Staffie dog hogtied and cooked alive over a fire at The Curragh

Ihatecuddles

Reoil wrote: »

Why people would have such ugly, ugly dogs is beyond me.

I think they're gorgeous! I would love one.

The Th!ng

Reoil wrote: »

Why people would have such ugly, ugly dogs is beyond me.

The person thing who did this is the ugly one.

folan

brought a tear to my eye.

Frigga_92

K4t wrote: »

Hold on, so according to both of you and others, the life of a dog is more valuable than that of the lamb or a chicken or a pig or a fly or a spider (many of which we kill, torture and eat everyday) but you want similar punishments for abuse and torture of dogs as there are for humans? You are equating a dog's life to that of a human and therefore implying that all human life is not equal at the same time.


All animals are equal but some are more equal than others?

Who tortures lambs, chickens and pigs everyday? If you know of someone torturing animals everyday you surely have a duty to report it to the authorities?

Into The Blue

K4t wrote: »

Hold on, so according to both of you and others, the life of a dog is more valuable than that of the lamb or a chicken or a pig or a fly or a spider (many of which we kill, torture and eat everyday) but you want similar punishments for abuse and torture of dogs as there are for humans? You are equating a dog's life to that of a human and therefore implying that all human life is not equal at the same time.


All animals are equal but some are more equal than others?

Finally!

Kenny Logins

conorh91 wrote: »

It's horrible if it's true.

The dog was certainly tied up, but do we really know this is the unusual punishment that was inflicted on him? Is it possible he was tied up and dumped near a fire? That he passed out with hypothermia? His injuries don't look nearly serious enough to actually have been hogroasted. There seems to be very little burned hair on the sides. Even if he were tied up, he would be able to trash and wrestle, why did so much of his skin avoid burns?

Something about this story doesn't seem right. The Journal are basing everything on the account of a volunteer, the Vet's opinion is coming to us third-hand.

Yeah, sounds like guessing to me. Good for traffic though.

K4t

henryporter wrote: »

In the future scumbags like that will be psychologically evaluated at a very young age to determine their likelihood of committing such atrocities and if found to be suspect will be put into a brain dead state and then hooked up as an energy source for a computer or some such - at least that would give them some purpose, whereas at the moment they are nothing but an extreme liability on humanity and every other species on the planet.

You are in far greater need of a psychological evaluation if you truly believe that.

folan

The Th!ng wrote: »

The person thing who did this is the ugly one.

Sorry, this is an aside, but read your post and thought:

confession?

dodderangler

K4t wrote: »

.


All animals are equal but some are more equal than others?

Well it was in animal farm and look what happened there
Poor oul boxer

KatW4

Poor dog there are some sick people in this world.

The Th!ng

folan wrote: »

Sorry, this is an aside, but read your post and thought:

confession?

The Th!ng loves animals of all sorts, the person thing who did this does not.

K4t

26sdrawkcab wrote: »

Who tortures lambs, chickens and pigs everyday? If you know of someone torturing animals everyday you surely have a duty to report it to the authorities?

Factory farms all over the world where millions of animals are kept in captivity, often in horrible conditions, mutilated and killed and sold.


The death of one man is a tragedy, the death of millions is a statistic.


I'm not saying the torture of the dog isn't horrific behaviour either, but the hypocrisy involved and the abandonment of rational thinking in response to such events is equally concerning.

The Th!ng

For anyone doubting the veracity of the article on TheJournal here is a link to the Kildare and West Wicklow SPCA page on Facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/KWWSPCA
WARNING! EXTREMELY DISTRESSING CONTENT

BeerWolf

I own a Staffy myself, and this has made my blood boil... ****ers that do this should be permanently removed from society.

K4t

BeerWolf wrote: »

****ers that do this should be permanently removed from society.

Nah, they shouldn't.

Kenny Logins

The Th!ng wrote: »

For anyone doubting the veracity of the article on TheJournal here is a link to the Kildare and West Wicklow SPCA page on Facebook.

https://www.facebook.com/KWWSPCA
WARNING! EXTREMELY DISTRESSING CONTENT

Still guess work though, isn't it?

