11-28T 105 to 12 -30 Ultegra

jamesd

I have a 10 speed 105 group set (2012 Cube agree)
Shifter: Shimano 105 ST-5700, 10-speed
Rear Derailleur: Shimano 105 RD-5700SS
Front Derailleur: Shimano 105 FD-5700BL double
clamp 34.9mm
Crankset: Shimano 105 FC-5750 2-Piece
50x34T
Cassette - Shimano 105 CS-5700 11-28T, 10-speed

What I am wondering is could I swap the cassette for a
Shimano Ultegra 6700 10 Speed Cassettes - 12 -30 and would I have much issues, would the 30 over the 28 be alot better for hills?
http://www.swimcyclerun.com/cassette...cassettes.html

Would I need to change the chain too ?
http://www.swimcyclerun.com/chains/s...eed-chain.html
or
http://www.swimcyclerun.com/chains/s...eed-chain.html

http://www.celebrazio.net/bicycling/...ty_tables.html

Cee-Jay-Cee

You have a short cage RD which takes 28t max so a 30 won't work besides the difference between a 28 and a 30 is too small to make any noticeable difference, you'd need to go to a 32 to make a difference.

jamesd

Perfect thanks for the answer, was thinking a 30 was too little a change.

I wonder is there a 32 10speed and maybe change the derailer

nilhg

Cee-Jay-Cee wrote: »

You have a short cage RD which takes 28t max so a 30 won't work besides the difference between a 28 and a 30 is too small to make any noticeable difference, you'd need to go to a 32 to make a difference.

Just a couple of observations on this, I've fitted a 12-30 successfully on a Trek with an Ultegra 6700 short cage derailleur, shifting was fine and I had no problems at all, didn't need to change the chain length either though I'd never chance the 50-30 cross chain combination. Before I did this I had done a bit of research and whether or not the combo worked seemed to come down to the derailleur hanger on the various bike models so no guarantees for the OP unless he can find someone with the same year bike model who has successfully done it.

On the difference between 30 and 28 I'd agree it's not huge but I found it noticable but that wasn't the only reason to go for the 12-30. My 11-28 went from 24 to 28 in one jump, whereas the 12-30 went 24-27-30 which gave me an extra gear in the range you need in the hills, especially on a long day, the 11cog was no loss in those circumstances.

G1032

You can get a gear ratio calculator online here

So for a 700c wheel with 23mm tyre the gear inches are as follows:

Gear inches for a 39/28 are 36.6
Gear inches for a 39/30 are 34.2
Gear inches for a 39/32 are 32.1

That gives a 7% difference between the 28 and 30 and a 14% difference between the 28 and 32

I don't think there is a Shimano 10 speed cassette with 32 teeth, but maybe I'm wrong.

I switched from a 25 105 to a 30 Tiagra back in the summer and noticed a huge difference. I didn't change the chain.

quozl

There are SRAM Shimano compatible cassettes with 32s. I use one with a Tiagra derailleur no bother despite the specced max being 28. Like was said it depends on your frame as well as the derailleur.

G1032

jamesd wrote: »

Perfect thanks for the answer, was thinking a 30 was too little a change.

I wonder is there a 32 10speed and maybe change the derailer

Just as a matter of interest what hills in Galway are you looking to climb? (assuming you're living in a small town in Galway!!)

Wishbone Ash

nilhg wrote: »

...On the difference between 30 and 28 I'd agree it's not huge but I found it noticable...

+1

It won't make that much of a difference in Ireland with fairly short climbs but when pacing oneself over several long 20/30km climbs averaging 8%, it's nice to know it's there especially at the end of a long day and the legs are going on strike.

jamesd

G1032 wrote: »

Just as a matter of interest what hills in Galway are you looking to climb? (assuming you're living in a small town in Galway!!)

Planning for tour de burren and the ring of Kerry

Cee-Jay-Cee

nilhg wrote: »

Just a couple of observations on this, I've fitted a 12-30 successfully on a Trek with an Ultegra 6700 short cage derailleur, shifting was fine and I had no problems at all, didn't need to change the chain length either though I'd never chance the 50-30 cross chain combination. Before I did this I had done a bit of research and whether or not the combo worked seemed to come down to the derailleur hanger on the various bike models so no guarantees for the OP unless he can find someone with the same year bike....

I've a 30t on my winter bike with a Tiagra Medium cage RD and it just about works without the B Limit screw out fully. A 32 cog definitely wouldn't work.

jamesd

My best bet for these hills then should be lose a stone myself to make them easier.

