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Isis burn pilot alive..

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    #602
    Sociopath2
    Registered Users Posts: 242 ✭✭Sociopath2


    BMMachine wrote: »
    so, according to the leaders of the Kurdish forces, they are the only effective ones in fighting ISIS. Then the article goes on to describe a war between the two groups, one which is heavily aided by western equipment and is also a cry for more help from the west, which to be fair would be expectant of the group.
    and thats it.
    Theres no talk about how these Kurdish forces have been fighting for years and years, even generations to create their own state with their own self interests at heart.
    I don't know, it seems like self aggrandisement and propaganda more than anything of real strategy or value. But heck, you guys already swallow whole all the propaganda you like from western news sources so its not like you know a difference, right? I sincerely doubt the Kurdish forces have the ability to carry the fight to ISIS but like the Northern Alliance of Afghanistan they might make a nice chariot for western interests to ride. By the articles own admission the Kurds have taken heavy losses and casualties.

    So yeah, a throwaway article which provides little to no depth ain't gonna cut it I'm afraid. Its back to you guys knowing f**k all again :) sorry bout that

    Provide an example of someone who has been engaging ISIS effectively so far, bar the Peshmerga and a source to back it up. Not holding a defensive line but actually engaging and defeating them.

    You are doing a lot of criticising yet giving no basis for it.

    So back to you and try to interpret the tenses correctly this time professor.

    And "propaganda from western media sources"? The mask is beginning to slip, how long before I hear about the new world order?


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    #603
    BMMachine
    Site Banned Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭BMMachine


    evo2000 wrote: »
    3 people have answered that for you so far, sociopath has dumbed it down as much as it cant be in order for you to grasp what was said...

    Give it a rest now..

    ooohhhh, spicey.
    "dumbed it down" you say. the guy who knows absolutely dick all about the middle east but is posting his hate filled non-opinions says "dumb it down". As I said - you are nothing but a problem. You are the exact type of person who would nod their head in agreement as long as your moral fibre is plucked in the right way. You and those like you are the reason so much corruption and b.s goes on without consequence in the world. You don't think but you have a voice and can parrot all day and all night with the firm belief that they are informed about what they are saying


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    #604
    BMMachine
    Site Banned Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭BMMachine


    Sociopath2 wrote: »
    Provide an example of someone who has been engaging ISIS effectively so far, bar the Peshmerga and a source to back it up. Not holding a defensive line but actually engaging and defeating them.

    You are doing a lot of criticising yet giving no basis for it.

    So back to you and try to interpret the tenses correctly this time professor.

    Syrians


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    #605
    Sociopath2
    Registered Users Posts: 242 ✭✭Sociopath2


    BMMachine wrote: »
    Syrians

    Source?


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    #606
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    The problem is ISIS have support in Sunni areas of Iraq and Syria. Their shia opponents do not. The Kurds can fight and defeat them in Kurdish areas but that's probably about the extent of it. I think ISIS are here to stay, mainly in the Sunni areas. Until some of the Sunni tribes get so disgusted by their behviour and rise up, which even then would be hard to do.

    Retaking Mosul will not be easy regardless of who plans to do it.


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    #607
    BMMachine
    Site Banned Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭BMMachine


    Sociopath2 wrote: »
    Source?

    A lot of the war is happening in Syria

    http://edition.cnn.com/2015/02/05/world/isis-jordan/index.html

    thats from today if it helps

    from november

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/nov/06/us-strategy-against-isis-working-well-assad-syria


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    #608
    BMMachine
    Site Banned Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭BMMachine


    So yeah, you educated and well informed guys still up for bombing them into the ground and western troops landing there and killing them all because you are so outraged or have you learned something from this thread?


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    #609
    Sociopath2
    Registered Users Posts: 242 ✭✭Sociopath2


    BMMachine wrote: »
    A lot of the war is happening in Syria

    http://edition.cnn.com/2015/02/05/world/isis-jordan/index.html

    thats from today if it helps

    from november

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/nov/06/us-strategy-against-isis-working-well-assad-syria

    Have you actually read either of those articles? The second one actually says that Assad is benefiting from US air strikes.

