Tyson Fury vs Joe Fraizer

Too Tough To Die

If Tyson's head is right, he destroys Frazier. Too big, too slick.

Littlehorny

walshb wrote: »

Ali was 6 inches shorter and 35 lbs lighter than Fury. What Frazier got to do vs. a faded Manila Ali won't be what he gets to do a
gainst Fury. He will be lucky to land a single clean head shot all night.

Frazier also beat a much less faded Ali as you know. Ali was also much much faster of foot and hand than Fury will ever be. Ali also had a great chin which Fury does not.
Frazier would get to Fury, i have no doubt. He would be the rock that the big ship Fury would get smashed on.

walshb

Littlehorny wrote: »

Frazier also beat a much less faded Ali as you know. Ali was also much much faster of foot and hand than Fury will ever be. Ali also had a great chin which Fury does not.
Frazier would get to Fury, i have no doubt. He would be the rock that the big ship Fury would get smashed on.

Fury has yet to be stopped or knocked out. Ali's chin became great, or apparently great later on in his career when his speed and reflexes lessened. Ali still got badly hurt in his earlier days, including against the 1971 Frazier. Either way Fury's chin won't be an issue here. He will likely get hit to the head by only glancing Frazier swings.

Littlehorny

walshb wrote: »

Fury has yet to be stopped or knocked out. Ali's chin became great, or apparently great later on in his career when his speed and reflexes lessened. Ali still got badly hurt in his earlier days, including against the 1971 Frazier. Either way Fury's chin won't be an issue here. He will likely get hit to the head by only glancing Frazier swings.

Fury does not hit that hard and does not move his head. Frazier will get to him, watch some of his fights on youtube and you will see him bobbing and weaving, not getting hit. His left is like a whip, very fast. He fights at serious pace and dishes out alot of punishment. I'm not saying Frazier is even top ten heavy of all time but time will tell on Fury. He's average at best.

Gringo180

walshb wrote: »

Ali was 6 inches shorter and 35 lbs lighter than Fury. What Frazier got to do vs. a faded Manila Ali won't be what he gets to do against Fury. He will be lucky to land a single clean head shot all night.

Even if he didnt land a head shot he will drop him with body shots.

walshb

Gringo180 wrote: »

Even if he didnt land a head shot he will drop him with body shots.

Highly doubt that happens, and even when he gets close I see Fury either hitting him with solid right uppercuts, or casually keeping him at bay with shoving. Seriously, if Frazier thought Foreman's size and strength were problematic he will be in a different world with Fury.

selectamatic

I'm genuinely sorry to resurrect such an old thread, however I was just browsing through the forum as today is the first time I've ever looked through the boxing forum on boards I'm usually more at home in the farming forum :P However I nearly spat me tea out all over the lap top when I seen this thread. It astounds me that this of all match ups should even enter ones mind. This is tyson fury we're talking about not Mike tyson! Joe would have Fury buckled with body shot's :rolleyes: The man nearly locked Ali's hips up in their third fight with body shots and that was when he was passed his prime. He also had an outstanding ability to take a punch again the thriller in manilla is testament to this some of the shots he took in the early rounds were mind numbing and he didn't even take a knee, sure he staggered but he threw right back and soldiered on. Fury just wouldn't knock fraizer out he just simply wouldn't. I'm actually still at a loss as to how this was posted as a serious question.

cowzerp

selectamatic wrote: »

I'm genuinely sorry to resurrect such an old thread, however I was just browsing through the forum as today is the first time I've ever looked through the boxing forum on boards I'm usually more at home in the farming forum :P However I nearly spat me tea out all over the lap top when I seen this thread. It astounds me that this of all match ups should even enter ones mind. This is tyson fury we're talking about not Mike tyson! Joe would have Fury buckled with body shot's :rolleyes: The man nearly locked Ali's hips up in their third fight with body shots and that was when he was passed his prime. He also had an outstanding ability to take a punch again the thriller in manilla is testament to this some of the shots he took in the early rounds were mind numbing and he didn't even take a knee, sure he staggered but he threw right back and soldiered on. Fury just wouldn't knock fraizer out he just simply wouldn't. I'm actually still at a loss as to how this was posted as a serious question.

