Violence in Games on Pat Kenny show in a minute

CiDeRmAn

I have been working in the field of mental health for some 25 years now, allow me to offer some perspective.
There is no causal link between videogames and violent behaviour.
Psychologically vulnerable people may adopt videogames as sinks for their obsessions, but no differently than the same type of individual might have used drinking or drugs etc. Essentially they are coopting a form of escapism that, for a healthy mind is just that, and using it to close off the factors in the real world they find hurtful or confusing. Again, years of old people would have used music, drink, drugs, art, any number of things where they and a group of similarly minded could avoid the real world, where they feel illequipped to compete, and exist only in a bubble where they are right, confident and secure.
Basically the use of videogames to an unhealthy extent is not a cause but a symptom.

http://www.changeitpsychology.co.nz/compulsive-behaviours-and-addictive-personalities

Also, in all those "scientific" talks on reactionary radio and TV they forget that there are a myriad of common factors that link the perpetrators of antisocial behaviour, but as they are familiar to the frightened audience they serve little purpose in driving up the paranoia, so the fact that they all watched Spongebob or ate Kelloggs breakfast cereal is dismissed, but the common element parents find confusing and frightening, well, surprise surprise, turns out that's at fault!
It's terrible reporting, simply made for shock value and a cynical effort to grab a conservative audience and keep them listening, watching or reading long enough so they take in the next set of advertisements and the station gets paid.

And, no, people who don't rage quit games or smash controllers are not sociopaths, you might want to stop using such descriptions to describe privately held beliefs, especially when it's apparent you don't know what you're talking about.

Unfortunately you also have individuals who are making a living from this whole controversy,
http://www.apa.org/science/about/psa/2003/10/anderson.aspx
Craig A Anderson, a psychologist who flies against mainstream thinking and instead portrays videogames as the cause of presents nightmares, Google him and you'll see just what I mean.

Grumpypants

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

And, no, people who don't rage quit games or smash controllers are not sociopaths, you might want to stop using such descriptions to describe privately held beliefs, especially when it's apparent you don't know what you're talking about.

FFS That was quiet obviously a throw away humorous comment to take the notion that games don't have any emotional impact on the player to an absurd conclusion.

Also to put it back in the context that the point I was made in. Playing games for an extended period has an impact, that might be a simple as being tired after playing games for ten hours straight. And if this is repeated day after day that this will have an impact. That might be as simple as the kid being tired in school and to avoid this you should limit the hours of play time.

But apparently that needs a huge scientific study to back it up for some people to consider it.

Once more I will just add that at no point did I link games to violence or anything else. I will also say that it is not specific to games, the same is true from accessing any visually stimulating content for extended periods such as watching TV etc etc.

Retr0gamer

Grumpypants wrote: »

But apparently that needs a huge scientific study to back it up for some people to consider it.

Yes but as has been pointed out IT's not videogames that cause it but other psychological issues.

Grumpypants

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Yes but as has been pointed out IT's not videogames that cause it but other psychological issues.

What? so if you stay up late playing video games, it wasn't the staying up late that is the reason you are tired the next morning but psychological issues. :rolleyes:

I'm no pretend internet doctor but I think I see a link between not sleeping and being tired.

But look I think it is not a good idea for a 12 year old to play ten hours of games a day. You need a study to say its bad. I guess we will never see eye to eye on it.

COYVB

Grumpypants wrote: »

What? so if you stay up late playing video games, it wasn't the staying up late that is the reason you are tired the next morning but psychological issues. :rolleyes:

I'm no pretend internet doctor but I think I see a link between not sleeping and being tired.

The point was it's not the videogames that are causing the lack of sleep, they're simply what's being done during the time the person isn't sleeping

Grumpypants

COYVB wrote: »

The point was it's not the videogames that are causing the lack of sleep, they're simply what's being done during the time the person isn't sleeping

I never said it was, in fact I said over and over that it could be any kind of stimulating content. I am talking specifically about the time spent playing games for an extended period because the thread is about playing video games and that impact, this is why i did not list all the different things you could be doing.

I didn't think it was such a strange concept to wrap your head around that playing games (like doing anything) for an extended period will have an impact, and to reduce that impact you should limit the time playing games.

In fact here is exactly what I said. Explain what is so wrong with this? Note not only do I not link games to violence i specifically call it out as not having any link. I also call out that there are caveats too like being pre disposed to addictive tendency, the increase in consumption of sugar and caffeine loaded energy drinks and playing games for extended periods, and at the end all I said was that will have an impact I didn't quantify that impact.

Games don't make you violent but they are intense stimulants and are addictive, so can cause problems for kids that have addictive tendencies or are prone to violent outbursts. Mix a very unhealthy lifestyle and diet where kids overdose regularly on sugar, caffeine and chemicals, with a lack of exercise to burn off the energy and you have a time bomb.

