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I love it when a plan comes together

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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    Unfortunately fitness is no linear.

    You did do that 63 but this time last year despite having not missed January you were running the same pace at slightly higher effort levels and followed it up with your first 10k you managed without stopping. The WMM was a blip also which can happen to anyone on the day as the weather was pretty poor so on a different day at the same fitness there is no reason why you couldn't have achieved a PB going by the training you were logging. So despite the few hiccups over the winter you actually are at a higher base fitness than same time last year despite the training already put in year to date in 2015.

    The point about knowing when to have the confidence in knowing not to go out is one which takes time to fully get right (not sure I have even fully mastered it) but it's the objective fine balance between knowing when a run is going to make you injured or sick and when it is just are mind playing tricks. Our mind will always tell us know which is why runners have to be a little nuts in general to excel :D

    The thing is even with the training done last year there was still a few absences for a few reasons. This means that you have area's of consistency which are places you can improve on from last year as well as the starting from a higher base fitness meaning that there are a few extra stones unturned to get that extra boost of fitness.

    Fitness doesn't last however it becomes easier to regain your level of fitness you had previously, quicker meaning that you will get back to where you were fitness wise last year (when you PB'ed in the Half) and you can kick on from it.

    I accept that there are a few stones to unturn but i dont believe the speed will come. I would have thought that yesterday being effort based would have been more successful than it was. I was not breathing crazily, there was no reason for it to go so wrong. In my mind anyhow. Im worried that my legs just dont know how to do it because in the height of 2 training plans last year they never achieved speed and the only race that i thoroughly enjoyed without reservation was the hm...but even that was only a minute or two off my best training run.

    Clonee i felt terrific at and i honestly pushed all the way through that race. That was 1:01 min. Now maybe its a racing head that needed tweaking there...i dunno. I just dont believe it will happen.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,009 ✭✭✭Firedance


    Now maybe its a racing head that needed tweaking there...i dunno. I just dont believe it will happen.

    Well then it won't, it's (almost) as simple as that, unless you believe, and put in the work it won't happen. Equally, if you do believe, and you are consistent in your training (for a long period of time) then it will happen. Try it.

    Actually, why not make Clonee 10K your goal race? that gives you loads of time, its on 30th June.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    Firedance wrote: »
    Well then it won't, it's (almost) as simple as that, unless you believe, and put in the work it won't happen. Equally, if you do believe, and you are consistent in your training (for a long period of time) then it will happen. Try it.

    Actually, why not make Clonee 10K your goal race? that gives you loads of time, its on 30th June.


    That is actually not a bad idea re Clonee. And as proof that I do listen and take onboard advice...i just got at €20 heart rate monitor in lidl.

    I can fully accept that running since Oct really has been sloppy and im not saying i expect to be at 10k peak condition now. Im just concerned that a tempo effort based run was such a car crash. If consistency is the key from here on okay...i take that. But the source of my issue is that last year when it was consistent and i followed 2 plans from start to finish there was no improvement at all.

    Not blaming the plans at all just to be clear!


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,059 ✭✭✭Pacing Mule


    I think it's fair to point out that the inconsistencies in the training recently were outside of HS's control. It's not been that she didn't want to or lacked the motivation to train.

    I know that she's very frustrated with the pace of progress and to be very honest I think she deserved more. I'd have expected her to break 60 min for the 10k last year but it didn't materialise.

    At this stage though it really is a case of getting the consistency going again. I don't think any of us need to worry about the personal commitment level. And the good news is that there is a more solid base underneath it all to build from. I do have the confidence that the progress will come.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    HRM FTW!!!

    Running within my capabilities is making everything so much better. My legs, heart and lungs feel a hell of a lot better. Id be getting back from a run and a couple of hours later dying to go out again. Most runs Ive a smile on me chops and loving the feel of it all.

    Im not sure what information Im supposed to be logging about the hrm, Ive kept everything in the 81-89% that Runners World says to. My heart rates have gone from 145-160. Otherwise, the runs have looked like this:-

    11/3 - 4.8 miles avg pace 11:04
    12/3 - 6.5m took 1hr15mins. No phone for stats. This run included a hill I attempted a 4 weeks ago and failed miserably at. Gave myself 4 weeks to try it again. This run, I kept an eye on the hrm and glided up it. This was a good one!
    13/3 - 4.4m avg pace 11:22
    14/3 - 2.9m avg pace 10:53. Think strava went a bit mental with the first mile! No HRM. Only had a short time, husband doing hospital runs so couldnt round it up to 3.
    16/3 - 4.6m avg pace 11:20. Loved this one! I was actually late back from lunch because I didnt want to turn back.
    18/3 - 4.3m - a hungover mess. But following the consistency advice it had to be done. Pure misery :pac:
    19/3 - missed this one though.
    20/3 10miles woohoo!!! Avg pace 11:12 mins. I knew I had 10 miles in me. I just knew it was coming. So headed down to the PP. Bumped in to Muler. Did the first 3 or so miles with him. Was way too fast. Though strava disagrees :pac: It felt pretty bad. I was self conscious over the pace, every step spelled out guil--ty....guil--ty. When i tried to talk my breathing went to pot, but my legs felt grand. In fairness Muler said to take it as slow as I needed but I felt too bad and couldnt get the inner voices to shut up. Eventually the guilt and paranoia got to me and I really wanted to get 10 miles done so I had to part ways and get me sh*t together. So off I went and got it done. I had to stop twice, once with Muler and another along the side of the zoo, because of a stitch, unbelievable as that sounds :pac: Good news is on the 28th Feb I went out with the intention of doing 10 miles but only managed 7.5 and died when I saw my car. Today I had to pass my car 4 times to get to 10m and no way was I finished until then.