    Nothing there about his forces and their effectiveness against ISIS and nothing to suggest they have been the most effective so far.

    The first has nothing to support your argument.

    You've no idea what you're talking about and you've been caught spoofing. It's funny how your arguments don't stand up when asked to back them up.

    Try that again with something relevant this time.


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    #610
    Tugboats
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,011 ✭✭✭Tugboats


    BMMachine wrote: »
    So yeah, you educated and well informed guys still up for bombing them into the ground and western troops landing there and killing them all because you are so outraged or have you learned something from this thread?

    You're also up for bombing and killing you just want it done by middle eastern forces with American money.


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    #611
    Sociopath2
    Registered Users Posts: 242 ✭✭Sociopath2


    BMMachine wrote: »
    So yeah, you educated and well informed guys still up for bombing them into the ground and western troops landing there and killing them all because you are so outraged or have you learned something from this thread?

    Since you have difficulty reading ill forgive you not understanding my posts where I said repeatedly a military solution would have to be a large scale ground offensive by middle eastern states, with the west kept out of it as much as possible.

    But don't let that get in the way of trying to get one over on phantom US cheerleaders. FFS


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    #612
    BMMachine
    Site Banned Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭BMMachine


    Sociopath2 wrote: »
    Have you actually read either of those articles? The second one actually says that Assad is benefiting from US air strikes.

    Nothing there about his forces and their effectiveness against ISIS and nothing to suggest they have been the most effective so far.

    The first has nothing to support your argument.

    You've no idea what you're talking about and you've been caught spoofing. It's funny how your arguments don't stand up when asked to back them up.

    Try that again with something relevant this time.

    you asked me who else was fighting ISIS. The Syrians and Jordanians are. Of course Assad is benefitting... like.. this is such an asinine conversation. I feel like Im having it with a 14 year old or something. "you've been caught spoofing" - how? because I answered your question about who else was fighting? The truth is we don't know how effective different groups are at fighting ISIS out there, its very hard to know these things, especially at the height of the conflict.
    Do you know what is time proven to make these internal conflicts more confusing? Western troops.
    So yeah, my arguments do stand up matey but sure, go do a few more mental gymnastics to justify your uninformed bloodthirsty response based on your own moral outrage and sense of importance. ignorant and asinine to a tee


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    #613
    BMMachine
    Site Banned Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭BMMachine


    Tugboats wrote: »
    You're also up for bombing and killing you just want it done by middle eastern forces with American money.

    just dumb and without any depth or merit. but from what you have been spouting on this forum that doesn't surprise me at all. You are unable to read any depth into anything, clap clap.


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    #614
    BMMachine
    Site Banned Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭BMMachine


    Sociopath2 wrote: »
    Since you have difficulty reading ill forgive you not understanding my posts where I said repeatedly a military solution would have to be a large scale ground offensive by middle eastern states, with the west kept out of it as much as possible.

    But don't let that get in the way of trying to get one over on phantom US cheerleaders. FFS

    yeah I actually agree. I want ISIS to be dealt with by forces within the region and not by Western forces. I want Western forces to stop going into these countries and causing massive amounts of destruction.
    The funding issue is always going to be there. I mean, where do you draw the line? Arabian money which is garnered from Western markets? The economy and free market is such a massive monster that the flow of money by their very nature are hard to control.

    Sorry but my anger on this thread is almost entirely directed towards those going "get the west in to kill everyone" etc.


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    #615
    Sociopath2
    Registered Users Posts: 242 ✭✭Sociopath2


    BMMachine wrote: »
    you asked me who else was fighting ISIS. The Syrians and Jordanians are. Of course Assad is benefitting... like.. this is such an asinine conversation. I feel like Im having it with a 14 year old or something. "you've been caught spoofing" - how? because I answered your question about who else was fighting? The truth is we don't know how effective different groups are at fighting ISIS out there, its very hard to know these things, especially at the height of the conflict.
    Do you know what is time proven to make these internal conflicts more confusing? Western troops.
    So yeah, my arguments do stand up matey but sure, go do a few more mental gymnastics to justify your uninformed bloodthirsty response based on your own moral outrage and sense of importance. ignorant and asinine to a tee

    You werent asked who else was fighting, you were asked who was most effective if not the Kurds.