Stick to the farming!
there is a reason why you don't be on this page and it's because you are just not that into Boxing.
Furey is 6,8" and joe about 5,10" and although a legend was quite limited.

efb

cowzerp wrote: »

Stick to the farming!
there is a reason why you don't be on this page and it's because you are just not that into Boxing.
Furey is 6,8" and joe about 5,10" and although a legend was quite limited.

That's a bit harsh! I think most people here said Frazier would win

Mantis Toboggan

It's sad to say but Frazer would get his head jabbed off.

cowzerp

efb wrote: »

That's a bit harsh! I think most people here said Frazier would win

I just went through it there and it's the opposite
The only people saying frazier would win are those who don't post on here ever, Basically non boxing fans who just know frazier was a legend, and probably don't realise Frazier would be journey man now, the Boxing world has moved on and Joe was to lumbering and to limited and to small.

walshb

selectamatic wrote: »

I'm genuinely sorry to resurrect such an old thread, however I was just browsing through the forum as today is the first time I've ever looked through the boxing forum on boards I'm usually more at home in the farming forum :P However I nearly spat me tea out all over the lap top when I seen this thread. It astounds me that this of all match ups should even enter ones mind. This is tyson fury we're talking about not Mike tyson! Joe would have Fury buckled with body shot's :rolleyes: The man nearly locked Ali's hips up in their third fight with body shots and that was when he was passed his prime. He also had an outstanding ability to take a punch again the thriller in manilla is testament to this some of the shots he took in the early rounds were mind numbing and he didn't even take a knee, sure he staggered but he threw right back and soldiered on. Fury just wouldn't knock fraizer out he just simply wouldn't. I'm actually still at a loss as to how this was posted as a serious question.

Ali was 210-215 and stood 6 feet 2/3. Fury is 5 inches taller and many lbs heavier. To try and compare the effects/effectiveness that Frazier will have on both men is ridiculous. Ali was not really able to push Joe off him. I think Fury has little trouble mauling and man handling and keeping Joe well off him via physicality and punching. This is a complete mismatch. It's a mismatch primarily because one man is so much bigger than the other. Added to this, the far bigger man can box and punch and hurt you. A no brainer.

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

I just went through it there and it's the opposite
The only people saying frazier would win are those who don't post on here ever, Basically non boxing fans who just know frazier was a legend, and probably don't realise Frazier would be journey man now, the Boxing world has moved on and Joe was to lumbering and to limited and to small.

Actually, HigginsJ is a fairly regular poster who got many thanks for post 4 on this thread.

Henno30 is a very frequent poster who thinks Fury has no chance....

Why stop at Frazier. I mean, Bob Foster (LHW) surely would destroy Fury as well, no?

walshb

Grenadier wrote: »

All that shows is how many people have Rose tinted glasses. If The 100m sprint couldn't be measured objectively I'm sure there would be many people who think the sprinters in the old days were better than him.

Who is him?

selectamatic

cowzerp wrote: »

Stick to the farming!
there is a reason why you don't be on this page and it's because you are just not that into Boxing.
Furey is 6,8" and joe about 5,10" and although a legend was quite limited.

