The Tipperary GAA (Club and intercounty) Discussion thread 2015

Rasputin11

realdanbreen wrote: »

Well if it doesn't happen Smith will have a field day mark my words.

Nobody flaked him in Thurles last year and he was poor, talking about hitting and hopping off lads is a thing of the past. We need to get stuck into them but legally, not by breaking a hurl off him or other old school nonsense.

danganabu

realdanbreen wrote: »

Heres a fact. We played Galway one time in a challenge game, Smith started a flare up early in the second half. Several players got involved but the Tipp boys were shy enough afterwards. The Galway selectors had that incident pencilled in as the number one note from that game for future reference.

That tells a number of things really!

Discipline from the Tipp players in a meaningless challenge, which is a good thing and more pertintly that it would seem that the Galway selectors are neanderthals!

I would absolutly love to know whom out of James Woodlock, Shane McGrath, Padraic Maher, Kieran Bergin or Ronan Maher that Smith is planning to rough up!

realdanbreen

Rasputin11 wrote: »

Nobody flaked him in Thurles last year and he was poor, talking about hitting and hopping off lads is a thing of the past. We need to get stuck into them but legally, not by breaking a hurl off him or other old school nonsense.

'hitting and hopping' off lads seems to work for Kilkenny when they play us.

thinkstoomuch1

danganabu wrote: »

That tells a number of things really!

Discipline from the Tipp players in a meaningless challenge, which is a good thing and more pertintly that it would seem that the Galway selectors are neanderthals!

I would absolutly love to know whom out of James Woodlock, Shane McGrath, Padraic Maher, Kieran Bergin or Ronan Maher that Smith is planning to rough up!

A very very good points I agree with

I'm finding this game hard to call

I think tippeary will win it but it's tough
Who would you think as I know when tippeary played limerick in the minor munster final you posted on that minor hurling thread you were backing limerick against tippeary as you thought the value was good on limericks
What do you make of the value sunday as you're a poster that understand these things

I think tipperary's fire power will edge it but this will be close as Galway are always dangerous these type of games

danganabu

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

A very very good points I agree with

I'm finding this game hard to call

I think tippeary will win it but it's tough
Who would you think as I know when tippeary played limerick in the minor munster final you posted on that minor hurling thread you were backing limerick against tippeary as you thought the value was good on limericks
What do you make of the value sunday as you're a poster that understand these things

I think tipperary's fire power will edge it but this will be close as Galway are always dangerous these type of games

I expect Tipp to win and will bet accordingly, semi finals are tricky games and the performance doesn't concern me, they are games that are simply there for winning. The 5 week layoff is a concern but only a slight one.

I would be very dissapointed if our forwards werent capable of exposing Tannion and Hanbury, the biggest threat is the aerial battle but if we handle that reasonably well I would be reasonably confident.

Have no idea what relevance the Munster Minor Final has to an AI senior semi final, although you brought the same point up in the Waterford thread as well, but more power to you, anything to take your attentioon of the mess that is Cork GAA right now I guess helps.

thinkstoomuch1

danganabu wrote: »

I expect Tipp to win and will bet accordingly, semi finals are tricky games and the performance doesn't concern me, they are games that are simply there for winning. The 5 week layoff is a concern but only a slight one.

I would be very dissapointed if our forwards werent capable of exposing Tannion and Hanbury, the biggest threat is the aerial battle but if we handle that reasonably well I would be reasonably confident.

Have no idea what relevance the Munster Minor Final has to an AI senior semi final, although you brought the same point up in the Waterford thread as well, but more power to you, anything to take your attentioon of the mess that is Cork GAA right now I guess helps.

Fair points and thank you for that

We know we have problems in cork and any time you want to debate them come to the Cork thread I'll happily engage
Munster minor game has no relevance but I said I'd ask you for value to bet in you had no problems betting against your own county tippeary in a munster final so I knew you would be impartial sunday in betting sense you will bet for where your get value irrespective of against your own county and that's fair enough


I'm not a betting man but I'll probably do a wager sunday as I'd never be able to bet against my county for love nor money.