Foxhound38

Sofiztikated wrote: »

**** me, that's a horrific act.

But as regards punishment, it's hard to call. Where do you draw the line? Cruelty to dogs, sure, everyone loves dogs, but what if it was a cat? A rabbit? A bag of hamsters? What about spiders? If that was a box of these guys?

Does that still warrant the life sentence some people are baying for?

How about finding out who it was, and their reasons for doing it? Then maybe decide on a punishment?

Is there any "reason" that could possibly be valid or understandable for tying a defenceless creature up and roasting it alive? Whoever did this is one sick puppy

dodzy

Sadly, the little Staffie passed away today, despite the veterinary team doing everything they could to save him. At the end, all they could do was make him comfortable.

“They just kept him warm in heated blankets and cuddled him and reassured him.”


Sick story alright, but why the dog was not put down immediately raises some suspicion as to whether this actually happened IMO.

Foxhound38

Reoil wrote: »

Why people would have such ugly, ugly dogs is beyond me.

They are some of the most intelligent, loyal dogs you can get. As said before in this thread, the sad thing is that the poor little creature in this video would have forgiven his torturer.

Staffies unfortunately have a bit of a PR problem, mostly unearned.

The other fella

[QUOTE=K4t;94054429]Hold on, so according to both of you and others, the life of a dog is more valuable than that of the lamb or a chicken or a pig or a fly or a spider (many of which we kill, torture and eat everyday) but you want similar punishments for abuse and torture of dogs as there are for humans? You are equating a dog's life to that of a human and therefore implying that all human life is not equal at the same time.


All animals are equal but some are more equal than others?[/QUOTE]

Please, please show me where i said the life of a dog is more valuable than a sheep or a chicken?Please?

The other fella

People are upset when things like this happen to emotionally intelligent beings such as ourselves.

Using the line "but should someone be imprisoned over killing a spider" is just ridiculous, not that i need to point that out.People saying that are being purposely obtuse, just to go against the majority opinion in this thread.

Mr_Spaceman

K4t wrote: »

No, force them to undergo a full psychological assessment and give them counselling. And fine them.

Simple minded is sending a person to prison for life for physical abuse of an animal.

Yes, indeed. Particularly when a bullet would be cheaper.

demanufactured

K4t wrote: »

Nah, they shouldn't.

And what do you think should be done with thwem..I cant wait to hear this....

Sofiztikated

CaptainInsano wrote: »

Again with the comparisons to other animals. You're trying to reason that there comes a point when it's excusable to be a sadistic cnut, so may as well broaden the whole spectrum to all species?
You can't form a mutual emotional relationship with insects like you can with the other animals you mentioned, dogs and cats especially.
Having said that, if I met anyone torturing insects for the craic of it, I wouldn't ever associate with them again.

I mean legally. At what point does the mandatory life imprisonment/shotgun to the face become "Ah, here."

Foxhound38 wrote: »

Is there any "reason" that could possibly be valid or understandable for tying a defenceless creature up and roasting it alive? Whoever did this is one sick puppy

S/He could be a grade A psychopath, well on his way to murderin' and rapin', or they could have been tripping balls, and thought it was a BBQ, or they could be "a bit slow" [insert intellectual disability here] and not fully understood the concept of what they were doing.

K4t

The other fella wrote: »

People are upset when things like this happen to emotionally intelligent beings such as ourselves.

Nobody is arguing to the contrary.

Using the line "but should someone be imprisoned over killing a spider" is just ridiculous, not that i need to point that out.People saying that are being purposely obtuse, just to go against the majority opinion in this thread.

I'll assume this is aimed at me. Why is a dog's life valued more than any other animal? Why should a dog's life be treated as the equivalent of a human life when under the law when other animals are killed every day and we don't care? People were arguing that the person should be imprisoned, some even said for life. While at the same time they happily devour their lamb, chicken and steaks every night, even taking great pleasure in it (sadistic or what?) There is a hypocrisy involved but you're too busy ignoring it to even try to understand.

