Property Market 2015

gmisk

Amidoman wrote: »

Hi.
I'm looking to buy now too with two approvals and a deposit on two houses right now.

I can understand having two mortgage approvals in place with different bank, I have approval with AIB and EBS (Bizarrely for different amounts even though they are essentially the same company).

But deposits on two houses at the same time seems kind of insane to me.....what is the logic behind this?

Amidoman

Simple one - I liked both houses but wasn't sure which one to go for. One will be completed in August. One in a month. The first one seems a bit dodgy because of the agents playing something funny so I decided to pay another deposit to secure a house that will be ready on time (it actually is ready now). I cannot afford loosing the money because the house is not comoleted on time or anything like that. It looks like I will take one deposit back today or tomorrow.
As for approvals - the same here - EBS and AIB and will probably go for the AIB as we have our accounts there.

As for the prices I don't know where they have been falling but I saw over 20 houses and I enquired about over 100. Every time the house was sale agreed or there was an offer on it the price was higher than asking one so it was maybe my bad luck. And to make it clear most of the houses we enquired about were outside Dublin usually in County Meath or Kildare.
There was a situation when a house in Newbridge piced at 195k (a lovely one with a buge garden and extesion at the back) was sale agreed at over 280k. It is not unusual. I think the only unrealistic prices are those for old E - G energy rating houses and those will fall with many houses being renovated, insulated, improved in any way.

Bob24

Amidoman wrote: »

As for the prices I don't know where they have been falling but I saw over 20 houses and I enquired about over 100. Every time the house was sale agreed or there was an offer on it the price was higher than asking one so it was maybe my bad luck. And to make it clear most of the houses we enquired about were outside Dublin usually in County Meath or Kildare.

One that point: because houses are selling for higher than asking prices doesn't mean prices are increasing. Many agents would advertise asking prices which are below what the seller wants to get in order to attract more interests and start a bidding war. Basically for these you have no chance of buying them at the asking price (event if you are the only person interested and are offerign the asking price, they will give you some excuse to keep you on hold until you give up or someone offers more).

eager tortoise

gmisk wrote: »

I can understand having two mortgage approvals in place with different bank, I have approval with AIB and EBS (Bizarrely for different amounts even though they are essentially the same company).

But deposits on two houses at the same time seems kind of insane to me.....what is the logic behind this?

Sorry, don't mean to drag things off topic but can I ask about your approval with 2 different banks? Is it common to get approval from more than one lender before proceeding? We have approval with ESB, haven't bought anything and I can't see us finding anything before it expires but are we very naive not to have shopped around lenders? Is there a big difference in the amounts you were approved?

gmisk

eager tortoise wrote: »

Sorry, don't mean to drag things off topic but can I ask about your approval with 2 different banks? Is it common to get approval from more than one lender before proceeding? We have approval with ESB, haven't bought anything and I can't see us finding anything before it expires but are we very naive not to have shopped around lenders? Is there a big difference in the amounts you were approved?

I initially had approval with BOI, but they weren't giving me what I needed and were proving awkward to deal with (plus rates were poor). So I went to a few other places, AIB and EBS have the same rates (as far as I can see) but I progressed with both so have approval from both.
Rates and lending amounts I was approved for with ulster bank, permanent tsb etc ruled them out for me.

gmisk

Amidoman wrote: »

Simple one - I liked both houses but wasn't sure which one to go for. One will be completed in August. One in a month. The first one seems a bit dodgy because of the agents playing something funny so I decided to pay another deposit to secure a house that will be ready on time (it actually is ready now). I cannot afford loosing the money because the house is not comoleted on time or anything like that. It looks like I will take one deposit back today or tomorrow.

When you say completed do you mean they are still being built?
I suppose that makes sense. Good luck with whichever one you end up with

Amidoman

eager tortoise wrote: »

Sorry, don't mean to drag things off topic but can I ask about your approval with 2 different banks? Is it common to get approval from more than one lender before proceeding? We have approval with ESB, haven't bought anything and I can't see us finding anything before it expires but are we very naive not to have shopped around lenders? Is there a big difference in the amounts you were approved?

