Veterinary Medicine in UCD

sotisme

Hi mods, I posted this in the UCD forum but not sure if it will get any responses so hope its ok to post here too. Thanks

Hi everyone, I was just looking to see if any vet med students are on boards.ie. I'm hoping to start veterinary medicine in 2016 (currently in 5th year). I've had my set on it my entire life and couldn't see myself doing anything else. I am completely animal obsessed, I've fostered 20+ animals, done about 10 weeks work experience with vets of different types throughout the country, and also work with animal rescues. I am also very interested in the medical side of veterinary.

I really wish I could leave school now to do it, and the thought of having to get about 600 points the leaving cert is terrifying.

What leaving cert results got you into it? Do most people just about scrape the points, or do lots of them get the full 625?

Is the course very female dominated, what would the make:female ratio be like?

Do most people enter the employment field right after their 5 years, or do they choose to specialise/do a PHD?

During the summer (or the college year), are there organised trips to exotic countries for working in animal rehabilitation/wildlife centres like you can do in Zoology?

Have you any advice or tips you could offer me? I would appreciate any replies, or insights as I've never had the opportunity to talk to a student doing veterinary medicine in UCD.

I have also heard talk about the HPAT being introduced for this course , does anyone know when this is likely to a happen?

I know that the course is highly demanding, and in your final year you won't have a minute to spare, but for the first few years, how hard is it? Is there any chance of a social life?!

Lastly, although I know this is virtually impossible to predict, but is it more likely that the points will rise or lower?

Thank you so much and I would be really grateful if someone could answer any of my queries, or offer any advice.

boomerang

This short online course from the University of Edinburgh in January might give you some insights into what it'll be like, OP... And it's free.

This course is designed to provide a basic overview of what is involved in the first year of a Veterinary Medicine degree. It will be of interest to those considering Veterinary Medicine as a career or those about to embark on their studies, as well as those keen to learn more about this profession generally or who are involved with caring for animals.


Over the five weeks the course will provide a taster of the subjects covered during the first year of the degree. It includes information on the profession’s past, present and future, as well as an introduction to body systems, basic animal care, and veterinary professional and clinical skills.

https://www.coursera.org/course/edivet

sotisme

boomerang wrote: »

This short online course from the University of Edinburgh in January might give you some insights into what it'll be like, OP... And it's free.

This course is designed to provide a basic overview of what is involved in the first year of a Veterinary Medicine degree. It will be of interest to those considering Veterinary Medicine as a career or those about to embark on their studies, as well as those keen to learn more about this profession generally or who are involved with caring for animals.


Over the five weeks the course will provide a taster of the subjects covered during the first year of the degree. It includes information on the profession’s past, present and future, as well as an introduction to body systems, basic animal care, and veterinary professional and clinical skills.

https://www.coursera.org/course/edivet

Thank you so much; I didn't know about this. Will definitely investigate.

boomerang

The points have been at the max. end of the scale for as long as I can remember OP, even when I did my Leaving twenty years ago!

From talking to vet students, it's hard slog from the start; during your holidays you're required to make up hours in practice. I don't think there are trips abroad unless it's something you do yourself; the likes of charity WVS (worldwide veterinary service) are a great way to gain experience overseas and really fulfilling.

Yes, the majority of students now are women. And most go straight into employment, unless wishing to take an internship to learn more about a particular speciality. AFAIK it's a tough employment market at the moment. The newly-qualified vets that I know are on job bridge or taking jobs in the UK.

The pay is relatively poor in the first years after qualifying; expect about €30-35k pa as a young, full-time veterinary assistant. (Someone who is employed by a vet practice, rather than owning their own practice.)

Capercaille

I know the local vet well. He works in mixed practice and works as a temporary veterinary inspector in the meat factory as well. He works every second night on call and every second weekend. Works around 70+ hours a week (more during the spring). The work is hard and he gets plenty of hardship from farmers. He has no real life outside work since he would be constantly tired. He often says that if he worked normal hours like a normal person, it would be a good job. He spends alot of time chasing money from clients.

sotisme

boomerang wrote: »

The points have been at the max. end of the scale for as long as I can remember OP, even when I did my Leaving twenty years ago!