I'll back tipp on your advice so
I ll throw small wager in it
Best of luck sunday.

danganabu

thinkstoomuch1 wrote: »

Fair points and thank you for that

We know we have problems in cork and any time you want to debate them come to the Cork thread I'll happily engage
Munster minor game has no relevance but I said I'd ask you for value to bet in you had no problems betting against your own county tippeary in a munster final so I knew you would be impartial sunday in betting sense you will bet for where your get value irrespective of against your own county and that's fair enough


I'm not a betting man but I'll probably do a wager sunday as I'd never be able to bet against my county for love nor money.

I'll back tipp on your advice so
I ll throw small wager in it
Best of luck sunday.

I haven't engaged on the Cork thread to be honest because I know how hard it can be, we have had more than our fair share of fallow periods, best to let the dust settle before a Tipp man starts commenting!

From a value perspective I would think that the overs in points and goals (havent checked the line yet but B365 are usually best price) will offer the most value, this will be a high scoring shoot out type game I think, more of a traditional 15v15 set up, a small bet on Callinan and Bonner for MOTM aswell, as I said before I think Tannion and Hanbury are there to be got at.

buggy beag

copied and pasted from premierview.:)Good to see the hate is back. It nurtured two counties in the late '80s when we had little other source of nourishment. I can't begin to tell you, lads, how bad it was back then. It was a time before chocolate-covered Kimberleys. It was a time before Coppers. It as a time before John Deere. It was a time before porn. Newspapers were in black and white. As was life itself. It was a time when you used your thumbs to hitch to Dublin as opposed to "cu l8r LOL". And as bad as things were in Tipperary where we had nothing else to sustain ourselves apart from calling Lynskey (the original citeógach mullocker) a raiser of piebalds, poor ould Galway was a sunken latrine in a Japanese POW camp. They would have welcomed Cromwell back if only for the employment the tarring and feathering would have provided.

And do you know what has ruined the hate?

Colleges hurling has ruined the hate.

Now, you have fellas from Galway and Tipperary playing together and staying together in UL and LIT and the likes. It's all selfies and tweets and first-name basis. There should be a law against it. The first and only time these fellas should meet is on burnt grass in Croke Park in an All-Ireland semi-final. They should be kept in sheep pens until then, and not fannying about the "Wet 'n' Wild Foam Party" in UL together checking how their "guns" look in this t-shirt. God be with the days of pure pig iron: when Sylvie Linnane needed an anaesthetic just to get his togs on; when Joe Hayes needed no trigonometry lessons to realise that the shortest distance between two points was through Tony Keady.

We need to go completely throwback here, to a time of nuns, crepe hats, and Golly Bars. To seven lads in a Ford Cortina with an array of badges on the back windscreen: "The Conquerors", "Gina, Dale Hayes and the Champions". and "Now You're Sucking Diesel". Not a can of Lynx in sight; you slept in the clothes you stood up in. The Galway lads trailing the usual smell of burnt sticks, the Tipp lads with farmers' tans from forking bales for the past fortnight.

The terraces were raw back then. You'd be surrounded by straw-hatted flutes from Ahascragh for whom baling twine was the height of sophistication. They'd roar at John Leahy from the minute he appeared to the minute he had someone sent off. And then they'd go completely bat**** altogether. They'd be atin' the straw hat when Leahy scored the winner.

You'd go back to Quinns just to goad them and their maroon jersies and maroon heads. They'd be fit to be tied, swilling Smithwicks to make the memory of John Leahy go away. And you'd be caffling at the state of Gerry McInerney's boots and the stupidity of Hopper McGrath.

Ah yes, the good times are back. Let the hate into your hearts

Dennis Reynolds

Dennis Reynolds wrote: »

Lads who do we want marking Joe Canning?

