Stephen Fry on confronting god after death

Dan_Solo

seamus wrote: »

So, Jesus Christ has the power to "grant you a will of repentance and grant you the ability to turn from a person of the world to a child of the lord" and to "[give] you eyes and ears so you can both see and hear the truth", yet he chooses not to, until you pray to him on Dan_Solo's behalf.

What's the deal there? Why does he require prayer before he'll save someone from suffering? He would rather you stroke his ego than selflessly save someone from suffering?

Even better is he gave us all free will apparently.
Unless Terrlock prays on my behalf, in which case god will change my brain and make me be holy.
Dafuq?

floggg

Terrlock wrote: »

I don't pray to Angels.

However I will pray to Christ Jesus on your behalf.

I pray that he gives you eyes and ears so you can both see and hear the truth.

I pray that he will grant you a will of repentance and grant you the ability to turn from a person of the world to a child of the lord.

Not because it benefits me or God, it's because I would not like you to suffer just because of foolish ignorance and pride.

If your are unwilling for this to happen right now, then I pray that your life is not cut short so you have every chance to come into repentance.

Since we are being condescending now, do you really think it's wise for somebody who believes in a bunch of fables about talking bushes and sky fairies written by a relatively primitive society of shepards and farmers who lacked even a basic understanding of the earth they lived on, never mind the universe, to be calling somebody ignorant?

Pray all you want. Thankfully you won't be disappointed by learninh the truth when you die, seeing as you'll just be dead.

Dead men don't feel disappointed. They are just dead.

Terrlock

dark crystal wrote: »

Do you believe Steven Fry will be in more trouble with God for not believing than believers who carry out heinous acts in his name?

Also, you are telling a lie when you say everyone knows God exists. Lies aren't good. The bible tells us so.

It's not about trouble and I pray that some how Steven Fry will be saved.

It's simply when God confronts him, he will know instantly the Glory of God.

He will know in a microsecond that the case he wishes to argue is complete non sense and have absolutely know grounding or significance and he will know that God is Just. God will never need to defend himself from any accusations. Your own heart and spirit will testify to the Lord.



Also I am not lying when I say that everyone knows God exists.

Even the hidden tribes in the Amazon know of God.


The Bible says that God reveals Himself to us through nature:…because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse

pueblo

Dan_Solo wrote: »

FFS, you can't say you're not arguing there's a god and then try to tell me there is by quoting the bible. If you're insisting logic is not important, then why not just type "ejifo\shglser" and do a little jig? It would be just as useful in a discussion.

Again, important to be precise here...I didn't quote the bible, I quoted Ron Brackin and I certainly didn't tell you there is a God as you state above.

Perhaps you didn't really read my post?

I am not insisting logic is not important. I am insisting logic is not useful in trying to determine the existence (or non-existence) of God.

Akrasia

Emersyn Deep Destroyer wrote: »

You will pay a lot more heavily if the church pulls all their property from use due to people pushing for the removal of teaching the catholic faith in schools. After all it would be ridiculous to if it wasn't taught in a catholic school owned by the church.

That's a lot of new schools that would have to be built....

That's right, our children have already been bought and paid for....

PopePalpatine

Emersyn Deep Destroyer wrote: »

You will pay a lot more heavily if the church pulls all their property from use due to people pushing for the removal of teaching the catholic faith in schools. After all it would be ridiculous to if it wasn't taught in a catholic school owned by the church.

That's a lot of new schools that would have to be built....

We can just write it off against the compensation that the Church owes its victims.

danrua01

Terrlock wrote: »

Also I am not lying when I say that everyone knows God exists.

I think you are.

TireeTerror

It is quite astounding that educated people believe in any form of religion. The entire concept is ludicrous.

If we were not taught about religion, or cursed by having religious parents, then there would be no religion. Thats not to say we would not find another reason to fight and to hate each other over in its absence.

danrua01

TireeTerror wrote: »

It is quite astounding that educated people believe in any form of religion. The entire concept is ludicrous.