    That's what you kept badgering that other poster, so answer the question and back it up. You aren't so sure of yourself now you're being questioned so you're throwing out the insults and dodging the question.

    Read my last post and then go and read my other posts.

    I don't want to see a ground invasion except as a last resort because it will be exceptionally bloody. Even then I said it needs to be done by a coalition of ME states not the US/West. I said it needs to be a large committed effort to defeat ISIS.

    So I'm sure you agree with a lot of that but you are too embroiled in childish one upmanship to debate properly.


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    #616
    Tugboats
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,011 ✭✭✭Tugboats


    BMMachine wrote: »
    just dumb and without any depth or merit. but from what you have been spouting on this forum that doesn't surprise me at all. You are unable to read any depth into anything, clap clap.

    You've said many times in this thread that you support Middle Eastern military action with western funding.


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    #617
    BMMachine
    Site Banned Posts: 2,094 ✭✭✭BMMachine


    Tugboats wrote: »
    You've said many times in this thread that you support Middle Eastern military action with western funding.

    "The funding issue is always going to be there. I mean, where do you draw the line? Arabian money which is garnered from Western markets? The economy and free market is such a massive monster that the flow of money by their very nature are hard to control."


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    #618
    anypills
    Registered Users Posts: 7 ✭anypills


    They made it all artistic, the being trapped in a cage and having rubble tipped on him was symbolic. Preceding his murder in the video was images of bombed civilians, children etc, from airstrikes. He was hardly innocent sure. They're all pricks all these war types. For those who doubt the authenticity of the video, these people don't need to fake such things, its easier just to do it for real.


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    #619
    leo2a6
    Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭leo2a6


    anypills wrote: »
    They made it all artistic, the being trapped in a cage and having rubble tipped on him was symbolic. Preceding his murder in the video was images of bombed civilians, children etc, from airstrikes. He was hardly innocent sure. They're all pricks all these war types. For those who doubt the authenticity of the video, these people don't need to fake such things, its easier just to do it for real.

    he was killed weeks ago...
    The cage is linked to sajida al-rishawi detained in 'cage', killed by fire and covered by rubble coz he was killing civilians by fire and rubble.
    IS is the meeting of sick Baath mentality/efficiency and Alqaida ideology...


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    #620
    Tugboats
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,011 ✭✭✭Tugboats


    leo2a6 wrote: »
    he was killed weeks ago...
    The cage is linked to sajida al-rishawi detained in 'cage', killed by fire and covered by rubble coz he was killing civilians by fire and rubble.
    IS is the meeting of sick Baath mentality/efficiency and Alqaida ideology...

    Was reading an interview with one of the hostages who was freed he was saying they are treating the young American girl pretty good. I think she will be their "spectacular"


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    #621
    leo2a6
    Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭leo2a6


    Tugboats wrote: »
    Was reading an interview with one of the hostages who was freed he was saying they are treating the young American girl pretty good. I think she will be their "spectacular"

    they are trying to negotiate but US won't accept or let its allies/vassals negociate...


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    #622
    Tugboats
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,011 ✭✭✭Tugboats


    leo2a6 wrote: »
    they are trying to negotiate but US won't accept or let its allies/vassals negociate...

    I'd take that with a pinch of salt. They were also negotiating with Jordan even though the pilot was already dead. Even if they were willing to release her I wouldn't be in favour of paying them millions of dollars like France and Italy did. Most agree that cutting off funding is vital so sending them millions via western Union every time they capture somebody isn't helpful.

    Jordan aside we've seen that Uk, Japan and USA aren't really concerned or shocked by the isis execution videos so far. It would be interesting to see would she be a tipping point for them?