I did the same thing. I also went to KBC but even though I provided even better paperwork with higher salaries (a recent increase) we got approved for 80% loan only which was unacceptale although the loan amount was really high for our expectations.
EBS and AIB gave us nearly the same amount of loan we could apply for. We were too late for applying to other banks.

Amidoman

gmisk wrote: »

When you say completed do you mean they are still being built?
I suppose that makes sense. Good luck with whichever one you end up with

Yes, they only laid foundations now. They were not going to build any houses before the deposits were paid in. It wamy take another 5 months before the house is finished and the agents' play seems unclear to us as we are first time buyers and we still don't understand most of the procedures although we have a solicitor who cleared a lot out to us.
The second house is actually completed. Seems ready to move in as nearly all works were completed. We saw it yesterday and decided to pay deposit on spot. Nicer, bigger, huge garden and a nice area although it is a village with not much in. Little more expensive but better finisz I think. The only think that makes me Wonder about the first one is a possibility we may get an extra room there for not much more and a lot less than trying to build an extension later.

Amidoman

gmisk wrote: »

When you say completed do you mean they are still being built?
I suppose that makes sense. Good luck with whichever one you end up with

Yes, they only laid foundations now. They were not going to build any houses before the deposits were paid in. It may take another 5 months before the house is finished and the agents' play seems unclear to us as we are first time buyers and we still don't understand most of the procedures although we have a solicitor who cleared a lot out to us.
The second house is actually completed. Seems ready to move in as nearly all works were completed. We saw it yesterday and decided to pay deposit on spot. Nicer, bigger, huge garden and a nice area although it is a village with not much in. Little more expensive but better finisz I think. The only think that makes me Wonder about the first one is a possibility we may get an extra room there for not much more and a lot less than trying to build an extension later.

Amidoman

Sorry, posted twice.

eager tortoise

Ok thanks a million. We were approved with EBS before new rules. Hadn't planned to buy at this point but we applied on the off chance that something suitable might come up. At this point I don't know if we'll end up using it as there's very little in the areas we'd like and we're lucky enough to be happy where we're renting. We got 3.5 times salary and are FTBs so I don't see that we'll be at anything of a disadvantage by getting re-approved in a few months time. We'll need a slightly larger deposit, but given the price of houses within our budget it won't be massively different.

Amidoman

eager tortoise wrote: »

Ok thanks a million. We were approved with EBS before new rules. Hadn't planned to buy at this point but we applied on the off chance that something suitable might come up. At this point I don't know if we'll end up using it as there's very little in the areas we'd like and we're lucky enough to be happy where we're renting. We got 3.5 times salary and are FTBs so I don't see that we'll be at anything of a disadvantage by getting re-approved in a few months time. We'll need a slightly larger deposit, but given the price of houses within our budget it won't be massively different.

I was thinking the same but the problem is we cannot wait longer. I know the prices may actually fall in the next few years but if we want to have kids there is nothing else we can do but buy now. Rent is much more expensive for us than repayments and it will increase more soon. This is pushing us to go for one of the houses we found. Our salaries would still allow us to apply again if prices don't increase anymore, maybe we would be able to save more deposit that should help too. But thinking about paying 14400 euro rent this year only makes me sick...

annie.t

Amidoman wrote: »

As for the prices I don't know where they have been falling but I saw over 20 houses and I enquired about over 100. Every time the house was sale agreed or there was an offer on it the price was higher than asking one so it was maybe my bad luck. And to make it clear most of the houses we enquired about were outside Dublin usually in County Meath or Kildare.
There was a situation when a house in Newbridge piced at 195k (a lovely one with a buge garden and extesion at the back) was sale agreed at over 280k. It is not unusual. I think the only unrealistic prices are those for old E - G energy rating houses and those will fall with many houses being renovated, insulated, improved in any way.

