Gardai and bystanders injured as teenagers go on a crime rampage

Nodin

prizefighter wrote: »

It doesn't mention them beating up unarmed civilians. In fact that article highlights that outside of rival gangs these 'animals' were seen as normal people who fed the poor and one saved a drowning woman.?!

Course, they were all saints in the past. Good oul days.

As is the case today with many criminals.

prizefighter wrote: »

So you are sticking to your prior point that Ireland had just as much violent crime and delinquency in the 30's as to now?!

There has always been crime and delinquency, here and elsewhere.

prizefighter

end of the road wrote: »

i didn't and i don't. whatever about sending someone around to physically take the child to school, sending a parent to jail costs the tax payer money that could be put to better use



yes.



collective punishment is immoral

So jailing a parent costs money but I'm assuming this state funded nanny chauffeur who will take your kids to school will be free yeah?! They can bring them to school on the back of unicorn along the rainbow highway to lollipop land.

Gatling

end of the road wrote: »

no example can be set. only a punishment can be doled out, which is prison hopefully

Yes it can be set, if whole families can be evicted from housing if only one individual is taking part in anti social behaviour or dealing then why can't we deport family's of these idiots scum

prizefighter

Nodin wrote: »

Course, they were all saints in the past. Good oul days.

As is the case today with many criminals.



There has always been crime and delinquency, here and elsewhere.

Hold on, you posted an article that shows although crime existed, it was very much an insular form of criminality. I'm just trying to convey to you that in modern Ireland we have a growing problem with antisocial behaviour and delinquency. There are too many part time parents who don't give A ****e whether their child is a bilingual mathematician or a meth addled sex offender.

reprise

end of the road wrote: »

i'm not bothered by it if its done in a fair and transparent process. i'm not of the delusian though that those who are deported can't come back and slip in undetected. no immigration system is perfect or seal proof no matter how much people delude themselves that the y are.

How many of the sex abusers Sinn Fein deported to the republic went back?

Nodin

prizefighter wrote: »

Hold on, you posted an article that shows although crime existed, it was very much an insular form of criminality. I'm just trying to convey to you that in modern Ireland we have a growing problem with antisocial behaviour and delinquency. There are too many part time parents who don't give A ****e whether their child is a bilingual mathematician or a meth addled sex offender.

"growing" compared to what?

Bad parenting isn't new either, btw.

end of the road

darkpagandeath wrote: »

So much fail in this thread, 16 yearolds are the responsibility of the parents. If they cannot parent them, then the state needs to either take these ruffians into care or put them in jail and then deport the lot of them to place of origin. As the parents again are responsible for the actions on people under the age of 18. So if their own values support the actions of said under 18s they are not going to be part of a law abiding society. That then would be grounds for deportation, supporting actions of criminals.

taking them into the failed system that is the care system would cost to much and they would still end up doing whatever

darkpagandeath

end of the road wrote: »

taking them into the failed system that is the care system would cost to much and they would still end up doing whatever

Ok so let them run wild ? I have had the pleasure to live here for 20 odd years and not broken the law like this lot.

end of the road

Gatling wrote: »

Yes it can be set, if whole families can be evicted from housing if only one individual is taking part in anti social behaviour or dealing then why can't we deport family's of these idiots scum

well certainly the eviction of whole families for the action of one is illegitimate and anyone who does it should be stripped of their authority. only if the whole family is involved in the anti-social behaviour should they be evicted. collective punishment is illegitimate and has no place in a forward thinking modern society

end of the road

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Ok so let them run wild ? I have had the pleasure to live here for 20 odd years and not broken the law like this lot.

no, lock them up

Gatling

end of the road wrote: »

no, lock them up

Not exactly forward thinking

coopdog85

I'd say there was a queue of guards outside their cell, all wanting to give those two rats a hiding. Would love to see what kind of damage the guards did to them!

Birneybau

*walking along oblivious*

Du du du du du du.

Oh, is this the Journal? No? Are you sure?

DK man

If this is what they are at at 16 wait till they are in their 20s.

Do we want people like this on our streets attacking innocent people? Are the laws sufficient to deal with this?

I think we all know the answer to the above questions. One of the dundons was deported from England after a crime spree and look what they saved themselves from.

Irish people don't want this scum in our country leeching off us and attacking us simultaneously

If we don't deport them after their sentance we are fools -

Little CuChulainn

DK man wrote: »

If this is what they are at at 16 wait till they are in their 20s.

Do we want people like this on our streets attacking innocent people? Are the laws sufficient to deal with this?

I think we all know the answer to the above questions. One of the dundons was deported from England after a crime spree and look what they saved themselves from.

Irish people don't want this scum in our country leeching off us and attacking us simultaneously

If we don't deport them after their sentance we are fools -

And what do we do with our own scum who are much worse and much more prevalent? I'm no liberal but this concept of deporting a family for their delinquent child is ridiculous. Some kids are uncontrollable. I know from experience that the worst scumbag can have a dream family and still turn out bad. And what about kids in state care? Should we jail the care workers when one of the little ****s commits a crime? Despite what the statistics might say to the contrary, this country is getting worse for public order issues, particularly amongst juveniles. We need a better solution than deporting the foreigners.

darkpagandeath

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

And what do we do with our own scum who are much worse and much more prevalent? I'm no liberal but this concept of deporting a family for their delinquent child is ridiculous. Some kids are uncontrollable. I know from experience that the worst scumbag can have a dream family and still turn out bad. And what about kids in state care? Should we jail the care workers when one of the little ****s commits a crime? Despite what the statistics might say to the contrary, this country is getting worse for public order issues, particularly amongst juveniles. We need a better solution than deporting the foreigners.