Steve Cunningham nearly cut fury down to size and let's be honest he's not exactly the finest cruiser weight to lace the gloves. Fury although 6,8 likes to get sucked into brawls and it'd suit him better to stay outside as he's not as indestructible as he lets on. There's a reason in the OP that it's said all American forums would pick fraizer America is the home of great heavy weights something I can guarantee fury will never be. I fear you're taking what they say on box nation a bit too seriously with the likes of David price on about working his way back to the top! Well as we can see from the weekend that went well and funny enough I don't remember him ever being at the top! Fury is a relatively accomplished domestic fighter in a relatively poor crop of domestic fighters, world class he ain't! His grit and determination has never been proven and I believe it's something he lacks and his punching power is below average for a man of his size a host of his knock outs and tko's have come when his unfit and out of condition opponents have been spent, there's a lot more to being a world class heavyweight than being over 6,6 and having a middlen jab! You can buy into this fury talk all ya want but 10 years from now no one else will be talking about him. I'm a keen boxing fan and dabbled in the sport myself only to succumb to chronic shoulder injuries, and you too seem to be a keen fight fan but if you think fury would trouble anything other than journey men than perhaps it is you who should find a new hobby. If you said tyson fury would easily beat joe fraizer to 90% of the boxing community you'd be laughed out the door and rightly so! Joe would walk right through that average jab with his boobing and weaving and he'd pound fury's soft unconditioned body into oblivion I'd actually have fury losing by not answering the bell for the 8th round.

cowzerp

selectamatic wrote: »

Steve Cunningham nearly cut fury down to size and let's be honest he's not exactly the finest cruiser weight to lace the gloves. Fury although 6,8 likes to get sucked into brawls and it'd suit him better to stay outside as he's not as indestructible as he lets on. There's a reason in the OP that it's said all American forums would pick fraizer America is the home of great heavy weights something I can garuntee fury will never be. I fear you're taking what they say on box nation a bit too seriously with the likes of David price on about working his way back to the top! Well as we can see from the weekend that went well and funny enough I don't remember him ever being at the top! Fury is a relatively accomplished domestic fighter in a relatively poor crop of domestic fighters, world class he ain't! His grit and determination has never been proven and I believe it's something he lacks and his punching power is below average for a man of his size a host of his knock outs and tko's have come when his unfit and out of condition opponents have been spent, there's a lot more to being a world class heavyweight than being over 6,6 and having a middlen jab! You can buy into this fury talk all ya want but 10 years from now no one else will be talking about him. I'm a keen boxing fan and dabbled in the sport myself only to succumb to chronic shoulder injuries, and you too seem to be a keen fight fan but if you think fury would trouble anything other than journey men than perhaps it is you who should find a new hobby. If you said tyson fury would easily beat joe fraizer to 90% of the boxing community you'd be laughed out the door and rightly so! Joe would walk right through that average jab with his nooning and weaving and he'd pound fury's soft unconditioned body into oblivion I'd actually have fury losing by not answering the bell for the 8th round.

American Boxing fans are clowns who cant see past the legends, there is plenty of them that would tell you Marciano would be the champ today and even more who would tell you that the Klitschko's are not good boxers, Frazier would just be above journeyman today and i think that is the bit you are not getting, to small, to basic and to flat footed, Furey is no great boxer to me but still bounces Frazier around the ring, You are over rating Frazier as far as i am concerned, He would struggle to be in the top 30 of all time in reality.

Mantis Toboggan

Fury would have a 31 cm reach advantage :eek:

I think it's fair to say that some people look back with the rose tinted glasses.
Frazier at 5f 10" just wouldn't survive in today's division. Cunningham is 6f 3" and even he got demolished by Fury (Albeit after he had knocked him down)

selectamatic

cowzerp wrote: »

American Boxing fans are clowns who cant see past the legends, there is plenty of them that would tell you Marciano would be the champ today and even more who would tell you that the Klitschko's are not good boxers, Frazier would just be above journeyman today and i think that is the bit you are not getting, to small, to basic and to flat footed, Furey is no great boxer to me but still bounces Frazier around the ring, You are over rating Frazier as far as i am concerned, He would struggle to be in the top 30 of all time in reality.