K4t

demanufactured wrote: »

And what do you think should be done with thwem..I cant wait to hear this....

As I said already, fined, and forced to undergo a psychological evaluation and counselling, which they probably should have had a long time before incidences such as this.

The other fella

K4t wrote: »

Nobody is arguing to the contrary.

K4t wrote: »

Hold on, so according to both of you and others, the life of a dog is more valuable than that of the lamb or a chicken or a pig or a fly or a spider (many of which we kill, torture and eat everyday) but you want similar punishments for abuse and torture of dogs as there are for humans? You are equating a dog's life to that of a human and therefore implying that all human life is not equal at the same time.


All animals are equal but some are more equal than others?

You just tried to suggest i was arguing for the contrary.I dont care if someone kills a fly or spider because they are not emotionally intelligent beings.

The other fella

K4t wrote: »

Nobody is arguing to the contrary.

I'll assume this is aimed at me. Why is a dog's life valued more than any other animal? Why should a dog's life be treated as the equivalent of a human life when under the law when other animals are killed every day and we don't care? People were arguing that the person should be imprisoned, some even said for life. While at the same time they happily devour their lamb, chicken and steaks every night, even taking great pleasure in it (sadistic or what?) There is a hypocrisy involved but you're too busy ignoring it to even try to understand.

Its not? You cant just make up random sentences like this and try to make out i was the one who was insinuating it.
Im ignoring what exactly?

Blatter

K4t wrote: »

While at the same time they happily devour their lamb, chicken and steaks every night, even taking great pleasure in it (sadistic or what?) There is a hypocrisy involved but you're too busy ignoring it to even try to understand.

I think you need to learn to understand the difference between cooking an already dead animal and torturing one by burning it alive.

Ave Sodalis

K4t wrote: »

I'll assume this is aimed at me. Why is a dog's life valued more than any other animal? Why should a dog's life be treated as the equivalent of a human life when under the law when other animals are killed every day and we don't care? People were arguing that the person should be imprisoned, some even said for life. While at the same time they happily devour their lamb, chicken and steaks every night, even taking great pleasure in it (sadistic or what?) There is a hypocrisy involved but you're too busy ignoring it to even try to understand.

Can you not see the difference between killing an animal for food and roasting a dog alive?

Yes, there's cruelty in some methods of butchering animals. However, that's not what this thread is about. This thread is about a dog who was tortured.

And in any rate, stepping on a spider is much different to holding it over an open fire and slowly roasting alive. If someone was doing that to spiders or flies, I'd be concerned too.

The other fella

Blatter wrote: »

I think you need to learn to understand the difference between cooking an already dead animal and torturing one by burning it alive.

Exactly this! People eat cows/sheep to survive. Burning that poor little dog was of no advantage to anyone.

Omackeral

Punishing whoever did this is absolutely correct. However, the people saying they should get a life sentence, have them locked up and the key thrown away or even hanged are spouting emotional hyperbole (I hope). Few years inside and/or a mental evaluation is more fitting.

Also,those with torturous violent revenge porn thoughts like sledgehammers to the balls, you're not exactly painting yourself in the best light. That's sick too. Punish them in the usual ways otherwise, society as a whole suffers if you drop to their level.

Frog Song

My heart sinks when I hear things like this. That poor animal I can't cope with stories like this, they stay with me. Evil bastard that did that, how the hell can anyone get a kick out of doing something like that?! Wtf is wrong with them?! They're probably laughing away to themselves today at the attention it's getting :mad:

Ireland is a small country, if anyone hears of who did this please do the right thing.

Poor dog

eviltwin

K4t wrote: »

Nobody is arguing to the contrary.

I'll assume this is aimed at me. Why is a dog's life valued more than any other animal? Why should a dog's life be treated as the equivalent of a human life when under the law when other animals are killed every day and we don't care? People were arguing that the person should be imprisoned, some even said for life. While at the same time they happily devour their lamb, chicken and steaks every night, even taking great pleasure in it (sadistic or what?) There is a hypocrisy involved but you're too busy ignoring it to even try to understand.

