Warhammer: Total War

blackwave

Wood Elf DLC will be released in December, no further info given other than that unfortunately.

Gunmonkey

So new DLC been revealed; Twilight Sisters vs Throt the Unclean
https://www.totalwar.com/blog/total-war-warhammer-ii-the-twisted-the-twilight-faq/

Bullet point stuff:
-Amber is f***ing gone as a core mechanic, only used for a few tech unlocks
-WElves now journey to forests dotted round the map to "heal" them, can also use a fast travel between forests (has a cooldown)
-Ariel looks to be some form of Hero/summonable unit
-Zoats are in baby!
-Throt has a flesh crafting mechanic, can "improve" units
-Skaven get lots of large rat themed beasts
-Twilight sisters have a "forge" mechanic to make unique items or improve old ones

FLC is a new Skaven Chieftain hero type and Drycha the Branchwraith for the WElves

ancapailldorcha

I f*cking love Skaven. They weren't great when they came out. I started a campaign with The Prophet & Warlock and they're just so much better now. Glad they're getting more DLC.

Gbear

I think Im looking forward to having another proper faction up by Kislev as much as anything.
I presume they'll start in Hell Pit on Mortal Empires.

Gunmonkey

Gbear wrote: »

I think Im looking forward to having another proper faction up by Kislev as much as anything.
I presume they'll start in Hell Pit on Mortal Empires.

Yeah thats a dead cert.

As for the two new WElf start spots....hrm, possibly the Laurelorn Forest north of Altdorf and maybe the forest way down south east of Khemri. Or they will add one or two new ones to the map, seeing as you have to go purify them....so could we see tons of new WElf factions dotted around the game now?

Gbear

Gunmonkey wrote: »

Yeah thats a dead cert.

As for the two new WElf start spots....hrm, possibly the Laurelorn Forest north of Altdorf and maybe the forest way down south east of Khemri. Or they will add one or two new ones to the map, seeing as you have to go purify them....so could we see tons of new WElf factions dotted around the game now?

It sounds like there's one up in Naggarond, which will be where Moulder and the new WElf faction will start on Vortex, and the WElf, I assume, on Mortal Empires.

ancapailldorcha

Breakdown of the new units here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB3RrIHnN-Y

Couple of rebalancing things they've done here as well that'll impact all factions. Ranged units apparently get a 1.2s amnesty where missiles will not hit trees, so you can put ranged units in trees and they'll be able to shoot out but still get protection from them, and you can abandon settlements now which is something I wish I've been able to do at various points so good option. Also you get to choose your own Chaos invasion, from turning it off to having it much much tougher.]

Now that there's sales on I reckon I'll get the couple of DLCs I don't have, which will bring me up to owning everything, don't want to think about how much it all cost :eek:

Gbear

Alina Nutritious Coyote wrote: »

Couple of rebalancing things they've done here as well that'll impact all factions. Ranged units apparently get a 1.2s amnesty where missiles will not hit trees, so you can put ranged units in trees and they'll be able to shoot out but still get protection from them, and you can abandon settlements now which is something I wish I've been able to do at various points so good option. Also you get to choose your own Chaos invasion, from turning it off to having it much much tougher.]

Now that there's sales on I reckon I'll get the couple of DLCs I don't have, which will bring me up to owning everything, don't want to think about how much it all cost :eek:

I've put a good 2000 hours in WH2 alone, so I'm not too bothered by accumulated cost, and it's one of the few games I've been happy to preorder content for.

It looks like a fantastic rework on the whole, and the units look brilliant. I've been watching a few show matches to showcase the new units and they seem to add a lot of veriety for both races.

The only thing is that as ever, the WE DLC faction unique mechanics are a bit of an afterthought.

ancapailldorcha

I've spent hundreds of pounds between Warhammer 2 and various Paradox titles. I'm much more concerned about getting a good game with genuine longevity than with the amount of money I'm spending over time. I'm much more annoyed about spending nearly 40 quid on Resident Evil 3, a game that lasted me 4.5 hours.

A lot of the DLC is lord packs which certainly aren't integral to the main game unlike a lot of Paradox DLC's. Creative Assembly do, in fairness release faction reworks for free along with a complementary lord.

The only thing is that I've seen one Youtuber, LegendofTotalWar claim that the Wood Elves are a bit weaker now but he does play on Legendary difficulty so that might be skewing him a bit. I've never played them but I might do now as I've bought the DLC and I like the Skaven as well.

Finished the long campaign there as the new WE faction. I enjoyed it, they play totally different to most factions in that territory is basically irrelevant to them. Consequence of that is you don't need loads of armies to protect it so you can get away with their crap economy a bit. Treemen are totally OP, there's no reason to have anything else in your army if you're so inclined, along with a healer to keep them topped up.

