The Tipperary GAA (Club and intercounty) Discussion thread 2015

digzy

digzy wrote: »

Are you seriously suggesting that a few posts here -a barney about nothing at all given someone's inability to read and take offence where none was given and definitely not intended-are in some way inappropriate or disrespectful given that they coincide with eddie's death. I'd dare say cancer has touched most of our families. My own at very close quarters.

Jaysus.....

Im simply saying to those who are bickering to cop the fúck on and stop bitching over nothing. By all means disagree with anyone you dont agree with but stop the sniping. Ridiculous carry on.

We're all Tipperary people at the end of the day and a bit long in the tooth for that craic

evolving tipperary

They seemed to have the tipp game plan figured. Knew what were doing - just made sure that clean catching was nigh on impossible in the full forward line and had men back to swoop on the break

We seemed to have too many players of the same body type - big and athletic - whereas Kerry had more of a compliment of pacy players alongside bigger aerial winners

digzy

Deleted User wrote: »

Im simply saying to those who are bickering to cop the fúck on and stop bitching over nothing. By all means disagree with anyone you dont agree with but stop the sniping. Ridiculous carry on.

We're all Tipperary people at the end of the day and a bit long in the tooth for that craic

Sure you could've said that the first time.I'd actually agree with you 100% too.
Having said all that someone wants to call me out over nothing.....

GoldFour4

We were horrific. That's a terrific Kerry team but we could have played them a lot closer than that. We constantly tried to run through the Kerry defence without a pass only to be disposed of the ball.

Kerry were clearly playing a sweeper from minute number 1. We kept pumping ball into them regardless of the consequences. We won barely any of our kickouts. That Kerry midfielder is going to go on to be an all star I'm sure of it. He caught ball after ball from kick outs and we just kept giving it to him.

Very hard to know what this run means for Tipp football in the future due to the number of duel players. Would be nice if a few of them committed to one code or the other. There's a serious case of burnout for those minor lads and preparing for two all irelands within weeks of each other is not good for a young athlete regardless of how great the achievement is.

evolving tipperary

O'Connor's some manager in fairness...

If Tipp football could get him on some committee to oversee some underage structures (and in tactical and fitness for minor teams in terms of clubs not just intercounty) it would be fantastic

evolving tipperary

I hate to see it but you could see someone like Quirke going to Aussie Rules...


Hopefuly not Tommy Nolan...

evolving tipperary

This is class:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gxDj26T-8B4&feature=youtu.be

QuinDixie

Deleted User wrote: »

We're a county of 160k people, while i havent broken the demographics up, surely we can put a a good football and hurling setup together? As you might have alluded to, we are at the mercy of the county boards in this country. They seem to ultimately decide who excels at what

Oh we could, but there will always be only one paymaster.
I am not saying Tipp football people should just accept their lot, but what I am saying is that dual players are pointless. They do not help the footballers or the hurlers. If we had no dual players this year, we may not have both finals, but going forward both codes would have known to a certain degree what their talent pool is like and would have been better off for it.

and I dont buy this most dual minors will pick hurling, senior football clubs would certainly veer their lot to county football.
Player burnout is a serious issue, this is an amateur game and these lads have to educate themselves.

Colin ORiordan is a one example, he played senior football this year and yet played U21 hurling as well. Why?
the hurling setup should have left him alone as he surely could have not trained properly for the U21 hurling and he had a very important senior football game soon after the U21 game.
Insanity to expect him to then play that senior football game and play to his peak.
who is winning with dual players, our opponents.

evolving tipperary

I suppose they were trying to swing him for the hurlers....sp were prepared to keep him in at the hope he might change his mind regarding football...

But, I agree - focus on one sport is required at the level - if you have serious senior inter county ambitions

Spirit of 67

digzy wrote: »

It's a reasonable projection..
Maybe if you read the post instead of looking for a barney you'd see my point was that the game was well and truly over so I felt mgmt ought to empty the bench and give the lads who put in the work all year an opportunity to play in an all Ireland final in the national stadium. A chance the vast majority won't get again. Tbf he actually gave many of them a good run.

Most of the hurling minor team won't play in croker again either. Same applies for the Galway and Kilkenny minor hurlers.However, given that tipp is a hurling stronghold -despite the illusions some posters seem to be under - they've a better chance by nature of playing for strong clubs to appear in a club final and by nature that if they can make the senior team, they'd feature in croke park at least once a year in general.

Some of ye seem to think our footballers are knocking on the door. Even if half the minor team made it on to senior, can you really see us making an appearance in an all Ireland quarter final in croke park within the next 5-10 years? Tbf we were absolutely destroyed by Tyrone this year, Kerry were miles better.maybe you missed those games. Now I'm not "disrespecting" them by saying what actually happened nor am I having a go at them for not being good enough. But it's hard to defend that 2nd half showing against Tyrone.
We were poor against Galway last year but for a few lucky goals towards the endwhich gave the score line some modicum of respectability.