If we were not taught about religion, or cursed by having religious parents, then there would be no religion. Thats not to say we would not find another reason to fight and to hate each other over in its absence.

I don't believe in religion but what you're saying is a bit offensive. My mother was, and is, religious, and she has raised me very well. She was definitely not a curse.

People are free to have faith, it can be good for a person. Intelligence doesn't come into it, and it doesn't affect it.

PopePalpatine

danrua01 wrote: »

I think you are.

I think it's more that he's unaware/wilfully ignorant of the Pirahã people.

pueblo

TireeTerror wrote: »

It is quite astounding that educated people believe in any form of religion. The entire concept is ludicrous.

If we were not taught about religion, or cursed by having religious parents, then there would be no religion. Thats not to say we would not find another reason to fight and to hate each other over in its absence.

I disagree. You confuse religion with spirituality.

Mankind has always had a sense of the spiritual world. Yes, it gets messed up when humans write it down and enforce it as dogma, but that just us.

The Zen saying 'Don't confuse the finger pointing at the moon with the moon' is relevant here, religion is only the finger, not the moon.

2015dude

cloud493 wrote: »

No, cos faiths have to be discussed and criticised. Otherwise it isn't faith, its bollocks.

Hahahahaha brilliant

jobbridge4life

kunst nugget wrote: »

At least the smartphone is a communication device that works. I tried talking to God in a church and I heard nothing back. I think the Holy Trinity needs to get 4G in…

I mean I wasn't specifically defending churches (I just really like impressive buildings) but while we are at it I could say at least the churches probably brought some solace/comfort/happiness to some people.

ScumLord

floggg wrote: »

Sorry, but the church coming to new lands was rarely a good package.

The church was more often an agent of destruction in colonized lands - enforcing its views, destroying social and political systems, legitimising appalling atrocities done in the name of progress, and opening up communities for exploration and exploitation by european agents.

The church played a shameful role in many colonisations.

It played a role yes but many colonisations were just a change of management. Some lands were so used to being invaded that it was just a matter of them getting a new tax collector. It all depends on the era but in the early days I think the church was probably a much nicer, more open and less of a tool of power mongering and that their intentions and actions were pretty decent. The Catholic church wasn't really the Christianity that came to Ireland originally, we had our own pretty unique version that saw colleges and hospitals popping up and Ireland becoming known as the island of saints and scholars. Europe was in turmoil, there were never ending power struggles and a culture of violence. That wasn't the fault of the church, sure the church got involved but they were just a player rather than the instrumentors.

You can't really judge people back then by modern standards. It was a different society and what was considered normal was different.

Dan_Solo

pueblo wrote: »

Again, important to be precise here...I didn't quote the bible, I quoted Ron Brackin and I certainly didn't tell you there is a God as you state above.

Perhaps you didn't really read my post?

I am not insisting logic is not important. I am insisting logic is not useful in trying to determine the existence (or non-existence) of God.

You quoted a guy quoting the bible. Huge difference there. Mega apologies.
You are merely doing a word swap. god/spirituality/majesty of the universe. We've heard all these before. It's theism by thesaurus.
How do you expect to explain this spirituality to anybody if you can't use logic to do so might I ask?

Terrlock

floggg wrote: »

Since we are being condescending now, do you really think it's wise for somebody who believes in a bunch of fables about talking bushes and sky fairies written by a relatively primitive society of shepards and farmers who lacked even a basic understanding of the earth they lived on, never mind the universe, to be calling somebody ignorant?

Pray all you want. Thankfully you won't be disappointed by learninh the truth when you die, seeing as you'll just be dead.

Dead men don't feel disappointed. They are just dead.

Sorry I'm not trying to be condescending, I genuinely will pray for him.

What is this bunch of fables that you talk about?

Where are these sky faires?

