Isis burn pilot alive..

anto3473

Tugboats wrote: »

Who do you want to feed and educate them? Remember most here think the middle east is none of our business so I hope you're not suggesting America foot the bill?

The UN. The prevention of war is in the interest of humanity as a whole, every country has a moral responsibility to promote peace.

Think of it in terms like these, a self propelled gun is a multi millon dollar machine (you could build a school for less) the shells are up to $150,000 and probably much more each (the cost of each shell would hire several teachers), and each one of these guns fires several shells a minute. When I see a column of armour and SPGs on TV rolling through a town the sheer cost of war seems mind blowing.

I'm not saying a world without war is possible in our lifetime but all war is insanity and is something the world should strive to eliminate.

Anyone promoting war, do you actually know what war is? Its not a sport on tv or something that should be ever glorified. It is then organised creation of a set of circumstances causing famine, poverty, disease, torture, violence and every crime you can think of until someone has enough and calls it quits.

The Marshall Aid plan kept those pesky French and Germans killing each other for the last 70 odd years and seems to have worked - why something similar shouldn't work in another part of the world?

Egginacup

evo2000 wrote: »

You re missing the bigger picture here, i dont really give a **** about money its more about the innocent people being butchered everyday, iraq would be better off being occupied by nato than the state its in now

We dont need to demonize ISIS they are doing a good job of that themselves dont you think? also why leave iraq when they could have easily stayed there? why the need for 3.0? when you coulda just kept 2.0 going...

And say they dont invade "because thats what NATO wants" and they let ISIS off just to defy the money hungry goverments, whats the end game there?

How fcuking old are you? Physically and mentally?
Iraq would be better off under NATO occupation than it is now?
In 2002 Iraq had the highest proportion of women in academia in the entire region....and that includes places like Israel, Turkey, Kuwait, Bahrain and a few other slums that are bought and paid for by ARAMCO, Raytheon, and Grumman. And we're talking doctors, biologists, engineers, botanists, architects, mathematicians, astronomers, etc., here, not nail technicians. Now there are over 1.5 million Iraqis and counting dead, millions living in squalor in refugee camps from Iran, to Uzbekistan, to Lebanon, to Syria, to miserable borderlands in every corner of the place that you deem something you have a clue about. Would you say life in Iraq was so terrible before America decimated the place in 2003 that the relatives of those millions of dead can't wait to send you a thank-you note.
And after delivering such slaughter upon millions you think the scum who did it are best placed to protect them.

You have some warped and clueless view which is quite frankly embarrassing to whoever either schooled you or spawned you.

Tugboats

anto3473 wrote: »

The UN. The prevention of war is in the interest of humanity as a whole, every country has a moral responsibility to promote peace.

Think of it in terms like these, a self propelled gun is a multi millon dollar machine (you could build a school for less) the shells are up to $150,000 and probably much more each (the cost of each shell would hire several teachers), and each one of these guns fires several shells a minute. When I see a column of armour and SPGs on TV rolling through a town the sheer cost of war seems mind blowing.

I'm not saying a world without war is possible in our lifetime but all war is insanity and is something the world should strive to eliminate.

Ok how do the Un build a school in Syria tomorrow? Will Isis help build it? Don't think they would work out too well. Do you support military action right now to get rid of Isis and then build a school??

LorMal

Egginacup wrote: »

How fcuking old are you? Physically and mentally?
Iraq would be better off under NATO occupation than it is now?
In 2002 Iraq had the highest proportion of women in academia in the entire region....and that includes places like Israel, turkey, Kuwait, Bahrain and a few other slums that are bought and paid for by ARAMCO, Raytheon, and Grumman. And we're talking doctors, biologists, engineers, botanists, architects, mathematicians, astronomers, etc., here, not nail technicians. Now there are over 1.5 million Iraqis and counting dead, millions living in squalor in refugee camps from Iran, to Uzbekistan, to Lebanon, to Syria, to miserable borderlands in every corner of the place that you deem something you have a clue about. Would you say life in Iraq was so terrible before America decimated the place in 2003 that the relatives of those millions of dead can't wait to you a thank you note.
And after delivering such slaughter upon millions you think the scum who did it are best placed to protect them.

You have some warped and clueless view which is quite frankly embarrassing to whoever either schooled you or spawned you.

