Renting Out - What I'm looking for, feedback welcome

MarkAnthony

Firstly I don't mind if this becomes a more general discussion but if your input is simply I wouldn't rent from you then please simply thank the post below this one. That is absolutely your right the only thing I would say is I have a right to protect myself as well.

Anyways with that caveat here's what I propose

-First and last months rent
-Security Deposit to the value of one months rent
-Reference from previous Land Lord
-Employment reference (or 2 in the case of a couple)
-Bank Statements for the previous X time - All info can be redacted on this except the SO showing the rent going out each month and their pay going in (possibly). This is the bit I'm particularity torn on; 12 months and pay seems onerous, 3 months rent only seems like it doesn't show a track record.

This is a one bed in D8, everything above board, well spec'd etc. looking for a professional couple rent c.€1000 per month with parking.

Thoughts?

MarkAnthony

OP you are a scoundrel and a rotter, I would not rent from you!

allibastor

Why would you want first and lasts months rent?

You are in essence looking for 3 months rent up front. 3K.
In my experience a landlord is very slow to give things back so you are in essence having 2 deposits.

zl1whqvjs75cdy

Afraid that's way too much deposit. Yeah you might not trust me as a tenant to not wreck the place but I certainly wouldn't trust a complete stranger with 3 grand.

MarkAnthony

allibastor wrote: »

Why would you want first and lasts months rent?

You are in essence looking for 3 months rent up front. 3K.
In my experience a landlord is very slow to give things back so you are in essence having 2 deposits.

It's the system I've seen used predominantly in the US and I've always thought it was a good protection. With regards to security deposits if the tenant was willing to pay the fees I'd be happy to use an escrow service.

I take your point though that the tenant may have been shafted in the past.

allibastor

MarkAnthony wrote: »

It's the system I've seen used predominantly in the US and I've always thought it was a good protection. With regards to security deposits if the tenant was willing to pay the fees I'd be happy to use an escrow service.

I take your point though that the tenant may have been shafted in the past.

In the US the rental market is very different. Landlords are providing a better quality house.

In Ireland it is a different story with Landlords and tenants version of wear and tear very different and what was included or not included.
Also, your 1 bed is 1k a month, when did you last have it painted, or kitchen fitted. when did you last inspect for damp or check the moisture movement in the walls. Have you an inspection done more than throwing your eye over it.

BeatNikDub

And 12 months of bank statements!
WHOAH

Mrs OBumble

I reckon reference from a previous landlord or similar.

For example, when I came to Ireland, i had owned my own home for 7 years previously, and my LL from the 7 years before that before then had died. So I quite literally didn't have one - and as a mature foreign professional IMHO am a better risk for a LL than many young locals.

MarkAnthony

allibastor wrote: »

In the US the rental market is very different. Landlords are providing a better quality house.

In Ireland it is a different story with Landlords and tenants version of wear and tear very different and what was included or not included.
Also, your 1 bed is 1k a month, when did you last have it painted, or kitchen fitted. when did you last inspect for damp or check the moisture movement in the walls. Have you an inspection done more than throwing your eye over it.

Again I realise the tenant has no reference from me, other than I am willing to show them that the property is fully registered etc and my willingness to provide more than just a mobile number but the demand in this area is exceptionally high.

Kitchen is in under a year, in fact the tiling will have only just have been completed, Bathroom will be a new fit or there may be a slightly reduced rent.

AFAIK other than a BER there is no requirement to have the place inspected, there's been no issues with damp in the almost ten years I've lived in the place. Other than the bathroom to be fair which is an issue with poor heating and ventilation which should be resolved in the refit.

MarkAnthony

allibastor wrote: »

Why would you want first and lasts months rent?

You are in essence looking for 3 months rent up front. 3K.
In my experience a landlord is very slow to give things back so you are in essence having 2 deposits.

donkeyoaty0099 wrote: »

Afraid that's way too much deposit. Yeah you might not trust me as a tenant to not wreck the place but I certainly wouldn't trust a complete stranger with 3 grand.

Understandable but it's not 2 deposits, it's the final month's rent. The tenant is guaranteed it back by simply withholding the final month's rent without comeback. Taking 2 months security (or equivalent) is something different. Understandable that people might not see it that way.

BeatNikDub

So you are happy to do the minimum required; but expect potential tenant to go above and beyond for you?
Have you been seriously burned in the past or something?

