David De Gea - Best in the World?

Billy86

Talib Fiasco wrote: »

But if De Gea is really the best shot stopper in the league and the world then he should be saving every shot right thus preventing those goals? One major criticism I have of De Gea is he doesn't punch the ball near enough.

Shay Given was named Premier League keeper of the year in 01/02 and 05/06. As per you, he was only the 12th best keeper the first time, and tied 7th best the second time.

Interesting, but for all the wrong reasons.

Kylo Ren

Some of the comments in here are absolutely hilarious.

Is DDG the best keeper in the world? Not for me. I'd give it to Neuer.

That being said, would I swap him for any keeper in the world? Not a chance.

CSF

Keno wrote: »

Some of the comments in here are absolutely hilarious.

Is DDG the best keeper in the world? Not for me. I'd give it to Neuer.

That being said, would I swap him for any keeper in the world? Not a chance.

I'm pretty sure you'd swap him for Neuer.

PhlegmyMoses

eagle eye wrote: »

Lets talk Premier league level first and forget the rest of the world.

Frasier Forster is every bit as good as David De Gea.

You need to do it at a big club imo. Some goalkeepers look great when the weight of expectation is not on them. If Forster gets a big transfer with all the pressure that comes with it and still performs well, then we can talk about him in those terms. People were calling Mignolet top 5 a couple of years ago. Not any more.

Guy:Incognito

GavRedKing wrote: »

Hart got a lot of media protection as hes English.

De gea is better and younger, IMO and id know who id prefer.

Hart talks a lot and manages the back line but hes made some poor judgements, hes not a bad keeper, far from it but hes not up with de gea.

Hart being English though means City will hold on to him till they're finished with him. De Gea being Spanish is Utd's biggest issue.

Billy86

Yeah but it's not an issue right now. And if it becomes one, just slap a €100mn+ price tag on him, and say goodbye if it is met.

Kylo Ren

CSF wrote: »

I'm pretty sure you'd swap him for Neuer.

No, I wouldn't. 4 years his junior, potential to be the best in the world, and has done all this while, I'm pretty sure, not playing with the same starting defence consecutively all season.

Billy86

Keno wrote: »

No, I wouldn't. 4 years his junior, potential to be the best in the world, and has done all this while, I'm pretty sure, not playing with the same starting defence consecutively all season.

That is one thing that cannot be ignored also, to be fair - there is absolutely no comparison in the situation DDG has had in front of him for the last 18 months compared to Neuer or Courtois.

CSF

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

You need to do it at a big club imo. Some goalkeepers look great when the weight of expectation is not on them. If Forster gets a big transfer with all the pressure that comes with it and still performs well, then we can talk about him in those terms. People were calling Mignolet top 5 a couple of years ago. Not any more.

It is all massively slanted based on the team you play for, regardless of size. De Gea is getting all the plaudits because he is playing at a team where he is having to make lots of saves, and he deserves the praise because he is making those saves.

On the other hand, you've Courtois, who has had to make less crucial saves, because his team are ridiculously strong defensively, and he is a monster in the air, so he receives less of the plaudits than De Gea does, but I wouldn't be of the opinion that Courtois is any worse than De Gea.

Will I Amnt

Keno wrote: »

No, I wouldn't. 4 years his junior, potential to be the best in the world, and has done all this while, I'm pretty sure, not playing with the same starting defence consecutively all season.

Same here. Neuer is the better keeper but I still wouldn't swap him.

CSF

Keno wrote: »

No, I wouldn't. 4 years his junior, potential to be the best in the world, and has done all this while, I'm pretty sure, not playing with the same starting defence consecutively all season.

If you wouldn't swap any keeper for Neuer you are full on insane. The man is a monster. Barely human.

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

That is one thing that cannot be ignored also, to be fair - there is absolutely no comparison in the situation DDG has had in front of him for the last 18 months compared to Neuer or Courtois.

Except that during that time Courtois has changed clubs, changed leagues and thus changed the back four that plays in front of him.

PhlegmyMoses

CSF wrote: »

It is all massively slanted based on the team you play for, regardless of size. De Gea is getting all the plaudits because he is playing at a team where he is having to make lots of saves, and he deserves the praise because he is making those saves.

