7 in 10 men overweight

laoch na mona

http://www.thejournal.ie/irish-men-overweight-1824111-Dec2014/

interesting to see the gendered breakdown of statistics, it's interesting that women still do most of the food prep and men are much less likely to learn how to cook, it's 2014 for feck sake men should know how to cook by now

full report if you're interested
http://www.safefood.eu/SafeFood/media/SafeFoodLibrary/Documents/Publications/Research%20Reports/Consumer-Focused-Review_Men.pdf

Sleepy

Well, you mangled that statistic! 7 in 10, not 1 in 7!

ancapailldorcha

Depends on how you define overweight. I know fitness fanatics who'd be overweight according to BMI despite have very little body fat and being in excellent physical condition.

laoch na mona

Sleepy wrote: »

Well, you mangled that statistic! 7 in 10, not 1 in 7!

fixed it:p

laoch na mona

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Depends on how you define overweight. I know fitness fanatics who'd be overweight according to BMI despite have very little body fat and being in excellent physical condition.

BMI is for large population groups not individuals, defiantly not anyone who lifts, plays rugby or otherwise packs on muscle in their spare time.

for mere mortals however it is a good guide, but body fat percentage is the best way to measure how healthy you are though imo

ancapailldorcha

As you said in the OP, a breakdown would be interesting as I suspect there's a fair amount of Sindo scaremongering at play here.

Slattsy

Me too.
Make that 8 in 10.

The Strawman Argument

laoch na mona wrote: »

BMI is for large population groups not individuals, defiantly not anyone who lifts, plays rugby or otherwise packs on muscle in their spare time.

for mere mortals however it is a good guide, but body fat percentage is the best way to measure how healthy you are though imo

I dunno if it's even a good guide, I'm fairly skinny, have had people confronting me on whether I've had an eating disorder and the like even, but according to BMI I'm very close to overweight! Doesn't really accommodate for the range of body types that there are out there at all so I'm not sure if it's a good idea that it's used so widely.

Wibbs

Personally I reckon the mirror tells all and you can forget about "BMI" and all that. Skinny, normal, muscled, chubby and fat are, or should be pretty easy to see in said mirror. At 5'11" with a 29-30 inch waist I can see I'm skinny, no need to reference BMI to tell me that. Surely the same is applicable if you're packing extra pounds? If your waist is bigger than your hips, you're carrying fat Ted, unless you're pregnant(and for the majority of folks in tGC that might require another more interesting thread. The Science category might want to hear from you too ).

laoch na mona

Wibbs wrote: »

Personally I reckon the mirror tells all and you can forget about "BMI" and all that. Skinny, normal, muscled, chubby and fat are, or should be pretty easy to see in said mirror. At 5'11" with a 29-30 inch waist I can see I'm skinny, no need to reference BMI to tell me that. Surely the same is applicable if you're packing extra pounds? If your waist is bigger than your hips, you're carrying fat Ted, unless you're pregnant(and for the majority of folks in tGC that might require another more interesting thread. The Science category might want to hear from you too ).

didn't the hse run a campaign similar to that, where they pointed out waist size as an indicator of a un/healthy weight

Captain Chaos

laoch na mona wrote: »

BMI is for large population groups not individuals, defiantly not anyone who lifts, plays rugby or otherwise packs on muscle in their spare time.

for mere mortals however it is a good guide, but body fat percentage is the best way to measure how healthy you are though imo

BMI is not really a guide at all and only really works for one body type. I got a medical in work a few months ago and before the nurse took my BMI I said I know I will be in the Obese section. She said yep, but I have to do it anyway. She then said for my build to have a BMI in the "normal" zone all my ribs would have to be clearly showing and I'd have to starve myself to the point that I would not be able to work. My body fat was around 15%.

I don't got to the gym or work out or play any sport and eat and drink whatever, it's just my work keeps me fit and I naturally put on muscle and keep it without even trying.

carzony

Well i'm 22 years of age, 6'1 and 12 stone. Everyone tells me I look like I need a good feed and the bmi says i'm a perfect weight but I a very unfit, have no muscle and have a bad set of man boobs and a bit of a stomach

Bmi definitely isnt perfect guide.

in regards to being overweight ''crap'' food is to cheap and readily available..