Nasty way to argue your point Egg. Your tin foil hat must be overheating your brain.

anto3473

Tugboats wrote: »

Ok how do the Un build a school in Syria tomorrow? Will Isis help build it? Don't think they would work out too well. Do you support military action right now to get rid of Isis and then build a school??

UN peacekeepers. What they do is keep the peace, with force when they need to.

I'm not saying that military action is always wrong sometimes it is needed to protect human life.

The primary goal of doing anything in the region should be ending ISIS.
Having peace like conditions there would be a good start on the road to relegating the likes of Isis to the history books. The larger plans of reconstruction could then take place.

rolliepoley

belacqua_ wrote: »

What's their weapon of choice, dummy dummy bullets? Liga laced with polonium?

:rolleyes:

Coming to a neighbourhood near you.

evo2000

Egginacup wrote: »

How fcuking old are you? Physically and mentally?
Iraq would be better off under NATO occupation than it is now?
In 2002 Iraq had the highest proportion of women in academia in the entire region....and that includes places like Israel, turkey, Kuwait, Bahrain and a few other slums that are bought and paid for by ARAMCO, Raytheon, and Grumman. And we're talking doctors, biologists, engineers, botanists, architects, mathematicians, astronomers, etc., here, not nail technicians. Now there are over 1.5 million Iraqis and counting dead, millions living in squalor in refugee camps from Iran, to Uzbekistan, to Lebanon, to Syria, to miserable borderlands in every corner of the place that you deem something you have a clue about. Would you say life in Iraq was so terrible before America decimated the place in 2003 that the relatives of those millions of dead can't wait to you a thank you note.
And after delivering such slaughter upon millions you think the scum who did it are best placed to protect them.

You have some warped and clueless view which is quite frankly embarrassing to whoever either schooled you or spawned you.

First of all calm your tits,

Of course it was better off before america decimated it but unless you ve a time machine thats pretty much irrelevant, ok so you re against any outside help do you think they are better off left to there faith then and the west should turn a blind eye to it ?

I think your view of doing nothing is quite warped

What do you suggest be done? or are you another one of these people taht just criticizes and insults while adding nothing of value to the topic,

Iwasfrozen

So can we unanimously agree these guys should be drowned in a giant vat of pig's blood? Gentlemen?

Tony EH

Sociopath2 wrote: »

ISIS and Nazism...

I'd quit now before you further embarrass yourself.

You clearly haven't the first clue what you're on about.

evo2000

Tony EH wrote: »

I'd quit now before you further embarrass yourself.

You clearly haven't the first clue what you're on about.

Are you an expert of some shorts? please shed you re light on the subject,

I see threads like this attract an awful lot of people like yourself that stroll in and say something along the lines of "I'd quit now before you further embarrass yourself." then proceed to add nothing to the topic only pointless sly digs and insults all the while claiming to be superior to the person your arguing with....

Tony EH

evo2000 wrote: »

Are you an expert of some shorts? please shed you re light on the subject,

I see threads like this attract an awful lot of people like yourself that stroll in and say something along the lines of "I'd quit now before you further embarrass yourself." then proceed to add nothing to the topic only pointless sly digs and insults all the while claiming to be superior to the person your arguing with....

I frankly don't have the time, nor the patience, to educate either you or Sociopath2 on the National Socialists, or why such comparisons are childish, and further I don't think you'd get it anyway.

Regarding the ISIS situation itself, the US was told that their invasion and toppling of Saddam Hussein would produce a power vacuum and it has resulted in the very extremists that he was successfully controlling. Likewise, Assad in Syria was handling his own problems with their like too.

The world now knows what the alternative is to the likes of Assad and Hussein. It's ISIS, because they have the conviction to carry out the most appalling atrocities to achieve their aims and as somebody who has viewed videos of those said atrocities, including the poor man in question, I can say that I know what I am talking about in that regard.

Dealing with ISIS and their like is not going to be easy, or tasteful. It wasn't tasteful siding with dictatorial power like Hussein or Assad, but it worked. Until the US decided to fuck that up of course. Such a course of action may be needed again, as ISIS will need to be tackled from within and by the people of the Middle East.

One thing is for sure, America blindly going in and "nuking", "bombing" and what ever you're having isn't going go work. It didn't the last time, or the time before that and it won't now. Saying "let's bomb them...blah blah blah" sounds hard and all. But this situation requires a intelligence and a scalpel, not stupidity and a wooden club.

