Emigrant votes - Yay or Nay?

braddun

should Europeans be allowed to vote

Wompa1

The emigrants!! I knew it was them, even when it was the water meters, I knew it was them!!

If they are Irish citizens, then sure, why not. I think most countries offer an absentee ballot...Look at us, acting like voting means a feckin' thing anyways. I'm abroad myself, if I had the vote in Ireland, I wouldn't bother my hole. I've voted a few times there but didn't bother in the last couple of elections.

Blind lead the blind

Kermit.de.frog

The problem I have with emigrants is the people that are getting this country back on it's feet stayed to face the music. Now the economy is on the up again the first in the door will be the deserters to stake a claim.

I would be against giving work to emigrants who left this country ahead of those who stayed.

But that is OT. They should not have a vote in general elections, end of.

csm

You'd rather they'd have stayed and claimed the dole then?

iba

anncoates wrote: »

They don't live here, don't pay taxes here etc. They can vote in the country in which they live.

All Irish Diplomats pay tax whilst abroad through the Irish taxation system, they pay PRSI, they pay income tax, they pay the universal tax

In addition, Irish diplomats are all subject to water charges, property tax etc

Galwayguy35

No.

I don't want the Government that will run the country being decided by people who no longer live here.

Jinonatron

As an emigrant who lives in Germany I don't think I should be able to vote in an Irish election simply because I am not paying tax there. Why should I affect the lives of the people who live there for issues such as government etc.

I think however referenda are different. If there is a referendum on abortion and same sex marriage I would head home to vote yes as I think people effected by those issues should be treated fairly. I don't think it's fair that gay people or irish women who want an abortion are not allowed to because a backwardbunch of lunatics wanna enforce their wishes on others. It's not any of their business.

irishmover

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

No.

I don't want the Government that will run the country being decided by people who no longer live here.

Because the government which has been decided by the people actually living in Ireland has been running the country any better??

Wompa1

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

The problem I have with emigrants is the people that are getting this country back on it's feet stayed to face the music. Now the economy is on the up again the first in the door will be the deserters to stake a claim.

I would be against giving work to emigrants who left this country ahead of those who stayed.

But that is OT. They should not have a vote in general elections, end of.

If everybody stayed the country would be even more f*cked than it is.

I left in 2012 by choice, I wasn't let go from my job it wasn't because of the hard economic times but I did pay top rate of tax for a few years, worked a total 15 years there...PRSI, USC and all of that crap. When I left that opened up a job for somebody who may have needed it more. Also, before I left, the recession benefitted me! In my last 2 years the cost of the essentials came down..I didn't leave when things were at their worst. I don't mind not being able to vote but that sentiment that people deserted is so stupid...

Also, if people went back there now, I think the pot is less sweet than it was in 2012! The price of rent and homes has gone up, the cost of the essentials has gone up. Property taxes and waters charges have\are being introduced.

Also, before the economy crashed. People still went to Australia for a year or two...it became more common, alright but in the long run the country will have benefitted from them leaving more than if they stayed.

Also, think about what bringing people back from other countries could do for the place. Pat McDonagh from Supremacs said in a radio interview that he liked hiring people in their offices that had experience in other countries and saw how things are done in other places...I know, personally I've seen how things are done in large corporations in the states. Something I only got a sniff of when working from Ireland.

RDM_83 again

Jinonatron wrote: »

I think however referenda are different. If there is a referendum on abortion and same sex marriage I would head home to vote yes as I think people effected by those issues should be treated fairly. I don't think it's fair that gay people or irish women who want an abortion are not allowed to because a backwardbunch of lunatics wanna enforce their wishes on others. It's not any of their business.

Interesting so your saying that Irish people who stay in Ireland are a "backwards bunch of lunatics" compared to those who emigrate, its also not even that likely that your idea would be that beneficial to achieving the result you desire since there is a large highly motivated deeply conservative bunch of Irish-Americans who are entitled to citizenship.
And if run the idea of Referendums only being for recent emigrants you will have to sort out the NI issue first.

Grayson

csm wrote: »

I'm a 'deserter' who lives in Aus and would love to come home. I grew up in Ireland. Most of my family and friends live there. I have a deep connection to the country and I would say I'm better informed about political subjects in Ireland than a lot of residents. I would have the following:

Presidential - yes, but diluted
Referendum - no
Dail - yes, but heavily diluted (e.g. all emigrants get one seat to vote for)

I would also limit it to emigrants (citizens who have been resident in Ireland at some stage). Possibly even those who have been registered to vote in Ireland. That and the dilution would address the concerns of having 20million passport-holders decide the fate of 4.5 million residents, while avoiding the complete disenfranchising of someone who goes abroad for work for a few years.

How about a few seanad seats instead of a Dail seat that can be voted on remotely by Irish immigrants? It gives them a say but no actual power.

As for people living here, I think an resident (especially an EU one) for 10 years or more should have full voting rights. I have a few Polish friends who got Irish passports, but the effort they had to go through was ridiculous. I know many others who wouldn't do it because they have no need for the passport. However they're not going anywhere. They've settled down, bought houses, had children. They're here for the long haul.

jank

Yes, of course. There is strong talk of enabling this for the next presidential election.
This is Ireland though, so new ideas like this is like watching the polar ice caps melt.

jank

Oh and the poll is wrong. It should be no taxation without representation.

anncoates

iba wrote: »

All Irish Diplomats pay tax whilst abroad through the Irish taxation system, they pay PRSI, they pay income tax, they pay the universal tax

In addition, Irish diplomats are all subject to water charges, property tax etc

Is everybody that emigrates from the country automatically a diplomat these days?

Rubberchikken

we can't get enough people, especially the young, living here to show an interest in voting when required. hard to imagine how the govt would manage to convince people who had the sense to leave to take the time in a foreign country to vote.


i do agree though with the fact that those that have worked abroad come back with a broader experience that those that remain.

c_man

I think they should have the vote for Presidential elections. No problem with that. I see where people are coming from in regards to Dail elections, so maybe have a set number of TDs (3??) set aside for emigrants. Their own consistency like

The_Captain

People on this board seem to be struggling to distinguish between emigrants and people of Irish descent.

Emigrants could well be repatriating money directly, or often people go abroad for a few years then move back here.

shruikan2553

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

The problem I have with emigrants is the people that are getting this country back on it's feet stayed to face the music. Now the economy is on the up again the first in the door will be the deserters to stake a claim.

I would be against giving work to emigrants who left this country ahead of those who stayed.

But that is OT. They should not have a vote in general elections, end of.

Bless your ikle heart. Will you be first in line for your saviour of the country award? I got the man at the door offering me untold riches if I left but I handed him back the ticket, looked off to the horizon, and as an Irish flag dropped behind me I said no, I will never leave, I will stay and help rebuild this country.

It wasn't as if I was too lazy to bother going anywhere so just kept things as they were and stayed.

rainbow kirby

I would favour giving the vote to emigrants for their first 5-7 years outside of Ireland - someone who was born, raised and educated in Ireland but emigrated as an adult will have much stronger ties to the country and is more likely to return and face the consequences of their vote than someone who is an Irish citizen by virtue of one Irish grandparent in the US.

Feels like my vote is trying to do the same thing regardless of whether I'm voting in Ireland or the UK though, get rid of the right wing scum that's in power.

Deenie123

rainbow kirby wrote: »

I would favour giving the vote to emigrants for their first 5-7 years outside of Ireland - someone who was born, raised and educated in Ireland but emigrated as an adult will have much stronger ties to the country and is more likely to return and face the consequences of their vote than someone who is an Irish citizen by virtue of one Irish grandparent in the US.

Feels like my vote is trying to do the same thing regardless of whether I'm voting in Ireland or the UK though, get rid of the right wing scum that's in power.

The current lot arent right wing, theyre just self serving.

jimgoose

No-one should be voting here unless they are domiciled for tax purposes here. Bloody nonsense.

Deenie123

jimgoose wrote: »

No-one should be voting here unless they are domiciled for tax purposes here. Bloody nonsense.

You can be domiciled here without being tax resident

Doc

I think Yes but with a time living out of the country limitation.

If you are going on around the world trip and it takes 1/2 a year then you should be able to vote while you are away. If you are living for 2 years or more away from Ireland then you should lose the right to vote outside the country and not get it back again unless you have lived back in Ireland again continually for at least 1/2 a year.

Cyclingtourist

Nay.

osarusan

Emigrants are deserters?



FFS, how moronic.

Grayson

I have a few Israeli friends who left Israel. To remain a citizen they have to keep paying taxes back there. As long as they do, they have voting rights. I think the US have something similar.

munchkin_utd

Grayson wrote: »

I have a few Israeli friends who left Israel. To remain a citizen they have to keep paying taxes back there. As long as they do, they have voting rights. I think the US have something similar.

very few countries have such a thing, and even for the US you have to be very well off to be required to pay tax, $97,600 according to one source, and even then tax paid abroad is somehow taken into account anyhow.

I'd have no problem in Ireland implementing that, because to be honest if taxes paid abroad are taken into account, then very very few will ever owe tax to Ireland as taxes abroad are nearly always higher than Irelands magically low income taxation rates.

The_Captain

Which tax do you think gives you the right to vote in Ireland exactly?

Can't be income tax because then the unemployed shouldn't have voting rights.

Capital Gains Tax? Motor Tax? VAT?

Pumpkinseeds

So how much would this nonsense cost the country then? It's bullcrap and a totally unnecessary expense. Any Irish national who doesn't reside in this country shouldn't be entitled to vote and we should not be wasting money on this crap.

iba

anncoates wrote: »

Is everybody that emigrates from the country automatically a diplomat these days?

Don't be stupid!