Could Barrett do a job on him? Barry done well on Glynn last year

buggy beag

buggy beag wrote: »

copied and pasted from premierview.:)Good to see the hate is back. It nurtured two counties in the late '80s when we had little other source of nourishment. I can't begin to tell you, lads, how bad it was back then. It was a time before chocolate-covered Kimberleys. It was a time before Coppers. It as a time before John Deere. It was a time before porn. Newspapers were in black and white. As was life itself. It was a time when you used your thumbs to hitch to Dublin as opposed to "cu l8r LOL". And as bad as things were in Tipperary where we had nothing else to sustain ourselves apart from calling Lynskey (the original citeógach mullocker) a raiser of piebalds, poor ould Galway was a sunken latrine in a Japanese POW camp. They would have welcomed Cromwell back if only for the employment the tarring and feathering would have provided.

And do you know what has ruined the hate?

Colleges hurling has ruined the hate.

Is it the same guy as the last post? Himself and some of his Galway buddies need to get a room.

Rasputin11

realdanbreen wrote: »

'hitting and hopping' off lads seems to work for Kilkenny when they play us.

They use their physical strength but they don't pull silly strokes or "flake" lads. Kilkenny are easily the most physically strong team in the game.

buggy beag

Deleted User wrote:

Is it the same guy as the last post? Himself and some of his Galway buddies need to get a room.

Haha na a different lad.i gets a gud chuckle from em anyway

buggy beag

Rasputin11 wrote:

They use their physical strength but they don't pull silly strokes or "flake" lads. Kilkenny are easily the most physically strong team in the game.

Ya there some lads in a ruck arnt they

tippspur

Maroon hats and Maroon heads,HaHa.

tippspur

tippspur wrote: »

Maroon hats and Maroon heads,HaHa.

Its like something a traveller would come out with on one of their baiting Youtube videos

evolving tipperary

Tipperary will lose aerial battle, says Nicky English
506
Wednesday, August 12, 2015By Paul Keane
Former All-Ireland winning manager Nicky English believes Tipperary should accept that they’re going to concede aerial possession to Galway’s powerful forwards and must simply concentrate on what to do next.


The legendary Tipp figure said it’s virtually certain that Galway forwards like Jonathan Glynn, Cyril Donnellan and Joe Canning are going to beat their men in aerial contests during Sunday’s All-Ireland semi-final.

Glynn in particular proved troublesome for Cork’s defenders in the quarter-final and English believes it’s certain that he will consistently win primary possession again.

“I think you’ve got to accept that Johnny Glynn is going to catch the ball,” said English. “You’ve got to be prepared for the second phase.
READ NEXT Ditch dated provincial structure, says Kilkenny stalwart Kevin Fennelly

“Johnny Glynn is going to catch the ball and that’s going to be it. You can’t be disappointed if he catches the ball because that’s just what he does. You’ve got to stop him from thereafter I think.

“I don’t expect Johnny Glynn will play full-forward, Galway switch around anyway. But Tipp have to be prepared for Galway winning ball in the forward line. They’ve become very good ball winners, the likes of Donnellan and Glynn. Tipperary have to be able to deal with them as Kilkenny did in the Leinster final. Johnny Glynn caught ball early but Kilkenny were able to get players around him and that’s probably the key.

“He’s a phenomenal athlete and a phenomenal player. After the last day against Cork, his confidence will be even higher.”

The 2001 All-Ireland winning manager acknowledged, however, that Tipperary couldn’t be in much better shape for the Croke Park contest.

All of their big gun players are firing and English has been impressed that current boss Eamon O’Shea has been able to seamlessly transition rookie players like Ronan Maher and Michael Breen into the first-team set-up.

“I think yes is the answer to the question of whether Tipp are in good shape, they are in very good shape though I think they’ll need to be because the tests are going to be a lot tougher now, particularly Galway,” said English.

