Breaking - Pakistan School Attack

Giggsy11

Deleted User wrote: »

Not exactly the best 2 examples given the recent attacks in China and the hotel attacks in India.

It's been acting for most of the year as it happens.

Which happened years ago in Mumbai? if so you need to do some research as it has nothing to do with Indian muslims.

DeadHand

Defender OF Faith wrote: »

What about Anders Breivik who killed 77 people so he could "save Norway and Western Europe from a Muslim takeover" he described him self as a christian just like those people today that describe them self as Muslims. What about the crimes the Christian crusaders committed in response to a call from the spiritual leader of Christianity the pope him self, going as far as cannibalizing the Muslims and impaling their children were these atrocities not committed in the name of Christianity?

these people according to you were obviously not acting in the name of Christianity following their own murderous version of the religion just like these people today are not acting in the name of Islam.

When did I say the crusaders or Breivik weren't acting in the name of Christianity?
They absolutely were.

The crusades were so long ago as to be of no relevance to this argument. Breivik was a delusional fantasist but a terrifyingly dangerous one. A racial/religious lunatic.

Still, he wouldn't have recieved a fraction of the sympathy from the Western world that the Taliban or even the fool in Sydney would recieve from the Muslim world.

Islam simply hasn't evolved or been disempowered/rejected in the Muslim world to the same extent that Christianity has in the West.

Which is why we continue to see far more barbarism commited in the name of Islam than any other religion or idealology.

There was a massive religious motivation behind this attack.

The fact is, if fundamentalist Christians had carried out this outrage instead of fundamentalist Muslims, the same worthies trying to downplay or dismiss the obvious religious element to this outrage would be howling about the evils of religion in general and Christianity in particular.

Timberrrrrrrr

eyescreamcone wrote: »

All you "Yanks Bad - Muslims Good" nutters need to get a grip.

Where did i say i'm against "the yanks"?

Whether you like it or not we all are on the side of western society.
That is against these nutjobs.

I'm not against anyone kiddo so you're wrong there

I hope they light up Afghanistan after this.

If the Taliban want to keep their families as human shields then so be it.

So you want to stop the killing of innocent people by killing innocent people? How do you know today's killers where Afghan? What if they are Pakistani?

yoozername

yoozername wrote: »

But yet, no other religion is involved in so much conflict. WHY?

Well looking at the "top 13" the first one is Mexico where it's all Christians.
Then there's Iraq where Christians just may have had a hand in getting it rolling.
South Sudan is all kinds of everything.
In Israel ya've got some Jews involved as well.
Nigeria it's Christians and Muslims.
Afghanistan had something to do with Christians of all descriptions.
Somalia's all kinds of everything.
The Sinai is an overspill.
CAR ya have Christians along with the Muslim.
Ukraine is mostly Christians.
Libya is a cluster****.

eyescreamcone

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I'm not against anyone kiddo so you're wrong there

So you're not against the crowd who attacked the school?
Nice one do-gooder!

Timberrrrrrrr

eyescreamcone wrote: »

So you're not against the crowd who attacked the school?
Nice one do-gooder!

LOL

I am against the murder of innocent children yes, I am also against calling for the culling of an entire religion (1 billion+ at the last count).

eyescreamcone

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

So you want to stop the killing of innocent people by killing innocent people? How do you know today's killers where Afghan? What if they are Pakistani?

They are Taliban and most of the Taliban are based in Afghanistan

eyescreamcone

eyescreamcone wrote: »

All you "Yanks Bad - Muslims Good" nutters need to get a grip.

Whether you like it or not we all are on the side of western society.
That is against these nutjobs.

I hope they light up Afghanistan after this.

If the Taliban want to keep their families as human shields then so be it.

Why Afghanistan? You know they've been "lighting up" parts of Pakistan for the last while yeah?

eyescreamcone

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

LOL

I am against the murder of innocent children yes, I am also against calling for the culling of an entire religion (1 billion+ at the last count).

Who said cull a religion?

yoozername

gandalf wrote: »

Or maybe you could stop labeling whole religion based on the actions of a minority of extremists.

