The Tipperary GAA (Club and intercounty) Discussion thread 2015

Let me go on record and thank Eamon O'Shea for his efforts the last three seasons. I do realise the respect he holds having heard Eoin Kelly speak of him in glowing terms a few years ago and acknowledge that the likes Seamie, Bubbles, Lar and Noel have flourished under his tutelage.

I can remember him being friendly enough to actually greet me without me ever meeting the man in my life beforehand in the Centra beside Drumcondra train station back in 2012 before that ill-fated game against Kilkenny and going off absolutely delighted. (My delight was to abruptly end that day)

While i accept that Eamon gave serious effort and commitment along with the team this year ill refuse to believe that we couldnt have done more.I can accept Kilkenny are better but I honestly think with a bit more self awareness and cuteness we could have got that extra edge in our perfromances against them.

In my own opinion, we didnt analyse ourselves enough. I didnt agree with some of the selection choices and i categorically stand by that, and the fact Shane Bourke worked his way back onto the panel with ease this summer would make me question the actual intensity levels of our training. With the greatest of respect to Shane who is a talented sticksman, i somehow find it hard to believe he turned into some sort of hurling John Rambo overnight and just forced his way back into our thinking. Fact is Eamon was more inclined toward a certain type of player and thats all well and good but you may as well be trying to win the grand national on a shetland when it goes into overkill.

Eamons championship record stands at W6 L5 and D1. His reputation is big amongst the players but relative to his reputation I cant help feeling slightly shortchanged looking back at that record. I felt that we left a few games behind us.

Ive the utmost respect for the man and while it isnt all of his fault, as manager he must take his fair share of responsibility. Yes perhaps my argument would be blown out of the water had the wind caught Bubbles sliothar and blew it la few inches the other way but it didnt. 3 weeks later we had a chance to up our game an extra few percent but couldnt live with the physicality. I felt the line could have reacted faster that day. Kilkenny went a goal up and in that type of game it was as good as a ten point lead.

And i dont buy into the fact that there is this huge gulf in class with Kilkenny. For god sake we were only losing to them by a score? Surely we could have tweaked things around? But we seemed to be sucked into the same funnel time and again.

So while i wish the man the very best in the future and thank him for his efforts I do think its time we embraced the future. I hope Michael Ryan is thinking and analysing and pondering how to put his own stamp on matters. Otherwise we're headed for further groundhog day and further pain and in danger of becoming the Mayo of hurling.

And yes the players need to make a tough decision too. Do they want to realise the fruits of their sacrifices? or do they want to prove Ger Loughnanes theory right?

evolving tipperary

Yes, at times, it was only a score. But, if you consider that Tipp were ravenous for victory and medals (must be worth at least 3 to four points) and KK have medals out the wazoo) I don't care how good Cody is at motivation or the players themselves, there comes a point when you just don't have the same hunger as someone who has never won it or only has one...That leads me to believe that the gulf in class is more than one score and KK proved that on numerous occasions.

Yet, I read recently that Bergin only went out 7 or 8 weekends in the last year or so - and, yet, in 2014 J Tyrell said in an interview that he didn't even have a biscuit because he felt there was a young lad down in Clare hungry for victory and he would be committed to his diet enough not to have a biscuit. So, Tyrell didn't indulge. There's something ruthless in that type of hunger which is not evident in Tipp. We have no right to expect that from a player, that is a decision for a player himself. And, not just because he is amateur. So, maybe, there's a tale in that...

Who knows...

But, we know now that malwadi and biscuits flowed like river down in Clare!!!!

So, if you're position is Declan Ryan/TD could have done more. Eamon/Ryan could have done more. Sheedy/Eamon did everything right because they won one (or does Eamon get no credit for that one because he hasn't won one as manager?) And, the players have been wronged by poor decisions and a lack of an ability on the line...