    Happy enough with today all in all :D


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,009 ✭✭✭Firedance


    great :) that's brilliant news!

    do you know your Max heart rate? if not just do a quick test, here's one that should work well - you don't need a track, the PP will do fine.

    At a track, do a warmup mile or two, followed by a mile at tempo pace, then gradually increase your speed over 400 meters before running a final quarter all out. "After every 100 meters during the last 400, look at your monitor and accelerate," says Atlanta-based coach Roy Benson. The highest number on your monitor will be close to your maximum heart rate. Once you know your true rate, you only need to update it every five years to see the effect of aging on your max heart rate.

    Once you have your max you will know what to run your easy paces at. HADD is a good place to start, he recommends 50 beats less than your max for all your easy runs - it works well.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,137 ✭✭✭El Caballo


    ^^^+1 to the above and good to see you getting back on track:). One thing is do not listen to that runners world article saying 81-89%, that heartrate zone is way off, 65-75% is much more reasonable and indicative of easy to aerobic running. Just be patient if your going to use HR, it will be slow at first.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    Ookkkaaaaay Im going to delete that response because the hrm has been explained to me and now that response looks stooopid. :o


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    Bit of a dodgy week distance wise

    Mon 21/3 - 2.9m avg pace 10:54. Thought I'd be wrecked after the 10 miles the day before. But it felt pretty ok. Not sure where Im losing the last .10m. Its the same route as always!

    Wed 23/3 - 3m avg pace 11:10. Wrecked is not the word. Like I'd been steam rolled by a tank. About a mile in I thought, Lets just see, considering how poop I feel, could I add something more. So I did some very short, conservative increased efforts. Bit cheeky, but might help confidence wise when the hurt starts in a race.

    Thurs 24/3 - 2.9m avg pace 11:08. Its our anniversary on Fri and with all the goings on a run would be tricky. So had to go today. Hilarious that this ended up 2 seconds faster than me meager speed attempts the day before. It felt a little easier than yesterday. But still pretty rough. I got in trouble for being late back last week from lunch. Normally I'd tell me manager go shove it, but as my boss is away (who would agree with me) I had to stick to strict lunch hour for the whole change, run, wash, change dealio. Which is why these two are a mile short.

    Sat 26/3 - 9.5m approx. 2 hours approx. Nothing gps wise charged and had to get out quick. Not a hope of doing a long run tomorrow so did it today. Im full sure it was 10 miles and I was home in less than two hours, but cant be sure. Felt pretty rotten again on the way out, so took it very easy. I warmed into it and when it came to where I had planned to turn back, I thought f*ck it. Lets just keep motoring, whats the worst that can happen? Well. I struck it lucky with the wind to my back on the way down. Of course, I knew that meant a pretty hard struggle on the way back, which would be uphill. But feck it! Feck it is right! Wind picked up. And up. And up. Then about a mile from home, the hailstones it. It was so bad I got brain freeze on the outside of my head :pac: I had to close my eyes and turn my back on the fullest force of it and wring my eyeballs out!! No phone. If I had it I would have made a rescue call to the husband. I contemplated stopping in the local and asking if I could borrow some o es phone :pac: My fingers were frozen, I was soaked to the skin. It was very much a run walk effort. When I finally got home and thudded on the window, the husband had to to strip me. Totally not in a sexy way :D

    I have wine now though so all is good. Not sure I'll manage to get out tomorrow, so that might just have to do for this week.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    The engine is broken!

    Mon 28/3 - 2.6m avg pace 11.32/mile - Felt okish when I started off but it quickly descended after the first mile into total hell. 4 stops to get myself together and try again. Normally this run is a lap of the estate and a little add on to get to 3 miles but it was too bad and adding on would have had no benefit and would have just extended the pain. The house was full of vomiting bugs all weekend and I wondered was I falling prey to it, but all the pain was in the legs rather than an overall drained feeling. I brought the kids up to the hell fire club earlier on in the day and there wasnt a sign of any heaviness or issues.

    Wed 30/3 - 4m approx avg pace 55 mins approx - Forgot to bring my phone to work so nothing stat wise but same Wed route as always, cut a little. My legs felt even worse today. I was a little sneezy and the lesser known dwarf throaty so perhaps i was a little on the sickly side of things. But two things....firstly it was again all stemming from the legs. It felt like there were 2 golf balls in my calves and no amount of slowing or distraction worked. I stopped to stretch at one point and it eased off a bit but kicked in again. There was a lot of stopping and a sit down on a grassy hill :o...hence the reason it took 55 mins! :pac: And secondly on the way back there was no stopping at all so wtf? If i was sick I should have felt crap thw entire time!