So you needn't be getting offended on behalf of the football team for some slight I didn't say. If you wanna cod yourself into thinking tipp are contenders for the last 8 in the all Ireland fair enough....

Losing Peter Creedon knocks a lot of the momentum we are building , depends on the next Manager to drive us on , hopefully someone with a decent track record . We are a Division 3 Team but improving and the quality of the Players we have is impressive . A dead Pitch in Brewster Park cost us promotion this year , had we played Fermanagh in Thurles we would have beat them ! Can only see 3-4 of the minor Team making it at Senior but we are at a stage where every year we can add 1-2 Players to the Senior Squad who have seen really good days with Underage Tipp Teams . We are able to add that bit of quality consistently now compared to before . Very few Counties are producing the Underage Players we are !

We are not contenders for the last 8 now but I believe if we continue where we left off under Creedon we have a chance . Promotion and remaining in Division 2 is a priority before we start thinking about Munster or AIs . I am very confident !

Spirit of 67

Speaking of Creedon , anyone know if he`s coaching any Club side since he left the Tipp scene ?

digzy

Spirit of 67 wrote: »

Losing Peter Creedon knocks a lot of the momentum we are building , depends on the next Manager to drive us on , hopefully someone with a decent track record . We are a Division 3 Team but improving and the quality of the Players we have is impressive . A dead Pitch in Brewster Park cost us promotion this year , had we played Fermanagh in Thurles we would have beat them ! Can only see 3-4 of the minor Team making it at Senior but we are at a stage where every year we can add 1-2 Players to the Senior Squad who have seen really good days with Underage Tipp Teams . We are able to add that bit of quality consistently now compared to before . Very few Counties are producing the Underage Players we are !

We are not contenders for the last 8 now but I believe if we continue where we left off under Creedon we have a chance . Promotion and remaining in Division 2 is a priority before we start thinking about Munster or AIs . I am very confident !

I sincerely hope you're correct. I'm not a big football person but I'd like to see us improve each year.
However, for as long as I can remember each year we're 'progressing' according to the media's narrative. I don't go to the football games but watch them on TV. Unfortunately at this point we're playing the better teams and to my untrained eye we've been outclassed. It's great to see us beating Wexford and Laois etc... Something we couldn't do a decade ago. My point is that for all the talk of the footballers we've almost hit a glass ceiling. By that I mean getting past a cork,Kerry,Galway,Mayo,Monaghan,Armagh,Derry,Tyrone,Donegal,Dublin,Meath,Kildare etc.It's very hard to see us getting through it. Not because I'm 'disrespecting' anyone involved, just don't think we've the football talent.

digzy

digzy wrote: »

I sincerely hope you're correct. I'm not a big football person but I'd like to see us improve each year.
However, for as long as I can remember each year we're 'progressing' according to the media's narrative. I don't go to the football games but watch them on TV. Unfortunately at this point we're playing the better teams and to my untrained eye we've been outclassed. It's great to see us beating Wexford and Laois etc... Something we couldn't do a decade ago. My point is that for all the talk of the footballers we've almost hit a glass ceiling. By that I mean getting past a cork,Kerry,Galway,Mayo,Monaghan,Armagh,Derry,Tyrone,Donegal,Dublin,Meath,Kildare etc.It's very hard to see us getting through it. Not because I'm 'disrespecting' anyone involved, just don't think we've the football talent.

You see i believe we have the talent but perhaps dont have the team behind the team. Our coaches are excellent to have brought us to where we are but as you correctly alluded to there is a glass ceiling which we have hit. I believe there is another level in Tipperary football though.

Spirit of 67

Deleted User wrote: »

You see i believe we have the talent but perhaps dont have the team behind the team. Our coaches are excellent to have brought us to where we are but as you correctly alluded to there is a glass ceiling which we have hit. I believe there is another level in Tipperary football though.

There is and at this stage I reckon we are at the same level as Armagh , Meath and Kildare who we will play in the League this year . The youngsters coming through now with Tipp who are getting to Munster and AIs regularly will be the difference !

Mantis Toboggan

Getting into the leinster championship would be ideal for the senior footballers.

evolving tipperary

Tipperary football, in terms of its emergence, is still in its early days and I think it's going very well. If you contrast results and consistency with results before it is improving all the time. Getting to a stage and sharing the same field with Tyrone is all part of the process. Tyrone brought their A game out of respect, and the Tipp footballers got a taste of it. They can learn and react to that now. The only way to obtain the standard of the top teams is to play them regularly in the championship. That will take time - However, there is another argument when you look at Dublin and their money and population pick...and counties solely focused on one sport...how can that playing field be levelled...

