SoccerManager.com (#4) The Boards.ie World

doc holliday

Panathinaikos 1-1 Boca Juniors. All square in the top of the table clash. We took the lead through Walters but Pana got a 81st min equaliser in a very even game. Now down to 3rd

PerrinV2

Must resist temptation to sell Fekir..

tupac_healy

PerrinV2 wrote:

Must resist temptation to sell Fekir..

Must not!

redzerdrog

Right lads whats the general etiquette around here. I have recently found out that Sunderland were due to receive Firmino as part of the benzema transfer to city.

Firmino has since been used to get Reus from Bayern.

I have tried to speak to gerp99 about this however the only reply i got was that MOD SNIP quit before the 2nd part of the deal was complete.

I think it is bad form on Gers behalf that he didn't tell me of this deal himself but even worse that he since used the player to secure another player.

So what next?

Seems like blatant cheeting to me or that just how things are done around here

Colemania

redzerdrog wrote: »

Right lads whats the general etiquette around here. I have recently found out that Sunderland were due to receive Firmino as part of the benzema transfer to city.

Firmino has since been used to get Reus from Bayern.

I have tried to speak to gerp99 about this however the only reply i got was that Mod Snip quit before the 2nd part of the deal was complete.

I think it is bad form on Gers behalf that he didn't tell me of this deal himself but even worse that he since used the player to secure another player.

So what next?

Seems like blatant cheeting to me or that just how things are done around here

General etiquette would see bayern and city come to some sort of agreement to transfer firmino to you and city forego another player for reus but i'd say ger probably forgot about the deal since he left. There's nothing else really you can do about it.

gerp99

How have I cheated? Serious allegation your throwing out there. Go through the games rules and show me. Also I had no deal with you. I had it with bear. He left. Not my problem.

ctrl-alt-delete

It can't be classed as cheating. It would be blatant cheating if it were your deal and City just decided to withhold part of it but this is totally different.

It is tough, but it is tough luck really.

It could have been the opposite way around with you owing City a player when you joined from the previous managers deal, and maybe you would have played ball and maybe City would be chasing it - but there is no obligation for anyone to continue deals like that.

There is nothing you can really do about it to be honest.

All only my opinion of course, I'm not saying I wouldn't feel the same, but it is the potential with the nature of deals like that - even though you didn't enter into it.

redzerdrog

gerp99 wrote: »

How have I cheated? Serious allegation your throwing out there. Go through the games rules and show me. Also I had no deal with you. I had it with bear. He left. Not my problem.

So you don't see anything wrong with not honouring the transfer?

KERSPLAT!

Well for me the start and finish of it is, Firmino is going nowhere right now. The deal is nothing to do with me.

mackeire

baza Rakus wrote: »

You're gonna have to ask me a more Pacific question; I turn so often I'm immune to being dizzy.

Iwa Jima, midway and Hawaii are all islands in which ocean?

tupac_healy

redzerdrog wrote:

Seems like blatant cheeting to me or that just how things are done around here

Bang out of order to accuse someone of cheating when there is NOTHING in the rules about this.....

Just my personal opinion but I think a deal is kept between 2 MANAGERS And both managers have an obligation to see it thru to the end... if one does not stay until late the completion of the deal I don't see why it stands up?

Just my 2 cents, and I did mention that there should have been something put in place about this exact sort of thing before before something like this happened...


But cheating, that's out of order IMO

redzerdrog

So deals are between managers and not clubs? That just ridiculous and if that is the case then I presume Firmino is on his way to Mod Snip in Shanghai

KERSPLAT!

Firmino. Is. Going. Nowhere.

tupac_healy

redzerdrog wrote:

So deals are between managers and not clubs? That just ridiculous and if that is the case then I presume Firmino is on his way to EireannBear in Shanghai

Well of course the deal is between the managers.... the 2 of them thrashed out the details and part of which was (my understanding) that Firmino was to go to Sunderland, but since Bear was not the Sunderland manager (he has in fact been gone quite a while, so holding a player for his return is preposterous) AGAIN, IMO his end of the deal was not fulfilled.....


All of this is a fruitless argument anyway since Firmino now resides at Bayern.

My point is calling it cheating when there is a charter in place and NO RULES were broken is out of order. But again I say, I did bring this very point up ages back and asked for some sort of ruling on the protocol if (and when, was only a matter of time) this happened. Had that been put in place you would have possibly had grounds for your accusation.... as it stands you don't

Wilberto

Honestly, to me the only person at fault here was the manager who left the gameworld before completing the deal. Now, clearly there was a genuine reason for him leaving at the time he did, but that's fairly irrelevant in my opinion.