I can see your point but if death was the intention here there are quicker and more effective ways to do it. What this person did was an act of cruelty designed to inflict as much pain and fear as possible on that poor dog. I can't get my head around someone thinking this let alone doing it. Poor little fella, hopefully he'll recover mentally from it.

K4t

The other fella wrote: »

You just tried to suggest i was arguing for the contrary.I dont care if someone kills a fly or spider because they are not emotionally intelligent beings.

How can you prove conclusively that insects are not emotionally intelligent? What about pigs, cows, sheep? Why is it acceptable to kill and torture them? The guy has problems but let's not reduce ourselves to his level or even lower by asking for violent revenge for the dog and life sentences. He needs help, as do many in this thread.

The other fella wrote: »

Exactly this! People eat cows/sheep to survive. Burning that poor little dog was of no advantage to anyone.

How do you know he wasn't planning on eating the dog?


Is it absolutely necessary to eat cows/sheep rather than dogs to survive?

CaptainInsano

K4t wrote: »

How can you prove conclusively that insects are not emotionally intelligent? What about pigs, cows, sheep? Why is it acceptable to kill and torture them? The guy has problems but let's not reduce ourselves to his level or even lower by asking for violent revenge for the dog and life sentences. He needs help, as do many in this thread.

How do you know he wasn't planning on eating the dog?


Is it absolutely necessary to eat cows/sheep rather than dogs to survive?

You really think he intended to eat the dog? You're clutching at straws at this point.

anncoates

Reoil wrote: »

Why people would have such ugly, ugly dogs is beyond me.

You get attached to them, regardless of their appearance.

Like your ma did with you, presumably.

K4t

eviltwin wrote: »

I can see your point but if death was the intention here there are quicker and more effective ways to do it. What this person did was an act of cruelty designed to inflict as much pain and fear as possible on that poor dog. I can't get my head around someone thinking this let alone doing it. Poor little fella, hopefully he'll recover mentally from it.

There's no denying the guy has problems. Possibly serious ones. But the majority of people are thinking emotionally rather than rationally about this case, which is understandable, but not necessarily right.

K4t

CaptainInsano wrote: »

You really think he intended to eat the dog? You're clutching at straws at this point.

It's possible. We kill animals everyday for consumption and many of them are tortured. That's life.
At the end of the day, humans are the dominant species for the most part and it is our duty to protect animals as much as we can, but when you start trying to apply the same moral principles to animals as humans, and trying to equate animals with humans under the law, you're fooling nobody but yourself.

The other fella

K4t wrote: »

How can you prove conclusively that insects are not emotionally intelligent? What about pigs, cows, sheep? Why is it acceptable to kill and torture them? The guy has problems but let's not reduce ourselves to his level or even lower by asking for violent revenge for the dog and life sentences. He needs help, as do many in this thread.

How do you know he wasn't planning on eating the dog?


Is it absolutely necessary to eat cows/sheep rather than dogs to survive?

1.Google can lead you to studies proving these things.

2.He put him over a low burning fire, while he was still alive,and then went away and left him there.If your cooking chicken, do you light fires in a racecourse, hogtie the bird and hang him over it while hes still alive and then leave?

Whispered

This happened down the road from me I know the vets involved and they are fantastic - both of my dogs brought back from the brink of death by them.

I feel sick thinking about it, I hope the gardai are taking it seriously. To think someone with that ability for cruelty is wandering around is worrying. Somebody knows who did this, somebody recognises this dog. I'd happily donate to a "reward for information" fund - the person who did this needs to be found and evaluated.

eviltwin

K4t wrote: »

There's no denying the guy has problems. Possibly serious ones. But the majority of people are thinking emotionally rather than rationally about this case, which is understandable, but not necessarily right.

Ah come on. The pain of being cooked alive would be immense. That poor dog would have been in great distress. Anyone who could stand by and not be affected by that doesn't have a heart. Saying that you plan on eating the dog doesn't excuse the torture involved in killing it.