I found loads of people declared war on me later in the campaign, like the ordertide did out of nowhere but it didn't really matter tbh because again you don't need territory really.

Gunmonkey

It aint much....but its something.

https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/l7ul83/azyr_stirs/

ancapailldorcha

Gunmonkey wrote: »

It aint much....but its something.

https://www.reddit.com/r/totalwar/comments/l7ul83/azyr_stirs/

Not like their usual DLC teasers. I'd say Warhammer 3.

Gunmonkey

Yeah thats one of the prevailing theories. And the star constellation is a Dwarf symbol for a late spring/early summer festival so a possible window of more news?

ancapailldorcha

Gunmonkey wrote: »

Yeah thats one of the prevailing theories. And the star constellation is a Dwarf symbol for a late spring/early summer festival so a possible window of more news?

Yeah. I think they might have one more DLC for WH2. A shame if they leave either of Norsca or the Beastmen in their current state as everyone else has had some attention now.

Usually, there's a vignette of a few seconds but this is a minute so I'm thinking it's the final iteration of the trilogy.

Gbear

Norsca were included in a pre-order bonus of some sort for WH2. I think they were announced after WH2 was.

It's a bit different to games being distinct from one another. It kinda doesn't matter when the last WH2 DLC comes out. They could release it after WH3 if they wanted to and it wouldn't make much difference, because they'd be playable in both either way.

ancapailldorcha

Norsca was a DLC for WH1. I think the pre-order bonus was contingent on their appearing in Mortal Empires.

I think WH3 is going to be the replacement for WH2. DLC for the latter seems pointless with the new title imminent though the combined map will probably be some time coming!

ancapailldorcha

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Norsca was a DLC for WH1. I think the pre-order bonus was contingent on their appearing in Mortal Empires.

I think WH3 is going to be the replacement for WH2. DLC for the latter seems pointless with the new title imminent though the combined map will probably be some time coming!

I'm pretty sure the CA community person who posts on reddit said there's one more TWW2 DLC coming.

Lot of people seem to think this is TWW3 which would be great, there are not many games I'd pay full price on day 1 for but this is definitely one of them.

ancapailldorcha

Alina Nutritious Coyote wrote: »

I'm pretty sure the CA community person who posts on reddit said there's one more TWW2 DLC coming.

Lot of people seem to think this is TWW3 which would be great, there are not many games I'd pay full price on day 1 for but this is definitely one of them.

Yeah, I recall the same. I'd say May for the DLC and then end of the year for WH3. We've known it's been coming for ages and mechanically, it's going to be identical to WH2 as they're all based off the same engine.

And yeah, this might be one for preordering.

Christy42

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Yeah. I think they might have one more DLC for WH2. A shame if they leave either of Norsca or the Beastmen in their current state as everyone else has had some attention now.

Usually, there's a vignette of a few seconds but this is a minute so I'm thinking it's the final iteration of the trilogy.

Beastmen need a massive rework. May as well save it for WH3. I would like to see Ogres in WH3 as well, that could be a cool and different faction.

Not sure what the new dlc will be. Vamps maybe?

ancapailldorcha

Christy42 wrote: »

Beastmen need a massive rework. May as well save it for WH3. I would like to see Ogres in WH3 as well, that could be a cool and different faction.

Not sure what the new dlc will be. Vamps maybe?

I'd say it'll feature the Beastmen along with a rework against a WH2 race. That seems to be the general pattern of the lord pack DLCs.

ancapailldorcha

ancapailldorcha

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

That person has subsequently deleted that comment saying they aren't allowed confirm or deny anything... But imo it pretty much confirms it. Well I hope it does anyway I really want TWW3.

ancapailldorcha

Alina Nutritious Coyote wrote: »

That person has subsequently deleted that comment saying they aren't allowed confirm or deny anything... But imo it pretty much confirms it. Well I hope it does anyway I really want TWW3.

Well, we knew it was coming. WH2 will probably receive its last DLC in April or May and then we'll get the last patch or two before WH3 releases at year's end.

Dave_The_Sheep

Guess MrSmartDonkey won't be a content partner for long if he can't keep his mouth shut.

Gunmonkey

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Well, we knew it was coming. WH2 will probably receive its last DLC in April or May and then we'll get the last patch or two before WH3 releases at year's end.

Last DLC could even be the same as Norsca was in the first game and be a pre-order bonus that works in both games.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIqv6Yrd7TE

Potatoeman

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Well, we knew it was coming. WH2 will probably receive its last DLC in April or May and then we'll get the last patch or two before WH3 releases at year's end.