:rolleyes:

Yes, a numerical minority. But a MASSIVE minority, compared to any other group.

The levels of popular support for the most depraved, barbaric laws are simply huge in nearly all Muslim countries: pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-overview/

The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

Let me guess, the next thing you'll say is, "well there's still 10% of Muslims who don't advocate torture and death by stoning for having an affair, so there"?

Timberrrrrrrr

eyescreamcone wrote: »

They are Taliban and most of the Taliban are based in Afghanistan

Embarrassed for you now

gandalf

eyescreamcone wrote: »

They are Taliban and most of the Taliban are based in Afghanistan

A large portion of the Taliban are based in Pakistan. Today's atrocity occurred because the Pakistani Army has been conducting aggressive actions against militant groups in Pakistan's lawless tribal belt since earlier this year which they are totally entitled to do to restore law and order.

Educate yourself before spouting rubbish please.

yoozername

Deleted User wrote: »

Well looking at the "top 13" the first one is Mexico where it's all Christians.
Then there's Iraq where Christians just may have had a hand in getting it rolling.
South Sudan is all kinds of everything.
In Israel ya've got some Jews involved as well.
Nigeria it's Christians and Muslims.
Afghanistan had something to do with Christians of all descriptions.
Somalia's all kinds of everything.
The Sinai is an overspill.
CAR ya have Christians along with the Muslim.
Ukraine is mostly Christians.
Libya is a cluster****.

Just funny that so many involve Muslims, though. If I was an actuary, this would be extremely statistically significant, to the point that there would be a near statistical certainty linking that religion to conflict. But hey, let's pretend it's everyone else's fault. Now back to campus, Down with the West!

Timberrrrrrrr

yoozername wrote: »

Just funny that so many involve Muslims, though. If I was an actuary, this would be extremely statistically significant, to the point that there would be a near statistical certainty linking that religion to conflict. But hey, let's pretend it's everyone else's fault. Now back to campus, Down with the West!

The same could be said about Christians don't you agree?

circadian

Anyone remember the
"No blacks, no Irish" signs in England years ago?

Yeah well that sort of discrimination against the Irish was the result of the behaviour of a minority (and blatant racism). I see the same happening with Islam, as those people become ostracized from societies the more the problem is fuelled.

yoozername

yoozername wrote: »

Just funny that so many involve Muslims, though. If I was an actuary, this would be extremely statistically significant, to the point that there would be a near statistical certainty linking that religion to conflict. But hey, let's pretend it's everyone else's fault. Now back to campus, Down with the West!

Very glad you're not an actuary.

shirazhyder84

yoozername wrote: »

Yes, a numerical minority. But a MASSIVE minority, compared to any other group.

The levels of popular support for the most depraved, barbaric laws are simply huge in nearly all Muslim countries: pewforum.org/2013/04/30/the-worlds-muslims-religion-politics-society-overview/

The apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

Let me guess, the next thing you'll say is, "well there's still 10% of Muslims who don't advocate torture and death by stoning for having an affair, so there"?

I am not sure from where are you getting all this information? First you mentioned that the actions of ISIS and Taliban are in accordance with Quran verses? How about you share a single verse with us from the Quran which says it is allowed to kill innocent people.

Then you mentioned that the founder of Islam is Taliban no.1 - who are you to talking about here?

yoozername

Deleted User wrote: »

Very glad you're not an actuary.

Excellent contribution, thanks.

The Backwards Man

Remember Spitting Image used to have the skit with Reagan having the red button above the bed?

It's awfully comforting to know that's not a fixture you find in every household

Autonomous Cowherd

Islam has engendered one of the world's greatest esoteric traditions in Sufism. It cannot be simply described as a barbaric religion, or dismissed as the ravings of a child molester. Islamic cultures gave rise to world sciences and art at a time when the rest of the planet was mired in cultish ignorance. There are no doubt extremists, which is a worrying development over recent decades, and is matched by a rise in extremist fundamental Christianty. No, the right wing fundies are not invading schools but their leaders are involved in drone warfare and civilian massacres on faraway soil. I am full sure the VAST majority of Muslim people are horrified and saddened beyond belief at this atrocity, where so many young children were slaughtered.