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Yes, at times, it was only a score. But, if you consider that Tipp were ravenous for victory and medals (must be worth at least 3 to four points) and KK have medals out the wazoo) I don't care how good Cody is at motivation or the players themselves, there comes a point when you just don't have the same hunger as someone who has never won it or only has one...That leads me to believe that the gulf in class is more than one score and KK proved that on numerous occasions.

Yet, I read recently that Bergin only went out 7 or 8 weekends in the last year or so - and, yet, in 2014 J Tyrell said in an interview that he didn't even have a biscuit because he felt there was a young lad down in Clare hungry for victory and he would be committed to his diet enough not to have a biscuit. So, Tyrell didn't indulge. There's something ruthless in that type of hunger which is not evident in Tipp. We have no right to expect that from a player, that is a decision for a player himself. And, not just because he is amateur. So, maybe, there's a tale in that...

Who knows...

But, we know now that malwadi and biscuits flowed like river down in Clare!!!!

So, if you're position is Declan Ryan/TD could have done more. Eamon/Ryan could have done more. Sheedy/Eamon did everything right because they won one (or does Eamon get no credit for that one because he hasn't won one as manager?) And, the players have been wronged by poor decisions and a lack of an ability on the line...

Ultimately players and management alike could have all done that little extra.

But the fact we have now been on the wrong end of the result 5 times would suggest that there is some sort of block within the mindset.

I refuse steadfast to believe that another all Ireland cannot be mined out of this group of players. Nothing will convince me that they aren't capable of beating all around them and winning the all Ireland again. I'm just not going to entertain any contrasting concepts

Rasputin11

I presume premierview is like the Battle Of Stalingrad since last Sunday!! Anyone saying anything critical of EOS probably banned for life.

evolving tipperary

I think another ALL-Ireland is possible too - too little return for a talented bunch of players though. I think ultimately the players need to take some responsibility for features of their game which have failed to kick on...


But, what can you do when things like cancer and injury are involved - not a whole pile.

Now, enough of the circling. Name eight young lads?

Rasputin11

Rasputin11 wrote: »

I presume premierview is like the Battle Of Stalingrad since last Sunday!! Anyone saying anything critical of EOS probably banned for life.

Or at least until January 1st 2199 :pac:

evolving tipperary

evolving tipperary wrote: »

I think another ALL-Ireland is possible too - too little return for a talented bunch of players though. I think ultimately the players need to take some responsibility for features of their game which have failed to kick on...


But, what can you do when things like cancer and injury are involved - not a whole pile.

Now, enough of the circling. Name eight young lads?

Well to be fair we did get injuries and of course Noels very serious illness throughout and there is no doubting a fit Noel would have made a huge difference. He was showing great form

For the future, from that minor team i would expect Tommy Nolan, Tynan, and Brian Mcgrath to emerge at least. Was very impressed with all the forwards to be honest. Very hardworking team throughout.

Next year i think we might see a bit more of Tom Fox, Tadhg Gallagher Barry Heffernan and please god also John Meagher.

John Mcgrath and Michael Breen may also become more prominent. Hopefully Paul Maher might get a game in goal also in the league.

Xenophile

solerina wrote: »

Don't usually post but I totally agree, leave the footballers alone....picking hurling over football hasn't exactly worked out for Bill Maher has it !!
Allow them to be proper dual players or stop trying to ruin the football panel !!!

I agree, the biggest contribution that Bill Maher can make to Tipperary GAA in the foreseeable future is to make himself available to the football team and help them to gain promotion to Division 2 in the league.

robbiezero

Rasputin11 wrote: »

I presume premierview is like the Battle Of Stalingrad since last Sunday!! Anyone saying anything critical of EOS probably banned for life.

Very similar to here to be honest. There are plenty critics of his reign and the "tippy-tappy" style of hurling he employed, but people acknowledge the effort he put in and how close he got, but ultimately failed.

robbiezero

Deleted User wrote: »

Let me go on record and thank Eamon O'Shea for his efforts the last three seasons. I do realise the respect he holds having heard Eoin Kelly speak of him in glowing terms a few years ago and acknowledge that the likes Seamie, Bubbles, Lar and Noel have flourished under his tutelage.