I don't appreciate you trying to class me as an american fan, I'm Irish and above all proud and supportive of the domestic scene. I have made no comment on the Klitchko's what so ever and anyone who would believe they are not great boxers is delusional and I am also no great fan of marciano's and his record is considerably padded something which wasn't the norm back then so I do feel his legend status is not proportionate to his achievements. How ever your views on Fury are very over blown with regards to his achievements. Just because he's 6'8 doesn't mean he's freakishly strong in his fights its not his pushing that causes fighters problems its the way he uses his considerable mass to lean on people! a good body puncher would punish him for this especially a body puncher like fraizer! We could go back and forth till the cows come home (Farming pun intended :P) but our views are so different it'd never reach a conclusion. We can let time dictate fury's legacy however in five years time I feel it is I who will have my views realised. Fraizer a journey man! please he had a journey man/ gritty style but that doesn't make him a journeyman his achievements prove he was a top fighter! much like that way fury's physique would lead you to believe he's an untouchable outside boxer it still doesn't make this notion true or make him world class, in fact I would go in so far as to say that it is fury who is the journey man.

cowzerp

Dennis Reynolds wrote: »

Fury would have a 31 cm reach advantage :eek:

I think it's fair to say that some people look back with the rose tinted glasses.
Frazier at 5f 10" just wouldn't survive in today's division. Cunningham is 6f 3" and even he got demolished by Fury (Albeit after he had knocked him down)

Also that punch Cunningham hit Fury with was a rocket regardless of his weight

walshb

selectamatic wrote: »

Joe would walk right through that average jab with his boobing and weaving and he'd pound fury's soft unconditioned body into oblivion I'd actually have fury losing by not answering the bell for the 8th round.

So, in essence you are pinning Joe's win on a body attack?

cowzerp

selectamatic wrote: »

I don't appreciate you trying to class me as an american fan, I'm Irish and above all proud and supportive of the domestic scene.

I replied to your comment about what american forums would be saying

Appreciate what you want especially after assuming i was just going with what box nation say in the post before!

Fury would not let Frazier in close enough to get body shots off, Foreman at 6'3 was like a huge monster with Frazier, Frazier factually was a tiny heavyweight who's style is not suited to fighting today's super heavyweight boxers

selectamatic

walshb wrote: »

So, in essence you are pinning Joe's win on a body attack?

How could you not? Joe was a famed hard hitter especially in his use of body shots. Couple this with fury's apparent lack of conditioning in this area and you have a perfect combination. That said if Joe managed to land a wild swinging left to fury's head surely it'd be a similar situation to the wild over head right steve cunningham threw except this time the punch would be thrown by someone who is known to be a power puncher! cunningham is known as the opposite, I seem to remember the commentators saying that fury was the first man steve knocked down in the pro ranks! To concentrate on anything other than the body attack would be madness on fraizers behalf however we all know he was a man who could throw a head shot. I will watch the remainder of fury's career with great interest as his size makes him interesting yet I do believe his achievements will be both minor and brief.

walshb

selectamatic wrote: »

How could you not? Joe was a famed hard hitter especially in his use of body shots. Couple this with fury's apparent lack of conditioning in this area and you have a perfect combination. That said if Joe managed to land a wild swinging left to fury's head surely it'd be a similar situation to the wild over head right steve cunningham threw except this time the punch would be thrown by someone who is known to be a power puncher! cunningham is known as the opposite, I seem to remember the commentators saying that fury was the first man steve knocked down in the pro ranks! To concentrate on anything other than the body attack would be madness on fraizers behalf however we all know he was a man who could throw a head shot. I will watch the remainder of fury's career with great interest as his size makes him interesting yet I do believe his achievements will be both minor and brief.

Do you think Joe gets to unload consistently enough on a man so much bigger? Don't you think that Fury will use that huge size to keep Joe away from his "soft" body, that is apparently out of condition? I have a feeling you envisage Joe just plodding forward swinging with one hand, his left hook, trapping Fury and working his body until Fury can take no more? That to me is a ridiculous scenario.

I see Joe Plodding forward and swinging and missing by quite a margin to the head of Fury, eating jabs and crosses and being man handled and pushed around by a huge man. Also, Joe getting hurt by the shots of a man that outweighs him by 40 lbs. Joe will not be let lie on Fury to simply pound away. Fury can either push him back fairly handily or work on him inside and then push him away.