Also what primitive farmers are your referring too? How were they primitive?

What basic understanding of the earth and universe did they not have?


As for death, my flesh may die, however my soul and spirit will not.


I have everlasting life, do you?

mikom

Emersyn Deep Destroyer wrote: »

You will pay a lot more heavily if the church pulls all their property from use due to people pushing for the removal of teaching the catholic faith in schools.

The church can use the vacant buildings for housing the dodgy priests moved on from their parishes.
It'll be like warehousing the E-voting machines only more shameful.

TireeTerror

danrua01 wrote: »

I don't believe in religion but what you're saying is a bit offensive. My mother was, and is, religious, and she has raised me very well. She was definitely not a curse.

People are free to have faith, it can be good for a person. Intelligence doesn't come into it, and it doesn't affect it.

Offence is a very personal thing. You should not allow yourself to be offended by the opinion of another.

The whole "you should respect what others believe" is nonsense, its pandering to the weak of mind. It is precisely this kind of sentimentality which is damaging to the advancement of society.

There is as much truth in the belief of Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy as there ought to be in religion. The notion that a grown adult genuinely believes in Santa Claus would be ridiculed and people would consider them to have mental issues. Believing in an entirely man made fiction such as religion is just as insane.

I genuinely pity people who have wasted their short time on this planet devoting themselves to a cult like Christianity or every other form of the insipid bile contained in various bibles.

I imagine an alien species coming to earth and asking me to explain religion and all I would feel is shame and I could only explain it as the weakest part of humanity.

In reality, the human species is pretty vile and disgusting. Only yesterday I saw a news report on ISIS throwing a blindfolded man from a rooftop several stories from the ground. The victim did not die from the fall, however the baying crowd then stoned him to death. His crime? Well he was alleged to have been gay.

I think no further words need to be said to said to prove how vile all religion is.

pueblo

Dan_Solo wrote: »

You quoted a guy quoting the bible. Huge difference there. Mega apologies.
You are merely doing a word swap. god/spirituality/majesty of the universe. We've heard all these before. It's theism by thesaurus.
How do you expect to explain this spirituality to anybody if you can't use logic to do so might I ask?

Ok, your sarcasm is noted.

I don't expect to 'explain' spirituality to anyone. The problem here is the word 'explain' which implies use of logic.

Unfortunately the only way to 'understand' spirituality is to experience it, using your spirit, not your mind.

pueblo

TireeTerror wrote: »

Offence is a very personal thing. You should not allow yourself to be offended by the opinion of another.

The whole "you should respect what others believe" is nonsense, its pandering to the weak of mind. It is precisely this kind of sentimentality which is damaging to the advancement of society.

There is as much truth in the belief of Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy as there ought to be in religion. The notion that a grown adult genuinely believes in Santa Claus would be ridiculed and people would consider them to have mental issues. Believing in an entirely man made fiction such as religion is just as insane.

I genuinely pity people who have wasted their short time on this planet devoting themselves to a cult like Christianity or every other form of the insipid bile contained in various bibles.

I imagine an alien species coming to earth and asking me to explain religion and all I would feel is shame and I could only explain it as the weakest part of humanity.

In reality, the human species is pretty vile and disgusting. Only yesterday I saw a news report on ISIS throwing a blindfolded man from a rooftop several stories from the ground. The victim did not die from the fall, however the baying crowd then stoned him to death. His crime? Well he was alleged to have been gay.

I think no further words need to be said to said to prove how vile all religion is.

What if God is that alien? Imagine the shame...:D

danrua01

TireeTerror wrote: »

Offence is a very personal thing. You should not allow yourself to be offended by the opinion of another.

The whole "you should respect what others believe" is nonsense, its pandering to the weak of mind. It is precisely this kind of sentimentality which is damaging to the advancement of society.

Please don't be offended, then, when I share my opinion that you are an absolute b*stard and would like to see you shot.