Karl Stein

Fratton Fred wrote: »

You are becoming a parody of yourself.

Your lack of self-awareness would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic.

But no, you keep your arse firmly on that fence, your head in the sand and carry on with your self righteousness.

My arse is not on any fence. I stand firmly on the 'stop fucking shit up' side of the fence opposite to defenders of the empire like you.

If you were genuinely concerned about terrorism then get on to the British Government and tell them to stop participating in it and siding with scumbag regimes like in Whabbi-fascist Saudi Arabia where the UK has lucrative arms contracts.

Meanwhile, everyone else will live in the real world and recognise that sometimes you've got to get your hands dirty for the greater good.

'The greater good'.. and so it was for many despots dictators and mass-murdering scum throughout history.

DeadHand

gandalf wrote: »

It was tribal, so is this conflict and any conflict where extremists are involved. Religion is just the banner or excuse in this case.

The guy in Sydney was a whackjob lone wolf with form for assault and on bail for involvement in the murder of his ex- wife, again religion was just the banner.

Tainting a whole religion because of actions of an extreme minority is wrong.

I'm glad you stopped sneering and I do accept there is a big tribal element to the Taliban conflict.

Still, the Rwadan conflict and this are radically different. The Hutu government and militias who carried out the atrocities were formed on ethnic lines. The Taliban are a group of religious extremists. This is their definition. They are religiously motivated, the Hutu forces were not.

While the lunatic in Sydney was a whackjob, his religious beliefs inspired him to do what he did. You cannot have been blind to the black flag and Islamic headband as well as his history of harrassing the families of bereaved soldiers in the name of Islam.

Indeed, it is wrong to smear a whole religion for the actions of a minority, as wrong as it is to turn a blind eye, for whatever reason, to the obvious truth that some religions are far more troubled by violence among it's adherents than others.

yoozername

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

The same could be said about Christians don't you agree?

Absolutely not. You use "all kinds of everything" where the word actual word is Islam. Iraqis have purged the 2000 year old Christian community. It's Muslims going mental in Nigeria, so many church bombings, Boko Haram, come on please. Afghanistan: the Taliban were instrumental in 9/11, that's how the Afghan war came about? You mightn't have been born at that point. Somalia, "all kinds of everything" again - except it's 99.8% Muslim.

Let's look at the list again:

2006 Mexican Drug War - Christian country, but no element of religiosity involved
2011 Syrian Civil War - Different Muslim sects at war
2011 Iraqi insurgency - Different Muslim sects at war
2013 South Sudanese Civil War - Mostly Christian country, but no element of religiosity involved
1948 Israeli-Palestinian conflict - Muslim/Jewish conflict
1999 Islamist insurgency in Nigeria - Muslim slaughter of non-Muslims
2001 War in Afghanistan - Muslim vs Muslim. Instigated by Taliban sheltering AQ, and 9/11. Virtually No non-Muslim involvement anymore
2004 War in North-West Pakistan - "The War in North-West Pakistan is an armed conflict involving Pakistan and armed militant groups such as the Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan (TTP), Lashkar-e-Islam (LeI), Tehreek-e-Nafaz-e-Shariat-e-Mohammadi (TNSM), al-Qaeda"
2009 War in Somalia - Muslim vs Muslim (Somalia is 99.8% Muslim)
2011 Sinai insurgency - Muslim/Islamists
2012 Central African Republic - "all kinds of everything"
2014 War in Donbass - Christian countries
2014 Libyan Civil War - Muslim/Islamists

Timberrrrrrrr

yoozername wrote: »

Absolutely not. You use "all kinds of everything" where the word actual word is Islam. Iraqis have purged the 2000 year old Christian community. It's Muslims going mental in Nigeria, so many church bombings, Boko Haram, come on please. Afghanistan: the Taliban were instrumental in 9/11, that's how the Afghan war came about? You mightn't have been born at that point. Somalia, "all kinds of everything" again - except it's 99.8% Muslim.

