Shower not draining, toilet flushing into shower box

on_my_oe

We brought a new build recently; tonight we used the ensuite shower for the first time as we had to tile the bathrooms.

OH noticed that the water in the shower box wasn't draining away, so pulled up the waste trap - full of water. OH then flushed the ensuite toilet, and water flowed upwards into the shower box including toilet paper.

We have already had issues where the hot water was plumbed into the toilets, and no hot water was plumbed into the shower. The ensuite is on the first floor, above our kitchen.

Any suggestions? We are panicking as we have installed a new kitchen, tiled everywhere and put down carpets, and are now worried everything will need to be ripped up.

Redbishop

on_my_oe wrote: »

We brought a new build recently; tonight we used the ensuite shower for the first time as we had to tile the bathrooms.

OH noticed that the water in the shower box wasn't draining away, so pulled up the waste trap - full of water. OH then flushed the ensuite toilet, and water flowed upwards into the shower box including toilet paper.

We have already had issues where the hot water was plumbed into the toilets, and no hot water was plumbed into the shower. The ensuite is on the first floor, above our kitchen.

Any suggestions? We are panicking as we have installed a new kitchen, tiled everywhere and put down carpets, and are now worried everything will need to be ripped up.

There is a blockage in your soil pipe from you toilet draining your en suite. Where ever the soil pipe goes down, probably outside the wall at the back of the en suite and the waste from the shower is probably connected to it too. the blockage is then causing the toilet water back up in to the shower. You will need a plumber or someone with experience of toilet and waste water piping to sort it out. The soil pipe is a wide pipe probably 4 inches wide and the waste from the shower is a narrow one usually 1.5 or two inches wide. If you look at the wall outside of the en suite then the Soil pipe and the little one connected to it should be visible.

on_my_oe

There was a large round pipe beside the toilet which goes down the wall, down into the kitchen and into the ground eg vertical. It's boxed off and tiled in the ensuite, and boxed off and covered by the new kitchen cabinets in the kitchen. I guess it would have been about as round as a hamburger, it was a hard pipe (not plastic).

Is that the soil pipe?

It's a duplex apartment so no external pipes - we are the ground floor and 1st floor; there is an apartment above us, but it's currently unoccupied.

on_my_oe

If the soil pipe is blocked, and we have only just taken possession, what is likely to have caused the blockage?

Redbishop

on_my_oe wrote: »

There was a large round pipe beside the toilet which goes down the wall, down into the kitchen and into the ground eg vertical. It's boxed off and tiled in the ensuite, and boxed off and covered by the new kitchen cabinets in the kitchen. I guess it would have been about as round as a hamburger, it was a hard pipe (not plastic).

Is that the soil pipe?

It's a duplex apartment so no external pipes - we are the ground floor and 1st floor; there is an apartment above us, but it's currently unoccupied.

Can you see if the toilet is connected to that?

on_my_oe

First image

on_my_oe

Second photo

on_my_oe

Third image.

The pipe is encased in the boxed section vertical to the left; the toilet is immediately beside, and then the pipes for the toilet are boxed in

Redbishop

on_my_oe wrote: »

First image

Yea thats the shower, Somewhere it is connected to the same pipe as the toilet and then somewhere between where they join up and where it connects to the main sewer there is a blockage. You need someone with proper drain cleaning rods to push them through the pipe and clear the blockage. good luck

on_my_oe

Sorry this is the worlds worst sketch, but it's a layout of our ensuite

The waste pipe from the shower runs along the wall (boxed in), under the basin cabinet where it's joined by the sink, again boxed in, and then to what we assume is the soil pipe.

Everything is covered by tiles or cabinets - is there a way of accessing / fixing without ripping everything out? There are several drainage covers immediately outside our front door.

punisher5112

Get some drain un blocker I had a similar problem.

Follow instructions using hot water pour a bottle or 2 down and leave for a while worked wonders for me.