It's not "weak" to respect what others believe and let them live their lives.

seamus

pueblo wrote: »

What if God is that alien? Imagine the shame...:D

Then he's not God, he's an alien

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"

pueblo

seamus wrote: »

Then he's not God, he's an alien

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"

No, then he would be an Alien-God.

Dan_Solo

pueblo wrote: »

Unfortunately the only way to 'understand' spirituality is to experience it, using your spirit, not your mind.

Again the thesaurus theism. I don't have a spirit because there is no such thing. It cannot be demonstrated to me in any fashion by another person.

dark crystal

Terrlock wrote: »

It's not about trouble and I pray that some how Steven Fry will be saved.

It's simply when God confronts him, he will know instantly the Glory of God.

You say you're not talking about trouble, yet you go on to say you pray that Steven Fry will be saved. From what exactly?

Also I am not lying when I say that everyone knows God exists.

Even the hidden tribes in the Amazon know of God.

You are lying when you say everyone knows God exists, though. It has never been proven and many people look for proof before blindly believing in something. I don't believe God exists, therefore your statement is wrong. Believe what you like, but it is supremely arrogant to speak on behalf of everybody.

The Bible says that God reveals Himself to us through nature:…because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse

With all due respect, I don't put any store in what The Bible says any more than I put any store in What the Qu'ran says or what Hans Christian Anderson says.

Until definitive proof is forthcoming on God's existence, I'll continue to listen to actual real men and women who have come up with actual real evidence for where all that nature stuff came from. I believe in Dinosaurs because we can prove they existed even though we can't see them anymore. I don't believe that we are all descendants of Adam and Eve because it makes about as much logical sense as Alice in Wonderland.

Dan_Solo

danrua01 wrote: »

Please don't be offended, then, when I share my opinion that you are an absolute b*stard and would like to see you shot.

But that isn't a critique of an opinion at all. Is that so hard to understand?

TireeTerror

danrua01 wrote: »

Please don't be offended, then, when I share my opinion that you are an absolute b*stard and would like to see you shot.

It's not "weak" to respect what others believe and let them live their lives.

I think you should have a wee cup of tea and calm down.

I wonder what you would think if I decided to write a book extolling the glory of molesting innocent children. I would promise an eternity of joy and wonder for those who tampered with children and babies. I would call it my bible. I would threaten an eternity of suffering to those who did not follow my every word.

For those that did decide to follow this "bible", would you so generously afford them the respect to carry on with their beliefs?

An extreme example for sure, but I could provide hundreds if not tens of thousands of examples of vile barbaric actions by the Catholic Church over the years, and these things are ongoing.

When believers are so willing to turn away from the truth of religion, despite their leaders abusing children in this very country, and the elders then covering it up, I will not respect them, for they are weak and worthy of no respect.

EDIT: Actually believers in religion are not necessarily weak, I have been too harsh and too quick to judge. With more thought they are actually victims themselves and they require assistance to try and awaken them from a lifetime of brainwashing. Its unlikely to help though, the best bet is to loosen the shackles of religion in the schools and eventually with each passing generation, religion will die.

danrua01

Oh dear. Enjoy your trolling, anyway.

TireeTerror

danrua01 wrote: »

Oh dear. Enjoy your trolling, anyway.

Will you say a prayer for me?

pueblo

Dan_Solo wrote: »

Again the thesaurus theism. I don't have a spirit because there is no such thing. It cannot be demonstrated to me in any fashion by another person.

What is this thesaurus theism you keep mentioning? Word worship??

You seem to think language somehow doesn't matter.. ..it does....

Proof you have spirit may be something that can be demonstrated sooner than you think. The Double Slit experiment seems to imply that reality is created by consciousness... what do you think the implications of that would mean for the possibility of the existence of a God?

"The QMP (quantum measurement problem) is a problem because it violates the common-sense doctrine of realism, which assumes that the world at large is independent of observation.