On the other hand, you've Courtois, who has had to make less crucial saves, because his team are ridiculously strong defensively, and he is a monster in the air, so he receives less of the plaudits than De Gea does, but I wouldn't be of the opinion that Courtois is any worse than De Gea.

I agree, but Courtois did it at the business end of the CL and La Liga last year as well.

My point is more related to keepers like Forster, Begovic, Mignolet etc, who can look great at smaller teams but may fall to pieces when the pressure of playing at United/Chelsea/Pool gets to them.

I think Forster is very good but mental strength is a huge facet of the likes of Neuer, DDG and Courtois' makeup. You can't really tell a whole lot about someone's mental strength when they're playing for teams where the expectation for the season is top half. Little mistakes are brushed away and forgotten and they are lionised for good games.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Except that during that time Courtois has changed clubs, changed leagues and thus changed the back four that plays in front of him.

That's true also, though he has gone from a very well organised unit to a team of top quality defenders, shielded by possibly the best DM in the world, having dealt with a club in turmoil under and inept manager last year and then this year a merry go round of new players and youth teamers on top of another new manager and new system (with a combined 37 years at the club having left all at once in Vidic, Ferdinand and Evra). Here are the backlines he has had in front of him this season (youth teamers and/or midfielders in red)...

Jones, Smalling, Blackett, Young, Lingaard, (sub: Januzaj)
Jones, Smalling, Blackett, Young, Valencia, (Keane)
Jones, Smalling, Blackett, Young, Valencia, (Keane, Januzaj)
Jones, Evans, Blackett, Young, Valencia
Rojo, Evans, Blackett, Rojo, (Valencia)
Rojo, Evans, Smalling, Blackett(sent off), (Smalling)
Rojo, McNair, Rafael, Shaw, (Thorpe - Rooney sent off)
Rojo, McNair, Rafael, Shaw, (Blackett)
Rojo, Jones, Rafael, Shaw
Rojo, Smalling, Rafael, Shaw
Rojo, Smalling(sent off), Valencia, Shaw, (McNair)
Blind, McNair, Valencia, Shaw, (Fletcher)
Smalling, McNair, Blackett, Valencia, Shaw, (Young)
Smalling, Rojo, Valencia, Shaw, (Fletcher)
Smalling, Rojo, Valencia, Young
Smalling, Rojo, Evans, Young, Valencia, (McNair)
Evans, Jones, Carrick, Valencia, Young, (McNair)

He has had two games out of 17(!) with a backline made up of first team defenders. Not with a set in stone 'first choice' defense - just with four actual first team defenders. Exactly half of the players to feature in the backline ahead of him have been midfielders or youth team players, and due to injuries and suspensions, only once has he had the same backline for two consecutive matches (it's not like van Gaal is resting players for midweek matches, after all).

Given the option between Courtois' situation and DDG's this season, I know which I would prefer.

Skylinehead

Andersonisgod wrote: »

No, in Claudio Bravo they have one of the top 5 goalkeepers on the planet and someone who form I consider better than De Gea's and in Ter Stegen they have an outstanding young keeper whose footwork could, as suggested on commentary during the game against PSG, revolutionize goalkeeping, the young German is a prodigy.

Funny that you weren't singing Bravo's praises as a top 5 keeper before he joined your beloved Barca. Odd that. Hint: he's not even close to that.

As for Ter Stegen (you should probably get your own teams player names right, who's "Ander Ter Stegan"?), revolutionizing footwork? Again, a certain Manuel Neuer would like a word with you.

CSF

Andersonisgod wrote: »

No, in Claudio Bravo they have one of the top 5 goalkeepers on the planet and someone who form I consider better than De Gea's and in Ter Stegen they have an outstanding young keeper whose footwork could, as suggested on commentary during the game against PSG, revolutionize goalkeeping, the young German is a prodigy.

Bravo is not in the same league as Neuer, Courtois or De Gea. I actually don't know what the top 5 is however so I can't disagree with you outright, but this is because the top 3 is so clear, and nobody else really stands out to me at the moment as performing to that sort of outstanding level.

djPSB

Just slightly behind Brad Jones.