I can remember him being friendly enough to actually greet me without me ever meeting the man in my life beforehand in the Centra beside Drumcondra train station back in 2012 before that ill-fated game against Kilkenny and going off absolutely delighted. (My delight was to abruptly end that day)

While i accept that Eamon gave serious effort and commitment along with the team this year ill refuse to believe that we couldnt have done more.I can accept Kilkenny are better but I honestly think with a bit more self awareness and cuteness we could have got that extra edge in our perfromances against them.

In my own opinion, we didnt analyse ourselves enough. I didnt agree with some of the selection choices and i categorically stand by that, and the fact Shane Bourke worked his way back onto the panel with ease this summer would make me question the actual intensity levels of our training. With the greatest of respect to Shane who is a talented sticksman, i somehow find it hard to believe he turned into some sort of hurling John Rambo overnight and just forced his way back into our thinking. Fact is Eamon was more inclined toward a certain type of player and thats all well and good but you may as well be trying to win the grand national on a shetland when it goes into overkill.

Eamons championship record stands at W6 L5 and D1. His reputation is big amongst the players but relative to his reputation I cant help feeling slightly shortchanged looking back at that record. I felt that we left a few games behind us.

Ive the utmost respect for the man and while it isnt all of his fault, as manager he must take his fair share of responsibility. Yes perhaps my argument would be blown out of the water had the wind caught Bubbles sliothar and blew it la few inches the other way but it didnt. 3 weeks later we had a chance to up our game an extra few percent but couldnt live with the physicality. I felt the line could have reacted faster that day. Kilkenny went a goal up and in that type of game it was as good as a ten point lead.

And i dont buy into the fact that there is this huge gulf in class with Kilkenny. For god sake we were only losing to them by a score? Surely we could have tweaked things around? But we seemed to be sucked into the same funnel time and again.

So while i wish the man the very best in the future and thank him for his efforts I do think its time we embraced the future. I hope Michael Ryan is thinking and analysing and pondering how to put his own stamp on matters. Otherwise we're headed for further groundhog day and further pain and in danger of becoming the Mayo of hurling.

And yes the players need to make a tough decision too. Do they want to realise the fruits of their sacrifices? or do they want to prove Ger Loughnanes theory right?

I don't believe there is any gulf in class, but we just have not been able to deal with hugely physical teams with a very defensive set up. I tend to view the first game of the All-Ireland last year as the exception. I don't know why Kilkenny set up like they did that day, maybe it was arrogance, maybe they didn't anticipate the threat that the Tipp forwards would bring given space, but Kilkenny learned their lesson that day and Cody will never again set up like that against Tipp.
I view the replay as the true barometer of where the two sides are and for me KK were comfortably better than us that day. The game was played completely on their terms and at no stage in that second half did we look like winning it in spite of a huge effort to keep ourselves in the game.

A lot of people have commented after Sunday that they are not too down after the defeat. I guess we are so sick of losing to KK that its a relief not to be beaten by them again and I think supporters are very aware of the fact that had we stolen a victory on Sunday, another All-Ireland defeat to KK was very much on the cards.

evolving tipperary

"not been able to deal with hugely physical teams with a very defensive set up. "

" another All-Ireland defeat to KK was very much on the cards."

Yet, you say there is no gulf in class?!?!?! Beaten time and time again? There was a gulf between Tipp and teh rest - and a gulf between then between Tipp and KK. That might change now...for Tipp...


"But the fact we have now been on the wrong end of the result 5 times..."

There's no logic to this rejection of the players as the failure and solely pointing at O'Shea and Ryan, without any evidence regarding Ryan. Tipp won't win anything for three years at least - until they produce players who can win ball aerially, keep calm, deliver accurate ball, score from distance, mark tightly, and find more than two ways of scoring in the forwards, from 5 to 12. That's the task that lies ahead of Tipp hurling at all levels- not just Michael Ryan.

robbiezero

evolving tipperary wrote: »

"not been able to deal with hugely physical teams with a very defensive set up. "

" another All-Ireland defeat to KK was very much on the cards."