If that doctrine turns out to be even slightly wrong, then some aspect of consciousness may play a key role in the manifestation of the physical world, as some of the world's esoteric and mystical traditions, and a good portion of Eastern philosophy, have long maintained."

http://www.noetic.org/blog/double-slit-in-physics-essays/

Terrlock

dark crystal wrote: »

You say you're not talking about trouble, yet you go on to say you pray that Steven Fry will be saved. From what exactly?





You are lying when you say everyone knows God exists, though. It has never been proven and many people look for proof before blindly believing in something. I don't believe God exists, therefore your statement is wrong. Believe what you like, but it is supremely arrogant to speak on behalf of everybody.




With all due respect, I don't put any store in what The Bible says any more than I put any store in What the Qu'ran says or what Hans Christian Anderson says.

Until definitive proof is forthcoming on God's existence, I'll continue to listen to actual real men and women who have come up with actual real evidence for where all that nature stuff came from. I believe in Dinosaurs because we can prove they existed even though we can't see them anymore. I don't believe that we are all descendants of Adam and Eve because it makes about as much logical sense as Alice in Wonderland.

I would pray that Steven Fry to be saved from the 2nd death.

Also again we don't need evidence that god exists as it's plainly obvious to all who don't deny him that he does exist. It's so obvious it is foolishness to even argue over it.


You don't want to believe in him, as you know if you do, you'd have to change your ways. You like your sinful ways and living your life they way you think is best. The lord gives you over to this. He does not try and change your mind. In fact he willingly allows you to deny him.

danrua01

TireeTerror wrote: »

Will you say a prayer for me?

Nah, I'm not religious! I'll throw a penny into the Trevi fountain next time I'm there, though.

ScumLord

Terrlock wrote: »

Also what primitive farmers are your referring too? How were they primitive?

According to the almighty google and wiki gods the Jews that wrote the bible wouldn't have been primitive. Not being able to write is a sign of a primitive peoples.

What basic understanding of the earth and universe did they not have?

Pretty much everything, they didn't know they were standing on a planet, they didn't know about the universe, they didn't know the sun was a star, they didn't know what lightning was, the list is virtually endless.

I have everlasting life, do you?

Nana nana bo bo.

ScumLord

Terrlock wrote: »

Also again we don't need evidence that god exists as it's plainly obvious to all who don't deny him that he does exist. It's so obvious it is foolishness to even argue over it.

How is it obvious? If the bible didn't exist neither would the god it describes.

You don't want to believe in him, as you know if you do, you'd have to change your ways.

This is simply delusional.

TireeTerror

Terrlock wrote: »

I would pray that Steven Fry to be saved from the 2nd death.

Also again we don't need evidence that god exists as it's plainly obvious to all who don't deny him that he does exist. It's so obvious it is foolishness to even argue over it.


You don't want to believe in him, as you know if you do, you'd have to change your ways. You like your sinful ways and living your life they way you think is best. The lord gives you over to this. He does not try and change your mind. In fact he willingly allows you to deny him.

Are you actually serious in this post? If you are, I actually do not even know what to say. It is incredulous and quite fascinating.

However I just cannot bring myself to believe that you believe this, because you must be trolling for sure.

2015dude

pueblo wrote: »

What if God is that alien? Imagine the shame...:D

A good point u make

K4t

Emersyn Deep Destroyer wrote: »

Why is a scientist of faith not a real believer. I'm a scientist and don't see myself as any different to any one else at mass on a Sunday just because of my chosen career.

Firstly, I will concede to you that the world can never be rid of religion. And that is because it can never be rid of the human impulses behind it; Fear, Hatred, Anti-Intellectualism, Sadism, Masochism, Sexism. All the same really. Religion is a part of all humans; the worst part. It is a fight against our own nature. For example, The Nazis built motorways (good things), but their defining characteristics, the things which they were really about, were evil. What religion does well most social organisations do well; Tennis clubs, gaa clubs, charities, rotary clubs etc. Now to answer your question..