    1/4 - zero. Kids being off is throwing a spanner into the Friday runs. Last week I was able to circumvent it by going out on the Thurs...but this week with the legs feeling so bad i decided to see if i could figure something else out. And I devised the perfect plan. Boys were going on a sleepover to the grandparents. So I could easily drop the kids off..hang around for a polite chat...leg it back to the house and get a run in before date night. Only prob was son No 2 decided to throw one of his hellraising tantrums involving kicks and punches to his poor ma...so no way could i leave him there. I had to bring them home. Date night was off. But run could still be done when they were in bed tonight! Nope, issue was resolved, date night back on...no chance for a run. Normally I wouldnt go into such detail about me personal issues, but wanted to express the will being there but opportunity not. Running with the kids isnt an option but something that i intend to work on.

    Sat 2/4 - 8.7m - avg pace 11:21 - By far my second most favourite run ever. It ticked a few deadly boxes:-

    [/] Picking a route for sh*ts and giggles
    [/] Finally finding the route that goes along the Dodder!
    [/] Tallaght to Donnybrook run

    I have been wanting to try this for so long. Granted it was all downhill :pac: but it was so enjoyable. My legs were still fairly heavy despite the 2 days off though. Slowing down and distraction worked to a point but it wasnt an easy run by any means. I thought of chickey2's log where she said she felt great at the end of her base training and all I could think was, I feel fecked :pac: . I reckon I could have kept going though, which is nice.

    Funny thing though, when I got to the Mount Carmel a Spanish couple stopped me and asked for directions to Orwell Nursing home...I said I hadnt a clue but pointed them in the general Orwell direction. The woman then shows me her phone with the website of the place they were looking for and I said, if you have the website, there must be a phone number and suggested they ring that. Duh! :D I did offer to ring for them if they werent confident with their English but he said no...so on I went :D

    Sun 3/4 - 5.2 m avg pace 11:39 - Legs still felt rough for three quarters of the way. Was all the time hmmming about whether to do 4 miles, or try 5, purely to bring the weekly mileage up to 20 :o. When it started feeling really bad I settled for 4m. But then just before the home turn i felt ok, took out my phone and saw 4.3 on it and felt good enough to bring it up to 5, so that I did. The craziness that goes on when you've no plan to follow! :D

    So, not sure what the leg business is about. Hopefully its just a general tiredness that passes rather than a bug that Im just taunting! Major fingers crossed that its an elastic band effect that is slow and hard when pulling it back, but then catapults you forward in 7 days time! ;)


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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Roll on back to school! Snap, my Thursday/Friday runs were disrupted too, damn holidays :D And yeah, kids smell 'mammy is going running' and throw their worst wobbly. Been there!

    Hope the legs behave.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    Roll on back to school! Snap, my Thursday/Friday runs were disrupted too, damn holidays :D And yeah, kids smell 'mammy is going running' and throw their worst wobbly. Been there!

    Hope the legs behave.

    Have you ever seen that episode of The Simpsons where Lisa becomes a vegetarian and sends their bbq pig flying?..'its just a little dirty...its still good...its still good...its just a little airbourne...its still good...its still good'

    Trying to catch a run on one of those days always makes me think of that. :D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    Great Ireland Run 20th April 2106
    Time: 1hr 12.

    So time to face the music. I totally and utterly bottled it.

    A few weeks ago I felt more than ready. I felt strong, controlled and ready to get stuck in to something. The week before I was concerned about the tiredness so I did a few very light jogs, kept myself well hydrated all week and watched the diet like a hawk. Kept the nerves well under wraps. There was no need for them. It wasnt a goal race, I had no proper training other than easy runs done. It was just a tester. I had planned to go out at 10:30/m for as long as I could for the first 5k, knowing it was downhill and deal with the hills when I got to them. Im recovering so quickly after hills now, it should go ok.

    Nerves kicked in on Sat eve and just deteriorated after that. Sun morning I was backing out. Sitting on the bed shaking looking at my running gear. Put an emergency call out on Running the World. They calmed me and for sure got me to the start line. Nerves were overbearing standing there. Shakes were back. The MC says 'anyone feels like backing out, now is the time to do it'. I nearly jumped the fence.

    1-5k

    Off we went. I was feeling great, nerves suddenly gone. Legs felt great, I was up for it, just keep it as planned. Lots of people surged a head, but I was happy I was doing the right thing. Lots of distractions before the round about, lots of people running and stopping became annoying very early. But judge not lest ye be judged! Looked at the watch at the round a bout 9:09 !! I freakin panicked like hell. Wtf have I just done?! That was not the plan! Nevermind you've just started, plenty of time to slow it down, then came the 1km mark. Feckity f*ck. That is gonna kill me later.

    Go by feel, I thought. Forget the watch and go by feel. Was happy I was slowing down and going at a nice slower pace. The wind was in my face, but recalled the last few weekends and didnt let it bother me. Looked at the watch 10:10. Major panic. If hills kill me on easy runs at a 11 mins starting off, what the hell was going to happen here? Ive fecked it up. My number ripped off the pins and was flapping about. Had to stop to fix it. At that stage, Id already lost.

    Looking at Strava it says I stopped 2 more times before I even got to Crossing Point, but I dont remember them. All I remember is I felt so panicked and so out of practice that I was drowning. I thought of nipping out, but thought that would hurt more than any bad time.