What the "bomb them" approach WILL do however, is drive recruits directly into the hands of ISIS and blow up spectacularly in wrong faces.

Karl Stein

evo2000 wrote: »

proceed to add nothing to the topic

How do you deal with someone who persistently attempts to draw parallels with what's happening in Iraq/Syria now with what happened in Germany/Japan 75 years ago?

Japan and Germany were a threat to entire continents. ISIS aren't even threatening Turkey, Iran or Jordan and are only in power in places that 'we' left in tatters.

FloatingVoter

Karl Stein wrote: »

How do you deal with someone who persistently attempts to draw parallels with what's happening in Iraq/Syria now with what happened in Germany/Japan 75 years ago?

Japan and Germany were a threat to entire continents. ISIS aren't even threatening Turkey, Iran or Jordan and are only in power in places that 'we' left in tatters.

Germany was allowed to become a threat to entire continents due to inaction. Had they been nipped in the bud around 1936 as Churchill and a few others advocated history would tell a different tale.
ISIS are destabilising an already shaky middle east. With the murder of the Jordanian man they have raised the levels of anger there to boiling point.
It is not "who caused this", "can we negotiate", or "oh, its far away". That's crap.
The fact that they were negotiating over this man's life when they had burnt him alive a month ago displays cynicism worthy of "Arbeit Macht Frei". This is fascism in all its glamour. It burns now or we burn later.
The comparisons between the sneaking rise of Nazi Germany and the apathy / appeasement of the onlookers is valid. Frighteningly valid.

evo2000

Tony EH wrote: »

I frankly don't have the time, nor the patience, to educate either you or Sociopath2 on the National Socialists, or why such comparisons are childish, and further I don't think you'd get it anyway.

Regarding the ISIS situation itself, the US was told that their invasion and toppling of Saddam Hussein would produce a power vacuum and it has resulted in the very extremists that he was successfully controlling. Likewise, Assad in Syria was handling his own problems with their like too.

The world now knows what the alternative is to the likes of Assad and Hussein. It's ISIS, because they have the conviction to carry out the most appalling atrocities to achieve their aims and as somebody who has viewed videos of those said atrocities, including the poor man in question, I can say that I know what I am talking about in that regard.

Dealing with ISIS and their like is not going to be easy, or tasteful. It wasn't tasteful siding with dictatorial power like Hussein or Assad, but it worked. Until the US decided to fuck that up of course. Such a course of action may be needed again, as ISIS will need to be tackled from within and by the people of the Middle East.

One thing is for sure, America blindly going in and "nuking", "bombing" and what ever you're having isn't going go work. It didn't the last time, or the time before that and it won't now. Saying "let's bomb them...blah blah blah" sounds hard and all. But this situation requires a intelligence and a scalpel, not stupidity and a wooden club.

What the "bomb them" approach WILL do however, is drive recruits directly into the hands of ISIS and blow up spectacularly in wrong faces.

But you ve time to log on and write petty sly digs...right, you seem to be convinced your opinion is gospel and is the only one that can work,

While you wrote alot of analogy's there you didn't actually say lot, you seem to be awful quick to dismiss military action from the table but don't actually replace it with any other solutions.

Voltex

My view is that ISIS is playing a very cute game here. They are using the most accessible medium there is to promote a message of shock and awe.

I wonder how many people on here criticizing ISIS and what they did to that pilot also criticized Israel for its actions in defending itself last year?

ISIS, Hamas, Hezbollah, Al Qaeda...to me they're all terrorists!!

Gatling

Egginacup wrote: »

Christ...this is priceless.
It's either military obliteration which will kill maim and displace millions more innocent civilians or it's reasoning with a few killers. And that the subzero IQ binary argument in your fractional dimension worldview.
Let's start with your abyssmal face punching analogy. Negotiations might indeed be futile but if you mates are holding down his kid and raping it then the cause of the punching might need to be revisited and adressed. Does that compute? Or do you kill the puncher and then wring your hands when the uncle and brothers are next to start attacking you?

How come it's ok when Vladimir putin does it

Sociopath2

Tony EH wrote: »

I frankly don't have the time, nor the patience, to educate either you or Sociopath2 on the National Socialists, or why such comparisons are childish, and further I don't think you'd get it anyway.

Regarding the ISIS situation itself, the US was told that their invasion and toppling of Saddam Hussein would produce a power vacuum and it has resulted in the very extremists that he was successfully controlling. Likewise, Assad in Syria was handling his own problems with their like too.