Wibbs

laoch na mona wrote: »

didn't the hse run a campaign similar to that, where they pointed out waist size as an indicator of a un/healthy weight

+1 It should be a good indicator alright L. If it's bigger than your hips you're carrying a gut, pretty much game over on the "am I carrying more than I should" metric.

Captain Chaos wrote: »

BMI is not really a guide at all and only really works for one body type. I got a medical in work a few months ago and before the nurse took my BMI I said I know I will be in the Obese section. She said yep, but I have to do it anyway. She then said for my build to have a BMI in the "normal" zone all my ribs would have to be clearly showing and I'd have to starve myself to the point that I would not be able to work. My body fat was around 15%.

I don't got to the gym or work out or play any sport and eat and drink whatever, it's just my work keeps me fit and I naturally put on muscle and keep it without even trying.

Feck me CC, you're an archaic human. No seriously. The theory goes that archaic humans like Neandertals put on muscle rather than fat as a given and a few studies have shown that still hold true with some rare enough modern folks like yourself. Kudos for you CC, though another theory has it that they died out because they didn't get podgy in the good times, so weren't as good at surviving the lean times, as muscle is much more costly than fat in calorie terms. Be grateful you're a throwback, rocking it old stylee in a time of plenty and having a job that buys into that.

iptba

Slattsy wrote: »

Me too.
Make that 8 in 10.

3 more and we can make it 11 in 10.

enfant terrible

The Strawman Argument wrote: »

I dunno if it's even a good guide, I'm fairly skinny, have had people confronting me on whether I've had an eating disorder and the like even, but according to BMI I'm very close to overweight! Doesn't really accommodate for the range of body types that there are out there at all so I'm not sure if it's a good idea that it's used so widely.

What height and weight are you out of interest?

Sam Kade

It says women diet more that men, I know a few women that have been dieting for years and they're still fat.

CaptainAhab

To further complicate matters, men can be 'skinny on the outside but fat on the inside', i.e. carrying internal fat that is not visible without a scanner and that is supposed to be even more dangerous than external fat.. Just some food for thought for anyone who thinks they might be ok because they are slim..

Pawwed Rig

I find that figure to be very high. A quick glance around my office would throw up a completely different percentage on both men and women much lower than the headlines below. In fact my last three jobs would indicate about 80% of men and women being either a healthy weight or borderline.
I wonder is there social economic reasons for this as in less well off people being more prone to obesity.

Potatoeman

Sam Kade wrote: »

It says women diet more that men, I know a few women that have been dieting for years and they're still fat.

I have heard that dieting frequently can cause more weight gain as when you stop your body tries to build back up fat reserves.

Men also more frequently want to gain muscle rather than lose weight.

laoch na mona

Potatoeman wrote: »

I have heard that dieting frequently can cause more weight gain as when you stop your body tries to build back up fat reserves.

Men also more frequently want to gain muscle rather than lose weight.

and fad diets tend to be marketed at women not men

Wibbs

True enough LnM, though one has been, the Paleo diet. Definitely more a male diet. Must be the caveman association.

strobe

Sam Kade wrote: »

It says women diet more that men, I know a few women that have been dieting for years and they're still fat.

I'll never get this craic of people dieting and not exercising. How many fat people do you know that diet regularly and have done for years? How many fat people do you know that exercise regularly and have done for years? It's the most blatantly self evident thing in the world.

Are people just stark raving insane?

ancapailldorcha

strobe wrote: »

I'll never get this craic of people dieting and not exercising. How many fat people do you know that diet regularly and have done for years? How many fat people do you know that exercise regularly and have done for years? It's the most blatantly self evident thing in the world.

Are people just stark raving insane?

You can eat properly if you don't have time to go to the gym and lose quite a bit of weight. I did it. Just avoid fad diets and stick to the basics. Simples.

keane2097

strobe wrote: »

I'll never get this craic of people dieting and not exercising. How many fat people do you know that diet regularly and have done for years? How many fat people do you know that exercise regularly and have done for years? It's the most blatantly self evident thing in the world.

Are people just stark raving insane?

Diet is vastly more important than exercise when it comes to losing weight.