Meathlass

I could live with the 2 months rental up front and the deposit but the 12 months bank statements seems particularly onerous and there's no way I would tell anyone (including my mother) what my take home pay is.

Draco

MarkAnthony wrote: »

-Bank Statements for the previous X time

Not a chance. Checking up the landlord reference should be enough there. If you're not going to trust a landlord's reference then there's no point in even asking for it.

MarkAnthony

BeatNikDub wrote: »

So you are happy to do the minimum required; but expect potential tenant to go above and beyond for you?
Have you been seriously burned in the past or something?

Sorry I'm not sure where you're getting that I'm doing the minimum and expecting a tenant to go above and beyond. There is very little point in getting involved in an emotive discussion where I say I'm a good landlord (or was in the past) and you assume that you get great tenants without taking precautions.

Constructive criticism only please.

MarkAnthony

Draco wrote: »

Not a chance. Checking up the landlord reference should be enough there. If you're not going to trust a landlord's reference then there's no point in even asking for it.

Good point, I wonder if it is worth asking for. I'm afraid I go on that old story about John getting a glowing reference from his previous employer just to be shot of him.

MarkAnthony

Meathlass wrote: »

I could live with the 2 months rental up front and the deposit but the 12 months bank statements seems particularly onerous and there's no way I would tell anyone (including my mother) what my take home pay is.

What about if everything was redacted on say 3 months of statements save for the rent going out?

Thanks for your reply.

Meathlass

I know my employer will just give out a reference stating "Meathlass has been employed by xxx for xxx years"

Landlord reference - I've never asked or needed one but sure I could just get one of my friends to be my 'landlord'. Don't see how you can set any store by it.

BeatNikDub

I am not being emotive at all, merely trying to understand your outrageous requirements.

Anyway, unfortunately, someone will probably do all of this (which is completely above and beyond necessity) because of the nature of the current market, which you are well aware of and as you say are taking complete advantage of. All that can be hoped for is that the couple that do end up renting from you are treated well.

Draco

MarkAnthony wrote: »

What about if everything was redacted on say 3 months of statements save for the rent going out?

You could have a situation where the rent went out but not enough funds to cover it and it bounced but the bounce was redacted.

MarkAnthony

Meathlass wrote: »

I know my employer will just give out a reference stating "Meathlass has been employed by xxx for xxx years"

Landlord reference - I've never asked or needed one but sure I could just get one of my friends to be my 'landlord'. Don't see how you can set any store by it.

To be honest that's all I'd want and expect from the employer, length of service would be my main concern. As for the LL ref, it's possible to do some digging - PRTB registration being of public record, but yes I absolutely see where you're coming from. The LL ref issues means I probably will look for bank statements, need to have a think on how long etc.

Thanks for your feedback.

MarkAnthony

Draco wrote: »

You could have a situation where the rent went out but not enough funds to cover it and it bounced but the bounce was redacted.

Eeesh - excellent point.

jimbo32123

Original poster, that is the old adic a lada (the apartment) being rented or bought for a rolls royce (what your looking for)

The first and last month is 33% OTT when you look at it, the 12 months bank statement is riciculous considering its is only 12 months required when applying for a morgugage! you are looking for the equivalent and equal to a nortgugage application for a one bed apartment rental... completely ridiculous!!

pwurple

I've never looked for bank statements as a landlord. Never considered it to be any of my business what my tenants spend their money on.

The rest looks fine to me.

Get a solid contract in place. And advise them of what you do, and don't cover. For example, their own personal possessions should be covered by their contents insurance.

Meathlass

MarkAnthony wrote: »

What about if everything was redacted on say 3 months of statements save for the rent going out?

Thanks for your reply.

I probably would do this but what's it going to tell you really? That I can afford to pay €1000 every month on a particular date. There's no way of checking that what I call "Rent" on my bank statement is actually rent. I could be paying a mate off for a drug debt.

I pay money to my housemate via SO every month for UPC. I call it UPC on my bank statement but it's going into a private current account. You can call the narrative description anything you want on your SOs and DDs.

MarkAnthony

jimbo32123 wrote: »

Original poster, that is the old adic a lada (the apartment) being rented or bought for a rolls royce (what your looking for)

The first and last month is 33% OTT when you look at it, the 12 months bank statement is riciculous considering its is only 12 months required when applying for a morgugage! you are looking for the equivalent and equal to a nortgugage application for a one bed apartment rental... completely ridiculous!!