K4t

K4t wrote: »

There's no denying the guy has problems. Possibly serious ones. But the majority of people are thinking emotionally rather than rationally about this case, which is understandable, but not necessarily right.

Here's rational - humans are animals too, with a little more intelligence. We're supposed to know better. To seperate humans from animals is to apply human context, emotion and understanding of the world (god, chosen species, here for a purpose that puts us above animals etc etc) to your understanding of day to day life.

You are the one being irrational, you just can't comprehend it. But then again, some of us animals are a little less smart than others. Doesn't mean we'll be roasting you over a fire.

lazza14

He was still trying to lick your hand – that’s the awful sad part, he’d forgive you, you know, it’s just very sad.

That had me welling up - absolute savagery ... what kind of mind does this ?

Zanablue

I just read this and feel sick and sad. It made me go and give my dog an extra hug. Hope the brats that did this are caught and punished for what they did to that poor little dog.

K4t

The other fella wrote: »

1.Google can lead you to studies proving these things.

2.He put him over a low burning fire, while he was still alive,and then went away and left him there.If your cooking chicken, do you light fires in a racecourse, hogtie the bird and hang him over it while hes still alive and then leave?

There is no conclusive evidence. Only studies.

I don't personally. I'm not arguing against the horrific nature of this, I'm arguing against the horrific reaction by some people to what happened.

Sergio Georgini wrote: »

Here's rational - humans are animals too, with a little more intelligence. We're supposed to know better. To seperate humans from animals is to apply human context, emotion and understanding of the world (god, chosen species, here for a purpose that puts us above animals etc etc) to your understanding of day to day life.

Of course. My argument is that we should not value one animal as more important than another under our human laws.

eviltwin wrote: »

Ah come on. The pain of being cooked alive would be immense. That poor dog would have been in great distress. Anyone who could stand by and not be affected by that doesn't have a heart. Saying that you plan on eating the dog doesn't excuse the torture involved in killing it.

I never said I wasn't affected by it. It's horrific. What I am saying is that anyone arguing that this is cause for the perpetrator to be imprisoned or put down himself and so on is engaging in hypocrisy and using their affiliation with dogs as opposed to other animals to cloud their judgement. It can't be one rule for one animal and a different rule for another.

Ave Sodalis

K4t wrote: »

Of course. My argument is that we should not value one animal as more important than another under our human laws.

I'm not sure if you mean that animals are equal to each other here or if you mean that humans are above animals?

The other fella

K4t wrote: »

There is no conclusive evidence. Only studies.

I don't personally. I'm not arguing against the horrific nature of this, I'm arguing against the horrific reaction by some people to what happened.

Of course. My argument is that we should not value one animal as more important than another under our human laws.

I never said I wasn't affected by it. It's horrific. What I am saying is that anyone arguing that this is cause for the perpetrator to be imprisoned or put down himself and so on is engaging in hypocrisy and using their affiliation with dogs as opposed to other animals to cloud their judgement. It can't be one rule for one animal and a different rule for another.

You are obviously a vegan of course, arent you?

The other fella

Fair play to the organisation who came to help him too, even just for comforting him in his last few hours.I always think id love to do something in that line of work, but imagine turning up to a scene like that.

The people working/volunteering there should be proud of themselves for what they do.

Omackeral

K4t wrote: »

Hold on, so according to both of you and others, the life of a dog is more valuable than that of the lamb or a chicken or a pig or a fly or a spider (many of which we kill, torture and eat everyday) but you want similar punishments for abuse and torture of dogs as there are for humans? You are equating a dog's life to that of a human and therefore implying that all human life is not equal at the same time.


All animals are equal but some are more equal than others?

K4t I started a thread on when animal cruelty becomes 'acceptable' ,for want of a better word, the further down the food chain you go. Dogs being hurt would be inexcusable according to most obviously whereas spiders etc wouldn't garner as much sympathy. You might take a look and check out some peoples opinions on which animals are more equal than others. Feel free to add your own on it too and we might generate a bit more discussion.


http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=89930276