DoYouEvenLift

Great! Less competition to stand out from the crowd for people who actually care about their health and appearance. But more envious losers who feel insecure about their physical shape when in the company of "someone who lifts" and try to cope with it by throwing backhanded and passive aggressive insults to feel better about their lack of motivation and effort.

ancapailldorcha

DoYouEvenLift wrote: »

Great! Less competition to stand out from the crowd for people who actually care about their health and appearance. But more envious losers who feel insecure about their physical shape when in the company of "someone who lifts" and try to cope with it by throwing backhanded and passive aggressive insults to feel better about their lack of motivation and effort.

What?

DoYouEvenLift

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

What?

I'm referring to "haters".

keane2097

DoYouEvenLift wrote: »

Great! Less competition to stand out from the crowd for people who actually care about their health and appearance. But more envious losers who feel insecure about their physical shape when in the company of "someone who lifts" and try to cope with it by throwing backhanded and passive aggressive insults to feel better about their lack of motivation and effort.

This sounds like a you problem.

Lucena

laoch na mona wrote: »

BMI is for large population groups not individuals, defiantly not anyone who lifts, plays rugby or otherwise packs on muscle in their spare time.

for mere mortals however it is a good guide, but body fat percentage is the best way to measure how healthy you are though imo

Judging by the rest of the comments, I don't think anyone actually read your post.

DoYouEvenLift

keane2097 wrote: »

This sounds like a you problem.

Nope. Ask some men who would be in above average shape about totally unwarranted negative reactions they've received from some people.

Most men I know do who fall into the 3 in 10 not overweight are ideal candidates to be mugged, built like teenagers.

beks101

strobe wrote: »

I'll never get this craic of people dieting and not exercising. How many fat people do you know that diet regularly and have done for years? How many fat people do you know that exercise regularly and have done for years? It's the most blatantly self evident thing in the world.

Are people just stark raving insane?

I find when people are exercising regularly, they can overestimate how much food they need and it can become a free-for-all. A sort of "sure I'm in the gym every day, I can eat what I want" and gradually the pounds creep up. In the past I've lost far more weight by eating less and not exercising a jot, than exercising a tonne and not keeping too close an eye on the diet.

My boyfriend is 6'2 and about 15 stone, 'unhealthy' on any BMI scale, but he's built like a brick **** house and has a really low body fat %, is one of the most health-obsessed people I know. It's a terrible gauge of health and fitness and can't believe it's still the standard tool for measuring these things.

Wibbs

Jeebus I just checked my BMI on one of those online calculator thingies and apparently I'm "optimum" and I look like a reject from an Oxfam poster*. If I went outside in a loin cloth Bob Geldof would be kicking off another charity record.








*Old farts may get that reference.

Pawwed Rig

beks101 wrote: »

I find when people are exercising regularly, they can overestimate how much food they need and it can become a free-for-all. A sort of "sure I'm in the gym every day, I can eat what I want" and gradually the pounds creep up. In the past I've lost far more weight by eating less and not exercising a jot, than exercising a tonne and not keeping too close an eye on the diet.

I am definitely guilty of that. I am not bad on exercising but find when I stop or can't do it for a while I am hungrier than normal. I am lucky though in that I have maintained a steady BMI for most of my life (sorry LNM but BMI is relevant for me ). It's not rocket science if calories in = calories out then I'm a happy bunny

beks101

beks101 wrote: »

I find when people are exercising regularly, they can overestimate how much food they need and it can become a free-for-all. A sort of "sure I'm in the gym every day, I can eat what I want" and gradually the pounds creep up. In the past I've lost far more weight by eating less and not exercising a jot, than exercising a tonne and not keeping too close an eye on the diet.

Along with the bad habits one picks up which can't be gotten away with when metabolism slows (damn aging) and when life gets in the way of the gym.

laoch na mona

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

I am definitely guilty of that. I am not bad on exercising but find when I stop or can't do it for a while I am hungrier than normal. I am lucky though in that I have maintained a steady BMI for most of my life (sorry LNM but BMI is relevant for me ). It's not rocket science if calories in = calories out then I'm a happy bunny

to be honest bmi is a fairly accurate measure for me as well, I'm average height and naturally light, I plan to more or less stay this size

Tarzana2

strobe wrote: »

I'll never get this craic of people dieting and not exercising. How many fat people do you know that diet regularly and have done for years? How many fat people do you know that exercise regularly and have done for years? It's the most blatantly self evident thing in the world.