Jim Stynes

This interests me as I am going to france in july for La Marmotte and I was wondering what gears I could change to. I am currently using a compact ultregra 11/28. Would a triple be good to go for on the day? How many more gears does that give me? I don't know much about gear ratios etc obviously

rigal

Jim Stynes wrote: »

This interests me as I am going to france in july for La Marmotte and I was wondering what gears I could change to. I am currently using a compact ultregra 11/28. Would a triple be good to go for on the day? How many more gears does that give me? I don't know much about gear ratios etc obviously

Depends on your fitness/time target but I would have thought 34/28 would be plenty. That's what I had when I did it a few years back. I never used it in training though, I just had it there on the day as an emergency gear. Needed it on the alpe a few times. :-) riding anymore than 34/28 would mean that you could literally be out there all day...

smacl

Jim Stynes wrote: »

This interests me as I am going to france in july for La Marmotte and I was wondering what gears I could change to. I am currently using a compact ultregra 11/28. Would a triple be good to go for on the day? How many more gears does that give me? I don't know much about gear ratios etc obviously

I've a low geared triple, and find great for the ramps at the end of a long day, or like now after Christmas, when I've a few extra pounds on. While 34/28 will be fine pretty much all the time, the lower gears make the likes of lovers leap coming into Enniskerry after eight hours in the saddle less of a nightmare.

Not all triples are low geared though, when I got my bike it had a 11/23 on the back. You also see a fair number of newer compacts, such as the Canyon Enduarace AL 6.0, with 11/32 on the back which is a lower gear than most triples.

2 Wheels Good

Depends on your style of cadence, I try and spin so faster the better. Found the Pyrenees much easier this year on a 34-28 than the Alps a couple of years ago on a 34-27. I was also a stone lighter which may have been more of a factor
But if you use cadence over power, the easier the ratio the better I think.

NeedMoreGears

Oddly I find I'm a bit quicker up steeper hills using a 30 rather than a 28. I presume this is down to lack of strength rather than lack of power (either way I'm slow enough TBH)

Brian?

I've yet to encounter a hill in Wicklow I needed more that a 34x28 on.

In fact I've done a cat 2 climb with 15-16% ramps with my lowest gear as a 39x25.

I'm quite fat too.

People have a tendency to buy what they think are solutions to problems that can be fixed with hard work.

ford2600

Brian? wrote: »

I've yet to encounter a hill in Wicklow I needed more that a 34x28 on.

Head across to Wexford and try Mt Leinster to the mast and see if you are not looking for a 30 cog, I know I was.

Brian?

ford2600 wrote: »

Head across to Wexford and try Mt Leinster to the mast and see if you are not looking for a 30 cog, I know I was.

I've heard it's tough alright. But a 30?

ford2600

Brian? wrote: »

I've heard it's tough alright. But a 30?

I got up in a 28 but would have liked a 30. Man with me got up in a 39/27 I think.

When in Canaries last summer was glad of 30 also. Valley of the Tears is brutal though.

For climbs like Ticincor 3km at 9% average I'll normally used to go up in 23; but my fastest time was in 28.

smacl

Brian? wrote: »

I've yet to encounter a hill in Wicklow I needed more that a 34x28 on.

In fact I've done a cat 2 climb with 15-16% ramps with my lowest gear as a 39x25.

I'm quite fat too.

People have a tendency to buy what they think are solutions to problems that can be fixed with hard work.

Went up the wall once in 42/28 and was seeing stars and spitting up bits of lung by the time I got to the top. Never again. I'm a fan of having a bit of comfort while cycling, and would rather spin up a hill in a low gear than grind my way up in a big one. Too much grinding on a regular basis also does nothing for my knees.

Brian?

smacl wrote: »

Went up the wall once in 42/28 and was seeing stars and spitting up bits of lung by the time I got to the top. Never again. I'm a fan of having a bit of comfort while cycling, and would rather spin up a hill in a low gear than grind my way up in a big one. Too much grinding on a regular basis also does nothing for my knees.

Nothing wrong with some comfort. A compact and an 11-28 is grand, but changing derailleurs etc. to go up to a 30 or 32 is a bit much.

Jim Stynes

Brian? wrote: »

I've yet to encounter a hill in Wicklow I needed more that a 34x28 on.

In fact I've done a cat 2 climb with 15-16% ramps with my lowest gear as a 39x25.

I'm quite fat too.

People have a tendency to buy what they think are solutions to problems that can be fixed with hard work.

I'm doing the Wicklow 200 but not worried about gearing for that at all.

It's the La Marmotte I'm worried about -that includes glandon, telegraph, galibier and the alp d'huez to finish off the 110 miles! So you can understand my worry that I might need more gears. Reading some blogs a lot of people said they couldnt believe the amount of people on triples! Most say they understand when they have 100 miles in the legs and are faced with alp d'Huez to finish off their day.

I am 6ft and 90kgs so I am going to get it tough whatever happens! I've never heard of someone not making it up a climb because they have too many gears!

uphillonly

As 2 Wheels said it really comes down to your cadence preference.

It looks like the pros use a higher cadence climbing than they did 20-30 years ago. Any analysis on the web about this? Contador had 50/34 - 11/32 on some climbs in the Vuelta a couple of years ago. I expect Froome has pretty low gearing looking at the cadence of his seated attacks on Ventoux.

I like to spin at 90+ with low gearing. I'm no Lucien Van Impe but climb Alpe d'Huez in under an hour. I haven't done the analysis but glancing at my power metre feel that I sustain higher power longer in a lower gear with higher cadence.
Up Kilmashogue Lane with its horrible ramps I averaged 84 in the club Hill climb which needs a low gearing. My last FTP test up Stocking Lane averaged 89.