Joe has too much to overcome here. Too much height and size and weight to overcome. He's a small HW. Fury would have very little to fear here.

Talib Fiasco

I personally don't think Joe woukd beat a lot of current Cruiserweights either.

walshb

Talib Fiasco wrote: »

I personally don't think Joe woukd beat a lot of current Cruiserweights either.

I think he would beat them, and probably brutally. He was so bloody strong. Non stop aggression and heavy hitting hands, with an excellent chin and an excellent engine. Size and weight beats Joe. CWs don't have that on him, and that will see them be forced to work at a ferocious pace. They don't have the firepower or strength to keep Joe honest. He will eat them alive. He had heavy enough hands to really hurt them.

Talib Fiasco

walshb wrote: »

I think he would beat them, and probably brutally. He was so bloody strong. Non stop aggression and heavy hitting hands, with an excellent chin and an excellent engine. Size and weight beats Joe. CWs don't have that on him, and that will see them be forced to work at a ferocious pace. They don't have the firepower or strength to keep Joe honest. He will eat them alive. He had heavy enough hands to really hurt them.

I dunno, I'd love to see the likes of Lebedev, Drozd and Huck against him. Huck has shown to have a fragile enough chin but is a great fighter, and I had him beating Povetkin too, a legit HW. Lebedev walks through anything, the fact he stayed going against a roided Jones for that long was remarkable, he is phenomenally skilled and packs a good punch himself. I also think Drozd would beat most current Heavies, so yeah I'd pick him too. It's no doubt Joe would give a great fight, but it's a different era, it's unfair in fact to compare pas with present for the most part, but yeah.

walshb

Talib Fiasco wrote: »

I dunno, I'd love to see the likes of Lebedev, Drozd and Huck against him. Huck has shown to have a fragile enough chin but is a great fighter, and I had him beating Povetkin too, a legit HW. Lebedev walks through anything, the fact he stayed going against a roided Jones for that long was remarkable, he is phenomenally skilled and packs a good punch himself. I also think Drozd would beat most current Heavies, so yeah I'd pick him too. It's no doubt Joe would give a great fight, but it's a different era, it's unfair in fact to compare pas with present for the most part, but yeah.

Those names just do not have the physicality and size to keep Joe honest, or at bay, nor the work rate to win on points. Joe was a bulky and heavy set man. 200+ lbs solid. He ate through opponents with work rate and strength and heavy hitting. All done at a frenetic pace. You need to be big and strong to beat him, not skilled and light. A guy like Toney at 190-200 lbs is someone who could get the job done, but he was an exception. Skilled, busy and very crafty/defensive and durable.

Lebedev is not near strong enough or heavy handed enough or busy enough to match Joe over 12 rds. I see a brutal beat down once Joe establishes that rhythm. If you cannot dent/stagger/hurt Joe with your shots prepare for a night of hell.

In the examples you gave I think eras has nothing to do with it. Joe is competitive in any era against men similar sized to himself.

Talib Fiasco

walshb wrote: »

Those names just do not have the physicality and size to keep Joe honest, or at bay, nor the work rate to win on points. Joe was a bulky and heavy set man. 200+ lbs solid. He ate through opponents with work rate and strength and heavy hitting. All done at a frenetic pace. You need to be big and strong to beat him, not skilled and light. A guy like Toney at 190-200 lbs is someone who could get the job done, but he was an exception. Skilled, busy and very crafty/defensive and durable.

Lebedev is not near strong enough or heavy handed enough or busy enough to match Joe over 12 rds. I see a brutal beat down once Joe establishes that rhythm. If you cannot dent/stagger/hurt Joe with your shots prepare for a night of hell.

In the examples you gave I think eras has nothing to do with it. Joe is competitive in any era against men similar sized to himself.

Lebedev, Huck and Drozd are big men though and have very good work rates...brilliant in fact.

