The Beast of Ballyhoura 2015 AR European Champs

pgibbo

Neady83 wrote: »

They will have PFDs available so I'm sure I'll be ok with that, as AKW said, hopefully they won't be long swims

Apologies, I should have checked what a PFD is. It's pretty much what I was suggesting. Might be no harm getting in to a pool with one before the event to ensure you can swim a bit whilst out of your depth

joey100

It's not your fault Pgibbo, AKW called it a PDF. Don't think you get much help swimming from one of them!

Definitely get in and try what it's like to swim in one before the day. The test to see if a PFD is still in working order is to tie a 6kg weight to it and it should still float. This is the minimum it needs to be able to float. They will help you stay up but you will need to do a bit of work too.

Neady83

pgibbo wrote: »

Apologies, I should have checked what a PFD is. It's pretty much what I was suggesting. Might be no harm getting in to a pool with one before the event to ensure you can swim a bit whilst out of your depth

Thanks pgibbo, I might do that this weekend

sconhome

joey100 wrote: »

It's not your fault Pgibbo, AKW called it a PDF. Don't think you get much help swimming from one of them!

Whoops!! Happens when I'm working on many different screens

Personal Floatation Device

shotgunmcos

@Neady you have a week, get thee to a pool. Doggy paddle, anything to move forward. The PFD will keep you afloat so don't worry.

I wouldn't bother with a tow as the line will get caught. In the 2 Beasts I've done

2012 it was an 800m swim and only 2 members had to do it.
2014 it was a 300m dark swim and 3 had to do it while the oher carried the stuff

AFAIK in 2013 all 4 had to swim across a small pond.

If you have to carry your gear on the swim just give it to the strongest swimmer. Worst case scenario, give your pack and the strongest swimmer's pack to the other 2 swimmers and the strongest swimmer can assist you, lifeguard style

Or the strongest swimmer can take all 4 packs packed into your bothy on a line behind him/her and the other 2 swimmers drag you in your PFD across. Ultimate Teamwork style

Depending on the water too in may not be that deep or you can coasteer around...

Still though, you have a week... find a lake and familiarise yourself!

lgk

shotgunmcos wrote: »

If you have to carry your gear on the swim just give it to the strongest swimmer.

Alternatively, stick the pack in a large drybag and use that as a float.

career move

I have my food divided up into: transition, bike/kayak and trek. Comes to approx 10600 kcal. Does that sound reasonable?

shotgunmcos

career move wrote: »

I have my food divided up into: transition, bike/kayak and trek. Comes to approx 10600 kcal. Does that sound reasonable?

Nope

72hrs. I'm estimating about 300kcals per hour or 8,000 kcals per day (inc an hours sleep per day). So thats 21,000 kcals*

*based on nutrition intake for our training days, 3k kcals over 8-10 hours

Even at a very modest 200kcals per hour (prob the min for your weight) you will need at least 14k Kcals

Can't be sure of breakfast rolls on the course this year!

career move

Thanks Mike. I'll reassess

In other news ... http://www.sleepmonsters.com/v2_races.php?article_id=9068

Finish is in Kilfinane! I'm going home!!!

sconhome

Waterford, Cork & Limerick ;-)

career move

Kerry

sconhome

career move wrote: »

Kerry

Didn't see them on the list of sponsoring Co Co. But we never know.

career move

AKW wrote: »

Didn't see them on the list of sponsoring Co Co. But we never know.

It's a decoy

Neady83

My tummy is in knots, it doesn't know whether it's excited or very very afraid :eek:

Food is pretty much sorted: packed into 9 bags that should last 8 hours each. Is it too soon to say that the long range forecast is looking okish?

lgk

career move wrote: »

I have my food divided up into: transition, bike/kayak and trek. Comes to approx 10600 kcal. Does that sound reasonable?

Plenty of good guidance online, including this on the biggest mistakes endurance athletes make. 150 cal/hour seems to be enough for most people, but everyone's different. I raced with one particular Irish army adventure racer a couple of years back who went through a phenomenal amount of food! Key is not to force it, too much food is as bad as too little, and stomach/nutrition problems are probably next to foot problems in seeing people drop out of races.

Bag up your food so that each bag has sufficient calories for a set number of hours, say 6. Then you'll have a good idea in advance how many bags you need to grab in each transition, speeding things up. Always carry some extra as your leg times won't always match pre-start estimates.

