Ireland Team Talk/Gossip/Rumour Thread IV

esterhayes

Apparently Zebo at 15 is likely this weekend.

total former

esterhayes wrote: »

Apparently Zebo at 15 is likely this weekend.

Jesus. That is extremely bad news for Jones, if true.

TBH if it was one or the other I'd pick Zebo

CatFromHue

Big opportunity for Zebo I think

.ak

Zebo was talking about playing FB in a recent interview so it'd make sense.

He's an exciting player at 15, so could be fun to watch...

razorblunt

Heading down to Cardiff for it, last time I was in the Millenium it was a Baa Baa's game so I'm looking forward to it. Even though it may not be "6 Nations" level.

There is only going to be so much variation in the backline as there has to be some consistency. But I also don't think that Sexton will start this weekend and I think Joe will want Trimble and Earls to get some game time (Luke Fitz said he is around a week behind in terms of fitness). With this in mind I'd say we will see first choice centres as a result:

I reckon:

Backs

Murray
Jackson
Earls
Henshaw
Payne
Trimble
Zebo

Reddan to come on quite early - probably 50 mins, and may actually start against the Scots.

Pack

Bent
Best
Ross
Toner
Henderson
O'Mahony (c)
Henry
Murphy

Awesomeness

Is there anyway to watch bbc wales online if I was in wales

thomond2006

Awesomeness wrote: »

Is there anyway to watch bbc wales online if I was in wales

Their website normally streams matches.

b.gud

Awesomeness wrote: »

Is there anyway to watch bbc wales online if I was in wales

ya through the iPlayer website, I've done it before

Awesomeness

Great was a bit worried I wouldnt be able to watch it. <SNIP>

.ak

Sorry folks, no discussion allowed on how to geoblock.

Synode

You can watch the match on <SNIP> (which has BBS Wales in HD) without any sort of geoblocking

Awesomeness

.ak wrote: »

Sorry folks, no discussion allowed on how to geoblock.

Sorry I knew no illegal streams but didnt realize that was against the rules. Wont happen again

total former

Synode wrote: »

You can watch the match on Xxxxx (which has BBS Wales in HD) without any sort of geoblocking

This is also an illegal site though.

Synode

total former wrote: »

This is also an illegal site though.

I'll take your word for it. But how is it still operating then without any need for geoblocking?

.ak

Yeah, it's not legally providing you with TV... Not sure exactly how it operates so openly but it's considered a work around for subscribing TV so we can't allow discussion on that either.

total former

Synode wrote: »

I'll take your word for it. But how is it still operating then without any need for geoblocking?

Because geoblocking is only necessary/applicable for legal sites.

phog

According to the IT neither RTE or TV3 offered to bid for the warm up games.

smiley_face

Based on the 1st selection of the warm-up matches,
It is interesting that there are certain positions at full strength and most other positions at 2nd strength.

Front row, full strength (Healy/McGrath/Kilcoyne, Best/Cronin/Strauss, Ross/Moore/Bent)
2nd Row, 2nd Strength
flankers, 2nd Strength
No.8, full strength (Heaslip)
9 and 10, 2nd strength,
12 and 13, 2nd strength,
11 and 14, 2nd strength
Fullback, 2nd strength

The selections are possibly significant in that:
Inclusion of Bent points at taking 5 props, not 6,
Kilcoyne will be next choice if Healy doesn't recover in time,
Strauss is ahead of Herring,
Henderson will be backup for POC,
Ryan is ahead of Tuohy as backup for Toner,
O'Donnell is ahead of Henry,
Marmion is ahead of Boss,
Madigan is probably No.22 for the RWC,
Cave is being given a chance to prove he should be 2nd choice to Henshaw,
Earls is being given a chance to prove he should be 2nd choice to Payne,
McFadden is ahead of Dave Kearney and Gilroy for wing cover,
Trimble will be be in direct competition with Bowe for the 14 jersey,
Jones continues as 2nd choice fullback,
and Zebo should get some time at fullback which would improve his chances of going as back three cover (if not 1st choice 11).

With the match against Scotland likely to be the last chance for anyone to make an impression to make the squad,
I'd expect the 2nd match against Wales and match against England will be with the full strength final squad.
So far it would look like this could be the RWC squad,
(I've marked Healy out as don't think he will recover in time, also marked guys in red that have injuries but that I'd expect to recover)
LH Props: Healy, McGrath, Kilcoyne,
TH Props: Ross, Moore, Furlong,
Utility prop: Bent,
Hooker: Best, Cronin, Strauss, Herring,
LH Lock: 4. POC, Henderson, Tuohy,
TH Lock: 5. Toner, Ryan,
6. POM, Murphy,
7. SOB, O'Donnell, Henry,
8. Heaslip, Conan,
SH: Murray, Reddan, Marmion, Boss,
OH: Sexton, Jackson,
Utility OH/IC: Madigan,
IC: Henshaw, Cave, D'Arcy, Reid,
OC: Payne, Earls,
LW: Fitzgerald, Zebo, McFadden, D. Kearney,
RW: Bowe, Trimble, Gilroy,
FB: R. Kearney, Jones,

McFadden and Trimble are borderline depending on their performances.
IMO we will take 5 back three players, and it looks like Zebo, Bowe, Kearney, Jones + 1 more,
It will be a toss up between McFadden, Trimble and Fitzgerald.

vienne86

smiley_face wrote: »

McFadden and Trimble are borderline depending on their performances.
IMO we will take 5 back three players, and it looks like Zebo, Bowe, Kearney, Jones + 1 more,
It will be a toss up between McFadden, Trimble and Fitzgerald.

i think you are right, and I think Fitz will get the spot, but Zebo might need to fight a bit for his spot too.

The Pheasant2

smiley_face wrote: »

O'Donnell is ahead of Henry,

7. SOB, O'Donnell, Henry,

What are you basing this off? TBH barring injury in the upcoming games, I would bet my left nut that Henry will be on the plane ahead of O'Donnell

shuffol

Henry was one of our best players when we won the 6N, he's a class act and as clever as they come. If he shows close to his 2014 form he's a cert.

And Schmidt is a big fan of Henry

smiley_face

The Pheasant2 wrote: »

What are you basing this off? TBH barring injury in the upcoming games, I would bet my left nut that Henry will be on the plane ahead of O'Donnell

smiley_face wrote: »

Based on the 1st selection of the warm-up matches,

Simply, that O'Donnell is being given the starting spot at 7, and Henry is on the bench.

Of course this is speculation, and I did say that the match against Scotland will give guys a chance to make an impression and improve chance of selection.

It's quite possible that Henry will get his chance to start next weekend against the Scots.

All I'm saying is that based on this selection you could read into it if you want, that O'Donnell could be ahead after the summer training sessions.

total former

I'd be shocked if O'Donnell was ahead of Henry or Murphy, he'll need an injury to make the plane.

.ak

TBH I wouldn't shocked if he's ahead of Murphy, there both on par in terms of development and pecking order.. but I'd imagine Murphy will go if Henry goes, no point in bringing 3 out n out sevens in SOB/Henry/TOD.

Awesomeness

BODS opinion

Brian O'Driscoll ‏@BrianODriscoll 20m20 minutes ago

Interesting Ireland team for the weekend. A few lads need monster games to sneak in. Earlsy & Donncha Ryan just need solid performances.

I really like TOD but I can't see how he fits into the RWC squad really. Schmidt is a huge fan of Henry so I think he'll certainly travel and then Murphy just covers more positions and is just as good as TOD is.

smiley_face

Tara Small Yawn wrote: »

I really like TOD but I can't see how he fits into the RWC squad really. Schmidt is a huge fan of Henry so I think he'll certainly travel and then Murphy just covers more positions and is just as good as TOD is.

When O'Brien got injured in the warm-up (against Italy in the 2015 6 Nations), and O'Donnell played the match instead of him, O'Donnell actually stood out as the most dynamic back-row for Ireland on the day.
He is a speedy ball-carrier and he looks to run good angles.
Henry gets stuck into the work at the rucks and makes very few mistakes.
Perhaps at the moment in the training camp, O'Donnell is ahead in terms of fitness and that's why he's being given the starting spot.
OR perhaps it's just a toss of a coin, and Henry could start against Scotland.
Either way, O'Brien is safe as 1st choice, so we can rest him until the return match against Wales.

I think Murphy is a shoo-in, as he covers 6, 7, and 8 better than either Henry or O'Donnell.
As they are realistically fighting for a spot on the bench I think Murphy is a definite as overall he offers the best cover from the bench.

RoundBox11

I'd be seriously surprised if TOD travels ahead of Henry, barring injury.

I don't think i've ever really been overly impressed with O'Donnell. He's a good solid player at club level but I don't think he cuts the mustard at international level.

RoundBox11

RoundBox11 wrote: »

I'd be seriously surprised if TOD travels ahead of Henry, barring injury.

I don't think i've ever really been overly impressed with O'Donnell. He's a good solid player at club level but I don't think he cuts the mustard at international level.

In the game against England I thought both he and Murphy out performed O'Mahony. He went well against Italy also.

That said I don't think he will travel as I feel that pecking order is Heaslip, Seanie, O'Mahony, Murphy, Henry, O'Donnell but honestly it could go either way between the last two.

RoundBox11

Deleted User wrote: »

In the game against England I thought both he and Murphy out performed O'Mahony. He went well against Italy also.

That said I don't think he will travel as I feel that pecking order is Heaslip, Seanie, O'Mahony, Murphy, Henry, O'Donnell but honestly it could go either way between the last two.

Yeah Actually I agree he did do well in those games. I'd just be worried if we were relying on him starting at 7. Whereas I'd be happy with Henry starting.

I suppose depending on who was starting at 6 and 8, TOD could be useful for his mobility?

RoundBox11

RoundBox11 wrote: »

Yeah Actually I agree he did do well in those games. I'd just be worried if we were relying on him starting at 7. Whereas I'd be happy with Henry starting.

I suppose depending on who was starting at 6 and 8, TOD could be useful for his mobility?

Well to put it another way, Seanie is going to be starting at 7 for all the important games so if he is injured O'Donnell will get his chance.

smiley_face

RoundBox11 wrote: »

Yeah Actually I agree he did do well in those games. I'd just be worried if we were relying on him starting at 7. Whereas I'd be happy with Henry starting.

I suppose depending on who was starting at 6 and 8, TOD could be useful for his mobility?

Perhaps a combo of 6 POM, 8 Heaslip, would work well with TOD.
Perhaps 6 Henderson, 8 Heaslip would work better with Henry.

smiley_face

smiley_face wrote: »

When O'Brien got injured in the warm-up (against Italy in the 2015 6 Nations), and O'Donnell played the match instead of him, O'Donnell actually stood out as the most dynamic back-row for Ireland on the day.
He is a speedy ball-carrier and he looks to run good angles.
Henry gets stuck into the work at the rucks and makes very few mistakes.
Perhaps at the moment in the training camp, O'Donnell is ahead in terms of fitness and that's why he's being given the starting spot.
OR perhaps it's just a toss of a coin, and Henry could start against Scotland.
Either way, O'Brien is safe as 1st choice, so we can rest him until the return match against Wales.

I think Murphy is a shoo-in, as he covers 6, 7, and 8 better than either Henry or O'Donnell.
As they are realistically fighting for a spot on the bench I think Murphy is a definite as overall he offers the best cover from the bench.

Yes TOD played that day against Italy, but Henry wasn't available either. Nor was Ruddock who'd started in the backrow at 7 in the AIs when both Henry and SOB weren't available.

I've said I rate TOD so you don't need to extol his virtues, basically the whole forum things he's a good player from what I've read on here. But he got that game against Italy on the back of three players who would have been picked ahead of him being out.

I also think you're reading way too much into this selection. If we see Henry get a game later in a closer to full strength side I would say it'll give more of an indication that Henry is ahead. We'll wait and see but I don't expect to see TOD in the 31.

MattD

Having Murphy and Henry on the pitch at the same time would just mean two players who excell at the groundhog stuff getting in each others way. O'Donnell is more of a ball carrier than Henry so gets the start with Murphy to just give the back row balance.

I still think Henry is first back up to any injuries in the row.

smiley_face

Tara Small Yawn wrote: »

Yes TOD played that day against Italy, but Henry wasn't available either. Nor was Ruddock who'd started in the backrow at 7 in the AIs when both Henry and SOB weren't available.

I've said I rate TOD so you don't need to extol his virtues, basically the whole forum things he's a good player from what I've read on here. But he got that game against Italy on the back of three players who would have been picked ahead of him being out.

I also think you're reading way too much into this selection. If we see Henry get a game later in a closer to full strength side I would say it'll give more of an indication that Henry is ahead. We'll wait and see but I don't expect to see TOD in the 31.

You said you don't see how TOD fits in, well he fits in as a like-for-like replacement for SOB obviously.
Whether or not that's enough we'll have to wait and see.
Already have Murphy as a groundhog to back up Heaslip and POM, so maybe TOD would be worth having as backup for SOB.
We might not want two players as similar as Murphy and Henry to call on if SOB needs a break, it might be better to have Murphy and TOD, one groundhog and one ball-carrier available to call on.

smiley_face

smiley_face wrote: »

You said you don't see how TOD fits in, well he fits in as a like-for-like replacement for SOB obviously.
Whether or not that's enough we'll have to wait and see.
Already have Murphy as a groundhog to back up Heaslip and POM, so maybe TOD would be worth having as backup for SOB.
We might not want two players as similar as Murphy and Henry to call on if SOB needs a break, it might be better to have Murphy and TOD, one groundhog and one ball-carrier available to call on.

TOD wouldn't really be a like for like replacement for SOB even though they both wear 7 for their clubs. SOB's greatest attribute last three seasons is his breakdown work and whilst he is an exceptional ball carrier he has also developed into a world class openside. I also don't think Henry and Murphy are similar players at all, and Murphy travelling has more to do with his ability and experience at 8 primarily and 6,7 secondarily.

total former

The question is how many of the squad were decided on before training camps began. If the majority of places were already set in stone, as I think they were, then Murphy is a dead cert and Henry just had to show fitness.