“Everything has run pretty smoothly for Tipperary so far in the Championship. At the same time, some of their reputation is built on beating Limerick well in the Munster championship, now Limerick turned out to be not at the races all year when it came down to it, so you probably have to discount a bit of that result.

“Against Waterford, really Tipperary were able to deal with them in the Munster final but I think it’ll be a step up again because Galway are very physically powerful.

“Waterford weren’t physically strong enough for Tipp and as they ran out of steam carrying the ball, Tipp were able to deal with them easily enough. But do I think Tipp are in a good position? Yes, of course.”

evolving tipperary

Collins comes across as a lunatic here:



David Collins: Tipperary game 'payback' time for Galway
By Peter Sweeney | Updated: Wednesday, 12 Aug 2015 14:43 | 10 Comments
10 Comments
Tipperary and Galway will clash in the All-Ireland semi-final on Sunday
Tipperary and Galway will clash in the All-Ireland semi-final on Sunday
David Collins says that Galway have revenge on their minds as they get ready to take on Tipperary in Sunday’s All-Ireland SHC semi-final.
Just over 12 months ago, Galway appeared to be cruising to qualifier victory over Tipp before a late collapse saw their summer end early again.
Collins and his Tribesmen team-mates have been thinking about that game since and are eager for another crack at the Premier County(live on RTÉ2, throw-in 3.30pm).

“We were in the driving seat in Thurles with 15 minutes to go and we took the foot off the gas,” explained the veteran defender.
“So yeah, there’s definitely payback there that we need to actually bring to the next game; that attitude has to be there.
"We’re training for six, seven months before we get to an All-Ireland quarter-final or semi-final and when you meet the guys that beat you, that’s where we need to be (tuned in), we have to get it to that level.
“We have to take it that we nearly hate Tipperary, that they’re in our way and we need to get them out of the way. That’s the attitude you have to take.”
Galway have a shocking recent record against Tipperary, winning only one of their last five championship meetings dating back to 2001.
Last year was particularly poor and Collins, a keen student of the game, admits that he has watched that match back several times in the hopes of picking up some clues as to what went wrong.
"I think what changed that day was they sat Padraic Maher back in the half-back line and he started clearing a lot of ball, we in the half-back line struggled to deal with a lot of it," he said.
Tipperary
"They really got on top. They perfected it last year and went all the way on to the All-Ireland final.
“They're looking at that too and they're thinking 'where are Galway's strengths, where are Galway's weaknesses, what can we target?' Obviously we're doing the same thing.
"I've watched it a few times. You pick out little things, mistakes that were made, how you rectify [them], what you'll try not to do the next day.
"The ability of the Tipp forwards and Tipp boys to win primary possession, that's key to that battle. We have to get out in front defence-wise and our forwards have to work like lunatics in that middle third. That's going to be key to it.
“I'd be the very one to analyse stuff and take snippets of information. I'm very much a stats-driven guy where you need to know how many breaks, what breaks were there, where you can get to, what's your capability. That's where I am at.”
Collins says that the intensity that all of Galway’s players have brought to training this year has impressed him, and was the driver of their startling 12-point All-Ireland quarter-final win over Cork last month., Underlying it all is the failure to recreate the highs of 2012, when they took Kilkenny to an All-Ireland final replay.
"When you're in an All-Ireland final, lads think you're going to be here every year. When I look back to 2005, we thought we would be in All-Ireland finals year-on-year and it just didn't happen.
"The hunger and the intensity and your attitude, those three key points. Your attitude has to be right, the hunger and the desire has to be there, and the intensity that you bring to training every night has to be there.
Jonathan Glynn in action against Cork
"When "Galway are like that, in that zone, we're dangerous. That's why we're here where we are."
The 31-year-old missed the Cork win due to a hamstring complaint but is fit for selection this week.
He knows how lucky he is still to be playing the game, with a long-term ankle injury looking to have ended his career eight years ago.
"It is always going to be 90-95%, mobility-wise, because of the injury that was sustained," he said.
"But I manage it well. I strap my ankles all the time for protection because of the injury that was there.
"It was a lateral inversion of my ankle – I ruptured and tore the ligaments off both sides of the bone and they had to be put back together. My career looked over, it was over in 2007, that is what they said.
"But two consultants later, they were saying we can get you back to 80-85%, so I thought I would go with it.
"I didn’t accept that my career was over. And that would always be my attitude. Unless it is broken or you can’t fix it, we will give it a good shout.
Once [surgeon] Stephen Kearns said we will get you back to 85%, I thought let’s go with it and three operations later, I was back. But it took a while, 18 months out of actual training."