Let's look at the list again:

2006 Mexican Drug War - Christian country, but no element of religiosity involved
2011 Syrian Civil War - Different Muslim sects at war
2011 Iraqi insurgency - Different Muslim sects at war
2013 South Sudanese Civil War - Mostly Christian country, but no element of religiosity involved
1948 Israeli-Palestinian conflict - Muslim/Jewish conflict
1999 Islamist insurgency in Nigeria - Muslim slaughter of non-Muslims
2001 War in Afghanistan - Muslim vs Muslim. Instigated by Taliban sheltering AQ, and 9/11. Virtually No non-Muslim involvement anymore
2004 War in North-West Pakistan - "The War in North-West Pakistan is an armed conflict involving Pakistan and armed militant groups such as the Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan (TTP), Lashkar-e-Islam (LeI), Tehreek-e-Nafaz-e-Shariat-e-Mohammadi (TNSM), al-Qaeda"
2009 War in Somalia - Muslim vs Muslim (Somalia is 99.8% Muslim)
2011 Sinai insurgency - Muslim/Islamists
2012 Central African Republic - "all kinds of everything"
2014 War in Donbass - Christian countries
2014 Libyan Civil War - Muslim/Islamists

You're getting your posters mixed up

You mention 9/11 Taliban

Remind us all how many of the 9-11 where Afghan

Palmach

circadian wrote: »

Anyone remember the
"No blacks, no Irish" signs in England years ago?

Yeah well that sort of discrimination against the Irish was the result of the behaviour of a minority (and blatant racism). I see the same happening with Islam, as those people become ostracized from societies the more the problem is fuelled.

They bring it on themselves. Drop the blatant discrimination against women, the hatred for LGBT, the disregard for liberal values and the religious leaders talking out both sides of their mouths and maybe people wouldn't be suspicious.

yoozername

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Embarrassed for you now

Why? What's wrong with what he said?

yoozername

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

You're getting your posters mixed up

You mention 9/11 Taliban

Remind us all how many of the 9-11 where Afghan

No, you and Buttonftw responded to my list of conflicts.

If you'd only read what I wrote:

2001 War in Afghanistan - Muslim vs Muslim. Instigated by Taliban sheltering AQ, and 9/11. Virtually No non-Muslim involvement anymore

Timberrrrrrrr

yoozername wrote: »

No, you and Buttonftw responded to my list of conflicts.

If you'd only read what I wrote:

2001 War in Afghanistan - Muslim vs Muslim. Instigated by Taliban sheltering AQ, and 9/11. Virtually No non-Muslim involvement anymore

You quoted me as saying

Absolutely not. You use "all kinds of everything"

When in fact i didn't.

How many of those top 15 conflicts also involve Christians?

yoozername

shirazhyder84 wrote: »

I am not sure from where are you getting all this information? First you mentioned that the actions of ISIS and Taliban are in accordance with Quran verses? How about you share a single verse with us from the Quran which says it is allowed to kill innocent people.

Then you mentioned that the founder of Islam is Taliban no.1 - who are you to talking about here?

As a proud kaffir (thanks be to Jesus), can I ever be 'innocent' according to Islam? Innocent really refers to Muslims only, right?

I'm referring to Don Mo, thought that was obvious enough. Protection rackets (jizya), murders, death penalty for leaving, you name it. All that's missing is the cement shoes.

Grand Moff Tarkin

circadian wrote: »

Anyone remember the
"No blacks, no Irish" signs in England years ago?

Yeah well that sort of discrimination against the Irish was the result of the behaviour of a minority (and blatant racism). I see the same happening with Islam, as those people become ostracized from societies the more the problem is fuelled.

Having lived and worked in England during the arse end of that time frame I can say it is a completely different situation to the 70's and 80's.

jmayo

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

You're getting your posters mixed up

You mention 9/11 Taliban

Remind us all how many of the 9-11 where Afghan

Granted 15 of the 19 terrorists were from Saudi Arabia. 2 were from the UAE, 1 was from Lebanon, and 1 was from Egypt.

But come on now be fair.
The taliban sheltered al-qaeda and it's leader whose members planned, gave the go ahead and carried out the 911 attacks.

The taliban allowed al-qaeda have training camps in Afghanistan.

