great media coverage and strong allies in the political, educational and media fields.

I know there was criticism of the campaign from supporters and opponents of the campaign but I think it has literally proved them all wrong.

The campaign didn't stop planning permission being granted

LagunaSeca

It stopped McD's moving into that site. Mission accomplished!

2011

swingking wrote: »

People have this belief that because McDonalds is not going to be there, then the kids won't be eating junk food.

I have heard all of the same arguments about cigarette advertising.

Annasopra

pixbyjohn wrote: »

The campaign didn't stop planning permission being granted

So what? McDs have retreated and the end goal was still achieved. These things happen in a campaign. Even more reason to admire their campaign. They persevered despite the setback and used different campaign strategies. Lidl and McDs didnt change their mind on this for no reason. Lidl - probably because they felt the pressure from members of the community contacting them and all of the bad pr in the national press, McDs probably just thought a court case was too much hassle. As I said the campaigners were criticised from all sides but they achieved their end goal with a well crafted campaingn strategy which impressed me.

Charlie-Bravo

There is still at the moment valid planning permission for a drive-thru fast food restaurant. Lidl could go bust tomorrow, unlikely I know, and that piece of land is presently of significant value! I'd be very cautious until something different had been applied for and the sod has been turned on it.