Yet, you say there is no gulf in class?!?!?! Beaten time and time again? There was a gulf between Tipp and teh rest - and a gulf between then between Tipp and KK. That might change now...for Tipp...


"But the fact we have now been on the wrong end of the result 5 times..."

There's no logic to this rejection of the players as the failure and solely pointing at O'Shea and Ryan, without any evidence regarding Ryan. Tipp won't win anything for three years at least - until they produce players who can win ball aerially, keep calm, deliver accurate ball, score from distance, mark tightly, and find more than two ways of scoring in the forwards, from 5 to 12. That's the task that lies ahead of Tipp hurling at all levels- not just Michael Ryan.

What I mean is that hurling wise there is not much between them and when the two teams go 15 on 15 it is very close as per league final and drawn All-Ireland. When KK go into dogfight mode, dropping back midfield and half-forward line there is certainly a gulf between the two teams, just I am not sure I would call it a gulf in class, but that doesn't matter.

evolving tipperary

" when the two teams go 15 on 15 it is very close as per league final and drawn All-Ireland. When KK go into dogfight mode, dropping back midfield and half-forward line there is certainly a gulf between the two teams"

Playing with different styles - managing the game!

Sure, that's what winning and class is all about! Getting over the line and, often doing it by a fine margin!

Plus, I made a point earlier about Tipp's hunger and KK just doing year in and year out - that takes just something else entirely.

thinkstoomuch1

danganabu wrote: »

Niall unfortunately wasn't 100% last year after missing so much of the year with injury, himself and Jason have definitely done enough to nail down a place.

Only change I can possibly see is COB coming into corner back with Breen loosing out, don't think I'd make that change myself but that's what I''m hearing from the camp.

Personally I would start Breen on the wing and have Ronan in the corner, a half back line of Bergin, Paudie and Breen wouldnt be long putting to bed this myth that the Galway half forward line are some sort of aerial masters!

News on Mikey Cahill is not so good I'm afraid had another set back about two weeks ago and it just seems one set back after another, he has been out so long now I'm beggining to worry that he may never get back to teh player we knew, please god I am wrong.

I have also heard from a number of panel members that Lar is absolutely buzzing in training and will feature on Sunday, a fully fit Lar is still vital to Tipp.

You were right regards lar he did feature
He didn't look great though and looked not great great player he once was
Having said that imo bringing him on fourteen minutes go should be on sooner


What do you make of sunday
Would you agree that problems could arise next year with management

You had said you were going to back Callan man of the matchin another post and that was a great call you were absoultey correct
He didn't deserves to be on the loosing team

Minors are a fine side and I think could edge Galway in all ireland final

My own opinion is Galway had more edge senior game
I had felt tippeary would edge it all week but that morning I got an instinct hard to explain but just a feeling Galway would win and just edge it and I posted as such in the hurling thread Galway tippeary match thread just before the game
I just felt tippeary like brennan said all focus was on meeting kk and tippeary were slightly vulnerable for this game
Tippeary certainly are better than sunday proved when as a team didn't perform
The focus imo was on all ireland final Like brennan said kk v Galway ten years ago had on Cork final but lost to kk in a classic semi final

evolving tipperary

Hurling a better place with Eamon O’Shea

54

12


Tuesday, August 18, 2015By Enda McEvoy
No match being an island, the only place any review of last Sunday from the losers’ perspective can begin is with another All Ireland semi-final. The 2012 All Ireland semi-final. Tipperary 1-15 Kilkenny 4-24.


There has been no more embarrassing day for the blue and gold in living memory, perhaps not even in undead memory. This is the backdrop. This is the nadir from which Eamon O’Shea, now the former Tipp manager, started out.

