Primary school database

Orion

Orion wrote: »

I've now given my school over a month to respond to my letter denying permission to upload my children's details. I've just sent a courtesy mail to the chair of the BOM to let him know as a courtesy that I'm now forwarding the communications and lack of responses to the ODPC and asking they investigate.

Took that threat to finally get a response. The BOM have decided not to input any details on the pod whatsoever.

lazygal

Orion wrote: »

Took that threat to finally get a response. The BOM have decided not to input any details on the pod whatsoever.

Does that apply to information that has already been submitted by other parents?

Orion

Yes. They are keeping returned forms on file internally but not submitting it.

heldel00

Orion wrote: »

Yes. They are keeping returned forms on file internally but not submitting it.

So your objection means the school is not submitting data for any pupil? Even those whose parents had no issue?

constance tench

heldel00 wrote: »

So your objection means the school is not submitting data for any pupil? Even those whose parents had no issue?

I think that's wise...until the Data Commissioner's investigation is complete.

heldel00

There are huge benefits to this database though which I think people are overlooking. I do agree that they have made a complete mess of it, something similar to the irish water fiasco but one objection preventing the uploading of data, given by willing parents, is very unusual.

constance tench

Why do you presume parents were 'willing' and had 'no issue'?

It's a clear fact, parents are being pressurised by the DES and schools
into handing over details.

lazygal

heldel00 wrote: »

There are huge benefits to this database though which I think people are overlooking. I do agree that they have made a complete mess of it, something similar to the irish water fiasco but one objection preventing the uploading of data, given by willing parents, is very unusual.

What are the huge benefits? Parents were told funding would be cut. There's a level of coercion there that puts a question mark over the willingness of them to submit information.

heldel00

constance tench wrote: »

Why do you presume parents were 'willing' and had 'no issue'?

It's a clear fact, parents are being pressurised by the DES and schools
into handing over details.

Of all the families in my school only one objected. The rest of the parents who were willing to submit data had theirs uploaded. I just find it unusual that one objection would prevent others having the info, they consented to, submitted.

I understand that people are wary of POD and that DES have made a complete balls-up of it but being able to locate children who leave unannounced and swifter transfer of data from primary to secondary would be very beneficial on our end of our end of things.

Scale the database back a bit if needed and don't retain info for 30 years but they need to have something in place. Record keeping is completely antiquated in primary schools all over Ireland. It's actually quite embarrassing when dealing with schools in UK or US.

meeeeh

constance tench wrote: »

Why do you presume parents were 'willing' and had 'no issue'?

It's a clear fact, parents are being pressurised by the DES and schools
into handing over details.

I didn't feel pressurised, I have absolutely no problem giving those details. Anyway if des have any cop on they will make those forms part of enrolment procedure.

constance tench

meeeeh wrote: »

I didn't feel pressurised, I have absolutely no problem giving those details. Anyway if des have any cop on they will make those forms part of enrolment procedure.

That's your free will.
Good for you.

constance tench

heldel00 wrote: »

Of all the families in my school only one objected. The rest of the parents who were willing to submit data had theirs uploaded. I just find it unusual that one objection would prevent others having the info, they consented to, submitted.

I understand that people are wary of POD and that DES have made a complete balls-up of it but being able to locate children who leave unannounced and swifter transfer of data from primary to secondary would be very beneficial on our end of our end of things.

Scale the database back a bit if needed and don't retain info for 30 years but they need to have something in place. Record keeping is completely antiquated in primary schools all over Ireland. It's actually quite embarrassing when dealing with schools in UK or US.

Were all the families made aware they could object?

heldel00

constance tench wrote: »

Were all the families made aware they could object?

We can't start spoon feeding people to that extent Constance. Not enough hours in the day I'm afraid.

Orion

heldel00 wrote: »

So your objection means the school is not submitting data for any pupil? Even those whose parents had no issue?

You're assuming I was the only one who objected. I wasn't. But it's irrelevant anyway. I refused permission to upload my children's details. The school deciding not to upload anyone's was the bom decision.

lazygal

heldel00 wrote: »

We can't start spoon feeding people to that extent Constance. Not enough hours in the day I'm afraid.