But what really makes a religion? What is the necessary condition? An exclusive faith that trumps other sources of truth. You might say what is wrong with that when we have so many educated religious people like yourself, scientists, mathematicians, philosophers etc.? It's because it is an intellectual contradiction; To think scientifically about the rest of your life, but to leave your enquiring, rationalist self at the door of the church. The scientists, the mathematicians, the philosophers who all hold religious beliefs are engaged in compartmentalized thinking. And it is so common because it is socially conditioned and culturally pervasive and a part of human nature as I've said. What's wrong with that you say? The scientists and mathematicians religious belief perpetuates faith. It gives the "real believers" intellectual cover, many of whom involve extremists and Jihadists and so on. And how is that the scientists and mathematicians fault? It's not either, there is nothing wrong with having faith per se, but it does involve a scary amount of doublethink and it can be dangerous as I'll explain.

And the main reason why it can be dangerous is because the "real believers", who are given intellectual cover by the intelligent, rational, more enlightened people of faith like presumably yourself, are the ones who lobby our governments in the name of religion and religious beliefs and attempt to force their beliefs on others. And governments are delighted to give in. Really, it's the moderates who are the greatest threat, the liberal apologists if you like. It's why say Cameron and Blair support faith schools in Britain and a string of same such measures in Ireland exist.

So I hope you understand from this post that when I criticise religion and religious belief I am not intending to personally cause you or any other person of faith personal harm. It is not in my nature believe it or not! I simply want to see a secular Irish state and for everyone to be free to practice and believe whatever they want, and for nothing to be free from criticism or even offence, and everyone equal under the law.


And any hope there is of that happening relies ultimately on freedom of speech and expression (getting rid of that blasphemy law first). And of course then a move towards a secular Irish state with separation of church and state in the constitution. Everyone will be free and equal under the law.

robinph

Terrlock wrote: »

Also again we don't need evidence that god exists as it's plainly obvious to all who don't deny him that he does exist. It's so obvious it is foolishness to even argue over it.

Humour us and show us some of this proof then. Or is the proof only available to you?

folan

RobertKK wrote: »

They are taught the national curriculum, with good education outcomes.

the national curriculum with, in these cases, additional material accounting to specific religions.

dark crystal

Terrlock wrote: »

I would pray that Steven Fry to be saved from the 2nd death.

Aah, so he WIILL be in trouble then. A second death on top of the first one? Harsh!

Also again we don't need evidence that god exists as it's plainly obvious to all who don't deny him that he does exist. It's so obvious it is foolishness to even argue over it.

You're right. Proof is so overrated.

You don't want to believe in him, as you know if you do, you'd have to change your ways. You like your sinful ways and living your life they way you think is best. The lord gives you over to this. He does not try and change your mind. In fact he willingly allows you to deny him.

That's jolly good of him! The troublesome thing is, he apparantly created us all with original sin, so we were all pretty much doomed before we even started.

Like you say, I'll just keep living my life of sin, the sin God kindly bestowed upon me at birth and wait until the day I shuffle off this mortal coil to get the proof I've been after, ever hoping he'll provide me with a satisfactory answer as to why he allows such misery to exist in this wonderful world he created for us all to suffer through as eternal sinners.

I'm presuming he'll just give the aul' free will speech, though. Covers a multitude of hard questions, that one.

Donkey Oaty

The best way to test the existence of God is to pray for something entirely random that would not ordinarily happen in a sane universe and see if it is granted.

For example, recently I prayed for a giant statue of The Stig from Top Gear to appear in Warsaw and also for a UKIP MP to tweet an invitation to play a game of "Hello Kitty World".

Needless to say, neither of these things have come true, otherwise I would have heard about them - but if they do, I'll start believing.

Hyzepher

Isn't religious belief a victim of geography?

