My four year old has just been discriminated based on her religion!

positron

And now I know how it feels like. It feels like someone punched my in my lower abdomen. It feels as if I am a primate covered in my own feces and a bunch of 'civilized high society' is looking down at us from their high power position.

It feels like they thinks my smart, intelligent and super compassionate four year old girl - who is everything I live for - is not up to their standards because her father (me) wanted to keep the simple values of honesty and integrity and respect (which is why I decided not to lie to a priest or a church).

Forgetting how I feel about it for a moment, come September, I don't know how I am going to explain to my four year old that she's "special" that she can't go to the same school where all of her neighbors and creche buddies are going to. She already knows this 'BIG' school where she was going to go as it's right next to her creche. It's literally 10 mins walk away from our house. Instead she will have to be taken a school far away in a car, every morning, which I think also puts an end to my wife's ambitions to go back to work for another while.

I can't believe in this discrimination is allowed in this day and age. Imagine what would happen if the local butchers or barber shop decided to prioritize their clients based on religion or hair colour!!

/Rant. Apparently I am an "untouchable". I am just gutted, that's all. :(


PS: A late edit to late comers to this thread. I understand that this is a dividing type of topic. I have come around from my initial disappointment and have decided that it's no big deal. Financial and other costs of course, but we will survive. I have also posted more details on the thread, to avoid any speculation why the place was not offered, patronage etc etc. We are all suffering, in various ways!

PPS: School's enrollment policy from their website:

In the event of the number of children seeking enrolment in any given class / standard exceeding the number
of places available preceding or during the school year the following criteria will be used to prioritise children
for enrolment, and in the following order:
a. Catholic children living within the catchment area**, and sisters and brothers of pupils
attending ..school..
b. Children of current staff, including ancillary staff;
c. Catholic children living outside the catchment area who do not have a Catholic school within
their own parish boundary;
d. Other children living within the catchment area;
e. Other children living outside the catchment area;
f. In the event that priority will be required to be given to children within any one of the above
categories, older children will be given priority.
g. It is proposed to enrol a maximum of 150 pupils for the school year 2012/2013.

Rosy Posy

I understand how emotive it can be to feel that your child has been excluded because you refuse to ally yourself with a particular religious denomination, but think for a moment, if you don't want your child indoctrinated into this religion then why would you send her to this school? I speak as a parent who chooses to send her kids to a school ten miles away that embodies the philosophical and pedagogical tenets that we want in our children's education. The driving is a pain but car pooling and school bus for the older kids is a wonderful thing. And I know it can foster dissonance with the local kids who go to the local school, but we get our kids to participate in extra curricular activities in the community and make sure our house is open for local kids to come and play so that these relationships can be encouraged. It can feel like rejection but if you've chosen a secular path for your family then this is what it takes to follow through.

farmchoice

you can explain that even though you knew quite well this day was coming you felt that your conscience was the most important thing.

that as you don't hold with the catholic church you chose not to have her christened. thereby effecting her choice of schools.

as a grown adult and a parent you knew this was coming so don't be crying the victim now, you made your bed.

I'm an atheist i hold the catholic church in very low esteem but i had my little fella christened for this very reason, its not fair, but its reality. i could have sent him to the newly opened non religious school but for the reasons you outlined in your post i chose not to.

you are more then entitled to your point of view and i admire you for sticking to your guns in what is unfortunately still a catholic country, but this is the price you pay for your convictions it and you knew it from the beginning.

madalig12

[/Quote]if you don't want your child indoctrinated into this religion then why would you send her to this school? [/QUOTE]

School...where people are taught subjects to help them get on in life
church....where people are taught about religion to help them cope with death.

Should be two different things altogether. They dont teach maths in church why should they teach religion in schools.

eviltwin

As the parent of a young child its a bug bear of mine. We are very lucky we got him into our local ET which is just up the road and we're really happy but we just got in by the skin of our teeth. A lot of other parents we're so lucky and have to send their kids to school elsewhere. I believe local schools should be for local kids, there should be no segregation on the basis of faith.

bpmurray

farmchoice wrote: »

you are more then entitled to your point of view and i admire you for sticking to your guns in what is unfortunately still a catholic country, but this is the price you pay for your convictions it and you knew it from the beginning.

Bollacks! The reality is that this is discrimination, something the UN has attacked Ireland for again and again. This stupidity won't change until such time as the government is sued in the ECHR.

Penny Tration

Surely you would have known she may not be accepted to a Catholic school, since she wasn't baptised?

That said, lots of the Catholic schools in my area have students of many different religions in them.

LeinsterDub

You should of just lied

baldbear

What's the harm in getting her baptised? No one really takes it seriously. It'll just make it easier.

eviltwin

baldbear wrote: »

What's the harm in getting her baptised? No one really takes it seriously. It'll just make it easier.

Its this kind of attitude that ensures nothing will change.

Sheldons Brain

The school has its standards, you can either comply with them or not, but if you decide not to do so you have no justification for whining about it. Just tell your daughter that you have decided to disassociate yourself from the local community.

Glinda

I don't mean to sound harsh, but if the school is oversubscribed, there will always be some children who don't get a place. There's no getting around it. It's hard when your child is the one who is left out, but if it wasn't your child it would be someone else's.

If it's a religious school, then they will give first preference to parish children. Other places give preference to kids who already have a sibling.

The real disgrace here is that there aren't enough state schools to take children who aren't affiliated to a religion.

But, even in places where there is an alternative school, the 'better' schools are often oversubscribed and have to allocate places based on criteria. People who are not given a place are terribly disappointed but seldom set out what criteria for choosing they would accept as fair where the school has to choose between one child and another for a place.

desertcircus

A school that refuses students based on their religious background deserves no state funding.

cruizer101

Sheldons Brain wrote: »

you have no justification for whining about it

Apart from the fact that the school is funded by the taxpayer which is you me and everyone so we should all be treated equally

Glinda wrote: »

People who are not given a place are terribly disappointed but seldom set out what criteria for choosing they would accept as fair where the school has to choose between one child and another for a place.