Our toilet was ushing back up through shower drain hole plus outlet pipe in floor.

on_my_oe

Reading that, I remember I've already used drain unblocked twice on the kitchen sink - does this make it more likely there is an issue with the soil pipe?

This is a plan of our kitchen

Redbishop

on_my_oe wrote: »

Sorry this is the worlds worst sketch, but it's a layout of our ensuite

The waste pipe from the shower runs along the wall (boxed in), under the basin cabinet where it's joined by the sink, again boxed in, and then to what we assume is the soil pipe.

Everything is covered by tiles or cabinets - is there a way of accessing / fixing without ripping everything out? There are several drainage covers immediately outside our front door.

You can take out the toilet bowl as it is the easiest place to access the pipe and then push some rods through from there. The cistern wont drain just because the bowl is disconnected so long as you dont flush.

Redbishop

on_my_oe wrote: »

Reading that, I remember I've already used drain unblocked twice on the kitchen sink - does this make it more unlikely there is an issue with the soil pipe?

No, because the water is going back in to the shower its the soil pipe thats blocked.

punisher5112

There will be multiple waste water pipes throughout the property.

So unblocking the kitchen sink will have nothing to do with a toilet.

Any bend or joint in pipe could cause a blockage

on_my_oe

Ok, I'm calmer now - just need to explain to OH

Field east

Trying to solve the problem yourself is a very good way of getting to know how the system works and you will then be in a better position to address similar problems in the future and help keep cost of living down. So , hopefully, you have a DIY approach.
Some points for consideration :-
(1). Check under the manhole covers to see what's there. Get the OH to flush the toilet just after you have taken off all the inspection covers that may be related to your soil pipe. You may be able to spot the offending pipe. If you do you could ram up , while using plastic gloves, a spring wire type pipe cleaner. These come in various lengths. There might be other types of cleaning rods available for this. Talk to your local DIY shop.
(2) approaching the same pipe from the toilet end, as already suggested, would be the next move. Turn off the water supply to the cistern first, or tie up the ball cock B4 you start to remove the toilet bowl. Removing this is not a daunting task.. Be gentle/careful when ramming rods into any pipe in case you disconnect pipes at joinings. If you feel a sudden resistance or there is increasing pressure needed then try and twist the rod at the same time you are pushing it in.

( 3)if the toilet was being used by the builders and there were things flushed down as well as toilet paper flushed down and it got partially blocked and then not used for some time, then this scenario could lead to 'stuff ' drying up/ getting hard in the pipe. This could easily happen just under the inspection cover

Best of luck with your endevours

on_my_oe

OH went to get drain rods this morning at the local plumbing merchants and came home instead with Dam Buster... Given it two attempts without success so now I'm going shopping to get the rods.

http://www.plumbingproducts.ie/product.php?id_product=1721

Fingers crossed, and fingers crossed for everyone's help so far - will update later.

(Still worried my beautiful ensuite and kitchen will need removing, so am open to trying everything)

Calahonda52

Field east wrote: »

Trying to solve the problem yourself is a very good way of getting to know how the system works and you will then be in a better position to address similar problems in the future and help keep cost of living down. So , hopefully, you have a DIY approach.
Some points for consideration :-
(1). Check under the manhole covers to see what's there. Get the OH to flush the toilet just after you have taken off all the inspection covers that may be related to your soil pipe. You may be able to spot the offending pipe. If you do you could ram up , while using plastic gloves, a spring wire type pipe cleaner. These come in various lengths. There might be other types of cleaning rods available for this. Talk to your local DIY shop.
(2) approaching the same pipe from the toilet end, as already suggested, would be the next move. Turn off the water supply to the cistern first, or tie up the ball cock B4 you start to remove the toilet bowl. Removing this is not a daunting task.. Be gentle/careful when ramming rods into any pipe in case you disconnect pipes at joinings. If you feel a sudden resistance or there is increasing pressure needed then try and twist the rod at the same time you are pushing it in.