The world now knows what the alternative is to the likes of Assad and Hussein. It's ISIS, because they have the conviction to carry out the most appalling atrocities to achieve their aims and as somebody who has viewed videos of those said atrocities, including the poor man in question, I can say that I know what I am talking about in that regard.

Dealing with ISIS and their like is not going to be easy, or tasteful. It wasn't tasteful siding with dictatorial power like Hussein or Assad, but it worked. Until the US decided to fuck that up of course. Such a course of action may be needed again, as ISIS will need to be tackled from within and by the people of the Middle East.

One thing is for sure, America blindly going in and "nuking", "bombing" and what ever you're having isn't going go work. It didn't the last time, or the time before that and it won't now. Saying "let's bomb them...blah blah blah" sounds hard and all. But this situation requires a intelligence and a scalpel, not stupidity and a wooden club.

What the "bomb them" approach WILL do however, is drive recruits directly into the hands of ISIS and blow up spectacularly in wrong faces.

Why don't you take the time to refute any of the points I made?

Had you bothered to read my posts properly you'd see I'm not advocating a US military intervention if at all possible.

I'll distill it down to a few points for you.

Any military campaign needs to aim for a decisive victory against ISIS, not just pushing them back from certain borders.

Such a campaign will require the commitment of massive resources to ensure that victory. Not committing enough resources will result in a repeat of Iraq.

There will be very high military and civilian casualties.

ISIS, being ideologically driven, are unlikely to surrender to give ground without a fight.

Western troops are the most capable of waging a successful campaign but ME states should provide the manpower to prevent it being painted as the west invading. Syria, Jordan, Iran and KSA need to step up.

If people want a military intervention they need to accept that it will be very messy. It's a last resort I don't want to see happen but I don't see a viable alternative at the moment.

Karl Stein

FloatingVoter wrote: »

It burns now or we burn later.

Utter hysterical bollocks.

These guys are deliberately trying to draw western troops (or their proxies) into their theatre of capability exactly because they know they cannot take their fight outside where 'we've' made a complete balls of.

The 'OMG WE'RE ALL GOING TO DIE' histrionics is exactly the response they are trying to effectuate.

You're like putty in their hands. Well done.

Tugboats

Voltex wrote: »

My view is that ISIS is playing a very cute game here. They are using the most accessible medium there is to promote a message of shock and awe.

I wonder how many people on here criticizing ISIS and what they did to that pilot also criticized Israel for its actions in defending itself last year?

ISIS, Hamas, Hezbollah, Al Qaeda...to me they're all terrorists!!

The shock and awe hasn't been working and either has goading America into a ground war. We've seen a half hearted surgical bombing campaign that has hardly even been newsworthy.

It's possible with the killing of the Jordan pilot that things may intensify as their king appears to be talking tough but we will see how that plays out.

Gatling

To quote the king of Jordan


William Munny, says, "Any man I see out there, I'm gonna kill him. Any son of a bitch takes a shot at me, I'm not only going to kill him, I'm going to kill his wife and all his friends and burn his damn house down."

Egginacup

evo2000 wrote: »

Theres a difference tho, they arent doing it on purpose, they arent roaming around butchering innocent people for the craic, its also not for the want of trying on the behalf of isis, i can only imagine the damage they do if they d nato hardware...

And even with that said, it still doesnt justify ISIS and there still needs to be something done about them.

Are you always the one who knows everything?
Now we had some fool on here earlier on yapping about the "rules" and how the "West" were the ones who knew how people should live. Some footage for you. If I was a small boy behind a rock witnessing this from the gallant "liberators" I would need no convincing to stay in school and learn the star spangled banner. I would spend my waking hours seething with the kind of hatred that nothing but my own death could extinguish:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=caa_1301350893

And if you think the victims are Taliban or some other excuse to be shot, think about the US military opening up with hundreds of rounds on family cars full of children just because the father speak Arabic and doesn't quite understand English...especially "pull over motherfucker! STOP MOTHERFUCKER!!!