How many believers, Catholics for the most part on this thread, could claim that if born in a Muslim, Buddhist or Communist environment could find their way back to their one "true" belief?

Followers of the bible aren't even in the majority worldwide.

If you choose to believe in god then fine go ahead - it requires blind faith in a belief handed down to you based on the geographical location of your birth.

But don't think that you can explain it any other way. It's blind faith.

Is there any other part of your life that you live so diligently based on blind faith? Or do you actually decide other things rationally.

If so why?

jobbridge4life

Hyzepher wrote: »

Isn't religious belief a victim of geography?

And/or time.

Dan_Solo

pueblo wrote: »

What is this thesaurus theism you keep mentioning? Word worship??

You seem to think language somehow doesn't matter.. ..it does....

Proof you have spirit may be something that can be demonstrated sooner than you think. The Double Slit experiment seems to imply that reality is created by consciousness...

No it doesn't.
Thesaurus theism is you saying you're not trying to say there's a god... but how about a spirit? Same crap. No thanks.

pueblo

Dan_Solo wrote: »

No it doesn't.
Thesaurus theism is you saying you're not trying to say there's a god... but how about a spirit? Same crap. No thanks.

Have a look at the Double Slit experiment....I would be interested to hear your 'logical' reasons for why reality seems to change if it's being observed.

Come on...open your mind a little...at least have a brief read of the findings of the experiment and let me know your thoughts. You have a duty as a rationalist.

circadian

RobertKK wrote: »

you would see there that people will pay for the sins of their ancestors

I know I'm late to the party but this jumped out at me.

So, say one of my ancestors was a thoroughly unsavoury person who didn't believe in god. When they die, surely they are then condemed to hell as a punishment for their sins and rejection of god.

Why, are the descendants of this person responsible for their actions? That doesn't seem very fair. If that is the case does this mean that god is also guilty of breaking his own rules, since he created man who is now considered to be inherently born with sin.

If I have to retrospectively atone for the sins of my ancestors, then surely god should also atone retrospectively for his sins.

Terrlock

ScumLord wrote: »

According to the almighty google and wiki gods the Jews that wrote the bible wouldn't have been primitive. Not being able to write is a sign of a primitive peoples.

So if they wrote the bible...they weren't primitive.

Also are you sure it was just the Jews who wrote the bible?

ScumLord wrote: »

Pretty much everything, they didn't know they were standing on a planet, they didn't know about the universe, they didn't know the sun was a star, they didn't know what lightning was, the list is virtually endless.


Nana nana bo bo.

That's just made up - They must have known a lot of those things as the bible talks about them. In fact many of the scientific facts the bible talks about weren't discovered to be true for centuries later by scientists.

mikom

Terrlock wrote: »

They must have known a lot of those things as the bible talks about them. In fact many of the scientific facts the bible talks about weren't discovered to be true for centuries later by scientists.

Which of the hundreds of re-writes of the bible was this again?

Arne_Saknussem

Terrlock wrote: »

It's not about trouble and I pray that some how Steven Fry will be saved.

It's simply when God confronts him, he will know instantly the Glory of God.

He will know in a microsecond that the case he wishes to argue is complete non sense and have absolutely know grounding or significance and he will know that God is Just. God will never need to defend himself from any accusations. Your own heart and spirit will testify to the Lord.



Also I am not lying when I say that everyone knows God exists.

Even the hidden tribes in the Amazon know of God.


The Bible says that God reveals Himself to us through nature:…because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse

You keep quoting from the Bible is if it's not a load of made up nonsense, full of contradictions and misinformation.

Terrlock

TireeTerror wrote: »

Are you actually serious in this post? If you are, I actually do not even know what to say. It is incredulous and quite fascinating.

However I just cannot bring myself to believe that you believe this, because you must be trolling for sure.

I assure you I'm not trolling and I stand by what I said.

Scripture teaches that all men know of God, however they deny his existence.