That would be the earliest. They usually time their releases with other games so Troy and three kingdoms will also push it out too. Think COVID delayed things too.

Gbear

If they're leading with Chaos in the teasers, I wonder would that suggest that Chaos will be front and center in the vanilla game, and not relegated to post-launch DLC.

Going off of games 1 and 2, they had brand new races added off the bat, so I figured that there was just too much to implement if they followed that same model for Chaos, Kislev, Chaos Dwarves and Ogres, despite Kislev and Chaos already having much of the work already done for them (Kislev should be 90% just reskinned existing Empire units).

There's more than enough variety already in the game, so I wonder might they release with a new Empire faction, maybe Kislev, maybe Dogs of War, but the bulk of the new content will be a fully fleshed out Chaos race, with separate factions for Warriors and the 4 god-aligned daemon factions, and then hold back the Ogres, Chaos Dwarves for later on, as well as important characters like Nagash.

Gbear

Potatoeman wrote: »

That would be the earliest. They usually time their releases with other games so Troy and three kingdoms will also push it out too. Think COVID delayed things too.

They generally seem to release 1 game a year. We had WH2 in 2017, Thrones of Brittania in 2018, Three Kingdoms in 2019 and Troy in 2020. I don't know if any others are currently planned for 2021, other than maybe a mobile game, which I don't think counts.

Covid might have an impact, but they'll have been working on the game long before lockdowns started.

Ooooh didn't know we were getting another teaser today. Have just read on Reddit they usually put trailers out on Thursdays so another two teasers tomorrow and Wed for the 2 remaining Chaos gods, then an actual reveal on Thurs?

Whatever it is, CA don't tend to have a huge amount of time between announcing and releasing stuff so I'd guess we'll be getting it sooner rather than later. TWW2 was announced in March and released in Sept.

ancapailldorcha

I'd say there'll be 2-3 more teasers and then the trailer on Thursday or maybe Friday.

Gunmonkey

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I'd say there'll be 2-3 more teasers and then the trailer on Thursday or maybe Friday.

Kinda on the money there....a little too on the money *narrows eyes*

(it is a new trailer....honest)

ancapailldorcha

There's four chaos gods in Warhammer lore. Last Friday, today and the following two days would make for one hint for each culminating in the actual trailer on Thursday.

ancapailldorcha

Gbear wrote: »

If they're leading with Chaos in the teasers, I wonder would that suggest that Chaos will be front and center in the vanilla game, and not relegated to post-launch DLC.

Going off of games 1 and 2, they had brand new races added off the bat, so I figured that there was just too much to implement if they followed that same model for Chaos, Kislev, Chaos Dwarves and Ogres, despite Kislev and Chaos already having much of the work already done for them (Kislev should be 90% just reskinned existing Empire units).

There's more than enough variety already in the game, so I wonder might they release with a new Empire faction, maybe Kislev, maybe Dogs of War, but the bulk of the new content will be a fully fleshed out Chaos race, with separate factions for Warriors and the 4 god-aligned daemon factions, and then hold back the Ogres, Chaos Dwarves for later on, as well as important characters like Nagash.

I'd say it's be the four chaos races with maybe Kislev as a pre-order bonus. Chaos Dwarves & Ogre Kingdoms are likely to be post-release DLC race packs like the Tomb Kings & Vampire Coast. I hope they add more races and lord packs than they did with WH2 as there are a few that are likely to be omitted like Ind, Cathay, Araby, and Albion. I reckon we'll just have to wait and see.

Gbear

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I'd say it's be the four chaos races with maybe Kislev as a pre-order bonus. Chaos Dwarves & Ogre Kingdoms are likely to be post-release DLC race packs like the Tomb Kings & Vampire Coast. I hope they add more races and lord packs than they did with WH2 as there are a few that are likely to be omitted like Ind, Cathay, Araby, and Albion. I reckon we'll just have to wait and see.

The issue there is that by far the most popular factions are human or humanlike "good guys".

So I think it's almost certain that there will be at least 1 human faction in the base game.

Pre-launch DLC would probably make more sense to me as minor factions or new Lords, to give older factions a place in the new game map. Nagash, a Dwarf, Empire or Greenskin Lord, or else a faction like the Dogs of War, which is mostly cobbled together from other races and/or reskinned Empire units would seem to be better candidates to me than Kislev, which I would imagine would be the obvious "good guys" in the new game.

ancapailldorcha

Gbear wrote: »

The issue there is that by far the most popular factions are human or humanlike "good guys".

So I think it's almost certain that there will be at least 1 human faction in the base game.