If I was a small boy and some "freedom" delivering dick did this to me in my country and to my mum I'd spend my LIFE looking for some way to hurt him back:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=85a_1355341668

Burning a dead pilot is cause for outrage now is it? And The Middle East should be nukes by some of the geopolitical geniuses on here.
How about you clean up some of these corpses before you have another stab at your video game:

http://iraqatrocities.blogspot.ie/2012/07/fallujah-victims-of-white-phosphorus.html

Tony EH

evo2000 wrote: »

But you ve time to log on and write petty sly digs...right, you seem to be convinced your opinion is gospel and is the only one that can work,

While you wrote alot of analogy's there you didn't actually say lot, you seem to be awful quick to dismiss military action from the table but don't actually replace it with any other solutions.

Sigh...

You didn't actually read the post did you.

Gatling

Egginacup wrote: »

Are you always the one who knows everything?
Now we had some fool on here earlier on yapping about the "rules" and how the "West" were the ones who knew how people should live. Some footage for you. If I was a small boy behind a rock witnessing this from the gallant "liberators" I would need no convincing to stay in school and learn the star spangled banner. I would spend my waking hours seething with the kind of hatred that nothing but my own death could extinguish:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=caa_1301350893

And if you think the victims are Taliban or some other excuse to be shot, think about the US military opening up with hundreds of rounds on family cars full of children just because the father speak Arabic and doesn't quite understand English...especially "pull over motherfucker! STOP MOTHERFUCKER!!!


If I was a small boy and some "freedom" delivering dick did this to me in my country and to my mum I'd spend my LIFE looking for some way to hurt him back:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=85a_1355341668

Burning a dead pilot is cause for outrage now is it? And The Middle East should be nukes by some of the geopolitical geniuses on here.
How about you clean up some of these corpses before you have another stab at your video game:

http://iraqatrocities.blogspot.ie/2012/07/fallujah-victims-of-white-phosphorus.html

All we need love altogether now all we is love

Sociopath2

Karl Stein wrote: »

How do you deal with someone who persistently attempts to draw parallels with what's happening in Iraq/Syria now with what happened in Germany/Japan 75 years ago?

Japan and Germany were a threat to entire continents. ISIS aren't even threatening Turkey, Iran or Jordan and are only in power in places that 'we' left in tatters.

You're still missing the point. As I pointed out to you earlier, it is not on the same scale.

It is, however, a similar question of dealing with an aggressive, ideologically driven force. Germany was let become a threat because of inaction by those who should have opposed it. We are in a similar situation with ISIS. Ideological based opponents are not easily defeated, regardless of size. I gave a rough estimate of the kind of forces needed to do so. It's no small number.

We now have to decide does someone intervene, at great cost, or attempt a different approach, taking the risk that ISIS may become a greater threat.

old_aussie

Gatling wrote: »

To quote the king of Jordan


William Munny, says, "Any man I see out there, I'm gonna kill him. Any son of a bitch takes a shot at me, I'm not only going to kill him, I'm going to kill his wife and all his friends and burn his damn house down."

Yep, I think that's what gonna happen.

Good to see Egypt is going to hang those brotherhood muslim terrorists.

Hopefully Jordan will keep their word and hang, low drop, shoot (what ever way they want to do it) all terrorists in their jails.

Anyone even slightly connected to supporting terrorism or terrorists should also be low dropped.

Before terminating the muslim terrorists they should have any useful info extracted from them by any means, after all, they are terrorists.

Lets fight fire with fire!

Tony EH

Sociopath2 wrote: »

Why don't you take the time to refute any of the points I made?

Had you bothered to read my posts properly you'd see I'm not advocating a US military intervention if at all possible.

I'll distill it down to a few points for you.

Any military campaign needs to aim for a decisive victory against ISIS, not just pushing them back from certain borders.

Such a campaign will require the commitment of massive resources to ensure that victory. Not committing enough resources will result in a repeat of Iraq.

There will be very high military and civilian casualties.

ISIS, being ideologically driven, are unlikely to surrender to give ground without a fight.

Western troops are the most capable of waging a successful campaign but ME states should provide the manpower to prevent it being painted as the west invading. Syria, Jordan, Iran and KSA need to step up.

If people want a military intervention they need to accept that it will be very messy. It's a last resort I don't want to see happen but I don't see a viable alternative at the moment.

It's been proven time and time again that "the west" (or America) are bloody TERRIBLE at handling anything in the Middle East. They **** it up constantly, because their main objective there is resources. They saddle up to awful regimes, like the House of Saud, and topple dictators they no longer like, when the opportunity arises.