    Not long after that I saw what I thought was the 5k marker. Looked at my watch 29 mins! Legend! Run! Get under the 5k and treat the rest like a training run, at least youll have something to take from it. The flags were a different colour, but I thought maybe it was to mark the half way. Ran for it anyhow. It was the water station. No 5k mark to be found, Im dying and when I hit it its going to be well over 30 mins. And the head went then. 5k was 35 mins :(

    I was going to have nothing to take from it. Time was going to be way off, the hills were coming, I was in a jock and the voice telling me I couldnt do it totally took over. It was walk/run after that. I tried for the hills, thinking with little effort Id put in, I should be able for them. I was starving, legs were jelly, head said no.

    So that was my Great Ireland Run lol. A tough course to get back in the saddle with but it was nothing I hadnt faced before and should have much better in. But the nerves and the lack of confidence were the only winners on the day.

    One thing is for sure. I learned more from today than I have from anything up until now. Probably the slow motion in which it all happened helped it sink in better :pac:

    Wed13 Apr 5.3/m avg pace 11:15/m

    Mon and Tues putting the running gear on was not something I felt like. Wed I went out. It felt great. Controlled. Easy. An absolute joy. So much so I snuck on an extra bit more than lunch hour allowed, with the change/wash factored in, but it felt so good I kept going.

    Fri 15 Apr 4 miles with 3 and a half* hills.

    Decided the voice in the head needs quietening. So I'd start with hills. Did a 1m warm up (with a loo stop :pac: ) up to the hill of choice. On the climb up to the hill the voice was back. Youre wrecked already, no way can you manage hills! My thinking was, dont be a martyr. Plan was to do 6, but as its a long time since I did anything like this, if 6 were too much call it a day. I would rather do 3 right than chuck in 3 more and wreck the head. Also, dont peg it up them. Control is what I want and each one to be right.

    First hill - pure joy. Timed it, it was 1 min so had my markers for the next few. 9:58. Perfect!
    Jog back to spot.
    Second hill - harder, but controlled everything ok.
    Jog back to spot
    Third hill - very hard. But I was recovering ok on the jog back. So went for another.
    Fourth hill - It was a battle. The body and the pain I can control. But that f*cking voice came back and I couldnt battle the two of them.

    Jogged/ran the long way back to the car. Not sure what the other times were for the last 3.5 hills as I had the phone not my watch and I wanted to concentrate. Not as fast as the first but controlled, but I think thats how its supposed to happen?

    I cant do races without confidence or work. Even when I tick those boxes the nerves are crippling. But at least I can work on the confidence and quieten down that voice.

    Also I shall be tackling that course on Sunday. Revisiting the scene of the crime lol. I need to figure out wtf happened.

    Any help or advice on what to do/where to go from here would be very gratefully received.

    Sorry about the lame post. Its embarrassing posting it what with all the great reports from Rotterdam etc. But I never did a report for the last 10k I did and now I wish I did so I could look back and compare with where it went wrong.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,059 ✭✭✭Pacing Mule


    When I read a log / race report what makes a good one IMO is the story of that persons journey, progress, setbacks etc. I don't think there's anything to be embarrassed about posting such an honest and frank report. It's far from lame.

    I think it's easy for people to say sure we all get nerves, why don't you get over it. But in some cases that is akin to people who have occasion to be a bit sad wondering why someone with deep depression doesn't just get over it. Heavy metaphors aside and by no means equating the race nerves with depression etc it provides a fascinating story. You know yourself you've ran much faster than that either side of the race in training runs. You will most likely have a great run on Sunday on the same course without the pressure. Last 10k you did was 62 minutes IIRC so the nerves coming into your story is a massive factor. It's a twist / angle that isn't mentioned much on boards.

    I'm blabbing on a bit but just wanted to say there's plenty of logs here documenting sub 3 marathons etc that are boring and tedious. Fair play to you for being so honest about your own situation.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    Well I wasnt expecting that Muler :pac:

    Thanks a lot. I didnt realise the problem it was tbh. I thought it was related to goal races and letting people down etc. But now I know its not that at all. I dont know why theyre so bad. I thought that the confidence was growing because everything felt slow but solid. But I found fairly early into the whole thing on Sun that nothing will highlight your insecurities like a race and unless you're confident in what you can do a race isnt going to ease them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,044 ✭✭✭chickey2


    I agree with Pacing Mule, you shouldn't feel lame about posting that race report. It was honest and you'll learn far more from an honest account of a crap run than a fake one!

    Did you run the route again today? How did you get on?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    chickey2 wrote: »
    Did you run the route again today? How did you get on?

    I did. 1:09. Second part still got me and its not much of a difference time wise, weather conditions were much better. But it was one hell of a different run and more of how I expected it to feel.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    The last couple of weeks...not much to report. 15 mile weeks if im lucky. Youngest fella has been sick so sleepless nights were back to newborn era and I was wrecked. That coupled with a sore leg and the eldest’s birthday all threw me off. But, heeding the consistency advice I got out as much as the body and time would allow and threw in cycling to work so I would have something going on.