What will kill the momentum of Tipp football (and hurling) though is losing players to Aussie Rules, Soccer, and Rugby - that's the fight on their hands. Darragh Egan rejected the opportunity to go to Aussie Rules to play hurling with Tipp - I wonder would that happen now. If hurling and football start uncovering special athletes and talent but lose it to professionalism...the climb will be even tougher....

If Tipp are going to compete at hurling and football the underage structure and the handling of the dual player must have a structure and rule base where everyone knows where they stand - the only concern should be the development of players to reach their full potential.

It too early to be questioning Tipperary's football progress in a fundamental way - as it's still progressing - and has very well for the past number of years in my book. It can't and won't happen overnight. I think it's motoring along nicely

Spirit of 67

Dennis Reynolds wrote: »

Getting into the leinster championship would be ideal for the senior footballers.

Wtf :rolleyes: !

danganabu

Spirit of 67 wrote: »

I reckon we are at the same level as Armagh , Meath and Kildare who we will play in the League this year!

We're really not at that level at all, we may very well get there but at present we well of that level.

Spirit of 67

Beaten by Armagh in the League after a point 3 and a half minutes into injury time when only 2 minutes should have been played , we gave as good as we got in Crossmaglen . Have Kildare in the League next year so we will see , have played them a good few times over the last 3-4 years in friendlies and have beaten them on at least 2 occasions , fair enough not competitive fixtures but lads are giving it everything !

danganabu

Spirit of 67 wrote: »

Beaten by Armagh in the League after a point 3 and a half minutes into injury time when only 2 minutes should have been played , we gave as good as we got in Crossmaglen . Have Kildare in the League next year so we will see , have played them a good few times over the last 3-4 years in friendlies and have beaten them on at least 2 occasions , fair enough not competitive fixtures but lads are giving it everything !

League games and friendly's, jaysus if the hurlers were to use such criteria they would be ridiculed and laughed out of the place, I though the football boys wanted to be treated equally? Or is it only when it suits.

Just checked the bookies odds for Sam next year to make sure I wasn't being overly harsh - Armagh 50/1, Meath 50/1. Kildare 66/1 and Tipperary 250/1 - pretty good barometer there I would have thought.

Now I have no doubt that 3-5 years ago we were probaly in the region of 1000/1 but the improvement has been over stated, understandably because of our incredible underage succes and also because of the lack of a credible challenger to Kerry and Cork in Munster, but I think a small bit of realism needs to be applied. For example the Chairman of the Football County Board claiming that Tipp would win a Senior Football AI by 2020, has to be one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.

evolving tipperary

You're points are all very good.

Odds can be a funny measuring stick...

But, if you look at the minor results compared to what it used to be.... we know minor or under 21 success do not guarantee a thing at senior ...but it does show a change in attitude and that structures are now different in a positive way - and players have the raw materials to be sculpted. They're sharing the pitch now on All-Ireland day.... So, surely, those kind of structural changes mean something significant rather than odds...Declan Browne talks about crying the day he saw the minors win the All-Ireland

I don't know if it is stupid - sometimes, you're better off to state such ambitions even if you don't really believe it or if it's achievable. You have to believe you're part of something going places...as a foundation...

You're right about the realism - it's a longer project than 2020. But, I understand how the footballers need to use positivity to believe...

On my own personal and selfish level, I'd be just hoping that the hurling management can persuade some of these outstanding athletes to focus on hurling from now on - and mold them into great players... - just as the football people will be hoping

Spirit of 67

danganabu wrote: »

League games and friendly's, jaysus if the hurlers were to use such criteria they would be ridiculed and laughed out of the place, I though the football boys wanted to be treated equally? Or is it only when it suits.

Just checked the bookies odds for Sam next year to make sure I wasn't being overly harsh - Armagh 50/1, Meath 50/1. Kildare 66/1 and Tipperary 250/1 - pretty good barometer there I would have thought.

Now I have no doubt that 3-5 years ago we were probaly in the region of 1000/1 but the improvement has been over stated, understandably because of our incredible underage succes and also because of the lack of a credible challenger to Kerry and Cork in Munster, but I think a small bit of realism needs to be applied. For example the Chairman of the Football County Board claiming that Tipp would win a Senior Football AI by 2020, has to be one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.

With all due respect to Barry O`Brien the incoming County Board Chairman at the time , I would say his comments were unrealistic rather than "stupid" . If someone told me 5 years ago Tipp would be in 2 AI Football Finals in 2015 I would have found it hard to believe but here we are !

The League game v Armagh was very competitive , both had full teams out ! I acknowledged the games against Kildare were friendlies , just pointed out how we done , which is encouraging . What`s also encouraging is the likes of Kildare want to play us in friendlies unlike before when we had to do with Carlow and Longford .