realdanbreen

Rasputin11 wrote: »

They use their physical strength but they don't pull silly strokes or "flake" lads. Kilkenny are easily the most physically strong team in the game.

OK I will be PC and drop the word flake. I'm not suggesting we do a Benny Dunne on Smith and a few more but if we shy back, as we have done in the past, they will go to town on us. I just don't want to hear on Sunday night 'Oh the ref didn't do his job' or 'Where did that Galway performance come from'. We need to forget about the excuses this year and win the all Ireland.

evolving tipperary

Examples of when Tipp have 'shy back'?

PlayByTheRules

What are people's thoughts on starting 15 for Tipp? Have Forde and Niall O'Meara bedded down places for themselves? I thought Niall should have got a run last year in the finals. Is Mickey Cahill fit and injury free? Would love to see him at work breaking out of defense again.

danganabu

PlayByTheRules wrote: »

What are people's thoughts on starting 15 for Tipp? Have Forde and Niall O'Meara bedded down places for themselves? I thought Niall should have got a run last year in the finals. Is Mickey Cahill fit and injury free? Would love to see him at work breaking out of defense again.

Niall unfortunately wasn't 100% last year after missing so much of the year with injury, himself and Jason have definitely done enough to nail down a place.

Only change I can possibly see is COB coming into corner back with Breen loosing out, don't think I'd make that change myself but that's what I''m hearing from the camp.

Personally I would start Breen on the wing and have Ronan in the corner, a half back line of Bergin, Paudie and Breen wouldnt be long putting to bed this myth that the Galway half forward line are some sort of aerial masters!

News on Mikey Cahill is not so good I'm afraid had another set back about two weeks ago and it just seems one set back after another, he has been out so long now I'm beggining to worry that he may never get back to teh player we knew, please god I am wrong.

I have also heard from a number of panel members that Lar is absolutely buzzing in training and will feature on Sunday, a fully fit Lar is still vital to Tipp.

evolving tipperary

If Woodie can come back from his injury - Cahill can come back too. Cahill's state of affairs hasn't quite reached Gar Ryan's torturous years of injury - which has no doubt affected him - but, Cahill can make it yet. But, another year like this one and you'd worry for him - might have to reinvent him into a forward - Pat Fox style!

PlayByTheRules

Interesting. Glad to hear we may get to see Larry light up Croke Park again, his display in the drawn game last year was very impressive. Was very unlucky to hit the crossbar with that vital goal shot. I must say though that Bergin's weak point from what I have seen is in the air. The others are solid aeriel contenders. Larkin beat Bergin in the air many times last year and he struggled in the air when Richie Power threw his elbows up too. It is the one part of his game that he could improve on.

danganabu wrote: »

Niall unfortunately wasn't 100% last year after missing so much of the year with injury, himself and Jason have definitely done enough to nail down a place.

Only change I can possibly see is COB coming into corner back with Breen loosing out, don't think I'd make that change myself but that's what I''m hearing from the camp.

Personally I would start Breen on the wing and have Ronan in the corner, a half back line of Bergin, Paudie and Breen wouldnt be long putting to bed this myth that the Galway half forward line are some sort of aerial masters!