They didn’t bring home the MacCarthy Cup under O’Shea? No, but they did come within six inches of doing so, and this in a county that long ago mislaid the habit of winning more than one All-Ireland per decade. They only managed one piece of silverware in nine trophy attempts? Yes, but they did reach two league finals and were unfortunate to lose one of them in extra-time.

The point is, none of this was ordained. After the horror of August 2012, Tipperary might have collapsed under the weight of their internal contradictions, bones broken for the next five years. Instead O’Shea stiffened their spine, righted the ship and steered it to calm waters. If it seems easy and obvious now there was nothing inevitable about it at the time.
READ NEXT How fired-up Galway proved an irresistible force

There was, though, one inevitability on Sunday. Tipperary losing to opponents who fastened both hands on their windpipe and slowly throttled them into submission. That they came so close in a game that on the contours of the afternoon, they were scarcely entitled to win was the only surprise.

It was a facsimile of the replay against Kilkenny 11 months ago. Tipp out-hungered, outworked and – consequently and ultimately - outscored.

The argument has already been advanced that once again the Munster champions were spavined by the five-week gap. This is in danger of becoming, or being allowed become, too handy an excuse. A more accurate way of putting it is to say that their provincial campaign failed to prepare Tipp for the unique rigour of the challenge Galway would end up presenting.

Limerick calved in the semi-final. Waterford posed them a novel intellectual puzzle – grist to the O’Shea mill, of course – in the final without actually laying a glove on them. Upon which they ran into opponents with momentum, opponents with five championship outings behind them, opponents sucking the same diesel Waterford were sucking when derailing Tipperary in the 2008 All Ireland semi-final.

One often hears of a horse “running in snatches” during a race. Galway ran in snatches in the Leinster final but here they reached a high cruising speed after 10 minutes and maintained it for the next hour. The tempo proved too much for Tipp. Even in injury-time, the winners managed three shots at goal to their opponents’ none.

One area where O’Shea failed was in eradicating the either-or from Tipp’s output. Prevent them reaching the 20-point barrier and you’ll almost certainly beat them. Bizarrely for a team that rattled off 1-28 versus Kilkenny first time around last September, they’ve consistently failed to come within an ass’s roar of this baseline requirement for winning a championship fixture. Look at their losing totals on O’Shea’s watch: 1-15 and 1-14 against Limerick and Kilkenny respectively in 2013; 2-16 and 2-14 against the same two counties last year; and 3-16 on Sunday.

A signal moment? Perhaps what transpired 10 minutes into the second- half when pressure from a posse of rabid canines in maroon shirts forced Tipp into coughing up a line-ball under the Cusack Stand. The moment the line-ball was awarded it seemed like a moment freighted with significance. Then David Burke pointed to put Galway in the lead and ensure it was more than just an existential incident.

This is not 1995. A slew of definitelys and maybes attended Tipperary’s performance nonetheless. Definitely Padraic Maher was badly caught two minutes from the end after doing the hard bit. The Thurles man was trying to play with the kind of time and space Waterford afforded him; Galway weren’t as generous. But all his faux pas did was help draw Galway level. Five minutes remained, including injury-time, and Tipp would lead again.

Maybe Darren Gleeson could have been more accurate with a couple of his puck-outs. As Stephen O’Keeffe has discovered this summer, however, occasional imprecision is the cost of tailoring one’s clearances. Both Tipp and Waterford need to find a tall half-forward with a good paw.



Not to get all Mourinho/Eva Carneiro here but definitely Seamus Callanan, just up from a heavy fall, shouldn’t have been given the responsibility of the penalty. Maybe we were wrong about Tipp’s increased panel strength. The introduction of Shane Bourke at the interval looked odd at the time and odder still when he was substituted. Definitely Patrick Maher, normally so studious about placing his shots wide of the goalkeeper, could have done better with his chance in the second- half. Forget the 2012 semi-final for a moment; maybe the 2011 All Ireland final was the day reality truly intruded for this bunch. Suddenly skies had clouds, there wouldn’t be a four-in- a-row after all and life was less straightforward than it appeared. Things have never been quite the same since.