Borderfox

I have an ultegra 12-30 and front rings are 53-39, derailleur is a medium cage 105. When I started last year I changed to a compact but have lost 20kg in the meantime and feel more comfortable on the larger front rings also as said above I prefer the ratios in the Ultegra top end

Wishbone Ash

jamesd wrote: »

Planning for tour de burren and the ring of Kerry

I'm not familiar with the Tour de Burren but you won't need any low gearing for the ROK. It could easily be done in the big ring at the front. The two major climbs (Coomakista and Moll's Gap) average 3% and are more long drags than climbs and the maximum elevation along the 170k route is about 250 metres.

Brian?

Jim Stynes wrote: »

I'm doing the Wicklow 200 but not worried about gearing for that at all.

It's the La Marmotte I'm worried about -that includes glandon, telegraph, galibier and the alp d'huez to finish off the 110 miles! So you can understand my worry that I might need more gears. Reading some blogs a lot of people said they couldnt believe the amount of people on triples! Most say they understand when they have 100 miles in the legs and are faced with alp d'Huez to finish off their day.

I am 6ft and 90kgs so I am going to get it tough whatever happens! I've never heard of someone not making it up a climb because they have too many gears!

That's some serious climbing alright. I could see myself wishing for a 34x30 on towards the end of that!

Seweryn

ford2600 wrote: »

I got up in a 28 but would have liked a 30. Man with me got up in a 39/27 I think...

I climbed that hill three times in 36/27 and only at the third go (when we cycled together with ford2600) I managed to get up there without having to stop due to poor fitness and lack of lower gear. I remember my average speed was something like 6 km/h on the final 2.6km climb. So, if I had a choice to put a lower gearing on my bike that day, I definitely would.

Wishbone Ash

I was struggling badly with a 34/28 near the end of a 30km climb in Austria a few years ago. To my utter dismay the chap along side me was chatting merrily on his 'phone while using a 39/23 (his lowest gear!).

Back home, I don't think I'd get up Kilmashogue, Mamore, Devils Elbow, Ballkill Road etc. without a 28.

07Lapierre

Jim Stynes wrote: »

This interests me as I am going to france in july for La Marmotte and I was wondering what gears I could change to. I am currently using a compact ultregra 11/28. Would a triple be good to go for on the day? How many more gears does that give me? I don't know much about gear ratios etc obviously

A compact with a 28 is LOWER than a triple with a 25 sprocket. Stay with your current setup.

ford2600

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I'm not familiar with the Tour de Burren but you won't need any low gearing for the ROK. It could easily be done in the big ring at the front. The two major climbs (Coomakista and Moll's Gap) average 3% and are more long drags than climbs and the maximum elevation along the 170k route is about 250 metres.

If you're a strong experienced cyclist doing 10-20k km per year then of course you could do ROK in the big ring(you might be cross chaining onlast km of Molls Gap) for a 30 something coming from a different sport or no sport the lower the gears available the better.

If I'm out for a hilly 50km spin I'll sometimes drive a big gear but after 200km in the Priests Leap 300 heading up Coumnaspic my legs were screaming for something lower than 28.

When your tired lower gears are your friend.

Jim Stynes, stick a 30 on the back and you should be fine. Don't get caught up in a fast group early on. Keep all your matches for the second half!

Wishbone Ash

ford2600 wrote: »

If you're a strong experienced cyclist doing 10-20k km per year then of course you could do ROK in the big ring(you might be cross chaining onlast km of Molls Gap) for a 30 something coming from a different sport or no sport the lower the gears available the better..

Apologies - wasn't intending to sound pompous! I would do a fair bit of mileage but I would be a fairly mediocre climber. I just thought the ROK was much flatter than I was led to believe. I don't know the area at all and kept waiting for the climbs which never arrived. (...and I'm and a long, long way past 30 and I've little experience of any other sport! )

ford2600

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Apologies - wasn't intending to sound pompous! I would do a fair bit of mileage but I would be a fairly mediocre climber. I just thought the ROK was much flatter than I was led to believe. I don't know the area at all and kept waiting for the climbs which never arrived. (...and I'm and a long, long way past 30 and I've little experience of any other sport! )

I'd take it up like that at all; as we get stronger it is easy to forget how tough long cycles were when we started.

30, 40, 60 does it matter? Preparation, genetics, mentality are way more important in long distance cycling.

I've lost count of the number of 60 pluses who have made bits of me on long spins

uphillonly

Jim Stynes wrote: »

This interests me as I am going to france in july for La Marmotte and I was wondering what gears I could change to. I am currently using a compact ultregra 11/28. Would a triple be good to go for on the day? How many more gears does that give me? I don't know much about gear ratios etc obviously

34/28 is the same as the 30/25 on my triple. Done the Marmotte many times happily spinning, well maybe not happily, up the hills.

That gearing is fine for the long alpine climbs. Nothing over 10% on the course.

Wishbone Ash

uphillonly wrote: »

.. Done the Marmotte many times...

Jaysus...fair play! :eek: