Saorview LCN Policy

The Cush

The long awaited Saorview LCN Policy, now in the public domain

mackersdublin

According to the schedule pdf RTE Junior is on 209, that moved to 207 last year

Glad to see Oireachtas TV is proposed for LCN 22

Sam Russell

Are the the ones to complain to about the screw up of the signal by including 38 blank headers and reordering the broadcasting sequence of channels?

I have drawn a blank so far in finding out why the signal is being messed with.

Elmo

Are the BAI not supposed to regulate EPGs?

RTÉjr is general entertainment? Guessing it'll move for other channels.

Pointless paper work really.

Was there a similar doc before the arrival of UTV Ireland?

The Cush

Elmo wrote: »

Was there a similar doc before the arrival of UTV Ireland?

As this is v.13, yes, but nothing in the public domain.

Elmo

The Cush wrote: »

As this is v.13, yes, but nothing the public domain.

Not much point to it, future proof it

Gen Ent
1. RTÉ ONE
2. RTÉ2
3. TV3
4. TG4
5. 3e
6. UTV Ireland
+1s
11. RTÉ ONE +1
News/Current Affairs/Community/Docs
21. RTÉ News Now
22. Oireachtas TV
Film
31. IFB Channel
Children
41. RTÉjr
42. TRTÉ
Music
51 - 59
Sports
61 - 69
Radio
71 - 90
niche/teleshopping
91 - 99

Sam Russell

Elmo wrote: »

Not much point to it, future proof it

Gen Ent
1. RTÉ ONE
2. RTÉ2
3. TV3
4. TG4
5. 3e
6. UTV Ireland
+1s
11. RTÉ ONE +1
News/Current Affairs/Community/Docs
21. RTÉ News Now
22. Oireachtas TV
Film
31. IFB Channel
Children
41. RTÉjr
42. TRTÉ
Music
51 - 59
Sports
61 - 69
Radio
71 - 90
niche/teleshopping
91 - 99

You have not allowed for the 38 blank channels nor for the SSU channels that feck up my TV.:mad:

Elmo

Sam Russell wrote: »

You have not allowed for the 38 blank channels nor for the SSU channels that feck up my TV.:mad:

I have taken into consideration all blank channel

Do they need blank channels to provide spaces between numbers?

Sam Russell

No, they just need them to screw up non-Saorview TVs and STBs.

There is no explanation for any of the nonsense they have introduced since the summer.

And nobody is interested in resolving it.

Kensington

Sam Russell wrote: »

No, they just need them to screw up non-Saorview TVs and STBs.

There is no explanation for any of the nonsense they have introduced since the summer.

And nobody is interested in resolving it.

So long as it is considered "in-spec" then they can probably do what they like with no recourse for out-of-spec receiving equipment...

Sam Russell

Kensington wrote: »

So long as it is considered "in-spec" then they can probably do what they like with no recourse for out-of-spec receiving equipment...

Well can they?

They say they have no commercial interest in the approval process.

It is not their responsibility to deliberately mess up the signal with the intent of rendering non-approved units inoperable or degraded. I would have thought that its intent is anti-competitive at the very least.

Besides which, it messes up people with a Saorview approved set that wish to receive cross border services such as Freeview and Freesat.

Under the infamous MOU signed by the previous Government, the Irish Government gave an undertaking to cause the broadcasting standards to converge. This clearly flies in the face of that commitment.

http://www.dcenr.gov.ie/NR/rdonlyres/7FC4288D-714E-41D8-A139-8A309C2F9A14/0/UKNIROIMOUFeb2010.pdf

Particularly note under Co-operation the need to develop of equipment to allow reception of TV signals from both jurisdictions. This is not only not happening - it is deliberately being flouted.

pegasuspub

It is also causing a lot of annoyance to the tv trade where you may have digital and analogue signals carried along a system in a hotel or b+b for example,as a result of all of this changing it is difficult to give the operator a channel list that does not need frequent updates,
it really is most annoying and unprofessional spending hours organising a tv list of say 20 tv channels on numerous TV's only to have to re do it again and again.

icdg

Sam Russell wrote: »

Well can they?

They say they have no commercial interest in the approval process.

It is not their responsibility to deliberately mess up the signal with the intent of rendering non-approved units inoperable or degraded. I would have thought that its intent is anti-competitive at the very least.

Besides which, it messes up people with a Saorview approved set that wish to receive cross border services such as Freeview and Freesat.

Under the infamous MOU signed by the previous Government, the Irish Government gave an undertaking to cause the broadcasting standards to converge. This clearly flies in the face of that commitment.

http://www.dcenr.gov.ie/NR/rdonlyres/7FC4288D-714E-41D8-A139-8A309C2F9A14/0/UKNIROIMOUFeb2010.pdf

Particularly note under Co-operation the need to develop of equipment to allow reception of TV signals from both jurisdictions. This is not only not happening - it is deliberately being flouted.

That's the original version before it was hastily rewritten - wonder why it's still up on the Department's website?

On the substantive topic I'm not sure why a platform with only nine channels of which all but two are controlled by just two broadcasters needs an LCN policy.

Elmo

icdg wrote: »

On the substantive topic I'm not sure why a platform with only nine channels of which all but two are controlled by just two broadcasters needs an LCN policy.

4 are non-RTÉ Channels (TV3, TG4, 3e and UTV Ireland).

Especially when the BAI regulate the EPG/LCN, TV3 asked the BAI to move 3e!

The Cush

icdg wrote: »

On the substantive topic I'm not sure why a platform with only nine channels of which all but two are controlled by just two broadcasters needs an LCN policy.

Even though there are only 9 channels they still come from 4 separate broadcasters with maybe a fifth (Oireachtas) in future. The policy ensures Saorview LCN allocation is fair, reasonable, and non-discriminatory to current and future broadcasters.

Sam Russell

icdg wrote: »

That's the original version before it was hastily rewritten - wonder why it's still up on the Department's website?

On the substantive topic I'm not sure why a platform with only nine channels of which all but two are controlled by just two broadcasters needs an LCN policy.

I would think the control of the Saorview platform is the responsiblity of some agency but apparently not. Comreg says it is not them, they only regulate the frequencies. BAI says it is not them, they only regulate the broadcasters. RTE say its not them, they only do the multiplexing.. 2RN deny that they have anything to do with it apart from transmission.

I suppose the DCNR say it is looking into it.

When there is a buck to be passed ................

Elmo

Sam Russell wrote: »

I would think the control of the Saorview platform is the responsiblity of some agency but apparently not. Comreg says it is not them, they only regulate the frequencies. BAI says it is not them, they only regulate the broadcasters. RTE say its not them, they only do the multiplexing.. 2RN deny that they have anything to do with it apart from transmission.

I suppose the DCNR say it is looking into it.

When there is a buck to be passed ................

I would have thought that under the Broadcasting Act 2009 the buck lies with the Broadcasting Authority of Ireland and that it regulates the LCN and EPG.

26.— (1) The principal functions of the Authority are to—
(h) prepare rules and enter into contracts in respect of electronic programme guides,

Sam Russell

Elmo wrote: »

I would have thought that under the Broadcasting Act 2009 the buck lies with the Broadcasting Authority of Ireland and that it regulates the LCN and EPG.

26.— (1) The principal functions of the Authority are to—
(h) prepare rules and enter into contracts in respect of electronic programme guides,

Well, maybe - but I have been trying to find out why the Saorview signal has been screwed up and have been on a Billy to Jack errand. I could not care about LCN or EPG, I just want the 38 blank headers removed, and the two SSU channels put back where they used to be.

Elmo

Sam Russell wrote: »

Well, maybe - but I have been trying to find out why the Saorview signal has been screwed up and have been on a Billy to Jack errand. I could not care about LCN or EPG, I just want the 38 blank headers removed, and the two SSU channels put back where they used to be.

Then under the act the minister can direct the Authority to do X, Y and Z get your local TD to put forward asking the Minister if he would direct the Authority to look at the Saorview Signal.

The Cush

icdg wrote: »

That's the original version before it was hastily rewritten - wonder why it's still up on the Department's website?

The text of the MoU wasn't changed only the press release from the 2 governments, both governments still link to the original signed document. See post #1 here for the text posted from the MoU before the changes to the press releases happened, no mention of BBC being FTA.

Changes to the press release text - http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=64337941#post64337941
Original UK press release - http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20100408145658/http://britishembassyinireland.fco.gov.uk/resources/en/pdf/pdf1/digital-tv-press-release


UK MoU link - http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20100407154013/http://www.culture.gov.uk/reference_library/media_releases/6613.aspx/
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20100407154013/http://www.culture.gov.uk/images/publications/UK-NI-ROI_MOU_Feb_2010.pdf

The Cush

Elmo wrote: »

I would have thought that under the Broadcasting Act 2009 the buck lies with the Broadcasting Authority of Ireland and that it regulates the LCN and EPG.

26.— (1) The principal functions of the Authority are to—
(h) prepare rules and enter into contracts in respect of electronic programme guides,

The BCI published an EPG Licensing Policy document back in 2007 under the 2001/2007 Acts. I assume a revised 2009-Act version exists somewhere within the BAI.
That contracts probably refer to third party epgs, e.g. MHEG-5 epgs, similar to those carried on Freeview previously.

In the UK the broadcasters (DMOL/DigitalUK) publish and manage the LCN policy and allocate the LCNs in compliance with Ofcom’s code of practice on electronic programme guides.

Gerry Wicklow

I've asked before and now ask again, has anyone got a box or TV that is fully functional on Saorview that is not a Walker?
Proper LCNs
MHEG5 text
Summer time (when needed)
Series linking.
etc, etc

My Saorview approved Samsung TV lost series record last year after 2RN "fixed" it. Samsung say it's a 2RN problem, 2RN say it's Samsung. All I know is it used to work.