Yet, above and beyond all, maybe Tipp’s only real sin on Sunday was to encounter the Tribesmen on one of their regular-occasional fiesta afternoons, a la the 1993 All-Ireland semi-final. (Further queries to Kilkenny re the semi-finals of 2001 and 2005, not to mention the 2012 Leinster final.) It happens and there’s nothing one can do about it. There’s a technical term for this syndrome: It’s Galway.

If O’Shea may have been too esoteric for some tastes, the fault was ours rather than his. It is to be regretted that a man who once admonished journalists for drawing conclusions from limited evidence — a certain inhabitant of 221B Baker Street would have been proud — did not win an All-Ireland as manager.



“Structured randomness” is another phrase of his that will endure, the kicker being that the structure precedes and accommodates the randomness — and on Sunday, not for the first time, Tipperary’s rhythm section wasn’t solid enough to allow for individual improvisation by anyone bar Callanan. It is never a coincidence that Tipp suffer when Patrick Maher can’t get the sliotar up quickly and transform into a human arrow flying straight at the enemy’s heart.

O’Shea’s epitaph will not be written on water. He returned to a bunch of young men acutely in need of a guiding light and not only tried to make them better hurlers but to make them better, more rounded individuals. And he helped give us the All-Ireland epics of 2009-10, two thunderous league deciders and on September 7, 2014 an afternoon where hurling again pushed and prodded at the boundaries of its possibilities and barrelled through.

Hurling has been a better and infinitely more interesting place for Eamon O’Shea.

ReacherCreature

Just thinking about the impact of O' Shea on our current team. Gleeson has started the last couple of years and looks to be #1 for the next few years. That's a fair achievement after the departed Brendan Cummins. Cathal Barrett has been a star since day 1. James Barry is our new fullback, hopefully our new Paul Curran. Kieran Bergin has been a solid find and is a great worker, personally a big fan. Ronan Maher's sample size is small but he could fly. Paudie Maher is a better player overall I think.

Woodlock/McGrath partnership when it works is great. McGrath even rediscovered form after a desperate year. Woodlock is one of the toughest players around.

Bonner Maher has gotten better which is hard to believe. O' Dwyer has been sensational, such a great hurler, 'wristy' out. Seamus Callanan has been superb and is one of the two best hurlers in the country. Noel McGrath on the overall, has been good though he has no real defined position.

Some negatives. Michael Cahill has vanished but that's largely due to injury and better players above him. I would've liked more of Paddy Stapleton but we have an abundance of cornerbacks. Paudie still makes lots of mistakes. Shane McGrath still has up and down games. Bonner is sometimes played on the wing when his better position is center forward. I still want to see more of Niall O' Meara, I'm still not convinced but like R. Maher, he could fly. Brendan Maher is more of a defender/midfielder than a forward I feel, at sweeper/defender last year he dictated whole games, now, not so much. Noel McGrath still doesn't really have a position, that's worth repeating. Lar hasn't done a huge amount lately bar popping up with peaches occassionally. Our bench doesn't set the world alight.

Anyway, a Munster title (in the most competitive province) an All-Ireland replay (and a gust of wind away from winning one) and a semi-final appearance isn't the worst haul in three years (especially as we were dumped out of the qualifiers in one of the years. Also, O' Shea picking back up Tipperary after the absolute debacle of 2012 is a phenomenal achievement: no one talks about that anymore. They only talk about how good Tipperary hurling is.

Overall, I'm deeming O' Shea's tenure a success. There's some questions over his decisions and choices but in the sense of player development and what we've done over the past few years I think it's fair. Sorry for the ramble.

ReacherCreature

ReacherCreature wrote: »

Just thinking about the impact of O' Shea on our current team. Gleeson has started the last couple of years and looks to be #1 for the next few years. That's a fair achievement after the departed Brendan Cummins. Cathal Barrett has been a star since day 1. James Barry is our new fullback, hopefully our new Paul Curran. Kieran Bergin has been a solid find and is a great worker, personally a big fan. Ronan Maher's sample size is small but he could fly. Paudie Maher is a better player overall I think.