They are guests here just like me, if they can't abide by the law go home. If you leave your kids unattended what do you think happens. Dogs go rabid if you let them roam the streets in packs.

RobYourBuilder

And what do we do with our own scum who are much worse and much more prevalent? I'm no liberal but this concept of deporting a family for their delinquent child is ridiculous. 

We have our own scrotes. No need to import another countries too. Again, look at the Aussies. A few members of three Irish families went on the rip and scammed some OAPs. Every member of the three families is now in a detention centre awaiting their deportation hearing and eventual repatriation.

That's how it's done.

We can deport them under public policy.

DoYouEvenLift

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

Throw them and their families out of the country.

And put that burden on another country? No, just wipe out their gene lines instead so nobody else has to suffer their existence.

darkpagandeath

DoYouEvenLift wrote: »

And put that burden on another country? No, just wipe out their gene lines instead so nobody else has to suffer their existence.

Even if serious.

Criminality is a learned behaviour and not a genetic memory.

SpaceTime

Quite misleading stuff is being posted here about what happened with that Australian deportation. It's not collective punishment at all.

From what I have read it may have been for breeching the terms of their visas, not because their families committed crimes. Although, individuals who did would face the justice system as well as the Department of Immigration and Border Protection rules. Their family members' activity simply brought them to the attention of authorities who checked for visa compliance.

They had lawfully held visas, but had 'no work' restrictions on them.

Australia follows rule of law, just like we do. They did not and will not deport random family members for something that some other family member did.

What simply happened was the actions of their family members resulted in all their visas being checked as part of a police and Department of Immigration and Border Protection raid.

That is a *very* different scenario to suggestions that Australian authorities threw out a whole family because of what some of them did. They didn't collectively punish anyone, they simply enforced the T&Cs of their visas which were being breeched, even if the scam hadn't happened you can be deported for working on a visa that specifies 'no work'.

http://www.irishecho.com.au/2015/01/23/mass-deportation-of-irish-nationals-from-wa/33481

This crime rampage in Lucan needs to be dealt with. My concern is that the juvenile courts here won't deal with it in a serious enough way given the severity of what happened.
Regardless of where they're from it's actually a problem with our justice system being unable to hold teens to account for serious crimes in general that is at issue here rather than immigration law.
That same pattern repeats in most Western / Northern European countries too - teens are almost immune from serious prosecution thus can behave abysmally without any serious threat of sanctions in most countries from what I can see.

Jake Rugby Walrus666

alf steward wouldnt tolerate any of this nonsense

foxy farmer

Yobs like these, homegrown or otherwise, should be put in leg irons, put on a boat and landed on some desolate island. Give them a sledge and put breaking stones for a few years. No first world luxuries. That wouldn't be long knocking the youthful exuberance off them.

Galwayguy35

foxy farmer wrote: »

Yobs like these, homegrown or otherwise, should be put in leg irons, put on a boat and landed on some desolate island. Give them a sledge and put breaking stones for a few years. No first world luxuries. That wouldn't be long knocking the youthful exuberance off them.

Re open Spike Island.

K.Flyer

What's the bets on G.T.A. getting the blame for their behaviour.
Cue some hand wringing individual...
"...oh they are normally such quiet young lads, but they were playing that game all day and blah blah blah"

JuliusCaesar

The Indo has become a complete tabloid catering to the simple-minded Hang 'em, flog 'em, send them back brigade, who are out in force here in AH as always.

These stories always anger me.

I love my country, but it seems to me that our legal system is so fcuked.

Little CuChulainn

darkpagandeath wrote: »

They are guests here just like me, if they can't abide by the law go home. If you leave your kids unattended what do you think happens. Dogs go rabid if you let them roam the streets in packs.

They aren't guests. They are EU citizens and as long as we are in the EU they have as much right to be here as you do. And you completely ignored my question about addressing our own issues. Adopting a policy of sending foreigners home does nothing to address the much bigger problem of Irish youths.

Ally Dick

We got left with the dregs of Eastern Europe. The hard workers went elsewhere when the building boom collapsed

reprise

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

The Indo has become a complete tabloid catering to the simple-minded Hang 'em, flog 'em, send them back brigade, who are out in force here in AH as always.

There was me thinking that psychologists would be the last people to apply lazy stereotyping and generalisations. You live and learn.

darkpagandeath

Little CuChulainn wrote: »

They aren't guests. They are EU citizens and as long as we are in the EU they have as much right to be here as you do. And you completely ignored my question about addressing our own issues. Adopting a policy of sending foreigners home does nothing to address the much bigger problem of Irish youths.

Don't you mean Criminals home, And their family that turn a blind eye to that criminality. At 16 I was not car jacking or punching police. The parents obviously don't care a dam. But i'm waiting to see them on tv going on about butter wont melt. And your right only extends to being in EU countries when you follow the law. Read the EU legislation on this and of grounds to be deported.