Wilberto

Also, this is just one of the many risks taken with these types of deals. If it goes your way, great. If it doesn't, unlucky plucky!

Wilberto

tupac_healy wrote: »

Just my 2 cents, and I did mention that there should have been something put in place about this exact sort of thing before before something like this happened.

Personally, I don't think anything can be put in place to stop anything like this happens. This is the reason why many managers opt not to do multi-part deals. It involves a lot of trust and faith in the other manager (not that that was the case in this instance, obviously. Just a case of a manager leaving before the deal was completed.)

redzerdrog

*Mod Snip* has told me that Ger had agreed to honour the deal for any incoming manager

KERSPLAT!

There are a handful of managers I'd do this kinda deal with, and this is the reason why.

KERSPLAT!

redzerdrog wrote: »

*Mod Snip* has told me that Ger had agreed to honour the deal for any incoming manager

That's grand, I didn't and I won't be.

tupac_healy

Wilberto wrote:

Personally, I don't think anything can be put in place to stop anything like this happens. This is the reason why many managers opt not to do multi-part deals. It involves a lot of trust and faith in the other manager (not that that was the case in this instance, obviously. Just a case of a manager leaving before the deal was completed.)

Not even to stop.. but to set out in stone who is in the right and who is in the wrong...


Tbf it's a grey area and I agree with your view on it, others wouldn't.... but if we had something to refer to then at least we would know who is right and wrong with no grey area

Mourinho

I paid the bear €5 via PayPal for Firmino if anything he's owed to me ye shower! :mad:

tupac_healy

Mourinho wrote:

I paid the bear €5 via PayPal for Firmino if anything he's owed to me ye shower!

5! Always said you were stingy!!!!!!

gerp99

I agreed to no such thing and I made no deal with you. When you took over the club benzema was gone. If he had swapped clubs then I could honour it but he didn't,he left. This isn't rl. Deals are done between managers not clubs. Why would I agree to him leaving but I still had to give away a player to a random manager. No one even had the club at this stage.

GT_TDI_150

I was in a similar situation when i did a deal with roma of which smalling to me in return for toprak going to roma had not yet completed when the then Roma manager left.

I approached the new roma manager to see if he was interested in doing the same deal, knowing full well he had no obligation, moral or otherwise, to do so but he agreed so i threw him an extra youth as a thanks but i knew when i hammered out the deal with roma that id potentially loose out on smalling and would have absolutly no claim to hm no matter what had or hadnt been agreed.

redzerdrog

The agreed transfer was Zabaletta, Turan and Firmino in exchange for Benzeme.

Benzema was transfered as per the agreed deal as where zab and turan. It is absolute bollox to say the deal was with the manager and not club.

It is cheating on my book and the fact that most of you are defending his actions reflects very poorly on this gameworld.

For those saying the deals are with managers and not the club is it perfectly ok for example a manager (sunderland) offer 4 or 5 players in exchange for Messi, sells the players at cost to Dortmund then moves clubs to say Sporting and then Messi transfers to Sporting. All while depleting the Sunderland team but not effecting the new club

Burlap_Sack

My two cents is the agreed deal should of been honoured. An advantage has clearly been gained and it was bad form not to complete the deal new manager or not.

redzerdrog

Burlap_Sack wrote: »

My two cents is the agreed deal should of been honoured. An advantage has clearly been gained and it was bad form not to complete the deal new manager or not.

Finally some sense around here

ctrl-alt-delete

Every case will be different.

In this case the Sunderland manager didn't change clubs as has happened with other similar deals previous to this, he left the GW.

I don't know how long Sunderland were unmanaged for after that, but you can't expect a manager to wait around and hold onto a player in such circumstances - at the moment you still can't deal with unmanaged.

An advantage may have been gained, but it was not gained through cheating.

redzerdrog

ctrl-alt-delete wrote: »

Every case will be different.

In this case the Sunderland manager didn't change clubs as has happened with other similar deals previous to this, he left the GW.

I don't know how long Sunderland were unmanaged for after that, but you can't expect a manager to wait around and hold onto a player in such circumstances - at the moment you still can't deal with unmanaged.

An advantage may have been gained, but it was not gained through cheating.

Firmino transferred long after I became Sunderland Manager