Actually it's more like 6 months on a mortgage, but from a strictly risk assessment point of view tenants are a higher risk financially speaking and by definition (because it's zero in the case of owner occupiers) risk of trashing the place and not paying for it.

MarkAnthony

Meathlass wrote: »

I probably would do this but what's it going to tell you really? That I can afford to pay €1000 every month on a particular date. There's no way of checking that what I call "Rent" on my bank statement is actually rent. I could be paying a mate off for a drug debt.

I pay money to my housemate via SO every month for UPC. I call it UPC on my bank statement but it's going into a private current account. You can call the narrative description anything you want on your SOs and DDs.

I take your point but you'd have to be pretty convoluted to do that for, say, six months, there's also the other safe guards in place such as a high deposit.

Thanks again for your input.

Redshift

I get the impression that being a landlord might keep you awake at night and that you should really think about it. I'm am a tenant, (hopefully not for too much longer) I have rented four different properties over the past eight years and have never been so much as a minute late with the rent and have always got all of my deposit back.
I'm telling you this because I'm in your target demographic but I'm also telling you that I would not rent from you. To put it simply you sound like you have the potential to be a pain in the butt and an interference in the private enjoyment of what would be MY home.

You sound like a decent and we'll organised person but I would just move on if I was searching for a property and saw that list of requirements. That said it's a landlord s market and you may well get someone who is willing to go along with your requirements.

Meathlass

It's a landlord's market in Dublin at the moment so if you state up front on the advertisement that these are the conditions you'll get someone to accept I'm sure.

I'm a tenant but I've read enough horror stories here and elsewhere about problems landlords have had so I don't blame you in wanting to protect yourself.

MarkAnthony

Redshift wrote: »

I get the impression that being a landlord might keep you awake at night and that you should really think about it. I'm am a tenant, (hopefully not for too much longer) I have rented four different properties over the past eight years and have never been so much as a minute late with the rent and have always got all of my deposit back.
I'm telling you this because I'm in your target demographic but I'm also telling you that I would not rent from you. To put it simply you sound like you have the potential to be a pain in the butt and an interference in the private enjoyment of what would be MY home.

You sound like a decent and we'll organised person but I would just move on if I was searching for a property and saw that list of requirements. That said it's a landlord s market and you may well get someone who is willing to go along with your requirements.

To be honest I've been a landlord before in a market with a much smaller demand and didn't have an issue. I take the point on almost all of your criticism (whether I agree with it or not) except the interference with your private employment; I thought it was fairly standard practice to ask for an employment reference? I certainly supplied one when I rented.

Sorry just reread your post; I don't think that's a fair judgement; you've no grounds for believing that I'm going to interfere with the property when rented. In fact quite the opposite, I'm doing this so that I have as little contact as possible, save for inspections which I assume is fairly standard every 6 months and if the tenant requires something fixed.

MarkAnthony

Meathlass wrote: »

It's a landlord's market in Dublin at the moment so if you state up front on the advertisement that these are the conditions you'll get someone to accept I'm sure.

I'm a tenant but I've read enough horror stories here and elsewhere about problems landlords have had so I don't blame you in wanting to protect yourself.

Thanks for your comment. I will definitely be putting the conditions on the ad. This also gives me the opportunity to say I'm fully aware that tenants get screwed all the time. I'm alive to that fact as well.

stupid_is_as _stupid_does

MarkAnthony wrote: »

Actually it's more like 6 months on a mortgage, but from a strictly risk assessment point of view tenants are a higher risk financially speaking and by definition (because it's zero in the case of owner occupiers) risk of trashing the place and not paying for it.

Hi MarkAnthony,

As you asked for feedback I am giving it as someone currently house hunting. I have seen very few landlords asking for bank statements. A tiny minority. Those ads I immediately ignored as I think it is a complete intrusion on privacy. My loss maybe but I would not budge on that. I have always paid rent and bills on time and have a glowing reference from my last landlord of three years.

Asking for the final month up front is a lot too and although I would be able to pay it I would probably go for somewhere that didnt have that requirement as I have never seen it before and I would prefer to keep the extra money in my bank account than sitting in that of my landlord. That said if someone was really interested in the apartment and there was not much supply that met the same criteria for the renter I do not think this would be a complete no no.

Can I ask a question off you as a landlord (or any other landlords on thread). You say you with the work reference you would want to know the length of tenure of employment. I am just after starting a job; public sector, decent wages and an indefinite contract (i.e not a fixed term contract). Would the fact that I am only starting employment be a negative from a landlords perspective?