From talking to vet students, it's hard slog from the start; during your holidays you're required to make up hours in practice. I don't think there are trips abroad unless it's something you do yourself; the likes of charity WVS (worldwide veterinary service) are a great way to gain experience overseas and really fulfilling.

Yes, the majority of students now are women. And most go straight into employment, unless wishing to take an internship to learn more about a particular speciality. AFAIK it's a tough employment market at the moment. The newly-qualified vets that I know are on job bridge or taking jobs in the UK.

The pay is relatively poor in the first years after qualifying; expect about €30-35k pa as a young, full-time veterinary assistant. (Someone who is employed by a vet practice, rather than owning their own practice.)

Thanks a million for your really helpful post. If I remember correctly, you are affiliated with a certain animal rescue in Limerick that I know very well!!

I would love to spend my summers working with charities like the WVS, although I am probably thinking much too far ahead. I am open to everything, and would be willing to start off my career abroad if it's particularly hard to find a job in Ireland.

Just wish I didn't have to spend two more years in school!:p

Capercaille

Even if don't get the points for UCD you can still do Veterinary in places like Budapest. It's alot more expensive though.

sotisme

Capercaille wrote: »

I know the local vet well. He works in mixed practice and works as a temporary veterinary inspector in the meat factory as well. He works every second night on call and every second weekend. Works around 70+ hours a week (more during the spring). The work is hard and he gets plenty of hardship from farmers. He has no real life outside work since he would be constantly tired. He often says that if he worked normal hours like a normal person, it would be a good job. He spends alot of time chasing money from clients.

Thank you for your input. I know, it is a tough job but I still think I could handle it. I did work experience with a vet in a similar situation to yours, his day started at 8am, driving from farm to farm, and often didn't finish until 5 or 6. However, he is very sociable and despite the moaning and groaning, really enjoyed getting to chat with each farmer. Its a hard job, but it's what works for him.

Rabbo

Very difficult course and hugely demanding career by all accounts but if you really believe you are up to it you should go for it.

You're probably aware that RTE recently did a very interesting mini series on UCD trainee vets called Junior Vets. It Might still be abailable in their player but I thought it gave an excellent insight into vet training in this country.

Capercaille

sotisme wrote: »

Thank you for your input. I know, it is a tough job but I still think I could handle it. I did work experience with a vet in a similar situation to yours, his day started at 8am, driving from farm to farm, and often didn't finish until 5 or 6. However, he is very sociable and despite the moaning and groaning, really enjoyed getting to chat with each farmer. Its a hard job, but it's what works for him.

If he was lucky his day would be those hours. During the Spring especially he would be called out numerous times in the middle of the night. Being on-call is the worst thing apparently, you can never relax. You would be always looking at the phone waiting for that call.

sotisme

Capercaille wrote: »

If he was lucky his day would be those hours. During the Spring especially he would be called out numerous times in the middle of the night. Being on-call is the worst thing apparently, you can never relax. You would be always looking at the phone waiting for that call.

I understand that, but that is probably the worst part of the job. He told me that at the start, he felt like superman out to the rescue, and several years later, it's like a bullet to the head when the phone rings in the middle of the night. I an fully aware of whats ahead of me;)

sotisme

Rabbo wrote: »

Very difficult course and hugely demanding career by all accounts but if you really believe you are up to it you should go for it.

You're probably aware that RTE recently did a very interesting mini series on UCD trainee vets called Junior Vets. It Might still be abailable in their player but I thought it gave an excellent insight into vet training in this country.

Thank you for your encouragement. I think I have watched each episode 10 times over at this stage:D

thegreatgonzo

Capercaille wrote: »

If he was lucky his day would be those hours. During the Spring especially he would be called out numerous times in the middle of the night. Being on-call is the worst thing apparently, you can never relax. You would be always looking at the phone waiting for that call.