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    #623
    Blackgrass
    Closed Accounts Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Blackgrass


    Shurimgreat wrote: »
    The problem is ISIS have support in Sunni areas of Iraq and Syria. Their shia opponents do not. The Kurds can fight and defeat them in Kurdish areas but that's probably about the extent of it. I think ISIS are here to stay, mainly in the Sunni areas. Until some of the Sunni tribes get so disgusted by their behviour and rise up, which even then would be hard to do.

    Retaking Mosul will not be easy regardless of who plans to do it.

    THIS.


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    #624
    nokia69
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,050 ✭✭✭nokia69


    Shurimgreat wrote: »
    The problem is ISIS have support in Sunni areas of Iraq and Syria. Their shia opponents do not. The Kurds can fight and defeat them in Kurdish areas but that's probably about the extent of it. I think ISIS are here to stay, mainly in the Sunni areas. Until some of the Sunni tribes get so disgusted by their behviour and rise up, which even then would be hard to do.

    Retaking Mosul will not be easy regardless of who plans to do it.

    the sunnis fought to get rid of al qaeda and foreign fighters a few years ago, and they were told the the shia government would be fair to the sunnis, that never happened

    I'm sure there are plenty of sunnis who hate ISIS but I doubt they will fight them to help the shia government

    ISIS will be around for a while yet


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    #625
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    BMMachine wrote: »
    yeah I actually agree. I want ISIS to be dealt with by forces within the region and not by Western forces. I want Western forces to stop going into these countries and causing massive amounts of destruction.
    The funding issue is always going to be there. I mean, where do you draw the line? Arabian money which is garnered from Western markets? The economy and free market is such a massive monster that the flow of money by their very nature are hard to control.

    Sorry but my anger on this thread is almost entirely directed towards those going "get the west in to kill everyone" etc.

    Blaming the west alone for the problems of the middle east is utterly childish. The region was in chaos long before the US or even modern Britain was born. And it would be if the west interevened or not.

    Most of the secular dictators in the region were/are western leaning/educated. And when or if these are removed and the ordinary man on the street is allowed run the place, it descends into religious blood letting.

    What do you think would happen if you removed all western influences from the middle east?

    If you don't know I can help you with the answer.

    The west is the only influence that keeps the region civilised. Its the cavemen of the region who want a conflict with the west, that's when the issues arise.


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    #626
    ronan45
    Registered Users Posts: 1,584 ✭✭✭ronan45


    Does anyone know or is their a link to what exactly the coaltion are doing on a daily basis, Ie: How many air strikes, How many bombs dropped, How many Planes Involved? Is it night operations or around the clock? Or is it 1 fly over per day with a few laser guided weapons dropped?


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    #627
    TommyKnocker
    Registered Users Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭TommyKnocker


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    Indonesia, Great lads altogether :D
    I am failing to see what is wrong with this?

    Murderers, drug traffickers and terrorists face the death penalty, so what? The US has the death penalty also and their last few by lethal injections did not go too well from all accounts.

    Indonesia still seems to be a better, more stable place at this time then Iraq or Syria.


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    #628
    Wurzelbert
    Registered Users Posts: 1,804 ✭✭✭Wurzelbert


    think we have reached a point where the only argument left against going thermonuclear on rakka and the is in general is the risk of further escalation of the whole mess...


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    #629
    Timberrrrrrrr
    Registered Users Posts: 25,525 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Wurzelbert wrote: »
    think we have reached a point where the only argument left against going thermonuclear on rakka and the is in general is the risk of further escalation of the whole mess...

    And you know


    The death of thousands of innocent men women and children who are there.


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    #630
    ronan45
    Registered Users Posts: 1,584 ✭✭✭ronan45


    I would be curious to know what percentage of the population Of Raqqa really support and are happy to have ISIS in town..... hmmmm I wonder would it be a majority or what


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    #631
    Wurzelbert
    Registered Users Posts: 1,804 ✭✭✭Wurzelbert


    Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »
    And you know


    The death of thousands of innocent men women and children who are there.

    collateral damage, sad as it would be...though i am aware that's bomber harris style talk...also wonder how many more will die by the hand of is if they are allowed to consolidate and extend their grip on the middle east and beyond...


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