Pre-launch DLC would probably make more sense to me as minor factions or new Lords, to give older factions a place in the new game map. Nagash, a Dwarf, Empire or Greenskin Lord, or else a faction like the Dogs of War, which is mostly cobbled together from other races and/or reskinned Empire units would seem to be better candidates to me than Kislev, which I would imagine would be the obvious "good guys" in the new game.

I think this is why Kislev could be a day one DLC like the Warriors of Chaos were all those years ago. There are assets they could reuse. I remember the original Pirates of Sartosa in the Vortex being reskinned Empire units for instance.

CA do seem like employ the rule of four when these games are initially released. Pre-launch DLC would have to feature a race that people actually want to play. Norsca have literally one decent unit and the Beastmen are both dull and weak so that leaves Kislev who I feel would tap into the defenders of order theme that people like Reikland seem to enjoy.

Gbear

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I think this is why Kislev could be a day one DLC like the Warriors of Chaos were all those years ago. There are assets they could reuse. I remember the original Pirates of Sartosa in the Vortex being reskinned Empire units for instance.

CA do seem like employ the rule of four when these games are initially released. Pre-launch DLC would have to feature a race that people actually want to play. Norsca have literally one decent unit and the Beastmen are both dull and weak so that leaves Kislev who I feel would tap into the defenders of order theme that people like Reikland seem to enjoy.

I think there's too many difference from game to game to easily compare the number of launch factions.

As far as I'm aware, Chaos were intiially intended as a sort of pseudo-faction only meant to provide a challenge to the player. They decided to beef it up a bit near release and make them playable through DLC. They've never really been a proper faction.

For game 2, High Elves and Dark Elves are basically the same army reskinned.

With game 3, they'll have 80% of the Warriors of Chaos already developed, as well as the models for the Slaanesh mortal lord (Sigvald) and the Tzeentch daemon (Lord of Change). They also have things like Chaos Dragons that exist but only as mounts. They could launch with 3 Daemons for each god, a Greater Daemon and a Herald hero for each, a daemon mount for each and a few skins for Lords depending on which mark of chaos they get, as well as ones for god-aligned Chaos Warriors (like Khorne Berzerkers).

That's far less development than for 4 unique factions. Even if they released with the full rosters, or near enough, there's still not that many daemons. The Empire have 20 units and unit variants. High Elves have 25. You'd be struggling to find 10 for each of the Chaos gods, even if you were digging into the lore and weird army books and thrown away bits of canon. And I don't think you can invent units for the Daemons. You can't really have the same generic sort of thing like for, say the Vampire Coast, where you could say "it's a zombie, but it also has a gun!".

Given that Kislev will itself mostly be a reskin, it'd be pretty ****ing cheeky to charge for it as DLC.

ancapailldorcha

I don't know. Both games launched with four playable races with the first game having the Warriors of Chaos as pre-launch DLC.

I would disagree regarding the High Elves and Dark Elves. Both factions have different units, different voice packs and different mechanics. Units like Spearmen and Dreadspears might be reskins but on the whole I think that both races are sufficiently different. Kislev might be able to use some units from other races but they'll need their own voicework, lords, heroes and unique units and other things.

I don't know if they'd get away with that amount of overlap. I think the Chaos factions would have to be properly stand alone. I don't know how much covid has hindered development or even how much more is needed as the latter two titles aren't much more than expansions and updates to the first in terms of the map and engine.

I'm going off off how CA have launched the past two titles but given that this is the finale and that people's expectations are high, we might get more for the purchase price this time.

I just hope they rework sieges.

ancapailldorcha

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I don't know. Both games launched with four playable races with the first game having the Warriors of Chaos as pre-launch DLC.

I would disagree regarding the High Elves and Dark Elves. Both factions have different units, different voice packs and different mechanics. Units like Spearmen and Dreadspears might be reskins but on the whole I think that both races are sufficiently different. Kislev might be able to use some units from other races but they'll need their own voicework, lords, heroes and unique units and other things.

I don't know if they'd get away with that amount of overlap. I think the Chaos factions would have to be properly stand alone. I don't know how much covid has hindered development or even how much more is needed as the latter two titles aren't much more than expansions and updates to the first in terms of the map and engine.

I'm going off off how CA have launched the past two titles but given that this is the finale and that people's expectations are high, we might get more for the purchase price this time.

I just hope they rework sieges.

Yeah was going to say I've played both HE and DE recently and I think they're plenty different. Slaves, Black Arks, monsters etc. Some units are similar sure but I think the two factions feel very different to play.