Woodlock/McGrath partnership when it works is great. McGrath even rediscovered form after a desperate year. Woodlock is one of the toughest players around.

Bonner Maher has gotten better which is hard to believe. O' Dwyer has been sensational, such a great hurler, 'wristy' out. Seamus Callanan has been superb and is one of the two best hurlers in the country. Noel McGrath on the overall, has been good though he has no real defined position.

Some negatives. Michael Cahill has vanished but that's largely due to injury and better players above him. I would've liked more of Paddy Stapleton but we have an abundance of cornerbacks. Paudie still makes lots of mistakes. Shane McGrath still has up and down games. Bonner is sometimes played on the wing when his better position is center forward. I still want to see more of Niall O' Meara, I'm still not convinced but like R. Maher, he could fly. Brendan Maher is more of a defender/midfielder than a forward I feel, at sweeper/defender last year he dictated whole games, now, not so much. Noel McGrath still doesn't really have a position, that's worth repeating. Lar hasn't done a huge amount lately bar popping up with peaches occassionally. Our bench doesn't set the world alight.

Anyway, a Munster title (in the most competitive province) an All-Ireland replay (and a gust of wind away from winning one) and a semi-final appearance isn't the worst haul in three years (especially as we were dumped out of the qualifiers in one of the years. Also, O' Shea picking back up Tipperary after the absolute debacle of 2012 is a phenomenal achievement: no one talks about that anymore. They only talk about how good Tipperary hurling is.

Overall, I'm deeming O' Shea's tenure a success. There's some questions over his decisions and choices but in the sense of player development and what we've done over the past few years I think it's fair. Sorry for the ramble.

Fair arguments. Ill admit we are in a good place at the moment. But we really need to push on in 2016.

Mantis Toboggan

O'Shea will be remembered fondly no doubt, granted he got decisions wrong and wasn't the best on the line but he gave everything he had for the cause.

However in tipp there's a belief that we should be winning or competing for the all Ireland each year. It's a positive in my opinion, and built on our glorious history. Not winning the all Ireland since 2010 is hard to take, especially when at the time we looked unstoppable, with so many young players in the team, we all thought we could go on and win many more, but it hasn't materialised like that. Clare are going through the same process now. Think this is why tipp fans can be overly critical, because we all feel that there is more all Irelands in this team. I still wonder what could have happened had sheedy not walked out on us.

ReacherCreature

I'll be the first to put my hand up and say there's a serious case of 'what if' about us not winning an AI in the last 5 years and I do have the fear of slipping into a torrid time where we win nothing and the 'golden years' are wasted but when you stack up O' Shea's achievements versus troubles in other counties, we have had success. But that being said, it's frustrating coming so close to All-Ireland victories and not getting them.

evolving tipperary

The style of play was fantastic, but it's certainly not the shortest distance between two points. But, his hands were tied by the type of player he had. Losing finals and semis is the worst.

ReacherCreature

ReacherCreature wrote: »

I'll be the first to put my hand up and say there's a serious case of 'what if' about us not winning an AI in the last 5 years and I do have the fear of slipping into a torrid time where we win nothing and the 'golden years' are wasted but when you stack up O' Shea's achievements versus troubles in other counties, we have had success. But that being said, it's frustrating coming so close to All-Ireland victories and not getting them.

I suppose the question is," Why do we always end up coming so close "...Is it players,or the management? I believe Eamonn got the best out of the players,and I think the players gave their all for Eamonn.....so where do we go from here?

evolving tipperary

I think our next Championship meeting with Galway will be very bad tempered after what happened the last day

evolving tipperary

Jackie Cahill understand me.