TOD is one of the guys that, as BOD says, needs a monster performance tomorrow and even that might not be enough.

total former

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/international/joe-schmidt-keeping-cards-close-to-chest-as-he-looks-to-pare-down-squad-1.2310415

GT reckons five props to travel but McGrath's "ability to cover tight head" will see Kilcoyne picked and Bent with only an "outside chance".

Hmmm.

Podge_irl

total former wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/international/joe-schmidt-keeping-cards-close-to-chest-as-he-looks-to-pare-down-squad-1.2310415

GT reckons five props to travel but McGrath's "ability to cover tight head" will see Kilcoyne picked and Bent with only an "outside chance".

Hmmm.

He's really gone downhill. Can't believe he's paid for this ill-informed ****e

Podge_irl

Podge_irl wrote: »

He's really gone downhill. Can't believe he's paid for this ill-informed ****e

There was talk before Marty Moore came through of converting Jack McGrath to TH so as to have him and Healy on the pitch at the same time.

stephen_n

Yes but when has he played there at any serious level, would be a fairly big gamble going into a World Cup especially with Moores injury profile. Bent would be a far safer bet really.

irishbucsfan

stephen_n wrote: »

Yes but when has he played there at any serious level, would be a fairly big gamble going into a World Cup especially with Moores injury profile. Bent would be a far safer bet really.

He played there against Ospreys for Leinster briefly and then Leinster quickly decided after that to not use him there again. When Leinster played Ospreys in the Pro 12 final that year they went to uncontested scrums because they didn't have another TH, despite him being available.

molloyjh

If anything proves that GT has lost his inside track it is that. What a load of total codswallop.

shuffol

This talk surfaced last year also during the Argentina tour? It's up there with some of Tony Wards suggestions.

smiley_face

Joe Schmidt revealed that he will be cutting a few players this week before announcing the team to face Scotland, and also will be releasing certain players that won't get selected for the Scotland match to play their club matches the following week (Munster V Connacht, Leinster V Ulster).
He said he will go to watch both matches and will include those matches in informing his final selection decisions, but that performances for province will carry less weight as the level will be lower than International matches.
It seems to fit perfectly how these fixtures are falling, I wonder if it was planned that these Interpro matches would coincide with the warm-up series?

It seems likely that certain players will be cut without getting to play in either of the first two opening warm-up matches.

My assumption obviously is that the 1st choice 23 will not be released, and I'd guess we will put out as strong a team as possible against Scotland as there will be a two week break before the following 2 matches.
In that case most of the peripheral squad will be cut and a few will be told they will be watched in the Interpro matches.

Here's an early prediction if we put out a near full-strength side to face Scotland:
Probably Herring, Buckley, White and Furlong will be cut.
Front row players will prob be the same against Scotland, possibly swapping the bench to start this time.
Probably POC and Toner to start, with Henderson on the bench. Ryan prob won't be released but Tuohy should be released to see how he plays for Ulster.
Not sure who's available between POM and SOB, but would start the trio of POM, Henry and Heaslip, with SOB on the bench. Would not release Murphy to Leinster, but would probably cut Conan.
Sexton should start, with either Jackson or Madigan on the bench and the other released to play 10 for their province for match practice, prob would release Jackson.
Murray to start with Marmion on the bench, Reddan rested and Boss released to Leinster.
Henshaw and Payne to start. Both Cave and Earls to be rested. D'Arcy and Reid to be cut.
Zebo, R Kearney and Bowe to start, with D Kearney on the bench, McFadden rested and Gilroy released to Ulster.

irishbucsfan

I think we'll see Heaslip rested and POC starting and captaining. There's not a huge amount of value playing him again, we're not learning anything.

Might be worth starting Conan. He likely won't travel but he offers value as a natural 8 who can allow the flankers in the squad to start at their natural positions. I'd like to see POM Henry and Conan. It also might be worth seeing SOB at 8.

total former

shuffol wrote: »

This talk surfaced last year also during the Argentina tour? It's up there with some of Tony Wards suggestions.

McGrath actually did play a few minutes at tight head in Argentina IIRC, but only because Rodney Ah You.

The Pheasant2

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I think we'll see Heaslip rested and POC starting and captaining. There's not a huge amount of value playing him again, we're not learning anything.

Might be worth starting Conan. He likely won't travel but he offers value as a natural 8 who can allow the flankers in the squad to start at their natural positions. I'd like to see POM Henry and Conan. It also might be worth seeing SOB at 8.

Murphy impressed at 8 against England. Wouldn't mind giving him a go in a backrow of

POM
Henry
Murphy