Was going to make the point ET made about the odds being a funny measuring stick . Wonder what price you would have got on the Under 21s to win the AI this time last year , couldn`t have been in the top 8 !

Spirit of 67

Mid Champs Loughmore/C beat South Champs Kilsheelan/K 1-12 to 1-8 in the County Prelim Quarter tonight . Evan Comerford kicked a heap of long distance frees for K/K !

danganabu

Spirit of 67 wrote: »

With all due respect to Barry O`Brien the incoming County Board Chairman at the time , I would say his comments were unrealistic rather than "stupid" . If someone told me 5 years ago Tipp would be in 2 AI Football Finals in 2015 I would have found it hard to believe but here we are !

The League game v Armagh was very competitive , both had full teams out ! I acknowledged the games against Kildare were friendlies , just pointed out how we done , which is encouraging . What`s also encouraging is the likes of Kildare want to play us in friendlies unlike before when we had to do with Carlow and Longford .

Was going to make the point ET made about the odds being a funny measuring stick . Wonder what price you would have got on the Under 21s to win the AI this time last year , couldn`t have been in the top 8 !

Joe Hannigan has made the same claim numerous times, and as recently as three months ago

If you think a league match in February is a barometer for where a team ranks then fair enough, I use something a bit more tangible like championship results, ours have been poor when we have played anything resembling a top team.

Tipperary were fifth favs at the start of the year after all they were 2011 AI Champions, 2012 Minor Munster Champions and 2013 Munster runners up , they were favourites for Munster so I cant understand how you could figure they would be outside the top 8 favs.

Dennis Reynolds

Dennis Reynolds wrote: »

Getting into the leinster championship would be ideal for the senior footballers.

I cant really see the overall benefits it has over our current situation to be honest.

For me we just cant expect to automatically rise to the top tier the way things are. Kerry showed exactly what we are up against going forward last Sunday. In order to crash the Dublin and Kerry party we are going to have to match them for coaching and preparation. Dublin have an enviable structure on board at the moment and i would be hoping we can entice on of the coaches from either there or Kerry and i dont mean another John Evans but a modern shrewd coach.

The main target should be Division 1 football over the next three years. The experience of playing against the very best during the winter would stand to us in the future. Without top level football we are fighting blind.

evolving tipperary

Kind of surreal that Tipperary have nominations! It was a short campaign!

http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2015/0923/729839-hurling-team-of-the-year/

danganabu

evolving tipperary wrote: »

Kind of surreal that Tipperary have nominations! It was a short campaign!

http://www.rte.ie/sport/gaa/2015/0923/729839-hurling-team-of-the-year/

Breen the only one deserving of a nomination and still has no chance ahead of English, Ronan Maher nominated ahead of Geraoid Hegarty is laughable

Spirit of 67

danganabu wrote: »

Joe Hannigan has made the same claim numerous times, and as recently as three months ago

If you think a league match in February is a barometer for where a team ranks then fair enough, I use something a bit more tangible like championship results, ours have been poor when we have played anything resembling a top team.

Tipperary were fifth favs at the start of the year after all they were 2011 AI Champions, 2012 Minor Munster Champions and 2013 Munster runners up , they were favourites for Munster so I cant understand how you could figure they would be outside the top 8 favs.

Indeed he has and it is still unrealistic , Hannigan btw would have been Chair of The Friends of Tipp Football at the time but it was O`Brien who originally said it . Once again we are catching up to the likes of Armagh and Kildare but are a way of the Top Teams .

I would like to see a Link as to where you say Tipp were 5th Favorites for the AI ! Cork were Odds on if I remember correctly for the Munster Final . Even if we were 5th Favorites it proves the point that Bookies don`t always get it right .

Id admire the fact that the county are at least setting targets albeit unrealistic targets. i think though while 2020 seems to be totally unrealistic given the way football has gone it would seem Joe is sticking by the target to save face.

When it was originally proclaimed around 2008 the football landscape was very very different. You got the impression that the door was open for a new team to emerge from nowhere. The 2010 season was probably the last competitive season of football. A Dublin team littered with self doubt after been hammered by Meath in Leinster lost to a fairly ordinary Cork side in the All ireland semi, Down beat Kerry en route to the final and looked likely to keep their Croker run going, Kildare probably missed their greatest ever chance to land the big one, Louth were cruelly denied Leinster, we gave Kerry and Dublin a fright and also beat Laois of a roasting hot summers day in Thurles while Germany were busy stuffing England down in south africa at the same time, Longford beat Mayo (albeit a pre James Horan Mayo)

Spirit of 67

2010 Cork beat Down by a point to win the All Ireland , the same Down team we beat the year before to win the NFL Division 3 !