That's for sure. One of the vets I work for told me today he was called away from the Christmas dinner to do a caesarean and the rest of the week was pretty busy too judging by the look of the place when I walked in (I had a whole wonderful 6 days off in a row!). I share a house with a young vet too and when she is on call she is never 'off'; even when we are just sitting down watching the TV she is checking her phone to make sure she didn't miss a call or that the phone is working. She'll be on call by herself for a few days over new year so no celebrations for her.

Capercaille

thegreatgonzo wrote: »

That's for sure. One of the vets I work for told me today he was called away from the Christmas dinner to do a caesarean and the rest of the week was pretty busy too judging by the look of the place when I walked in (I had a whole wonderful 6 days off in a row!). I share a house with a young vet too and when she is on call she is never 'off'; even when we are just sitting down watching the TV she is checking her phone to make sure she didn't miss a call or that the phone is working. She'll be on call by herself for a few days over new year so no celebrations for her.

A miserable existence. I know only one vet that actually enjoys being a vet overall. The on-call work is a killer for them. The constant pressure to cure everything must be difficult. Even the money for vets is bad now for the hardship they get.

Flabangav

Our year is nearly 50:50 male to female. And a lot of people scraped the points, hardly anyone got 6 A1's.

thegreatgonzo

Capercaille wrote: »

A miserable existence. I know only one vet that actually enjoys being a vet overall. The on-call work is a killer for them. The constant pressure to cure everything must be difficult. Even the money for vets is bad now for the hardship they get.

It's worse for young large animal vets than it used to be apparently because years ago they were paid commission on the work they did whereas now they are treated like any employee so are paid a fixed amount regardless of the work they do. It really is a vocation.

Capercaille

thegreatgonzo wrote: »

It's worse for young large animal vets than it used to be apparently because years ago they were paid commission on the work they did whereas now they are treated like any employee so are paid a fixed amount regardless of the work they do. It really is a vocation.

Revenue are clamping down on assistants getting paid on commission I believe, that's why it's salary now. Young vets gets totally raped on salary, working long hours and getting paid pittance. I know a young vet who said she would be better off financially working in Tesco for the hours she works.

thegreatgonzo

Capercaille wrote: »

. I know a young vet who said she would be better off financially working in Tesco for the hours she works.

That's awful.
Sorry OP for sounding so negative:) If it's the job for you I would still say go for it and best of luck!

sotisme

Flabangav wrote: »

Our year is nearly 50:50 male to female. And a lot of people scraped the points, hardly anyone got 6 A1's.

Thank you, that is really helpful. Can i ask what year you are in at the moment? Are you enjoying it?

Aru

I am a vet.few years qualified....and I would never advise anyone to chose this job if they want to stay in Ireland.
Ive a few years experience and I am still getting a salary that works out as less than minimum wage per hour worked....my rota isnt that bad, my workplace is generally nice to work in and bar the on call its an enjoyable life.I love working as a vet it has always been my life ambition and I love my job most of the time...

but theres no real future hope of progression unless you inherit a practice through family or you can raise enough money to buy into a practice...and on the wages young vets get its not possible.the revenue are making comission working near impossible.
Its managable as a young person but longterm family prospects are bleak.part time work is rare in ireland and the on call is a killer at the minute...it would be horrific with children.if i am on call and up all night dealing with emergencies I still have to work the day after...its just the way it is. the practices here in ireland are generally small and theres not much room for a changing call rota so working overnights during the week and on weekends is a given in most of the country.I worked xmas eve and xmas day and will be doing new years eve as well.I wont be getting any xrtra pay for this and we dont get extra for bank holidays or weekends either.

The job is very high pressure with hugh responsibilty for the moment you finish collage and the support network in practices that hire new grads is often very poor.working in new rural areas can be very isolating.the suicide rate in vets is way above the norm.

In ten years chances are I will no longer be working as a vet as I couldnt afford to stay working on these sort of wages and hours if I had kids unless my partner was very well paid or going to be a sahd.

one of my collegues is qualified 10 years of his year of 80 only 30 are still working in the proffesion.hes thinking of retraining as well.

The uk,oz nz qnd canada generally give better quality of life wages and hours....but I am Irish.I want to live work and have family here not across the water.