You don't want to be stopping to prepare a 4 course meal in transition, but use them as a good way to get in some balanced nutrition that is too bulky/awkward to carry.

After the race, take note of what you got through, what worked and what didn't. Use that to hone your planning for future races.

sconhome

lgk wrote: »

Plenty of good guidance online, including this on the biggest mistakes endurance athletes make. 150 cal/hour seems to be enough for most people, but everyone's different. I raced with one particular Irish army adventure racer a couple of years back who went through a phenomenal amount of food! Key is not to force it, too much food is as bad as too little, and stomach/nutrition problems are probably next to foot problems in seeing people drop out of races.

Bag up your food so that each bag has sufficient calories for a set number of hours, say 6. Then you'll have a good idea in advance how many bags you need to grab in each transition, speeding things up. Always carry some extra as your leg times won't always match pre-start estimates.

You don't want to be stopping to prepare a 4 course meal in transition, but use them as a good way to get in some balanced nutrition that is too bulky/awkward to carry.

After the race, take note of what you got through, what worked and what didn't. Use that to hone your planning for future races.

That's a very good link.

The protein bit is critical!

If you fail to include protein in your fuel, your body has only one other choice: your own muscle! Called lean muscle tissue catabolism or muscle cannibalization, this process devastates performance through muscle deterioration and increased fatigue-causing ammonia accumulation, and also negatively affects the immune system and recovery..

:eek: :eek:

I take most of my protein and carbs in liquid form through drinks and supplement with nuts, trail mix, secret recipe flapjacks and lots of rashers!!

career move

Ya good article. Thanks for the link Although I don't think I could keep drinking the lower volume of fluid recommended 470ml/hr even if I could carry it :eek:

Enduro

Lads, ye're totally overcomplicating things. A few simple points from experience:

- drink to thirst. If you're not thirsty then all is good.
- It doesn't matter what you think you should eat, you'll start rejecting all types of things after a day or two. Bring food that you know you'll want to eat.
- only use "sports" bars if you really really like them. Normal food that you normally eat is better.
- Gels are like defibrulators... they'll kick start you if you keel over, but don't use them unless you need to (they'll inhibit your fat burning engine).
- have a good mix of food. Try to have something savoury. Cheese works for me, also beef jerky.
- you need a lot less food than you think you do. You should be racing in the fat burn zone. You've probably got about a months worth of energy to draw on without having to eat. Over the years I copped on to the fact that I was transporting the same food from the start to the end of races as I had packed more than I needed. You actually "need" very little.
- If you get the opportunity to eat in transition, make it something different again. Preferably real food.

tip: divide your food into half day sized bags (zip locks or whatever). grab one for short stages or two for longer at the prior transition.

sconhome

Enduro wrote: »

You've probably got about a months worth of energy to draw on without having to eat.

I'd say I've a year's supply going spare

shotgunmcos

Interesting counting on your fat stores for fuel. Makes sense. But how much do you get from them each hour for 72 hours?

So, are you saying the race nutrition is just to top up glycogen stores? How far does your standard 2k glycogen store go? I've been pondering this the last few days. Maybe you are more adept at staying in the fat burning zone the most but with the amount of hills involved I fully expect to be chomping through carbs!

So 1g of fat is 9kcals.
I won't go into the math but at 150 kcals an hour, you would still go through your gycogen store and chew through 2lbs of fat. Not trying to draw this into a science debate, just celebrating the sore, battered, dehydrated, sleep deprived but leaner version of oneself in just 3 days :pac:;)

Grand a few snacks on the move and meals in TA... sweet! Or no... savoury :pac:

For sure we packed enough food for a winter last year and carried half of it around for 40 hours

sconhome

1lb of body fat they reckon is 3500kcals.

Sure you see the size of me and how little I eat on rogaine, training days etc. 1.5lts of the mix in a bladder and plain water bottle 750ml did me the 24 hours (with some remaining) :-)

I hear you on the leaner version of self.

sconhome

shotgunmcos wrote: »

Interesting counting on your fat stores for fuel. Makes sense.

TBF Enduro and Barry Murray have it down to a fine art at this stage.

All of us can do it - especially at the intensity of racing that we are doing.

Enduro

AKW wrote: »

TBF Enduro and Barry Murray have it down to a fine art at this stage.

All of us can do it - especially at the intensity of racing that we are doing.

