Racing weight

joey100

So another boring day in work had me looking round the interweb trying to pass the time. Found this article about 'racing weight' by Chris McCormack

http://triathlon.competitor.com/2013/05/nutrition/chris-mccormack-on-the-triathlete-weight-debate_74945

What do people think?? I get the impression it really only applies to the pro's. But have thought about it from my own perspective too, I'm naturally slight and short, (5''8, 60KG), at my heaviest, when a student and drinking most weekends and the eating that goes with that, I was around 73kg. I reckon I could lose another kilo or two without it negatively impacting on my training or races. But for longer distances would I be better a bit heavier? (this is not a question really, just a thought based on the article) Or is the simple 'jiggle test' the best way to see if you need to lose weight?

pgibbo

Like everything it's a balancing act. Lighter usually means running faster. But what good is that if you've lost power on the bike. As with most things it's very personal as you might be more injury prone at a lighter weight than someone else. So many variables IMO.

When I did my first IM people were telling me I was too thin. Last year I was nearly 2kg lighter but felt a lot better and was physically stronger than when I did my first IM. Cumulative training certainly helped in the intervening period. So I guess it depends on where you are in your development as an athlete too.

RJM85

If your mammy isn't worried that you're eating enough, you're too fat.

tunney

joey100 wrote: »

So another boring day in work had me looking round the interweb trying to pass the time. Found this article about 'racing weight' by Chris McCormack

http://triathlon.competitor.com/2013/05/nutrition/chris-mccormack-on-the-triathlete-weight-debate_74945

What do people think?? I get the impression it really only applies to the pro's. But have thought about it from my own perspective too, I'm naturally slight and short, (5''8, 60KG), at my heaviest, when a student and drinking most weekends and the eating that goes with that, I was around 73kg. I reckon I could lose another kilo or two without it negatively impacting on my training or races. But for longer distances would I be better a bit heavier? (this is not a question really, just a thought based on the article) Or is the simple 'jiggle test' the best way to see if you need to lose weight?

Ah joey, most of the irish triathletes are fat for normal people never mind athletes and now you are posting a link to tell them to put on more weight cause macca said you can be too lean???

Discovering race weight, in my opinion, goes through a number of phases that happen over years
1 My race weight is X
2 Realising that X is too high, so you knock half a stone off to get Y
3 Realising that Y is still to high so you knock a stone off to get Z
4 Realising that Z is still a little high so you knock a few more pounds off to get B
5 Realising that B is a tad too light and halfway between Z and B is right.

Body fat is really the best way to do it. If not a single digit you have more to lose, once you start fluttering under 8% you may run a risk of going too light for you.

joey100

Was half thinking the same myself, just didn't want to say it!

tunney

Although the last time I talked honestly about weight I got a stalker and was abused for a year about everything from sexuality to family. So I might take any serious discussion on weight out-of-band and do over email/pm if you don't mind.

Kander

Ah dammit! So today I learned I'm still fat >.<

peter kern

i have not read the article but all i can say its funny he would write this given the fact that one of his atheltes was too skinny this year and lost bike power.and it was clear for prety much all year and not just a suprise at hawaii.

sconhome

Can I not just use this excuse?

BTH

tunney wrote: »

Discovering race weight, in my opinion, goes through a number of phases that happen over years
1 My race weight is X
2 Realising that X is too high, so you knock half a stone off to get Y
3 Realising that Y is still to high so you knock a stone off to get Z
4 Realising that Z is still a little high so you knock a few more pounds off to get B
5 Realising that B is a tad too light and halfway between Z and B is right.

Body fat is really the best way to do it. If not a single digit you have more to lose, once you start fluttering under 8% you may run a risk of going too light for you.

Some of us just weight the same no matter what I do. I could probably put on 2-3 kg if I did nothing for 2 months but it would be gone again in three weeks.

And no, I'm not too skinny.

shansey

RJM85 wrote: »

If your mammy isn't worried that you're eating enough, you're too fat.

Thats my rule too!!

lgk

Funnily there's a book by that very title!

sconhome

lgk wrote: »

Funnily there's a book by that very title!

Book basically says all that Tunney said but takes much longer to get to the point

tunney wrote: »

Discovering race weight, in my opinion, goes through a number of phases that happen over years
1 My race weight is X
2 Realising that X is too high, so you knock half a stone off to get Y
3 Realising that Y is still to high so you knock a stone off to get Z
4 Realising that Z is still a little high so you knock a few more pounds off to get B
5 Realising that B is a tad too light and halfway between Z and B is right.

Body fat is really the best way to do it. If not a single digit you have more to lose, once you start fluttering under 8% you may run a risk of going too light for you.

Book also recommends eating to lose weight that training on empty is not the right thing to do that all workouts should be fuelled properly and consistently to avoid stress reactions and fat storage.

Kurt Godel

tunney wrote: »

Although the last time I talked honestly about weight I got a stalker and was abused for a year about everything from sexuality to family. So I might take any serious discussion on weight out-of-band and do over email/pm if you don't mind.

You shouldn't let one negative experience put you off from discussing here. Far too many people are quick to take offence regarding their weight, as though it was some unmentionable affliction that they can do nothing about.

After you met me in swim trunks the other day, you seemed hesitant to discuss weight in case I might have taken offence. In the end you took the gloves off, told it like it was (that I'd need to lose a lot of fat if I wanted to hit any of my Tri goals), and I've started to react to that advice. That's a lot more useful than tiptoeing around an obvious issue- lose weight to get faster would apply to probably 95% of posters here (to bring the topic back to the OP).