News on Mikey Cahill is not so good I'm afraid had another set back about two weeks ago and it just seems one set back after another, he has been out so long now I'm beggining to worry that he may never get back to teh player we knew, please god I am wrong.

I have also heard from a number of panel members that Lar is absolutely buzzing in training and will feature on Sunday, a fully fit Lar is still vital to Tipp.

danganabu

evolving tipperary wrote: »

If Woodie can come back from his injury - Cahill can come back too. Cahill's state of affairs hasn't quite reached Gar Ryan's torturous years of injury - which has no doubt affected him - but, Cahill can make it yet. But, another year like this one and you'd worry for him - might have to reinvent him into a forward - Pat Fox style!

I hope you are right but the main difference with Mickey at this stage is that it has been a series of relatively unrelated injuries as opposed to one persistent one, that has to be a major concern.

realdanbreen

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Examples of when Tipp have 'shy back'?

See my earlier post, I saw them shy back against Galway(on more than one occassion) I might add.

danganabu

PlayByTheRules wrote: »

Interesting. Glad to hear we may get to see Larry light up Croke Park again, his display in the drawn game last year was very impressive. Was very unlucky to hit the crossbar with that vital goal shot. I must say though that Bergin's weak point from what I have seen is in the air. The others are solid aeriel contenders. Larkin beat Bergin in the air many times last year and he struggled in the air when Richie Power threw his elbows up too. It is the one part of his game that he could improve on.

A bit like Padraic Maher in Cork 2010 and John O'Keefe in Croker 2011 I wouldn't blame Bergin for those incidenets, it was the freedom and room that the KK half back line were getting that day ( much like Gardner and Tommy Walsh in the above examples) make it absolutely impossible for the back with the quality and volume of ball been rained down on top of them.

danganabu

realdanbreen wrote: »

See my earlier post, I saw them shy back against Galway(on more than one occassion) I might add.

In a challenge match against Andy Smith :rolleyes: case closed so!

realdanbreen

danganabu wrote: »

In a challenge match against Andy Smith :rolleyes: case closed so!

Sigh! Perhaps I need to break it down a bit for you. How many times have they played KK in recent years? Answer 16. How many have they won? Answer 3. In the majority of those games KK have harassed/crowded/shoved Tipp all over the field. My point is that Tipp need to toughen up and do something about that, no more excuses.

danganabu

realdanbreen wrote: »

Sigh! Perhaps I need to break it down a bit for you. How many times have they played KK in recent years? Answer 16. How many have they won? Answer 3. In the majority of those games KK have harassed/crowded/shoved Tipp all over the field. My point is that Tipp need to toughen up and do something about that, no more excuses.

Now back to the original question can you give specific examples from those games where Tipp 'shy back'?

League matches dont worry me either, so I count 7 matches as follows:

2009 - Lost an absolute classic with a little help from the ref, still the greatest game of hurling ever played IMO

2010 - We won with a masterclass

2011 - Simply beaten by a better team on the day and actually did very well considering the performance to finish the game as close to KK as we did.

2012 - We'd all prefer to forget it, but it was tactics and naeivity that lost it, nothing to do with shying back or physicality

2013 - Convinced we would have won if Lar had of stayed on the field had Murphy in knots and Murphy went on to be MOTM

2014 - Drew a classic and were inches from victory and the replay again like 2012 was a tactical failure to adopt to KK, and also a lack of depth on teh bench, a weakness that has been remedied this year.

Rasputin11

realdanbreen wrote: »

Sigh! Perhaps I need to break it down a bit for you. How many times have they played KK in recent years? Answer 16. How many have they won? Answer 3. In the majority of those games KK have harassed/crowded/shoved Tipp all over the field. My point is that Tipp need to toughen up and do something about that, no more excuses.

Would it not be obvious then that Kilkenny have had better players than us in the last 5 years? Better players and more physically strong players. Hurling is still a very skill based game and 3/16 wins for us surely points to them having more skill than our players.