Yeah absolutely. For years I knew that conventional nutritional advice as regards calroies needed etc was BS, as I was breaking all the "rules" and thriving. It was talking to Barry that clued me in to the more advanced thinking in sports science and nutrition, and it explained extremely well what I had figured out from experience of racing multiday ARs. Talking with Barry, and doing more of my own reading allowed me to fine tune my training to make even more gains w.r.t. fat adaption and racing.

MCOS, it's a very interesting area and you'd enjoy reading into it. Have a google for Tim Noakes (He really is a great sports scientist!). There's some great videos of him on you tube explaining the basics. You're in a good place anyway as I know you're big into food quality, which is the most important thing to get right, irrespective of carb/protein/fat balance.

I'm well fat adapted (I've read it takes about 6 months or so to truely get fat adapted), but I find I don't have to worry about eating anything at all to stay moving and not have glycogen depletion problems. My normal racing liquids are enough to keep me ticking along. I've raced for 5 days (New York 6 day running race last year) without a problem and eating hardly anything, just the odd ice cream treat in the heat (I had the race under control and effectively won by then and indulged myself with a little food in the last day).

pgibbo

Barry's a great man for talks and seminars. You should try to get to one Mike. You'd find it very informative

sconhome

pgibbo wrote: »

Barry's a great man for talks and seminars. You should try to get to one Mike. You'd find it very informative

Meant to say to you he was out our way today. Invited me for a spin on Twitter through the Burren.

career move

Neady83 wrote: »

Is it too soon to say that the long range forecast is looking okish?

Naw I like the way your thinking and the internet never lies
http://m.yr.no/place/Ireland/Munster/Ballyhoura_Mountains/long.html

shotgunmcos

career move wrote: »

Naw I like the way your thinking and the internet never lies
http://m.yr.no/place/Ireland/Munster/Ballyhoura_Mountains/long.html

The wettest intervals of that forecast is Sat 1800-0000. When do you think we will get to the trails?! :rolleyes:;):cool:

Neady83

shotgunmcos wrote: »

The wettest intervals of that forecast is Sat 1800-0000. When do you think we will get to the trails?! :rolleyes:;):cool:

Just made space for my hiking boots in the kit bag

shotgunmcos

Neady83 wrote: »

Just made space for my hiking boots in the kit bag

Packing already! Excited are we?! Countdown clock for live site on 4 days 23hrs

Already warned my boss that I'll be legging it out of the place on Tuesday Can't wait to get over to UL and start soaking up the atmosphere.

sconhome

shotgunmcos wrote: »

Packing already! Excited are we?! Countdown clock for live site on 4 days 23hrs

Already warned my boss that I'll be legging it out of the place on Tuesday Can't wait to get over to UL and start soaking up the atmosphere.

WALK please!!!

Last thing we need is you tripping and wrenching an ankle before we even started!!!

Neady83

shotgunmcos wrote: »

Packing already! Excited are we?! Countdown clock for live site on 4 days 23hrs

Already warned my boss that I'll be legging it out of the place on Tuesday Can't wait to get over to UL and start soaking up the atmosphere.

Excited, nervous, eager, frightened ...... woke up this morning and thought, this time next week we'll have been out for two nights and still have a night to go :eek:

sconhome

Neady83 wrote: »

woke up this morning

Lucky you! I haven't been sleeping

Señor Fancy Pants

Best of luck to all of you!

I'm jealous but also delighted I'm not doing it! You are lunatics.....stay safe and have fun!

Dilbert75

Enjoy it all each one of you lunatics!

martyboy48

Good luck one and all.... May the force be with you

joey100

Best of luck folks, hope at the very least the weather isn't too bad, 72 hrs is bad enough without having to put up with an Irish summer doing it!

sconhome

joey100 wrote: »

Best of luck folks, hope at the very least the weather isn't too bad, 72 hrs is bad enough without having to put up with an Irish summer doing it!

Thanks Joey.

In fairness you can fit a lot of Irish seasons into 72 hours, once we don't get snow we'll be grand

pgibbo

Best of luck this weekend everyone. Enjoy :cool:

mossym

BTW, i'm providing updates on team #triharder over here

http://triharderar.com/

i'll also keep an eye on Neady's team so you might see some updates on them too

Djoucer

Looks the whole field except the top 10 have been short coursed.