Are people just stark raving insane?

Exercise is great, obviously, but it is a small part of weight loss, in my exercise. Exercise does add to the calories deficit but diet is way more important. Exercise is what makes that newly slim body look good naked.

Fukuyama

If your diet isn't in order don't even bother exercising.

It's a common mistake for many blokes to start eating steaks and slam protein shakes just because they've started in the gym. That'll just pile on more fat unless you know what you're doing.

You can lose a lot of weight just through (strict) dieting.

Pawwed Rig

Dieting alone is really difficult to maintain though. If you are doing one it would be best to do the other

ancapailldorcha

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Dieting alone is really difficult to maintain though. If you are doing one it would be best to do the other

I dropped the best part of 3 stone just by cutting out bread and junk food while increasing my water intake. Some weight/bodyweight work has obvious benefits but isn't necessary from a weight loss perspective.

Fukuyama

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Dieting alone is really difficult to maintain though. If you are doing one it would be best to do the other

If you asked me why most diets fail I'd say this: boredom.

We eat when we're bored, lounging around or otherwise unstimulated. One of the best ways to not eat is to not give yourself a chance to and exercise can do this by filling a 1.5 hour gap in an empty evening. It also boosts mood which can preemptively stop emotional eating. Many people also don't want to crap all over their efforts in the gym by eating half a box of Nesquick and opt for the porridge instead.

Fad diets are incredibly difficult to keep up. They deprive your body of at least one macro-nutrient which brings about cravings. Instead, it's best to opt for a diet which consists of a wide range of food groups but has smaller portion sizes.

Wibbs

Tarzana2 wrote: »

Exercise is great, obviously, but it is a small part of weight loss

+1000 T, it's a lot easier to not eat the bucket of KFC than to try and exercise the hundreds(thousand?) of calories from said bucket off afterwards.

Pawwed Rig wrote:

Dieting alone is really difficult to maintain though.

That's true too PR, at least for normal people and it's easy for someone like me with a built in tiny appetite to say "eat less". I'm lazy with it, so the choice between sweating in a gym and not eating a cake, the not eating the cake wins every time.

alistair spuds

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Depends on how you define overweight. I know fitness fanatics who'd be overweight according to BMI despite have very little body fat and being in excellent physical condition.

yeah that must be it, 7 in 10 irish men must be fitness fanatics . . .

BlatentCheek

While BMI isn't perfect it is valuable as an indicator to people that they may have a problem and should have it looked into further.
You'd think that people would know they're fat by looking in the mirror but in fact people trick themselves into thinking they're grand. The fact that obesity usually occurs in clusters makes this problem worse as the fat family whose friends are mostly tubbers tend to consider themselves normal.

I was overweight for a while and because I did a lot of exercise I was sure that the BMI was just wrong for my body type. Cut down my diet to sensible levels without doing anything drastic and noticed a massive change and now I realise I was in denial for a few years. BMI might be wrong for individual cases but an overweight or obese score should set alarm bells ringing until you have proof from further tests that it's wrong for you.

Wanderer2010

And yet, despite the staggering amount of overweight and obese people in this country, the anti-fat brigade is still very strong and visible in bars, at job interviews, even walking down the street. May i ask the guys here, have they ever experienced any slagging or discrimination based on their size?

My point is that you would think with so many overweight people in this country,its nothing unusual to see anymore and nobody would give a toss. Its like slagging someone for having an Irish accent when in Ireland- there are so many heavy people out there now Im v surprised that people can still face abuse and mockery. The skinny people are the MINORITY now!!

Lucena

Wibbs wrote: »

+1000 T, it's a lot easier to not eat the bucket of KFC than to try and exercise the hundreds(thousand?) of calories from said bucket off afterwards.

That's true too PR, at least for normal people and it's easy for someone like me with a built in tiny appetite to say "eat less". I'm lazy with it, so the choice between sweating in a gym and not eating a cake, the not eating the cake wins every time.

That reminds me of an ad (or maybe directly on the packet) for KP Peanuts which said that the contents of the bag would give you enough energy to swim for an hour.

I’m sure most people missed the fact that that meant that you’d have to swim for an hour to burn off the calories consumed by eating the peanuts!

Energy good, calories bad!!

jackofalltrades

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

The skinny people are the MINORITY now!!