Give any kid a huge amounts of stimulants like, sugar and caffeine and then show them content that is designed to be hugely visually, mentally and emotionally stimulating over extended periods of time and it will have an impact.

pH

Fair enough but there's plenty of videos of golfers/tennis players smashing their equipment too, no one suggests that playing these sports is problematic. I've seen people "lose it" over a game of cards, I've seen a monopoly board thrown into the air with the cards and pieces flying, no one is suggesting that board games are a problem.

Same old gang of "tut-tutters", any frustration, rage and anger caused by video games is not unique to video games, some people rage all the time, in traffic, in queues etc, some people rage at video games, so what? It says nothing about video games.

Retr0gamer

Grumpypants wrote: »

What? so if you stay up late playing video games, it wasn't the staying up late that is the reason you are tired the next morning but psychological issues. :rolleyes:

You've taken what I've said totally the wrong way.

Cidermans post explains it a lot better than myself.

CiDeRmAn

So, to recap, anything that engages the senses and the mind and is done to excess of then possibly harmful.
I think that is referred, classically, as the bleeding obvious.
And one should not blame the game affecting the minds of children, there is the responsible adult to consider who abdicates this responsibility and let's kids in their care play any game whatever the rating and to as much excess as they like.
Blame rightly lies with them.
Be it games, movies, music, books anything.
And, the point, is that the discussion at hand is about a media report on the effects of videogames on the young and so your contribution is naturally going to be a part of that, you can't pick and choose our responses and your joined the debate. If it doesn't suit you don't have to take part

Grumpypants

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

So, to recap, anything that engages the senses and the mind and is done to excess of then possibly harmful.
I think that is referred, classically, as the bleeding obvious.
And one should not blame the game affecting the minds of children, there is the responsible adult to consider who abdicates this responsibility and let's kids in their care play any game whatever the rating and to as much excess as they like.
Blame rightly lies with them.
Be it games, movies, music, books anything.
And, the point, is that the discussion at hand is about a media report on the effects of videogames on the young and so your contribution is naturally going to be a part of that, you can't pick and choose our responses and your joined the debate. If it doesn't suit you don't have to take part

Yes it is bleeding obvious, that is why I have been utterly baffled by the continued denial of it and the need for some study to prove it.

Did you listen to the radio piece? What he said pretty much mirrored what I said.

They had a person on the radio to talk about violence in games and he said there is no link between that and real world violence, that the problem comes from playing in excess and it is up to the parents to limit this exposure before it becomes a problem.

So what I said is actually perfectly in line with the media piece.

Grumpypants

Retr0gamer wrote: »

You've taken what I've said totally the wrong way.

Cidermans post explains it a lot better than myself.

Ciderman and you are talking about a completely different thing than I am. We are all in agreement that there is no link to games violence and real world violence. That was dismissed in the media piece and in every post in this thread. Again no one is saying there is a link.

I, in a totally different topic that falls under the broader subject of kids playing games to excess as discussed in the radio piece, think that drinking 4 litres of red bull and playing 10 hours of games has an impact and that parents should not let young kids do that.

R0ot

Grumpypants wrote: »

Ciderman and you are talking about a completely different thing than I am. We are all in agreement that there is no link to games violence and real world violence. That was dismissed in the media piece and in every post in this thread. Again no one is saying there is a link.

I, in a totally different topic that falls under the broader subject of kids playing games to excess as discussed in the radio piece, think that drinking 4 litres of red bull and playing 10 hours of games has an impact and that parents should not let young kids do that.

Why associate it to video games at all? If they are drinking 4 litres of red bul and playing 10 hours of soccer or watching 10 hours of tv etc. it's all excess the connection to video games seems just to point the issue at video games / parenting.

Grumpypants

R0ot wrote: »

Why associate it to video games at all? If they are drinking 4 litres of red bul and playing 10 hours of soccer or watching 10 hours of tv etc. it's all excess the connection to video games seems just to point the issue at video games / parenting.

Because it was a conversation about the impact of playing video games to excess, in a video games forum, in the video game category. It would have been weird to suddenly start talking about playing soccer.

Retr0gamer

Nobody is arguing that playing videogames is healthy, it's pretty obvious. Doing anything to excess isn't healthy.

pH

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

So, to recap, anything that engages the senses and the mind and is done to excess of then possibly harmful

Do you have any evidence for that? How much reading for example is "harmful" to a child? How much violin practice? Or academic study? Or TV watching for that matter?

Nobody is arguing that playing videogames is healthy, it's pretty obvious. Doing anything to excess isn't healthy.

But what's "excess", and in terms of hours spent is 10 hours of reading less or more healthy than 10 hours of TV watching, or piano practice or playing a video game?

Retr0gamer

Excess is when you let whatever you are doing get in the way of normal life, for instance letting it get in the way of social life or letting it affect work or school.

Generic Dreadhead

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Do people genuinely smash controllers out of frustration? I hoped that was always light-hearted hyperbole. I can confidently state I have never been so angered by a game that I even remotely felt the need to throw an expensive controller.

Tony Hawkes 3 -> Thug 2

Had to set up a pillow on the floor between my legs