    It led to this week, which has been the most successful, enjoyable, happiest week Ive ever had. And I cant let it go unreported :pac:

    Tue ⅗ - 5.3 miles avg pace 11:26 - it was easy, painfree and found me pushing on on a route nicely.

    Wed ⅘ - 2.9 miles avg pace 11:19 - fartleks. Tried fartleks last week and some really decent hill sprints which woke me up a little bit. That morning I pushed it on the bike a little bit too. So i felt ready, strong and determined. 1m easy running (to get me to the straight no traffic light part). A wind blew up out of no where, I was pushing hard against it, too hard, I needed to keep the energy for the fartlekking bit. I was running against a brick wall, no matter how much I slowed it pushed harder. I honestly was never so frustrated. There was no wind that morning, I hadnt noticed anything up until now. I thought grand just let the wind calm down, no point in puahing through and then go for it. Every time I picked up so did the blooming wind. I thought of changing it to an easy run and trying again, but I wasnt sure how the week would pan out. 3 weeks of no sleep, yet I was feeling strong, there’s every chance I wouldnt feel like this for the next few days. So I did my best and fought on. Stats and pace say otherwise, but I was WRECKED, when I got back to work and really felt it. There is a bit of chickening out going on when it gets hard. But now I know it, its all stuff to work on.

    Thur 5/5 - 4m avg pace 11:24 - a lovely run. Legs were sore after yest, so I took it fairly easy and it was a beaut.

    Fri 6/5 - 4.4m avg pace 10:51 - nothing like a fight to get you moving. However it doesnt help with the control. Went off thundering the streets, that and the anger had my head melted, so I had to stop for a sit down and get my head together :pac: . Started off again and really loved it. An extension again to the usual Fri route.

    Sat 7/5 - 4.5m avg pace 11:18 - was well aware I had snuck an extra run in this week. But felt great and thought feck it, just go out. Again, it was a beaut. Easy days easy, so to hell if its slow, I thoroughly enjoyed it.

    Sun 8/5 - 10.1m avg pace 11:56 - Hah! Near killed me. I felt great again, so 10m seemed doable. I was really going to test myself and do the GIR route and do the second lap of it twice. If I kept it slow and easy, I could do this! I couldnt do it. That second half is a flaming killer! So when I got to the end of it I looked at the phone, 7 miles. The last few miles had me beat, it was so hot, I had little water left, I couldnt do that second half again and live :pac:. I considered doing the 3 m lap around they use in other races, but I couldnt manage anymore hills! The 10 mile was off, get back to the car, get 8m done and that would bring the week up to 30 miles. Turned back towards the car, felt ok again. Looked at the phone 8 miles. Jaysus I couldnt let those last 2 miles go now! :pac: If I kept it slow, did two loops of the path around the cross, ding dong job done. Did my two loops, jaysus the legs were exhausted, got back to the car, looked at the phone...9.5 miles!!! So i did another half a loop to get the 10 miles. Collapsed on the grass and died! :pac:

    I know mileage shouldnt be a focus. I know Ive upped it by nearly double this week and Ive probably wrecked the week ahead. But I regret nothing. It has been the best week of running Ive ever done. 6 days straight, highest mileage EVER and I feel fantastic! Ive never felt stronger. Speed is a pox, I know but hopefully it will click. There is a slight demon in me tempting me to go out tomorrow and continue the streak, but my leg needs a little rolling/gentle fairies to lightly dance on it :D I’D DO IT ALL AGAIN!!!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    Knowing myself as well as I do, I knew I needed a plan this week. The great (for me) week last week would have given me all kinds of excuses to miss runs, but the consistency has been so good I am desperate to build on it. So I started MS's 10k plan from last year. Ran it by him and he said go for it, so I am.

    10/5 - 5 miles easy avg pace 11:55

    Was going great until the turn back and fought nausea the whole way back. Got to mile 4 and had to stop, double over, but sadly no puke. But mile 4 continued in that vein so much so I thought of sticking my fingers down my throat and get the bloody thing over with. I was stranded a mile from work, no money for the luas and hanging. I had to get back to work so had no choice but to try and keep running. Made it eventually :D

    11/5 - 8 × 30 sec hills with 2 min recoveries. I remember so well doing this last year. Brought back some good memories :D. I picked the wrong hill however, was shorter than I thought. Im well able for this so will definitely do another route the next time it crops up in the plan.

    12/5 - 5.3 easy avg pace 11:15 - grand run. Was delighted with myself when I saw the pace. Sadly Strava didnt click in properly for the first mile. But a grand run nonetheless.

    13/5 - 4.6 easy avg pace 11:20. Loved it so much. Went up through Milltown again and the main thing was to take that hill at the golf course. Delighted to have made it. Nearly ended up on a car bonnet at Windy Arbour mind you. But I really love these change of scenery Friday runs.

    15/5 8 miles avg pace 11:31. Grand job ;)

    Theres a progression run on Wed. Should be fun! :pac:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,009 ✭✭✭Firedance


    15/5 8 miles avg pace 11:31. The head is not in a good place atm. Hasnt been for quite sometime. This should have had 2 MP kms stuck into it. But just getting out the door was good enough. I picked an old route, usually I run it clockwise because its an uphill struggle. Today I took it easy on myself and went anti clock wise. A cop out, but much needed. I realised today Im picking routes for these lsr's to make myself suffer. My pace is so slow Im making myself hurt. Last week I picked the 10k route that slayed me as part of a 10m run, with the main objective of punishing myself for the slow pace. That has to stop. Today I was running down hill and it was just so lovely. The noggin is so bad thats what I need atm. The 2km MP was freaking me out too, so instead of having them at the end, when it felt good I pushed on and I am fairly happy with some of the efforts today.