We are house hunting at the moment too and I have to say my experience is similar. We are looking in County Kildare and have just decided to look further out as prices have gone beyond our budget which I admit is not big. 6-8 months ago we would have bought 3 bed house in Newbridge, Kildare Town or in the area but atm even as far as Monasterevin is gone up so much its hard to believe. Plus there is not much out there and very little comes to the market. All houses we viewed had offers above asking when we enquired about them.

mickman

Amidoman wrote: »

I was thinking the same but the problem is we cannot wait longer. I know the prices may actually fall in the next few years but if we want to have kids there is nothing else we can do but buy now. Rent is much more expensive for us than repayments and it will increase more soon. This is pushing us to go for one of the houses we found. Our salaries would still allow us to apply again if prices don't increase anymore, maybe we would be able to save more deposit that should help too. But thinking about paying 14400 euro rent this year only makes me sick...

You will pay close to that amount in mortgage interest , especially in the first years

Amidoman

annie.t wrote: »

We are house hunting at the moment too and I have to say my experience is similar. We are looking in County Kildare and have just decided to look further out as prices have gone beyond our budget which I admit is not big. 6-8 months ago we would have bought 3 bed house in Newbridge, Kildare Town or in the area but atm even as far as Monasterevin is gone up so much its hard to believe. Plus there is not much out there and very little comes to the market. All houses we viewed had offers above asking when we enquired about them.

It may be like the other poster said - agents put asking prices below seller's expectations in order to draw interest to the houses. No matter if the prices are falling or not, most of those are crazy anyway and beyond reasoning especially in those counties (Meath and Kildare).
I don't know what your budget is but it may be a good idea to look for new houses. There are lovely 3bed houses for sale in Enfield. 250k and we decided to pay the deposit on one. The reason behind looking for a new house is a price that will not change. It means you will have to finish the house, put floors on or some tiles, buy kitchen appliances etc but you will also decorate the house your way. You din't need to clean the previous owner's mess etc. I've seen a good few older houses that weren's bad and old just totally sticky as owners didn't bothe cleaning much...

Amidoman

mickman wrote: »

You will pay close to that amount in mortgage interest , especially in the first years

But I will be paying back my own place doing whatever I wish not what landlord allows me to do etc... I'm renting a good size apartment in SCD but I can pay back a good size 3 bed house with a good size garden for less or the same including life and house insurance.

mickman

Amidoman wrote: »

But I will be paying back my own place doing whatever I wish not what landlord allows me to do etc... I'm renting a good size apartment in SCD but I can pay back a good size 3 bed house with a good size garden for less or the same including life and house insurance.

fair enough

helimachoptor

lots of weird stuff happening on daft this morning.

Lots of houses in SCD appearing back with price increases like €214,068 etc

http://www.daft.ie/sales/34-new-park-road-hollypark-blackrock-dublin/1041655/?ea=1&utm_source=property_alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=property_alert_email

http://www.daft.ie/sales/50-clonkeen-road-blackrock-dublin/1009405/?ea=1&utm_source=property_alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=property_alert_email

Also my home are saying prices are up the last 3 months, i'm assuming they are referring to asking prices

NinjaTruncs

helimachoptor wrote: »

Also my home are saying prices are up the last 3 months, i'm assuming they are referring to asking prices

Asking prices are way up in SCD, especially with Sherry Fitz. A house I am looking at Sherry has listed at 15% more than the last house to have sold in the same estate. The last house to sell was in better condition and sold in the summer of last year so it's hard to see that prices have moved on that much since then. Needless to say the current house hasn't received any offers yet.

Bob24

helimachoptor wrote: »

lots of weird stuff happening on daft this morning.