Have very thin/underweight people ever been in the majority in Ireland in our recent history?(excluding times where food supply was very limited).
Or are you labelling people in the normal/healthy weight category as skinny?

deathtocaptcha

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

And yet, despite the staggering amount of overweight and obese people in this country, the anti-fat brigade is still very strong and visible in bars, at job interviews, even walking down the street. May i ask the guys here, have they ever experienced any slagging or discrimination based on their size?

My point is that you would think with so many overweight people in this country,its nothing unusual to see anymore and nobody would give a toss. Its like slagging someone for having an Irish accent when in Ireland- there are so many heavy people out there now Im v surprised that people can still face abuse and mockery. The skinny people are the MINORITY now!!

you can be overweight or even obese and look 'normal' i.e. not worthy of slagging...

it's the extreme fatties morbidly obese that get the slagging... i.e. people that can't run or would look out of place on a football pitch...

beer bellies have always been ok - lots of amateur GAA / football players have them, but in general those lads can still move about and show a turn of pace / athleticism when they need to..

Pawwed Rig

deathtocaptcha wrote: »

it's the extreme fatties that get the slagging

Mod note - Please be more diplomatic with your language

Fukuyama

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

And yet, despite the staggering amount of overweight and obese people in this country, the anti-fat brigade is still very strong and visible in bars, at job interviews, even walking down the street. May i ask the guys here, have they ever experienced any slagging or discrimination based on their size?

My point is that you would think with so many overweight people in this country,its nothing unusual to see anymore and nobody would give a toss. Its like slagging someone for having an Irish accent when in Ireland- there are so many heavy people out there now Im v surprised that people can still face abuse and mockery. The skinny people are the MINORITY now!!

I remember back in my early teens I gained a few pounds. Too much Playstation and sugary sweets, not enough football. Got stick off my parents, siblings and a few other kids around my age. Nothing serious, just little comments or jokes taking the piss (I gave as good as I got too). Anyways, it was these insults that kind of put an end to my denial. I spent a summer playing huge football matches that lasted from sun up to sun down. By mid-July I was skinny as ever. Sometimes honest insults can be helpful.

As adults, I think name calling is a bit immature. Haven't witnessed it much outside of close friends taking the pi55.

I really hope Ireland never reaches a stage like in the US where the HAES (Health at Every Size) movement is growing in power. It uses the power of democracy for evil in my opinion, by getting the majority (fat people) to vote for stupid public health policies that only serves their own illness to the detriment of others who actually look after their health.

As for discrimination - I actually think it's okay to discriminate against obese (not overweight) people for certain jobs. I've worked physically demanding jobs (unloading trucks mainly) and had obese co-workers. There comes a stage in obesity where a human just can't hack the job and others have to work harder to do his work for him.

There have also been calls in the US to discriminate against obese people during evacuation situations. During Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans (50% obese city - way above national average), Coast Guard and Fire Department resources were tied up during a massive natural disaster due to obese people. Not only were these obese people unable to rescue themselves where an able-bodied person could, thus leading to a rise in "unnecessary" distress calls, it often required 3 times the amount of personnel to safely evacuate and transport them. Even in the hospitals which were running on generators, obese caused problems.

During Hurricane Katrina, 12 staff members at a New Orleans area hospital took nearly two hours to carry a single obese patient down an emergency stairwell. As a result, many staff members were unable to assist with other aspects of the hurricane evacuation

REPORT

So we have obese people being rescued while elderly, genuinely disabled and those REALLY caught in the tick of it receive no help. And the obese take up more specialized resources when they are rescued, keeping in mind that during these situations hospitals are crammed and resources are at breaking point.

The alternative, which is to list obese people as non-priorities and rescue/treat normal sized people first isn't one to be taken lightly as it could result in their deaths - however, in doing so, multiple normal sized people could be saved using those rerouted resources.

In a practical situation, if eleven people are on a roof and the helicopter can only hold ten, and there's one obese guy that weighs as much as two people, then I think he should be left on the roof and rescued later.

/tangent

RDM_83 again

^^^^

Just in relation to that suggestion and I'm not suggesting at all you mean it that way but the optics of what you suggest would be amazingly bad from a race angle (black female obesity = 41% white female obesity = 24.5%)

Edit: And thats without even going into the socio-economic thing