However, as I've already said, the solution to the likes of ISIS is to pick the lesser of two "evils". In this case, it means going back to supporting the dictators like Hussein, Assad and Gaddafi. Their secular governments did an AWFUL LOT to suppress extremist groups like AL Qaeda and ISIS and were doing a decent job. They could also be reasoned with, unlike ISIS.

US bombs from the air and boots on the ground will simply radicalise more and more people and play directly into the hands of extremist groups. It's absolutely inevitable and it is not a viable solution.

Tugboats

old_aussie wrote: »

Yep, I think that's what gonna happen.

Good to see Egypt is going to hang those brotherhood muslim terrorists.

Hopefully Jordan will keep their word and hang, low drop, shoot (what ever way they want to do it) all terrorists in their jails.

Anyone even slightly connected to supporting terrorism or terrorists should also be low dropped.

Before terminating the muslim terrorists they should have any useful info extracted from them by any means, after all, they are terrorists.

Lets fight fire with fire!

Killing them in jail is a bit of a token gesture. King Abdullahs words have got my hopes up for full scale air strikes followed by a ground invasion with Jordan troops. Anything less than this is an anti climax and I will be writing a strongly worded letter to the King

I only have 2 main reasons for favouring war

1 I love watching wars on the news I think it makes great tv. My first war was Desert Storm. I remember I couldn't wait to get home from school to find out the latest. Its all changed now with 24 hour news and internet which has further enhanced the viewing experience. Sky will have some interactive maps and military experts ready to go.

2 The war led by Jordan would confuse the hell out of the anti war protesters who only like to protest against military action taken by America. Their heads would explode if it was a middle eastern country doing the heavy lifting and I would laugh myself to sleep every night

evo2000

Egginacup wrote: »

Are you always the one who knows everything?
Now we had some fool on here earlier on yapping about the "rules" and how the "West" were the ones who knew how people should live. Some footage for you. If I was a small boy behind a rock witnessing this from the gallant "liberators" I would need no convincing to stay in school and learn the star spangled banner. I would spend my waking hours seething with the kind of hatred that nothing but my own death could extinguish:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=caa_1301350893

And if you think the victims are Taliban or some other excuse to be shot, think about the US military opening up with hundreds of rounds on family cars full of children just because the father speak Arabic and doesn't quite understand English...especially "pull over motherfucker! STOP MOTHERFUCKER!!!


If I was a small boy and some "freedom" delivering dick did this to me in my country and to my mum I'd spend my LIFE looking for some way to hurt him back:

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=85a_1355341668

Burning a dead pilot is cause for outrage now is it? And The Middle East should be nukes by some of the geopolitical geniuses on here.
How about you clean up some of these corpses before you have another stab at your video game:

http://iraqatrocities.blogspot.ie/2012/07/fallujah-victims-of-white-phosphorus.html

In all seriousness, when did i say NATO were saints? i didn't! there's a fair difference between NATO and ****ing ISIS tho!

Tell me all knowing one, did the women and children they butchered and still butcher because they were of a different religion, what did they do to deserve such a death?

Your starting to sound more and more like a lad that ll be hopin on a plane over to help em!

Side note, i think 2 people brought up nukes the rest of the people on this thread are making legitimate points stop using the "nukes" as a stick to try and discredit everyone elses points.

old_aussie

Karl Stein wrote: »

Utter hysterical bollocks.

These guys are deliberately trying to draw western troops (or their proxies) into their theatre of capability exactly because they know they cannot take their fight outside where we've made a complete balls off.

You're like putty in their hands. Well done.

Get off the playstation!

What, you haven't heard of the Twin Towers in the USA, the London bus bombings, the Lindt Cafe in Sydney Australia, The railway bombings in Spain, the Mumbai India, the Bali bombings in 2002 that killed 202 people.

The list goes on and on, I haven't all day to list them all.

As I said, get off the playstation, and have a look at the real world.

Egginacup

Sociopath2 wrote: »

Think of WWII, massive destruction required to stop Nazi Germany and Japan. It took two nuclear strikes to break Japan. That war was necessary.

The option of doing nothing effectively throws anyone in ISIS sphere of influence to the wolves.

Not every ISIS fighter is a grieving husband/son. It's far more complex.

When violence is necessary, you need to commit to using it effectively. You can't do it in half measures and you can't delude yourself that it will be clean.

Spoken like a true slope-shoulder who would never have half a testicle to go anywhere near the odd angry shot.