How do you know only one family objected? Were you privy to who ticked the no consent box or was the objection communicated to all teachers? How is it spoon feeding to draw the attention of.parents to the fact that sensitive information to be stored for 30 years doesn't have to be shared?

meeeeh

constance tench wrote: »

That's your free will.
Good for you.

Latin phrases and a concept of free will, I learn something new everyday.

Telling people that resources will be spent on basis of the centralized data and not on the basis how many principals call des saying pretty please, is common sense not pressuring people to do anything. It baffles me that there is no centralized data, you can complain about info they are collecting but to complain about most logical and basic procedure is irrational.

constance tench

meeeeh wrote: »

Latin phrases and a concept of free will, I learn something new everyday.

Telling people that resources will be spent on basis of the centralized data and not on the basis how many principals call des saying pretty please, is common sense not pressuring people to do anything. It baffles me that there is no centralized data, you can complain about info they are collecting but to complain about most logical and basic procedure is irrational.

Why, thank you Meeeeh! I'm doing just that.

constance tench

heldel00 wrote: »

We can't start spoon feeding people to that extent Constance. Not enough hours in the day I'm afraid.

Let's get on with the force feeding...right?

meeeeh

constance tench wrote: »

Why, thank you Meeeeh! I'm doing just that.

Oh sorry I thought you were teaching Latin.

Anyway that has nothing to do with actually being surprised that the information wast majority of people supply will be used for funds allocation.

heldel00

lazygal wrote: »

How do you know only one family objected? Were you privy to who ticked the no consent box or was the objection communicated to all teachers? How is it spoon feeding to draw the attention of.parents to the fact that sensitive information to be stored for 30 years doesn't have to be shared?

Parents can object to anything they want. From school tours to visiting teachers to standardised testing to anything they want. We don't inform them as to what they can and can not object to. That's what I mean by spoon feeding.
I was involved in collecting the data so that is how I know only one family objected. (Don't see how that is relevant btw.)

heldel00

constance tench wrote: »

Let's get on with the force feeding...right?

OU812

Refused to provide any information that we considered identifying inc pps, background etc.

constance tench

meeeeh wrote: »

Oh sorry I thought you were teaching Latin.

Anyway that has nothing to do with actually being surprised that the information wast majority of people supply will be used for funds allocation.

I was under the impression you thought it was all Greek!
Apology accepted anyway.

Orion

heldel00 wrote: »

There are huge benefits to this database though which I think people are overlooking. I do agree that they have made a complete mess of it, something similar to the irish water fiasco but one objection preventing the uploading of data, given by willing parents, is very unusual.

I think you'll find that people are not overlooking the benefits. Read through this thread alone for examples. It's the data retention that is an issue. If they want to retain statistical information that's fine - it's the retention of personal information way beyond any useful period for statistical purposes that I - and many others - have a problem with. That is why I objected and refused to return the form and denied my school permission to upload any data regarding my children.

Let's be blunt here - this is a FG data-mining exercise to build up a database of citizens way into the future. That is not acceptable no matter how it's spun.

meeeeh

The only problem with this theory is that it is done by labour ministers.

Orion

meeeeh wrote: »

The only problem with this theory is that it is done by labour ministers.

You mean junior partners in a FG led government? Labour have done exactly what they've been told to do for the last 4 years. And are about to reap the "benefits" of that.

meeeeh

Yes you might be right. The FG illuminati are going to create a water charges register from the details of seven year olds. I am out of this thread it is full of enlightenment that I lack the understanding of.

heldel00

I have religiously followed this thread and I think if you read my last post Orion you will see that I said retaining info for 30 years needs to be addressed.
I think I'm going to make an exit from this thread too. The topic has been well thrashed out.

pwurple

Orion wrote: »

Let's be blunt here - this is a FG data-mining exercise to build up a database of citizens way into the future. That is not acceptable no matter how it's spun.

LMAO.

Popping back in to the thread was good for a chuckle this morning. I love this kind of nutty conspiracy stuff. Fine gael are out to get us even though it's a different party altogether, and they're providing a service... Wahhhhh!



Good to get to the REAL issue of the evil overlords anyway. Priceless. Keep it coming.

Orion

You can laugh all you want but why else would they want to retain all personal information for 30 years? There is absolutely no justification for that. Statistical information yes - personal data no.