I disagree...Lebedev has very good power, certainly to keep the vast majority of guys honest...and he's a strong fellow, has a very big and wide upper body. Plus he is incredibly skilled for a man of his size. I think he has every chance. In fact I think he should move up to HW and give it a crack. I certainly think he'd give the vast majority of Heavies a run for their money. And Huck has proven himself as a solid HW too if he stuck with it.

walshb

Talib Fiasco wrote: »

Lebedev, Huck and Drozd are big men though and have very good work rates...brilliant in fact.

I disagree...Lebedev has very good power, certainly to keep the vast majority of guys honest...and he's a strong fellow, has a very big and wide upper body. Plus he is incredibly skilled for a man of his size. I think he has every chance. In fact I think he should move up to HW and give it a crack. I certainly think he'd give the vast majority of Heavies a run for their money. And Huck has proven himself as a solid HW too if he stuck with it.

Lebedev has CW power. It takes Foreman-esque power and weight and physicality to really dent and discourage Frazier. Huge difference between Denis and George here, in the key departments of size/strength and power. Lebedev also has to think about how he reacts to Joe's consistent power hitting and work rate.

selectamatic

While I do acknowledge your points on the issue of Joe trying to get inside I do feel you are slightly exaggerating fury's speed while fast for his size when compared with the likes of Nikolai Valuev and china's new colossal Taishan Dong, he isn't fast enough to make his defenses impenetrable if he was I would have no doubt he'd be a huge player for years to come in the HW ranks however it has been shown that it is quite possible to get inside when dealing with fury as he does love to brawl and can on occasions get sucked into situations that a man of his size shouldn't be in. Like wise I also feel you are slightly exaggerating Frazier's lack of pace while his footwork was below average for a man of his size and build, his head movement was pretty dam good not mike tyson good but still good and his ability to take a punch is well known. (Note I acknowledge the Foreman KO's, but Foremans use of truly devastating swinging upper cut bombs was tailor made for Fraizer! He effectively bobbed and weaved straight into them) I also believe Fury has no where near the punching power of foreman. When all this is taken into consideration I feel Frazier has the capabilities to get inside and punish fury and I could imagine him having great success in doing so. Fury is vastly more technically gifted than Valuev ever was however he has certainly not got Valuev's ability to take a punch therein I feel lies his weakness. This is what I truly believe and I'm afraid I can't see myself changing my mind any time soon however if Fury does go onto greatness I will absolutely recognise his achievements and support him. His character does lend itself well to Irish supporters so he would be a very popular champ should it ever happen. If Fury had Valuev's chin or a touch more speed and accuracy my belief's would differ however as things currently stand so to will my opinion.

OneOfThem

I think you're mental lads. It's natural to point to what foreman did to frazier but Fury isn't George foreman. He has nowhere near the hand speed, the accuracy or the punching power of foreman, nor the chin. Smaller lads (fair enough not as small as joe) with far less guile have closed the gap and gotten through to Fury with relative ease in lots of his fights. Even with his immense size he's not hard to hit.

I see Frazier getting up close enough to him to tee off without getting caught with anything substantial on the way in again and again. I don't think Fury copes with taking the shots he'd definitely end up taking.

Fury's size and reach gives him a chance of hanging in there, but that's all. He's not hard to hit and he's not that hard a hitter for a HW. He's bigger than foreman but he's not foreman. He isn't going to be blasting frazier with bombs on the way in. I'm not sure where people are getting that idea from having watched both fighters fights. Hell be swinging and missing mainly then getting blasted with shots. Anything he does land is unlikely to hurt frazier.

Itd be competitive due to the size difference. But frazier wins the fight all day long for me.

mooreman09

This is the most ridiculous thread I've ever seen on any forum. WTF???????

walshb

mooreman09 wrote: »

This is the most ridiculous thread I've ever seen on any forum. WTF???????

Why?

walshb

OneOfThem wrote: »

Ibut Fury isn't George foreman. H

That's right. He is about 25 lbs heavier and 3 inches taller. BTW, Fury's hands may not be as heavy as George's but how can you be so sure on the speed being slower than Foreman? If Frazier found it difficult to get close and land on Foreman then he finds it equally, if not more difficult to get close and land on an even bigger man.