Distance from school and siblings, simples

skallywag

Am I missing the point here, i.e. where is it mentioned anywhere that the school was catholic and that the child was refused for not being a catholic? i.e. could just as easily have been a protestant school refusing a catholic?

pwurple

I don't know how I am going to explain to my four year old that she's "special" that she can't go to the same school where all of her neighbors and creche buddies are going to

Eh, what? My child will be starting school next september and doesn't give a monkeys where her neighbours and creche buddies are going. No explanation required. She'll go where we send her, end of. It's a school which isn't our preferred religion either, but it's the closest decent school, so we go along with it. I generally put religion to the very bottom of my list of educational priorities.. behind maths english PE, irish etc. All thsoe things are far more important. She'll learn that religion in school and we'll do our own thing outside.

The inconvenience for you is a big problem, which I completely understand, but please don't do the 'Poor ickle 4 year old' thing. Your 4 year old will see it as completely normal. No need for the hand-wringing on her behalf.

If this is the way you've chosen to do it, then organise yourself around the car journey (and honestly, it seems like only a tiny handful of children avoid a car trip to school these days anyway... so it's not going to child-abuse here to transport her in a car to school).

And of course your wife can work. What do you think everyone else does?

vicwatson

desertcircus wrote: »

A school that refuses students based on their religious background deserves no state funding.

And for me this is the whole point - if one is going to teach religion in taxpayer paid for schools then all religions and none should be taught in taxpayer paid for schools.

I cant see why this cannot happen within the next 3-5 years.

vicwatson

She'll learn that religion in school and we'll do our own thing outside

Wha'?

Orion

baldbear wrote: »

What's the harm in getting her baptised? No one really takes it seriously. It'll just make it easier.

Why should she have to? It's a state funded school. There is legislation coming which will repeal the section of the Equal Status Act which allows this discrimination to take place. Not before its time.

Orion

skallywag wrote: »

Am I missing the point here, i.e. where is it mentioned anywhere that the school was catholic and that the child was refused for not being a catholic? i.e. could just as easily have been a protestant school refusing a catholic?

Probably because nearly 90% of primary schools are under catholic patronage. CoI schools generally take anyone regardless of religion.

Glinda

So, which children should be left without places? This is the pointy end of the question which no-one ever seems to deal with. Almost everyone seems to agree that religion is out (even for religious schools) so what is an acceptable deciding factor when they have to choose between kids?

pwurple

vicwatson wrote: »

And for me this is the whole point - if one is going to teach religion in taxpayer paid for schools then all religions and none should be taught in taxpayer paid for schools.

The churches own the schools. The property they sit on was bought and paid for by whichever community wanted it. Maybe the govt could buy them out?

pwurple

Orion wrote: »

Probably because nearly 90% of primary schools are under catholic patronage. CoI schools generally take anyone regardless of religion.

Not so. Catholic schools generally take anyone regardless of religion unless over subscribed. Exactly the same policy as COI.

_Brian

You stuck to your principals in not having your child baptised into a faith.

This is a choice on your behalf.
But surely you knew there would be consequences for your decision.

We all make decisions and live with the consequences.

If you really wanted your child in this school them you should have made the choices in life that would facilitate that.

conorhal

desertcircus wrote: »

A school that refuses students based on their religious background deserves no state funding.

I don't see any suggestion that the OP was refused a place, only the suggestion that her child won't be going to the same school as her friends based on her parents preference for a non-denominational education. In other words, her choice.
There's a fierce bang of narcisistic entitlement off the OP and I find it odd that her 'unique and special snowflake' can only be unique and special in a context where everybody else has to conform to her views for her convienience. She want's her child to be different but when it comes down it actually making a choice that marks that difference she then complains it's descrimination?
Get up the yard!

mikom

baldbear wrote: »

What's the harm in getting her baptised? No one really takes it seriously. It'll just make it easier.

Put another one on the "books" for the feckers that excluded you......... No bloody way.
Some people have a back just made for a saddle.

average_runner

vicwatson wrote: »

And for me this is the whole point - if one is going to teach religion in taxpayer paid for schools then all religions and none should be taught in taxpayer paid for schools.

I cant see why this cannot happen within the next 3-5 years.

Then maybe the state should pay back the money to the churches that funded these schools for years

A_Sober_Paddy

pwurple wrote: »

The churches own the schools. The property they sit on was bought and paid for by whichever community wanted it. Maybe the govt could buy them out?

Well if the church owns all these properties, the state should remove them and take them for themselves...In punishment for the decades of a abuses the church has enforced on the people of this state

vicwatson

pwurple wrote: »

The churches own the schools. The property they sit on was bought and paid for by whichever community wanted it. Maybe the govt could buy them out?

My local school recently got an extension to their school, and a friends school was completely rebuilt - are you telling me that the taxpayer has now gifted these buildings to the Catholic Church, even though the taxpayer paid for them?

average_runner wrote: »

Then maybe the state should pay back the money to the churches that funded these schools for years

And vice versa, perhaps the Catholic Church should not be looking for state funding if they want Catholic Schools, let them fund themselves and see how many "Catholics" take them up in the year 2015. That'll learn them quick!

skallywag

A_Sober_Paddy wrote: »

Well if the church owns all these properties, the state should remove them and take them for themselves...

Is that you Henry?

Magnate

_Brian wrote: »

You stuck to your principals in not having your child baptised into a faith.

... I can't tell if this was an intended pun or not.