Al Capwned

Some of the comments here are extremely lol-worthy.....

Threads like this will always descend into this though.
Saying someone is the best in the world is a matter of opinion.
Saying David de Gea is one of the best in the world, or world class, well that's just fact.

I wouldn't want anyone else in goal for United though.

tastyt

The save that he pushed onto the bar was a very good one today, the rest were terrible efforts. He stood up well I suppose and is definitely in great form at the moment.

Neuer is the man at the moment though. Not popular to say but Hart is top class aswell

Andersonisgod

Skylinehead wrote: »

Funny that you weren't singing Bravo's praises as a top 5 keeper before he joined your beloved Barca. Odd that. Hint: he's not even close to that.

As for Ter Stegen (you should probably get your own teams player names right, who's "Ander Ter Stegan"?), revolutionizing footwork? Again, a certain Manuel Neuer would like a word with you.

Well somebody needs to inform those doing the world team of the year because his stellar campaign at Sociedad and his magnificent World Cup with Chile and equally tremendous start to life at Barcelona has put him in the world's top 5 keepers. He's shown he has the mental strength to be one of the very best around.

Alas my thumbs are slightly too big for my HTC One's keypad, thus there will be the occasional erratic spelling. Talk to Gerry Armstrong who made the claim last Wednesday night, though from what I've seen of him I would tend to agree with that claim, Ter Stegen is breathtaking with the ball at his feet, he could be very special.

WallyGUFC

Neuer>>>>Courtois>>De Gea>>>>>>>>>>>>everyone else.

Seriously, anybody who thinks they aren't the best 3 keepers in the world is mental. Hart? Lloris? Claudio Bravo? Nope. Neuer, Courtois and De Gea are way, way ahead of everyone else imo.

Will I Amnt

How the f*ck could any goalkeeper be "breathtaking" with the ball at their feet?
Is he dribbling past players? overhead kickouts? Or is he just doing what a goalkeeper is supposed to be doing and not sh*tting himself when the ball is kicked back to him?

Andersonisgod

Will I Amnt wrote: »

How the f*ck could any goalkeeper be "breathtaking" with the ball at their feet?
Is he dribbling past players? overhead kickouts? Or is he just doing what a goalkeeper is supposed to be doing and not sh*tting himself when the ball is kicked back to him?

I haven't checked YouTube but perhaps there is some highlights there of the young German with the ball at his feet. If not then you should have been watching him vs PSG.
I suspect I may be the biggest fan of Victor Valdes on here but even the great Victor Valdes, and my word he is great, may struggle to equal Ter Stegen with the ball at his feet. He's a prospect that it's very easy to get excited about.

That_Guy

De Gea is certainly noticed a fair bit more because the defence in front of him rely him an awful lot.

Courtois has a pretty solid defence in front of him and may not get the notice and praise fans/media heap onto De Gea because of that.

He has certainly been asked to work more than I think he'd like but he's been top notch for most of the season thus far.

Not sure about best in the world right now but certainly all the potential if the last few weeks are anything to go by.

The Moldy Gowl

Jesus. A pro footballer being good with the ball. You would hope he is good with kicking a ball.

Will I Amnt

Well if a goalkeeper competently controlling a ball takes your breath away you must be purple in the face watching some of the other Barcelona players.

Andersonisgod

Gowlasauras Rex wrote: »

Jesus. A pro footballer being good with the ball. You would hope he is good with kicking a ball.

It's odd because I suspect a lot of the people who so feverishly champion Neuer don't watch him play 90 minutes each week, I suspect they see vines of him on their news feeds (a lot of them involving him with the ball at his feet) and they go crazy for that stuff.

Yet here comes Ter Stegen, who I absolutely believe top quality in this aspect, and suddenly it should be a given?

eagle eye

WallyGUFC wrote: »

Neuer>>>>Courtois>>De Gea>>>>>>>>>>>>everyone else.

Seriously, anybody who thinks they aren't the best 3 keepers in the world is mental. Hart? Lloris? Claudio Bravo? Nope. Neuer, Courtois and De Gea are way, way ahead of everyone else imo.