Lots of houses in SCD appearing back with price increases like €214,068 etc

http://www.daft.ie/sales/34-new-park-road-hollypark-blackrock-dublin/1041655/?ea=1&utm_source=property_alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=property_alert_email

http://www.daft.ie/sales/50-clonkeen-road-blackrock-dublin/1009405/?ea=1&utm_source=property_alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=property_alert_email

Also my home are saying prices are up the last 3 months, i'm assuming they are referring to asking prices

Very strange stuff yes - just got this one in my Daft notifications (€264,615 increase): http://www.daft.ie/sales/12-64-pembroke-road-ballsbridge-dublin/1038916/

Mine and yours are all Savills. I suspect they are playing a silly game advertising property at a low price for a short period of time so that they get picked-up by people's email alerts on Daft (alerts will show a low price); and they then increase the price once they know the emails have gone through (so when you click on the link on the alert you get the higher price on the website).

gogreen81

Bob24 wrote: »

Very strange stuff yes - just got this one in my Daft notifications (€264,615 increase): daft.ie/sales/12-64-pembroke-road-ballsbridge-dublin/1038916/[/url]

Mine and yours are all Savills. I suspect they are playing a silly game advertising property at a low price for a short period of time so that they get picked-up by people's email alerts on Daft (alerts will show a low price); and they then increase the price once they know the emails have gone through (so when you click on the link on the alert you get the higher price on the website).

I would never go for such an EA. I can understand when they advertise property maybe 5-10% less to get more attention, but raising an it by 264k???which is almost double for that property.

Bob24

Bob24 wrote: »

Very strange stuff yes - just got this one in my Daft notifications (€264,615 increase): http://www.daft.ie/sales/12-64-pembroke-road-ballsbridge-dublin/1038916/

Mine and yours are all Savills. I suspect they are playing a silly game advertising property at a low price for a short period of time so that they get picked-up by people's email alerts on Daft (alerts will show a low price); and they then increase the price once they know the emails have gone through (so when you click on the link on the alert you get the higher price on the website).

And yet the price history near the end of the ad doesn't record the price that was supposedly €264,615 cheaper. Ditto on the other properties posted above.

Bob24

Deleted User wrote: »

And yet the price history near the end of the ad doesn't record the price that was supposedly €264,615 cheaper. Ditto on the other properties posted above.

Yes I don't know how they did it.

On my RSS feed from Daft it appears as "Region €230385", not sure what it means (but other listings don't say "region" so this probably is what they played with):

johnp001

Bob24 wrote: »

Yes I don't know how they did it.

On my RSS feed from Daft it appears as "Region €230385", not sure what it means (but other listings don't say "region" so this probably is what they played with):

It is shown on mobile version but not on desktop version.
Screenshot from mobile:

Taylor365

There is a 3 bed house in drumcondra down for 80k too.

Coffee machine must be broke...

gaius c

gogreen81 wrote: »

I would never go for such an EA. I can understand when they advertise property maybe 5-10% less to get more attention, but raising an it by 264k???which is almost double for that property.

I suspect that it is a gremlin of some sort and quite possibly nothing to do with the EA at all.

seamus

My suspicion here is that Savills are re-using old ads for new properties, to avoid paying the fees to Daft for each new listing.

Bob24

seamus wrote: »

My suspicion here is that Savills are re-using old ads for new properties, to avoid paying the fees to Daft for each new listing.

I think it is more sneaky.

If you look at the listings for Savills Dawson Street here, a good bit of their ads have that type of price increase and for all the ones I checked the price increase / current price ratio is equal to 0.53. This can not be a coincidence.

I suspect they have some trick to advertise at a low price in a way that is not visible on the regular website (probably linked to the "region" thing I mentioned, and the price is obviously automatically calculated always using the same ratio) and are then advertising the actual price.

handlemaster

according to the Indo property asking prices are up 2.2% ?


http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/house-prices-still-rising-but-at-slower-pace-report-31106974.html

Bob24

handlemaster wrote: »

according to the Indo property asking prices are up 2.2% ?


http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/house-prices-still-rising-but-at-slower-pace-report-31106974.html

Yes: at least in Dublin asking prices are increasing (can be seen on MyHome and Daft) and selling prices are decreasing (can be seen on PPR and CSO reports).

Maybe a shift of strategy from EAs: they used to advertise lower prices to attract more buyers and generate bidding wars and are now advertising higher prices to increase people's expectation and make them feel like they are gettign a good deal of they buy below asking price.