If you are considering becoming a vet you need to start seeing practice with vets esp during springtime to see exactly what you are getting yourself in for. Go in with your eyes open.

Aru

As for the leaving.I repeated the lc and took on subjects I could get high points in and dropped the others I struggled with. Many in my year repeated to get the points(i went to ucd) we had 75 percent girls to 25 percent boys.
However I found the course horrific.the first 2 years esp as it very science based and not very relevent to the actual job you end up doing.I scraped through those years by the skin of my teeth.those exams were 100 times more stressful that the leaving!The later years are still difficult but at least they are clinical based so you can see why its nessecary to learn and they are more enjoyable.working while in collage is near impossible.not just due to the hours(lectures start at 8 and can be in til 6 in the later years) but also as you have compulsary work experience to do during your holidays. The work experience is key to your long term vet life as well and incredibly important and its great to see what real practice is like and to make the contacts and references to help get a job after collage....but it makes a summer job impossible.

My brother did medicine while I was doing veterinary.He freely admits our course is much more difficult.

Budapest etc are options but very very expensive and the loans are very difficult to pay off on low starting salaries.oh and jobs for new grads are getting more and more difficult to come by.some new grads this year apparently ended up working on jobsbridge schemes.

sotisme

Hi Aru, your feedback is much appreciated. I now see just how tough a profession veterinary is. I'm still set on it (can't see myself doing anything else to be fully honest!) but at least I am ready to face the hard lifestyle. I still don't know if I would be interested in working abroad, but I guess I'll have 7 years to decide that!

Capercaille

sotisme wrote: »

Hi Aru, your feedback is much appreciated. I now see just how tough a profession veterinary is. I'm still set on it (can't see myself doing anything else to be fully honest!) but at least I am ready to face the hard lifestyle. I still don't know if I would be interested in working abroad, but I guess I'll have 7 years to decide that!

Would you be happy working on less than the minimum wage for years on end?

Aru

Capercaille wrote: »

Would you be happy working on less than the minimum wage for years on end?

Its not actually minimum wage!new grads still make ok salaries(24 to 35 grant is nothing to be whinging about in a normal houred job) so no where near the minimun wage overall
..its only for the amount of time you are working that the hourly rate works out so poor...Ive done plenty of weeks of 120+ hr plus time working due to on call.Its free time poor not money poor.

Capercaille

Aru wrote: »

Its not actually minimum wage!new grads still make ok salaries(24 to 35 grant is nothing to be whinging about in a normal houred job) so no where near the minimun wage overall
..its only for the amount of time you are working that the hourly rate works out so poor...Ive done plenty of weeks of 120+ hr plus time working due to on call.Its free time poor not money poor.

Sorry misunderstood. Still though 24,000-34,000 for those hours and the work involved (professional work) is terrible. I know a girl that's newly qualified that's on 15,000 per year in Horse practice on the Curragh.

Aru

Capercaille wrote: »

Sorry misunderstood. Still though 24,000-34,000 for those hours and the work involved (professional work) is terrible. I know a girl that's newly qualified that's on 15,000 per year in Horse practice on the Curragh.

I agree for whats involved its not great...but all the same cant be pretending me are poor martyrs either. its still a respectable amount of money and many people get by on a lot less so felt the need to point that out.

its just not much considering the training and hours involved.getting a doctor or plumber doing vets work and hours for the same money or call out charges would be near impossible

Capercaille

Aru wrote: »

I agree for whats involved its not great...but all the same cant be pretending me are poor martyrs either. its still a respectable amount of money and many people get by on a lot less so felt the need to point that out.

its just not much considering the training and hours involved.getting a doctor or plumber doing vets work and hours for the same money or call out charges would be near impossible

You're a professional person and getting paid 25,000-35,000 is a terrible wage.

The man in red and black

Capercaille wrote: »

You're a professional person and getting paid 25,000-35,000 is a terrible wage.

For the hours worked yes. I worked in a clothes shop while I was in the vet college and I got paid more per hour there than some vets are paid now in Ireland if you average it out per hour. If you put in the same hours doing a minimum wage job you would be making alot more overall if you know what I mean.