Unrelated to TWW3 but I'm having my first go with Bretonnia at the moment and they seem insanely strong. No supply lines, easy to get economy going with farms, loads of good units along with disposable and free peasants, and Louen Leoncour is absolutely insane. I have him on his flying mount, lots of points in his tank skill line with regen, and you can just send him to fight flipping anything and he will get hundreds of kills taking minimal damage. One thing they really do lack is replenishment but going to try have most of my lords kill the Fey Enchantress to get her trait. Think I'm going to try take over the world, or at least the whole western side of it and we'll think about things from there.

Christy42

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I'd say it's be the four chaos races with maybe Kislev as a pre-order bonus. Chaos Dwarves & Ogre Kingdoms are likely to be post-release DLC race packs like the Tomb Kings & Vampire Coast. I hope they add more races and lord packs than they did with WH2 as there are a few that are likely to be omitted like Ind, Cathay, Araby, and Albion. I reckon we'll just have to wait and see.

4 chaos gods seem too similar to me to be the entire game. They will also want to show opposed races for conflict.

However Kislev would be an empire offshoot really. I don't see them getting multiple LL so I am not sure they would count as a full race for the game. Bear Cav in the trailers would be really cool though and story wise Kislev are an obvious opponent for Chaos.

ancapailldorcha

Alina Nutritious Coyote wrote: »

Yeah was going to say I've played both HE and DE recently and I think they're plenty different. Slaves, Black Arks, monsters etc. Some units are similar sure but I think the two factions feel very different to play.

Agreed completely. They also have quite different themes as well.

Alina Nutritious Coyote wrote: »

Unrelated to TWW3 but I'm having my first go with Bretonnia at the moment and they seem insanely strong. No supply lines, easy to get economy going with farms, loads of good units along with disposable and free peasants, and Louen Leoncour is absolutely insane. I have him on his flying mount, lots of points in his tank skill line with regen, and you can just send him to fight flipping anything and he will get hundreds of kills taking minimal damage. One thing they really do lack is replenishment but going to try have most of my lords kill the Fey Enchantress to get her trait. Think I'm going to try take over the world, or at least the whole western side of it and we'll think about things from there.

Bretonnia can be great fun. I used to think they were weak but since they got their rework they've improved. I wouldn't be too bothered about the replenishment. Certainly not so much as to farm the poor aul Fey Enchantress.

Repanse is also a lot of fun. She only gets a horse so she's a bit weaker than Louen. She can boost her army's replenishment and obtain the unbreakable trait so she's like a wrecking ball.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFslmOLOyDg

Annoying, CA reused her voicework on the High Elf caster lord so it just sounds so wrong there but I think Repanse is one of my favourites.

Christy42 wrote: »

4 chaos gods seem too similar to me to be the entire game. They will also want to show opposed races for conflict.

However Kislev would be an empire offshoot really. I don't see them getting multiple LL so I am not sure they would count as a full race for the game. Bear Cav in the trailers would be really cool though and story wise Kislev are an obvious opponent for Chaos.

I don't know any more about game 3 than anyone else. What I do know is that the Chaos gods seem to hate each other as well and their factions are likely to play differently. There is plenty of room for non Chaos factions in that area like the Dogs of War, the Ogre Kingdoms, Ind, Cathay, Nippon, etc. Kislev have the potential to be a lot of fun as well.

https://twitter.com/totalwar/status/1356543720682901504?s=20

New teaser, the previous two released at exactly 3pm so this on is early. The Drummer is one of the Star Signs of the Old World. It is the Sign of Excess and Hedonism. Don't need to think too hard about this one!

Gbear

Could well mean that we get the trailer at 3pm today.

Gbear

Gbear wrote: »

Could well mean that we get the trailer at 3pm today.

Yep have seen some speculation to that end now (though tbh wasn't thinking that when I posted above). Don't want to get my hopes up too much.

ancapailldorcha

Gbear wrote: »

Could well mean that we get the trailer at 3pm today.

Actually, yeah. The trailer could serve as the fourth teaser.

Gbear

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Actually, yeah. The trailer could serve as the fourth teaser.

Well I was more just thinking that the 4 gods have now all been represented.

Unless we're going to get another teaser for another race, or maybe to indicate Chaos Undivided, then the trailer should be up next.

ancapailldorcha

Gbear wrote: »

Well I was more just thinking that the 4 gods have now all been represented.

Unless we're going to get another teaser for another race, or maybe to indicate Chaos Undivided, then the trailer should be up next.

I thought each god would get a separate one. Then again, it might be fitting for CA to deviate from their normal marketing habits.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0d9h9E0dSI

Kislev confirmed then.

Last line "evil approaches, and it arrives tomorrow", god damn teases.