Hijackers such as Nawaf Alhazmi and Khalid Almihdhar had a long association with Afghanistan.
Alhazmi made his first visit to Afghanistan in 1993 before fighting in Bosnia. He fights in Afghanistan against the Northern Alliance with his brother, Salem Alhazmi.
Almihdhar makes his first visit to Afghanistan training camps in 1996, and then fights in Chechnya in 1997.

Most if not all of the 911 hijackers had training at various al-qeada camps such as the Khaldan camp, Al Farooq camp and the Mes Aynak camp in Afghanistan.

BTW people may remember Mes Aynak and it's giant Buddist statues that the taliban decided should be blown to bits with tank shells.

So please less of the shyte that the taliban and Afghanistan had nothing to do with 911.
They allowed al-qaeda do what they bloody wanted and used their memebrs in their own internal conflict to stay in power.

Karl Stein

jmayo wrote: »

The taliban sheltered al-qaeda and it's leader whose members planned, gave the go ahead and carried out the 911 attacks.

The Taliban offered talks about handing OBL over to the Americans.

President George Bush rejected as "non-negotiable" an offer by the Taliban to discuss turning over Osama bin Laden if the United States ended the bombing in Afghanistan.

theguardian.com

The taliban allowed al-qaeda have training camps in Afghanistan.

Before Al-Q started blowing up American stuff the US was okay with the Taliban and talked with them about 'US interests'.

A senior delegation from the Taleban movement in Afghanistan is in the United States for talks with an international energy company that wants to construct a gas pipeline from Turkmenistan across Afghanistan to Pakistan.

bbc.co.uk

yoozername

Autonomous Cowherd wrote: »

Islam has engendered one of the world's greatest esoteric traditions in Sufism. It cannot be simply described as a barbaric religion, or dismissed as the ravings of a child molester. Islamic cultures gave rise to world sciences and art at a time when the rest of the planet was mired in cultish ignorance. There are no doubt extremists, which is a worrying development over recent decades, and is matched by a rise in extremist fundamental Christianty. No, the right wing fundies are not invading schools but their leaders are involved in drone warfare and civilian massacres on faraway soil. I am full sure the VAST majority of Muslim people are horrified and saddened beyond belief at this atrocity, where so many young children were slaughtered.

Cool story. What has Islam created in say, the last half millennium? It has destroyed left and right, but how about what it created?

Well Obama has been called a Muslim, now you say he's one of those right-wing Christian fundamentalists.

Enlighten us about how many drone strikes the Thai/Chinese/Iraqi/Nigerian/South Sudanese/Indonesian/East Timorese/Cypriot/Indian/Phillipino/Russian/Sri Lankan/Ivory Coast governments have carried out, to make them just as bad as the Muslim nutters, in your eyes?

porsche959

ebbsy wrote: »

Mushroom cloud needed.

Boards.ie is an Irish-domained forum, may I ask are you Irish yourself and if so do you have a very short memory indeed?

Good thing the British government didn't adopt a 'mushroom cloud needed' approach during the Troubles, otherwise none of us would be around to post on this forum.

yoozername

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

How many of those top 15 conflicts also involve Christians?

3/13 involve Christians, at least 10/13 involve Muslims. None of the Christian conflicts is for the purpose of furthering Christianity. Most or all of the Muslim conflicts are religious in nature.

Nodin

yoozername wrote: »

Cool story. What has Islam created in say, the last half millennium? It has destroyed left and right, but how about what it created?

Well Obama has been called a Muslim, now you say he's one of those right-wing Christian fundamentalists.

Enlighten us about how many drone strikes the Thai/Chinese/Iraqi/Nigerian/South Sudanese/Indonesian/East Timorese/Cypriot/Indian/Phillipino/Russian/Sri Lankan/Ivory Coast governments have carried out, to make them just as bad as the Muslim nutters, in your eyes?

Iraq and Indonesia are both muslim countries. Indonesia is the worlds largest muslim state.

humanji

As expected, the thread went the same route these threads always do and the mod warnings were ignored again.

By the way, if anyone is interested there was a terrible attack on a school in Pakistan where scores of children were gunned down. But I guess that's not as interesting as bitching at each other.