What did Buffon do wrong to fall back into the pack?

Also Petr Cech has done nothing wrong but isn't playing because he is behind Courtois but he is still top ten in the world at the very least.

SherlockWatson

It's not Neuer's ability with the ball at his feet that people go mad for, it's that he's absolutely batshít insane, he has made the Sweeper Keeper role his own, and Ter Stegen being able to control a ball doesn't change that.

That_Guy

Andersonisgod wrote: »

It's odd because I suspect a lot of the people who so feverishly champion Neuer don't watch him play 90 minutes each week, I suspect they see vines of him on their news feeds (a lot of them involving him with the ball at his feet) and they go crazy for that stuff.

Yet here comes Ter Stegen, who I absolutely believe top quality in this aspect, and suddenly it should be a given?

I'm pretty sure you've just gotten your stats from here:

http://www.futhead.com/15/players/303/marc-andre-ter-stegen/

WallyGUFC

eagle eye wrote: »

What did Buffon do wrong to fall back into the pack?

Also Petr Cech has done nothing wrong but isn't playing because he is behind Courtois but he is still top ten in the world at the very least.

I suppose I don't watch enough of Juve, would have Buffon as my default number 4 in the world anyway. Cech isn't top 3, a very good player but I still believe the top 3 are way ahead of everyone else.

Garzorico

Courtois and Cech are both better than both Neuer and De Gea.

I don't know much about the art of goalkeeping but it's more than staying upright and hoping the striker hits you with the ball ala Neuer and De Gea. Any decent striker clips the ball past them every time. Sturridge would have had a hattrick today no bother.

Biased as I am and having only watched Neuer in ECL and WC matches Drogba buried a header in the last moments of the ECL final past a frozen Neuer and then Drogba rolled the winning peno past him in the resulting shoot out.

Of any keeper in the world I'd rather Courtois or Cech in goal. Lucky me being a Chelsea fan.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

I haven't checked YouTube but perhaps there is some highlights there of the young German with the ball at his feet. If not then you should have been watching him vs PSG.
I suspect I may be the biggest fan of Victor Valdes on here but even the great Victor Valdes, and my word he is great

So great that nobody wants to employ him!

Billy86

Garzorico wrote: »

I don't know much about the art of goalkeeping but it's more than staying upright and hoping the striker hits you with the ball ala Neuer and De Gea. Any decent striker clips the ball past them every time. Sturridge would have had a hattrick today no bother.

I think you just won the race to the bottom that is this thread.

SherlockWatson

Garzorico wrote: »

Courtois and Cech are both better than both Neuer and De Gea.

Biased as I am.

Yup, you are. Neuer is the best Goalkeeper in the world.

Andersonisgod

That_Guy wrote: »

I'm pretty sure you've just gotten your stats from here:

http://www.futhead.com/15/players/303/marc-andre-ter-stegen/

Fun fact. I don't use futhead.

Billy86

SherlockWatson wrote: »

Yup, you are. Neuer is the best Goalkeeper in the world.

Mark Schwarzer is better than him too. Obviously.

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

So great that nobody wants to employ him!

Ask those who've worked with him just how great he is. Barcelona's perfect goalkeeper, he is the blueprint to follow for hundreds of years.

PhlegmyMoses

Garzorico wrote: »

Courtois and Cech are both better than both Neuer and De Gea.

I don't know much about the art of goalkeeping but it's more than staying upright and hoping the striker hits you with the ball ala Neuer and De Gea. Any decent striker clips the ball past them every time. Sturridge would have had a hattrick today no bother.

Biased as I am and having only watched Neuer in ECL and WC matches Drogba buried a header in the last moments of the ECL final past a frozen Neuer and then Drogba rolled the winning peno past him in the resulting shoot out.

Of any keeper in the world I'd rather Courtois or Cech in goal. Lucky me being a Chelsea fan.

Agreed. Also, Dennis Wise was a nice person and Frank Sinclair was better than Baresi.

Garzorico

SherlockWatson wrote: »

Yup, you are. Neuer is the best Goalkeeper in the world.

Neuer is a flapper at crosses. Commanding ones area is an essential skill of top top (been watching Jamie) keepers.

Courtois and Cech are reliable in every aspect of their game.

Garzorico

Billy86 wrote: »

Mark Schwarzer is better than him too. Obviously.

Forgot about him! Obviously he's not top 5.







Top 10 maybe.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

Ask those who've worked with him just how great he is. Barcelona's perfect goalkeeper, he is the blueprint to follow for hundreds of years.

Yyyeeeaahhhh, I'm going to go ahead an assume you never heard of Hugo Gatti.

I guess he's just too perfect for anyone else really, Valdes signing for anyone else would just tarnish his perfect legendary excellence.

Andersonisgod

Billy86 wrote: »

Yyyeeeaahhhh, I'm going to go ahead an assume you never heard of Hugo Gatti.

I guess he's just too perfect for anyone else really, Valdes signing for anyone else would just tarnish his perfect legendary excellence.

That's terrific but someone who hasn't played for Barcelona can hardly be the perfect Barcelona goalkeeper.

However, a Catalan who was absorbed into the ranks of Barcelona as a child and grew up as a goalkeeper and as a person, who would be called up to the first team and go on to become the most successful goalkeeper in the club's history, that man can be the perfect Barcelona goalkeeper, and there have been none better in the long history of the club than VV.

Liam O

Imagine how good De Gea would be in one of these bad boys.

Billy86

Andersonisgod wrote: »

That's terrific but someone who hasn't played for Barcelona can hardly be the perfect Barcelona goalkeeper.

However, a Catalan who was absorbed into the ranks of Barcelona as a child and grew up as a goalkeeper and as a person, who would be called up to the first team and go on to become the most successful goalkeeper in the club's history, that man can be the perfect Barcelona goalkeeper, and there have been none better in the long history of the club than VV.

Zubizarreta was easily a better keeper and more successful (by your logic Michael Carrick is/was a more successful midfielder for Man Utd than Roy Keane, Bryan Robson or Bobby Charlton - it's flawed), just a different style - and yes, one less suited to Barcelona's style the last decade or so. Gatti is the blueprint on which all of these modern ball playing keepers are based on. Even if he was f***ing nuts.

Liam McPoyle

Not the best in the world yet, he has done well against some shyte teams and done well against some daycent teams.

Another year or two though then yes, yes he will be.

But by then United will have spent about eleventy billion on Rooney's wages and we will have a Battlestar Galactico situation where we have fiddy players for every position and nothing will be as it seems.

WallyGUFC

Garzorico wrote: »

Courtois and Cech are both better than both Neuer and De Gea.

I don't know much about the art of goalkeeping but it's more than staying upright and hoping the striker hits you with the ball ala Neuer and De Gea. Any decent striker clips the ball past them every time. Sturridge would have had a hattrick today no bother.

Biased as I am and having only watched Neuer in ECL and WC matches Drogba buried a header in the last moments of the ECL final past a frozen Neuer and then Drogba rolled the winning peno past him in the resulting shoot out.

Of any keeper in the world I'd rather Courtois or Cech in goal. Lucky me being a Chelsea fan.

You're dead right.

x43r0

I would hold DDG in the same bracket as Lloris

fozz10

cech is better than de gea. he has proven to be in the top 3 keepers with years and still is. how de gea can be rated better than even cech never mind the other two is crazy. de gea is nothing compared to the other 3 commanding his box and they are all at least his equal at shots and at probably all slightly better at one on ones. no point in claiming de gea is in the top in the world after half a good season and a load of dodgey ones behind him

lassykk

I said I'd read this thread as it might be free of the usual Barcelona crap that takes up every thread that has even a hint of Barcelona about it. I think I need to find out what the ignore button does!

I genuinely thought that a debate about the best goalkeeper in the world wouldn't descend to some German kid who has played a handful of times and can play with the ball at his feet... FFS Barthez was handy outfield but that didn't make him world class or anywhere close to it. Revolutionary my arse. Sorry that I don't have the linguistic skills to say it fancier to make it sound better.

On topic I would agree that Neuer is number one and despite being a United fan I think Courtois has done it that big longer than De Gea. He was unreal for Atheltico last year but De Gea is immense for United though. If they lose him it would be a massive blow