VIA sleepmonsters:

"The sea paddle stage is taking longer than expected and in worsening conditions most of the race field took the second short course option. They will come ashore and walk to Dunmore East to start the next stage, missing checkpoint K5. (The photo shows Dumore East bay and the beach teams come ashore on.)"

"It looks like only the top 10 remain on the full route. Team 9, Black Hill/OpavaNet have retired with the girl on the team sick."

Dilbert75

Talked to a couple of racers going through - all found the last section of kayak difficult: just going nowhere. #TeamTriHarder were in good spirits this evening as they headed out from transition in Dunmore East.

Oryx

A 25m jump off a cliff? That would have been me crying like a baby right there. Fair play to those guys!

Señor Fancy Pants

Any updates on these nut jobs?

mossym

Triharder finished at 5.20 this morning. Updates on their site

sconhome

mossym wrote: »

Triharder finished at 5.20 this morning. Updates on their site

Mossy has done a cracking job on reports, thank you sir!

Dilbert as official #TriHarderAR photographer you're hired!!

We laughed, cried and cried laughing through 68.5 hours of racing through some stunning locations, standing tall on mountains and crawling through ditches.

An awesome job done by all the Irish teams who stood shoulder to shoulder with the best of European racers and put it up to them.

Huge kudos to Enduro & Co on their podium place. Delighted for you guys.

LGK I didn't get to meet you, great going.

Neady - 1st time out and you guys rocked it!!

Mike, Kate, Shane & myself are over the moon. We finished 29th overall and 6th Irish team home.

Thanks to each one of you for all the messages of support. Going to take some time for this to settle in.

Neady83

Dilbert it was so lovely to see you before the coasteering

We finished 38th, without injury and very happy adventurers. It was tough at times, the hike a bike sections nearly broke me both mentally and physically but I loved the hike (without the blinking bike) in the Galtees The best thing about it though was we had such a laugh especially when we met random people asking what we were up to - they could not wrap their heads around it at all.

It was an epic adventure, I did so many things for the first time (coasteering & swimming in open water) and we learned so much as a team. I had no idea what sleep deprivation would do to a person, the hallucinations were hilarious though (castles, dancing hikers, vans, dinosaurs) and the footpaths I slept on were the most welcome of beds.

Thank you all for the messages of support and for all the advice throughout the year. Well done to Mike, Sean, Kate and Shane, ye put in an epic performance and got a well deserved top 20 position.

Today is a day of ups and downs, I'm still trying to compute everything we did, the highs and lows and process the distance we covered. After getting all the gear washed and the bike sorted, I've my feet up resting my sore feet and swelled calves but thankfully there's no lasting injuries.

Oryx I didn't do the 25ft jump off the cliff, we lost 250 points because of it unfortunately. I was so happy to have got through the swim without having a panic attack that I couldn't risk doing that jump and screwing it all up.

I'll start the race report during the week when I've figured it all out in my head, mind you, it probably won't be in sequence because I can't remember exactly went where

We started off the race asking each other who's idea this was but we finished it asking, what's next that pretty much sums it up

Dilbert75

Neady83 wrote: »

Dilbert it was so lovely to see you before the coasteering

Likewise - I did smile to myself afterwards when I realised I'd only introduced myself by my Boards name! You did great - there's no way I'd have tackled it at all, never mind achieve as much as you did.

Dilbert75

AKW wrote: »

Dilbert as official #TriHarderAR photographer you're hired!!

As long as I get 6 hours sleep a night I'm game. Feel free to share the pics.

shotgunmcos

Brilliant event. I don't know how I will pen a report but I will.

Well done Neady and the Arses great to meet you again and well done on finishing ranked

Enduro huge congrats and cheers for stopping over. Sounds like Get No Sleep had some race. You were like the kid that got the sweets Big kudos for putting it up to the European top teams that came over.

The event stepped up a big notch to host the AR Euro Series final.

As for #TriHarderAR, well we had a ball and I'm very proud of the team and how we stepped up a notch this year. It was all about learning again. Applying last year's lessons to bring out an improved performance. This year we executed our plan, had a ball of fun, epic highs and some very specific lows. We pulled together as as team though and finished strong passing other teams.

The volunteers are selfless wonderful people. AR, though, is an enter if you dare, thing...

lgk

AKW wrote: »

LGK I didn't get to meet you, great going.

Cheers. Meant to look you guys up, but as usual, brain was a bit fuzzy at the end.

You did really well, must already be looking forward to ITERA next year