MojoMaker

Joe, you're well under Tunney's 8% threshold, have you considered you might be at your racing weight already?

joey100

Joe, you're well under Tunney's 8% threshold, have you considered you might be at your racing weight already?

I didn't really want to turn this into a thread about me, or anyone in particular. Wanted to keep it in broader terms. To be honest though I don't think I am in single digit body fat yet and if I am I wouldn't be far off 10%. I'm dropping a bit of weight by cutting the crap from my diet (I do still eat crap, just not the bucket loads I used to) still eating as much if not more but just watching what I eat. All the numbers are going up for me in training at the moment and I feel good.

tunney

joey100 wrote: »

I didn't really want to turn this into a thread about me, or anyone in particular. Wanted to keep it in broader terms. To be honest though I don't think I am in single digit body fat yet and if I am I wouldn't be far off 10%. I'm dropping a bit of weight by cutting the crap from my diet (I do still eat crap, just not the bucket loads I used to) still eating as much if not more but just watching what I eat. All the numbers are going up for me in training at the moment and I feel good.

If only there was someone with a body fat scales you could measure you on Monday.

MojoMaker

Weren't you something like 7.x% when we tried that gadget in Killashee last season? Ok it was fairly unscientific I know

If the training numbers are going up and it's trending well and you're plotting your weight each month against those figures you're probably doing all that needs to be done to arrive at Tunney's magic sweet spot? All I would add to that assessment is keeping an eye on energy levels as well as power figures and weight?

joey100

@mojomaker, I think I was but wouldn't put faith in that machine at all, It had James at above 20% and he's definitely not that high. Like you say it's about finding that balance between weight, power and performance. I think for most of us that means dropping weight. Personally I think the article refers more to professional's where possibly due to the amount they training they do they have to track their weight so that they don't become too light. Not a problem 99% of amateurs have I would guess.

BTH

joey100 wrote: »

Personally I think the article refers more to professional's gingers where possibly due to the amount they training they do genetics they have to track their weight so that they don't become too light.

Genuinely, this is the only reason I own a scales. I got too light about 15 months ago through a combination of training and some food groups not agreeing with me.

sconhome

BTH wrote: »

Genuinely, this is the only reason I own a scales. I got too light about 15 months ago through a combination of training and some food groups not agreeing with me.

Ah here give us a few tips!! I wish I didn't have to go through them all to find out which ones don't agree with me.

tunney

AKW wrote: »

Ah here give us a few tips!! I wish I didn't have to go through them all to find out which ones don't agree with me.

Garlic is one that BTH cannot tolerate.

Oh wait is that gingers or vampires?

BTH

tunney wrote: »

Garlic is one that BTH cannot tolerate.

Oh wait is that gingers or vampires?

Same thing.

Dairy was the main culprit AKW.

RJM85

Most people are delusional about weight in my experience. I raced last year between 70.5 - 71.5kg. I had more than one conversation with club mates where they acted shocked that I'd like to drop at least 3-4kg for this season.

desertcircus

I look forward to the day when "should I aim to clock in at 72 or 75 kilos?" is a question I can ask myself without laughing.

zico10

RJM85 wrote: »

Most people are delusional about weight in my experience. I raced last year between 70.5 - 71.5kg. I had more than one conversation with club mates where they acted shocked that I'd like to drop at least 3-4kg for this season.

Why have you decided you need to drop 3-4kg? Just because most people are overweight doesn't mean one individual can't be too light.

I think studying the figures here is very interesting;

http://www.slowtwitch.com/Products/Kona_14_Top_15_men_-_run_4714.html

The two fastest marathons were ran by guys who weighed 74kg and 78kg. Only one guy on the list would be lighter than your target weight, and he's a midget from France weighing 63kg. The heaviest guy on the list, at 79kg, ran a faster marathon than him.

Triathletes do not need to be as light as runners and long distance triathletes, the context in which the op was made, certainly don't.

For the op, honestly Joey, you're one of the slightest built triathletes I know. I don't see how you could lose 3 kilos without it affecting your power. And if you were thinking of going long, I certainly wouldn't recommend it.

BTH

zico10 wrote: »

Why have you decided you need to drop 3-4kg? Just because most people are overweight doesn't mean one individual can't be too light.

I think studying the figures here is very interesting;

http://www.slowtwitch.com/Products/Kona_14_Top_15_men_-_run_4714.html

The two fastest marathons were ran by guys who weighed 74kg and 78kg. Only one guy on the list would be lighter than your target weight, and he's a midget from France weighing 63kg. The heaviest guy on the list, at 79kg, ran a faster marathon than him.

Triathletes do not need to be as light as runners and long distance triathletes, the context in which the op was made, certainly don't.

For the op, honestly Joey, you're one of the slightest built triathletes I know. I don't see how you could lose 3 kilos without it affecting your power. And if you were thinking of going long, I certainly wouldn't recommend it.

That's some coincidence. I used the exact same link yesterday to prove to someone off thread that I really can't lose a kilo or two. I'm the same height and weight as someone on that list

zico10

BTH wrote: »

That's some coincidence. I used the exact same link yesterday to prove to someone off thread that I really can't lose a kilo or two. I'm the same height and weight as someone on that list

Great minds and all that!

RJM85

I suppose the more important thing here is actually about body composition. I'd be perfectly happy to be the same, or even higher weight with better body composition. As it stands though, I personally have /fat/ to lose.

RJM85

Ben Hoffman is similar weight / height to me. He's a lot leaner though.

RacoonQueen

Jaysus I feel incredibly fat after reading the womens one!
http://www.slowtwitch.com/Products/Kona_14_Top_15_women_-_run_4711.html