( 3)if the toilet was being used by the builders and there were things flushed down as well as toilet paper flushed down and it got partially blocked and then not used for some time, then this scenario could lead to 'stuff ' drying up/ getting hard in the pipe. This could easily happen just under the inspection cover

Best of luck with your endevours

While I understand the sentiment here, the idea of lifting manhole covers in an apt block is a completely different legal animal to doing so within the curtilage of a private house.

my3cents

I may have missed it sorry if I did but is this a flat, single story dwelling two story house, in the town on mains drains or out in the country on a septic tank?

on_my_oe

This is a duplex apartment within a managed housing estate eg we pay €1000 management fees yearly. It's in Dublin North, so on city water.

We went to B&Q to get the rods, but they advised us against it, saying that the soil pipe should be part of the management fee maintenance.

Now we are stumped - do we contact the management company or the developer? We are considering contacting Dyno Rod and getting them to solve it, and then invoicing the management company.

If it's our problem, fine, we will deal with it and use the drain rods, but we are wary of opening the drain covers then causing a bigger problem and discovering it was/is a management company issue.

Redbishop

on_my_oe wrote: »

This is a duplex apartment within a managed housing estate eg we pay €1000 management fees yearly. It's in Dublin North, so on city water.

We went to B&Q to get the rods, but they advised us against it, saying that the soil pipe should be part of the management fee maintenance.

Now we are stumped - do we contact the management company or the developer? We are considering contacting Dyno Rod and getting them to solve it, and then invoicing the management company.

If it's our problem, fine, we will deal with it and use the drain rods, but we are wary of opening the drain covers then causing a bigger problem and discovering it was/is a management company issue.

Basically I think if the soil pipe is serving just your apt then if the blockage if inside your boundary then you are responsible. But if the apt overhead is also connected to the same pipe then it is a management company issue. Either way rodding the pipe should clear the blockage and solve your problem. Dont worry, I know it seems a mess when it happens but usually it doesent take too long to clear and shouldnt involve removing any fixtures and fittings.

PS usually with pipes serving more than 1 apt the builder leaves a rodding entrance somewhere handy to allow easy access to the pipe from somewhere inside the building.

on_my_oe

Thank you again for your help.

We spoke with the site supervisor; his immediate response was that the tiler must have been pouring adhesive down the toilet... OH did the tiling, so we know that didn't happen.

The site supervisor did at least tell me that the soil pipe is ours, and ours alone eg the upstairs unoccupied apartment has a separate pipe to ours.

Redbishop

on_my_oe wrote: »

Thank you again for your help.

We spoke with the site supervisor; his immediate response was that the tiler must have been pouring adhesive down the toilet... OH did the tiling, so we know that didn't happen.

The site supervisor did at least tell me that the soil pipe is ours, and ours alone eg the upstairs unoccupied apartment has a separate pipe to ours.

Sound and the advice was no prob. Sorry I dont live near you or would rod it for you. It usally takes 10 mins to clear a blockage unless there is builders waste in there. If there is then the builder can be asked to clear it or invoiced for the clean out. Anyway best of luck.

my3cents

OP try a simple sanisnake type drain cleaner (you can also hire) it will go around the corners in this case and might just get you sorted. tbh Dynarod would be my last choice.

Woddies have this one but it might not be up to the job, however compared to getting someone to call out at €15 it may be worth a try.

on_my_oe

Ok, so we tried rodding it for about 40mins, we thought we could feel a blockage about 2m up from the ground. We were wary of being too enthusiastic and causing further damage and so called out a drain unblocker (mainly because they were half the price of the 'market leader'). They used the jet wash and suddenly it was all firing back... The blockage was gone - took them 20mins from pulling up to driving away. Unfortunately too quick to be sure but he thought he saw builders waste.

Fingers crossed that's all.

Possibly if we went a bit longer we might have cleared it but we didn't want to cause any further damage.

As a positive, we now know where every single waste source (bathrooms, kitchen etc) all exit the property.

Thank you all for your help - appreciated it!

my3cents

And thanks for posting back always good to hear how it all turns, glad it was a good result.