Want to move out, never signed contract

Greasy in Tbilisi

OK, here's my situation. I moved into a house share about 18 months ago. Sharing with 2 others. Paid a deposit and the first month rent to one of the other tenants (the rent comes from their account to the Landlords). I always pay electronically into the housemates account and name it e.g. December rent. However I never had to sign a contract or anything when I moved in. The Landlord owns a few houses together next to where we are and I've met and talked to the Landlords on a few occasions, they're nice people, no issues. Landlord is registered with PTSB as far as I know.

When I moved in, I was delighted because the rent was substantially lower (€550) for the area in was in and the facilities that were there. The trouble started about a year ago when the Landlord called in and was talking to one of the housemates (the one problem with the place is that the walls/floors are paper thin so everyone can hear everything). Basically the landlord was saying they wanted a rent increase, that the rent was too low for where we were (even compared to the other houses next door that they own). The landlord told us what the rent next door was and to have a chat among ourselves and see what we thought.

Later that day I said to the housemate "what did the landlord want" they explained what the landlord said but said not to worry about it we'll have a talk about it sometime but that they knew the landlord and that they were a bit eccentric and not to worry about it. Fast forward about 2 months and the Landlord called to the door again, this time to the other housemate, basically saying the same thing about the rent. The other housemate countered straight away saying that they were a civil servant and was hit by wage cuts and that their Father was ill and various other excuses that they couldn't afford any increase (not saying they were lying but they never seems short of money otherwise). Anyway, the Landlord said "OK, listen you've explained your situation and that's OK, but please say it to the others and let me know what they think".

I waited for about 4 weeks for the other Housemate to let me know that the Landlord called again and what they said but they never did. I think I even asked could we talk about the rent situation once or twice but they kept avoiding it. Anyway after this 4 week period after the Landlord called for the second time, I got pissed off and seeing the Landlord outside one day, went outside to talk to them myself. I covered for the others basically saying "the others said there was an issue with the rent but they weren't really sure of the details, can you let me know what the situation is?". The Landlord explained again and I said "look, I don't know about the other two but I'm happy to increase my rent to €600 a month". I know it's a bit mercenary but I like where I live and even €600 is about €100-150 less a month than anything similar in the area. Plus the way I look at it the second housemate with playing the poor mouth card basically agreed their own rent €550 with the LL when they said they couldn't afford any increase.

So when the next months rent was due I told the housemate who's account I paid the rent into that there would be €600 going in this month and why, and they went mental saying I couldn't agree terms like that with the LL. I tried to explain the situation but they weren't happy. Anyway fast forward about a year and the other two haven't talked to me in months. I don't mind too much, they weren't my kind of people anyway and we all have busy schedules so we don't see each other that much, but obviously it's not an ideal situation.

Anyway, sorry for the essay. What I'd like to know is where do I stand if I want to move out? I'd like to get a reference from the LL but how much notice do I need to give. Even though I'm sure the other 2 would love to get rid of me I reckon they're that thick and spiteful that they'd insist I'd give a full months notice before I go which isn't practical. Very occasionally other comparable places come up in the area but with move in dates of about 2 weeks max. Anything I need to be wary of when getting my deposit back? The place is exactly as I found it (a lot cleaner actually) minus normal wear and tear. I think when I moved in my deposit went to pay back the previous housemates deposit (they were friends with the two current Housemates) the LLs weren't involved and I don't trust the housemates not to screw me on the deposit if I moved out.

TL/DR: Moved into a place, didn't sign any contract. Deposit and rent paid to other housemate, LL not really involved in day to day. Me and other housemates don't get on any more, if I was to move out where do I stand re: giving notice and ensuring I get my deposit back.

Thanks in advance!

MouseTail

What were you thinking? In any case it sounds like one of the older housemates (possibly the one whose bank account you transfer the rent into) has the lease with the LL. She is right by the way, you had no right to negotiate a rent increase on her behalf. if your rent is paid monthly you will have to give a months notice, and get it from the new housemate as it has nothing to do with the Landlord. If you manage to get a housemate sooner they will probably be agreeable to you moving sooner.

housetypeb

What makes you think that your extra rent was passed onto the landlord?It would seem the other housemate is the lease holder and you're renting off of her.

Greasy in Tbilisi

MouseTail wrote: »

What were you thinking? In any case it sounds like one of the older housemates (possibly the one whose bank account you transfer the rent into) has the lease with the LL. She is right by the way, you had no right to negotiate a rent increase on her behalf. if your rent is paid monthly you will have to give a months notice, and get it from the new housemate as it has nothing to do with the Landlord. If you manage to get a housemate sooner they will probably be agreeable to you moving sooner.

Well it was never explained to me that the older housemate was the leaseholder, the way I understood it (and I could be wrong) was that so many people have moved in/left over the years that the LL didn't care too much who lived there as long as the utility bills and rent were paid every month, hence there was no contract. The LL only realised their name was on the ESB bill a few months back (it had been their name on the bill for years). When they found out they said it was OK but obviously just to make sure we pay it each month.

The housemate whose account I pay the rent into wasn't an original tenant they would have just moved into a room at some stage. Maybe the LL did arrange a lease with them at some stage but it was never communicated to me at any stage that this was the arrangement.

Even when the housemate went mental when I told them I had talked to the LL about the rent increase they never said "well I'm the leaseholder you should have talked to me", they said "you can't agree a rent increase for all of us", to which I said "I didn't, I arranged the increase for myself, the other housemate agreed the 550 with the LL and you can arrange whatever you want with the LL yourself", to which they replied "well you should have talked to us first" and I said "well I tried to but you kept avoiding the issue", and that was it.

housetypeb wrote: »

What makes you think that your extra rent was passed onto the landlord?It would seem the other housemate is the lease holder and you're renting off of her.

Well I presume if the extra rent wasn't passed onto the LL then the LL would have asked me about it. Again, it was never explained to me that the other housemate was the lease holder (if indeed they are).

the_syco

Greasy in Tbilisi wrote: »

Paid a deposit and the first month rent to one of the other tenants (the rent comes from their account to the Landlords).

No contract, and you're essentially paying money to another tenant sounds a bit like the main tenant is subletting the place to you? In which case you're a licensee, have very little rights, but I don't think this is the case as they haven't tried to boot you out yet.

Eldarion

I'm sure the other tenant which you are effectively subletting from was delighted with the little increase. I could almost guarantee his/her standing order was not increased by €50 a month for the actual rent.

You didn't really have much business dealing with the landlord directly unless he was leasing the rooms individually and you each had separate leases but that doesn't seem to be the case in this situation.

The landlord is also in the wrong here and should only be discussing rent in total rent due for the property and only with the tenant he has a lease/tenancy agreement with, it's not his concern how the rent is divvied up beyond that (more for ensuite, less for box room etc). Going behind your housemate's backs here only really served to weaken his negotiation position. I wouldn't go as far as to say he's right in not speaking to you for months but I can understand why he'd be odd about it.

That being said he does seem to be acting a bit childish about the whole thing and doesn't sound like he was approachable at all. I can understand why you were worried but you really shouldn't have concerned yourself as it doesn't sound like it was a problem that needed solving on your end.

seamus

You're subletting the room from one of the tenants which means you have no notice period. You can up and move out whenever suits you.