    Theres a progression run on Wed. Should be fun! :pac:

    I'm sorry to hear that HS, mind yourself and if you can find a route that you really enjoy (coast/beach/lovely views) I can certainly recommend it. Enjoy your progression run on Wednesday!


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 123 ✭✭Hannibelle Smeeeth


    Firedance wrote: »
    I'm sorry to hear that HS, mind yourself and if you can find a route that you really enjoy (coast/beach/lovely views) I can certainly recommend it. Enjoy your progression run on Wednesday!


    Oops just read it back. Way too much info for a training log :pac: Just edited.

    Yeah, Ive a few varieties in routes now which is helping and Im cycling to work too, which is a nice change. I head to the PP any Sunday I can which helps too for sure. It'll pass. Might try an aul sauna ;)


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,082 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    Not sure this is one of my better ideas, but I’ll give it a crack anyhow. Name changes are all done now so I’ve got me old username and me old log back and that’s that.

    Sept 16 – Dec 16 Building everything back up with the physio. 3 x3 miles a week. 3 strength exercise sessions a week and lots of stretching. It all came back together beautifully. No more pain and everything very slow.

    Jan – Feb 17 – I think it was around December I started pushing it to 3.5 miles x3 a week and added in meager long runs of 5 miles and increasing it. Till one Sunday I felt like a caged animal and pushed it to 9 miles, with physios consent. So the Sunday runs are in around that now.

    Feb – mid March – At some point , could have been mid Feb, I got the urge to speed up. Snooped on here and it seems to be the thinking that easy runs should only be easy if they’re part of something bigger? Not sure if I have it right, but I’m also aware I’m holding myself back a lot. So I decided just to push a little but more on the easy runs and I added a few speed spurts on various runs. They went exceptionally well. The speed stuff I am terrible at and I was probably being a bit conservative, but slowly slowly catchy monkey. Also I’m not supposed to be doing anything but easy runs so I’m being extra careful.
    I think the strength exercises are helping. Though I’m still not stretching enough. When I do legs feel great...when I don’t pain is back.

    Consistency has never been my friend. But I think I’ve been ok. The great thing about only being allowed do 4 runs a week is that you can usually catch up with yourself. I’ve been trying to hit 20 miles a week and there have been some long runs missed and some mid runs here and there . But I’ve been pretty good. Last week there was a big jump in avg speed, which I know you’re not supposed to focus on for easy runs, but it’s nice to see. Hopefully it is an actual improvement and not a glitch!

    Form is pretty poor too. But I watch other runners all the time and I’ve tried to mimic them. When I get tired I do a ‘Form check’ and when I fix it I get more out of myself. The core exercises are helping there i think.
    All in all the legs feel so strong at the moment and I’ve lost a bit of weight to help things along too. I don’t think I’m far off getting the green light to be allowed follow a plan. I look at Myles Split 10k plan from a few yeas back on almost a weekly basis trying to assess whether I’m ready for it yet. I’m sure I could even rob some sessions from it in time. If I keep going it can’t be long until I enter races again. I had a few earmarked this year, but family events are throwing a lot of spanners in the work. So either it’s karma telling me to be patient for a little bit longer, or I need to just go for it.

    Again, not sure this is one of my better ideas, or indeed if there’s much point posting at all when there is no structured plan. But sure here goes lol.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,044 ✭✭✭chickey2


    Welcome back and best of luck with the plan!


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,082 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    Thanks Chickey! Hope things are flying for you.

    Tues 14th March 4.4 miles avg pace 11:44 pm :o
    Whatever I did to myself on Sundays run my legs were still sore until Wednesday. So I took it fairly handy.

    Thurs 16th March 4 miles avg pace 11:24 pm
    I wasn’t feeling great heading out so didn’t expect much. A bit of a chesty cough and a sore throat, nothing too major but felt rundown. As soon as I got moving I was grand. When I got to the Red Cow I was surprised how nice it was all still feeling. II just kept calm and relaxed and got up the hill in the best nick ever. It was lovely to finally get up that Hill without needing oxygen or a lie down :D

    Fri 17th March 3.4 mile tempo run avg pace 11:46 pm :o
    I had a plan. It was simple. 1 mile warm up. 1 mile fly like a bird. 1 mile cool down. Problem is i don’t use the watch anymore so length of warm ups and cool downs and pace are all guess work. Also, I forgot to turn strava on until half way into the first mile so the different stages bled into each other. I was hoping to hit and hold 11 mins for the middle part and the first mile was 10:56 and the second was 11:08. The second was up hill into a wind. I was also trying to work hard enough to get some benefit from the run but keeping it balanced to avoid breathing too deeply, which would set off the cough and have me spewing phlegm everywhere. The last mile and a half was an over estimate for distance. Was a little underwhelmed truth be told. Conditions were a test for sure, and I don’t think I could have pushed any harder all things considered, but still didn’t feel like I’d got much out of it.

    Sun 19th March 6.4 miles avg pace 12:03 pm (supposed to be 9 miles)

    Felt bad heading out but got into a lovely space and was happily plodding along. I was working harder than normal and I could feel my lungs just waiting to attack lol. I was tiring way too early into it, but sure what can you do? I thought of cutting it short but I really want to keep to this 20 mile a week minimum thing. Got down to Rathfarnham and I was sweating like a pig lol my head was throbbing, throat was completely dry. I was wearing my rain jacket and happened to find a €2 coin in the pocket. Nipped into a petrol station for a bottle of water and that did the trick for a while. I was still tiring way too soon, even carrying the bottle became a pain. There are very few bins in Rathfarnham it seems :D . Anyhow finally got rid of the bottle and was motoring on. But the wind was a Sneaky devil. Everyone had to contend with it today. You don’t even notice it’s there until you’re facing into it and the constant push against it. I can cope with bad weather and I can cope with the uphill climb back home. The two together are a pain in the t*ts, but again, I can cope. But not today. I had run out of tips and tricks and it was very unpleasant. So I had to put a rescue call in to the husband :o

    So the weeks miles are 18.5. I’m a bit peed off I couldn’t make it another mile and a half. After I rang my husband I wondered was I being soft. So I tried to run up until he met me, but there was nothing and when I stopped I coughed and phlegmed all over the place :D. This sounds an awful lot more negative than in intended . I love how things are going. OK pace is a b*ll*cks. But the effort is getting easier. The enjoyment is absolutely second to none. I am loving it.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,082 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    Tues 21 March 4m avg pace 11:37pm

    I can’t remember much about this. I know I wasn’t in the mood at all for it, body still felt under the weather and drained. But once I got into it it was lovely.

    Thurs 23 March 4.1m avg pace 11:39

    Whilst the hill at Belgard is great for climbing, I’m a little concerned the initial downhill is giving me false confidence. You’d never be lucky enough to have that kind of a downhill at the start of a race and there’s no other way of tackling it without first benefitting from a steep slope. So I went on one of my old routes, which starts as an uphill drag as a change. And sure enough the legs felt it. I was in little mood for it , but again once I got out it became such a lovely run and although the time sucks, I feel effort wise as if I handled it way better than I can ever remember.

    Sat 25th March 2.7m

    Idea is to alternate weeks between a speed spurt and a tempo run. So a few weeks ago I started just warming up, then speed up for the count of 100 and then recover for a count to 90 and do that 6 times. I’m full sure for these types of things your meant to pick a pace for a goal race, ie if you’re training for a 10k you lash through at 10k pace. But I think that all maybe for further down the road. For now, I let the body tell me what pace is hard enough for me to maintain for the 100 count. And the rule is, no matter what youre facing into, be it wind, a hill, whatever, once that 100 count starts thats it, youre away. It is such fun. I love it. I wish I could maintain that kind of speed forever because it just feels so great. Sadly however I’m just about holding it for 100 secs and after the 3rd one I need to walk the first bit of the recovery. I’m not quite sure how to work out the average speed of it all, but it went like this:-
    1km easy
    1. 100 – evenly enough held on to 9:39-9:44 pace
    2. 100 secs – ranged between 8:41 to 8:49
    3. 100 secs – 8:50 – 8:38 (downhill)
    4. 100 secs – 9:30 – 9:34 ( start of the uphill climb)
    5. 100 secs – 10:58 – 10:53 ( worst of the hill)
    6. 100 secs – 10:07 – 9:36 ( down hill again. Legs tried to convince me I had already done 6 but brain thankfully said to add this one on)
    1km easy.

    Sun 26th 9.2m avg pace 12:44 for 8.8 m and 0.4 at 13:47pm
    Holy f*ck I died! I felt great on the way out. I wasn’t to keen going out after last night’s run, but unexpected events meant the two had to go back to back. Legs were tired, but OK. There’s a woman I see sometimes, she has a beautiful stride on her. She looks so calm but as if she is having the time of her life and pushing because this is what she was born to do. Anyhow she passed me today. I swear she is just fantastic to watch! But as I was watching her I was mimicking her lol. I never realised until I was breathing heavily and then I thought sh*t you’ve 8 more miles to do you clown! :pac: Anyhow I died again. I was so good at these 9m runs a few weeks ago but lately I am struggling. I crawled home. So much so at one point I called a halt and was determined I was done. Took out my phone to turn it off and saw 8.2 on the clock. Bugger! I was way off what I needed for 20 m week. So I motored on. My God it was all shades of discomfort. Trying to pick paths with dishes when crossing roads because I couldn’t handle footpaths. Then I called another halt to it again. Looked at the clock 8.8. Holy mother of f*ck! What is wrong with these bloody roads! Am I finally going so slow that for every step forward, it’s 5 back? :pac: This time I actually turned off my strava, but when i saw where i was at i thought feck it, I’m 0.3 short of 20 miles, I can’t leave it...so off I went. But then I forgot to turn strava back on :mad: so had to go again. Pathetic to most I’m sure, but we all have our quirks.

    All in all, the long runs are becoming an issue. I’m not sure what’s going on with them. But I’m pretty sure they may have to be cut short and I have to let the 20 mile a week dream go for now. I am moving so slow as it is, I can’t see the benefit of slogging it out for 2 hours at that pace. It’s a shame because I was absolutely loving them. But I’ll try again next week when I’ll have had the Saturday off the day before and hopefully this God damn cough will be gone!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Anyhow I died again. I was so good at these 9m runs a few weeks ago but lately I am struggling. I crawled home.

    .....

    All in all, the long runs are becoming an issue. I’m not sure what’s going on with them. But I’m pretty sure they may have to be cut short and I have to let the 20 mile a week dream go for now. I am moving so slow as it is, I can’t see the benefit of slogging it out for 2 hours at that pace.

    Ah, you're doing ok, sure you finished it this week! (9.15miles for me today). I'd guess the problem is having the interval/tempo right before the LSR (and also you have probably taken-up the overall weekly mileage)

    It's possible you might be running the easy runs too fast. What's the 5k race-pace at the moment, do you know? Your easy/LSR pace should be 5k mile pace + 2:30-3:00 per mile. I am doing my easy runs not too far from your midweek easy (around 11:00 for me) but my current 5k pace is 8:02. I always used to do my easy runs too fast in the past, but have been sticking to the rules over the past 5-6 months and I don't think it's done any harm ...


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,082 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    Ah, you're doing ok, sure you finished it this week! (9.15miles for me today). I'd guess the problem is having the interval/tempo right before the LSR (and also you have probably taken-up the overall weekly mileage)

    It's possible you might be running the easy runs too fast. What's the 5k race-pace at the moment, do you know? Your easy/LSR pace should be 5k mile pace + 2:30-3:00 per mile. I am doing my easy runs not too far from your midweek easy (around 11:00 for me) but my current 5k pace is 8:02. I always used to do my easy runs too fast in the past, but have been sticking to the rules over the past 5-6 months and I don't think it's done any harm ...

    Hi HSR, hope you're keeping well!

    Now, you see, easy runs. Yes. I know I've been told that easy runs should be easy, but my concern has always been that it has been too easy which is part of what's holding me back.

    So I did a bit of googling and also searched on here and apparently easy runs are easy to help with the recovery process whilst running high miles and in proper training. If youre not running too much and nothing too strenuous, your easy runs will be faster. I therefore wondered whether that was part of my lack of speed improvement issue. My thoughts therefore were not to just trot out easy miles when all my runs (at the time) were easy and the mileage was low. I can hardly call my 6 x100 sec, my 3 Mile tempo runs or my 20 mile weeks strenuous or heavy on the mileage so that's why I was just going by what felt good. Probably in the grand scheme of things my pace is probably more steady than easy, but taking everything into consideration I thought that was about right? :o


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    So I did a bit of googling and also searched on here and apparently easy runs are easy to help with the recovery process whilst running high miles and in proper training.

    Well, they are also to build the aerobic base, doesn't matter what speed you do for that (recovery pace is even slower than easy).
    I can hardly call my 6 x100 sec, my 3 Mile tempo runs or my 20 mile weeks strenuous or heavy on the mileage so that's why I was just going by what felt good. Probably in the grand scheme of things my pace is probably more steady than easy, but taking everything into consideration I thought that was about right? :o

    Well, it might bit heavy for current fitness right now. If it's any help I don't feel that keeping easy runs on the slow side has hampered my race pace compared to the days when I ran everything steady :rolleyes: ... and I'm doing similar mileage/speed to yourself. Dunno, only you can judge. Keep it up!

    I am grand, trying to build up mileage a bit myself :)


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,082 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    I'm definitely bearing in mind what you're saying. I did wonder yesterday whether the struggle started when I upped the easy runs to 4 miles or when I started pushing a bit more on the easy runs. I'll have a look later when I go back over strava and see what was going on a few weeks ago. The good thing is that I'm not in any plan or training for anything atm so I can take some time to work these things out and fix it.

    I don't think I have, or ever had a race pace lol. I think that's been half my problem. I certainly wouldn't be anywhere near your 5k pace! I have accepted that I haven't a bog how to race so part of this 100 sec speed up thing is to slowly learn how to hold a speed, other than snail pace lol.

    You were injured for a while weren't you? Are you recovered now?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    I'm definitely bearing in mind what you're saying. I did wonder yesterday whether the struggle started when I upped the easy runs to 4 miles or when I started pushing a bit more on the easy runs. I'll have a look later when I go back over strava and see what was going on a few weeks ago. The good thing is that I'm not in any plan or training for anything atm so I can take some time to work these things out and fix it.

    I don't think I have, or ever had a race pace lol. I think that's been half my problem. I certainly wouldn't be anywhere near your 5k pace! I have accepted that I haven't a bog how to race so part of this 100 sec speed up thing is to slowly learn how to hold a speed, other than snail pace lol.

    You were injured for a while weren't you? Are you recovered now?

    Was injured a lot in the year up to summer 2016. Got going again around August and apart from a minor calf strain in Jan/Feb have been going consistently. Have to watch it of course, but aiming to build the miles up a bit from now. Fingers crossed!

    Maybe no harm to race a 5k to test your pace? If it fits the plan ...


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