Standards, on and off the pitch, cannot drop. History has taught us that when that happens, Tipp struggle.
O’Shea tried desperately hard to ensure that it wouldn’t happen under his watch. He couldn’t live with his players 24/7 and monitor their living and social habits, of course, and now, it’s very much up them to decide the future course of Tipperary hurling.
They’ll make him happy if they choose the right path but first and foremost, they must do it for themselves.


http://www.the42.ie/eamon-oshea-tipperary-7-2279201-Aug2015/

Rasputin11

Drom bet Brackens in the Mid Football Semi tonight, O Riordan didn't play as he was off on AFL trials I heard.

evolving tipperary

Good, I hope he gets picked up for his own good and makes a tonne of money

Tipp4Liam

It's heartbreaking to watch the lads come so close In so many big matches since 2010 can't seem to get over the winning line I think the players are there maybe just not being used in the right positions for next year a line up of gleeson Barrett breen cahill r maher Barry bergin b maher n mcgrath p maher bonner bubbles n o meara seamie j mcgrath wouldn't be too far away would like to see paudie giving a chance maybe to help our ball winning ability in the forward line

evolving tipperary

Munster champions victims of their success in current hurling system
Michael McCarthy
PUBLISHED
19/08/2015 | 02:301 COMMENTSSHARE
Seamus Callanan of Tipperary had a blinding performance against Galway in the All-Ireland SHC semi-final1
Seamus Callanan of Tipperary had a blinding performance against Galway in the All-Ireland SHC semi-final
At Croke Park on Sunday, I witnessed the most exciting game I've ever watched as a neutral. Galway were magnificent and an absolute joy to watch at times. Even so, though they lost a classic to a last-second winner, it has to said that Tipperary were under par.
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Galway won the battles all over the field, and in midfield especially. If not for a performance for the ages by Seamus Callanan (right), Tipp would have been put to the sword a lot earlier.
Were Eamon O'Shea's team at the right pitch in just their third championship game of the season, and after a five-week wait since the Munster final?
It's the fourth year in a row the Munster champions have lost their next game, and, amazingly, only Tipp in 2009 and 2011 have done it in the last nine years.
It's easy to point at Kilkenny as being in the same boat in Leinster, but, as always, they're the exception that proves the rule. Of the last four Leinster champions that weren't Kilkenny, only Galway in 2012 won their semi-final.
But even Kilkenny appear unhappy with the current system. Hurler of the Year Richie Hogan spoke to us on Off The Ball last week and told us he "hates" it.
"I'd rather have a match every two weeks. If I had the choice, I'd love to play six or seven games at least in championship."
Kilkenny have overcome the problems, but surely we can accept there's a disadvantage there for the team who wins the provincial title, and that's a real problem. Galway came into last Sunday's semi-final having played five games, Tipperary two. There's something seriously wrong with that. We can't keep ignoring a clear pattern.

QuinDixie

oshea was a failure and to say tipp are in a good place is bizarre.
He actually achieved less than declan ryan, so tipp have regressed under him.

OShea gave kk the all ireland last year on a plate by not adapting for the replay.
After we lost last year OShea should have sat down and asked himself - how do i improve this squad/team.
Answers - shane mcgrath/woodlock axis is not good enough to win the all ireland.
brendan maher/padraig maher are wing backs.
breen/ronan maher new midfield.
get denis maher/bonner maher/ oriordan/ anyone who can add biff to the forwards.
A simple game plan of adding beef to the squad, maybe not great hurlers but players who can add some steel.

Hope Michael Ryan started his scouting last September as the squad left to him, being brutally honest, are proven losers.

A simple game plan of adding beef to the squad, maybe not great hurlers but players who can add some steel

I have heard this argument about Tipp having great skill,but soft hurlers..I would be inclined to agree

primary 2

how is it that tipp have never played with the same hunger or aggresion that they played with in the 2010 all ireland final?i dont think i have ever seen them come close to that since, the intensity they had that day was just unbelievable, surly there cant be any execuses when it comes to motivating your self on a big day? or was liam sheedy just a serious motivator like non other?