OneOfThem

walshb wrote: »

That's right. He is about 25 lbs heavier and 3 inches taller. BTW, Fury's hands may not be as heavy as George's but how can you be so sure on the speed being slower than Foreman? If Frazier found it difficult to get close and land on Foreman then he finds it equally, if not more difficult to get close and land on an even bigger man.

Just by watching their fights Walsh. Foreman gets off more hard accurate meaningful shots in a shorter time than Fury. His hands go from set to landed in a shorter amount if time. That hand speed. I haven't lazer gated their fists or anything. But that's my opinion, on seeing them fight. Do you disagree?

I disagree that a bigger man is necessarily harder to hit than a smaller man. They have the potential to be. But it isn't guaranteed. (Not to be clichéd and I know these are two entirely different fighters and it's a completely different fight. Frazier isn't Tyson and Fury isn't Valuev, but just as proof of concept... Mike Tyson lands on Valuev all day long without catching much of anything.)

I think Foreman was hard for Frazier to get close to and land on because he was throwing and landing, hard, fast, accurate punches as Frazier came in, better than Frazier could avoid those punches and absorb the ones that landed. I don't think Fury could do the same. I think he'd miss more. What he landed wouldn't hurt Frazier as much. And when Frazier landed, his shots would hurt Fury more than they hurt George.

I think it's an entirely different fight. And one that ends in Frazier standing over an exhausted, attritioned (if I can be permitted to invent a word), befuddled Fury (imo etc).

(I love these fantasy fight imagining things discussions. We should do more of them. Always fun and interesting).

selectamatic

I would say that Frazier never got the opportunity to get close to George! He got hit with a wicked swinging upper cut and that was it, He was dazed and completely on the back foot from there after. So to say Joe can't get close to a big man on evidence from the foreman fights isn't really that accurate. Frazier vs foreman II is an unfair representative of Joe as he was close to retirement and probably should have already been. So a true statement would be Frazier couldn't get close to a big man with the devastating power of Foreman, however these type of fighters are few and far between and Tyson Fury certainly isn't one of them. The fight between Frazier and joe bugner would be a more acceptable comparison and Fraizer had quite a bit of success at getting inside he also dropped bugner in the 10th but it went the distance. Bugner was no slouch either he could take a punch and had great success at a domestic level so I would have him as a better comparison. while Bugner is far from a perfect match its a dam sight closer than comparing Fury to foreman as Fury is no Foreman that's for sure.

walshb

OneOfThem wrote: »

Just by watching their fights Walsh. Foreman gets off more hard accurate meaningful shots in a shorter time than Fury. His hands go from set to landed in a shorter amount if time. That hand speed. I haven't lazer gated their fists or anything. But that's my opinion, on seeing them fight. Do you disagree?

I disagree that a bigger man is necessarily harder to hit than a smaller man. They have the potential to be. But it isn't guaranteed. (Not to be clichéd and I know these are two entirely different fighters and it's a completely different fight. Frazier isn't Tyson and Fury isn't Valuev, but just as proof of concept... Mike Tyson lands on Valuev all day long without catching much of anything.)

I think Foreman was hard for Frazier to get close to and land on because he was throwing and landing, hard, fast, accurate punches as Frazier came in, better than Frazier could avoid those punches and absorb the ones that landed. I don't think Fury could do the same. I think he'd miss more. What he landed wouldn't hurt Frazier as much. And when Frazier landed, his shots would hurt Fury more than they hurt George.

I think it's an entirely different fight. And one that ends in Frazier standing over an exhausted, attritioned (if I can be permitted to invent a word), befuddled Fury (imo etc).

(I love these fantasy fight imagining things discussions. We should do more of them. Always fun and interesting).

Some very good points regarding Frazier-Foreman. I don't see Fury unleashing in the same manner that George did. George was very very busy and heavy handed. I still think Fury's size is juts too much for Joe to get off any effective and hurting offense. He's too short!