The Vladimir Putin appreciation thread.

Gatling

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Sorry Gatling, it isn't BS, as much as you might like it to be so. There was a terrorist precence from the very start of the so called civil war in Syria. The peaceful demos that some insist on waxing lyrical about were anything but. Yes civilians did get killed in those first days, so did a lot of Syrian police. Mainly as a result of terrorist snipers who were using the same tactics that were used in Kiev - put blood on the streets to create chaos and exasperate the situation. I have no doubt that there was discontent in Syria back in 2011. That was well and truely exploited and hijacked.

On a side note, I have been courteous and open to debate on this thread. I have refrained from casting insults.

Lol..

This thread is an insult .


Ones man's personal keyboard masturbations over oul vladi

cnocbui

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

No question about it. Vladimir Vladimirovich Putin is the best thing that ever happened to Russia. He brought it back from the chaos of the collapse of the Soviets to where it is today, a great power, a counterbalance to US imperialism,.

You mean Gorbachev. Putin has, with his egomaniacle machinations aimed at reconstituting the USSR, managed to stuff up the massive progress that was being made thanks to Gorbachev's courage and put Russia in reverse, hence the massive exodus of the middle classes.

server down

Irish Praetorian wrote: »

Really, how has that worked out in Eastern Europe since the fall of the USSR? The places where the US/NATO holds sway have largely become modern free democratic societies. In a few cases it its stopped genocide (Bosnia/Kosovo). Contrast that with the Russian influenced fringes such as Abkhazia, Donbass, Crimea - frozen conflicts and ethnic cleansing.

Lets go a little further, do you imagine the China Sea and the nine-dash region is going to have more or less conflict as US influence in the region abates?

It's not a particularly easy choice of make, especially when you consider the colossal mistake of Iraq, but the US still strikes me as being the least malign option.

I’m not sure why you are blaming Russia for areas that collapsed after the soviet empire. Why not blame Britain for modern Zimbabwe?

The US support of democracy overseas is contingent on whether those democracies support US policy. If they don’t the US supports or orchestrates a coup. See the history of Latin America. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor


In the case of Eastern Europe the countries are, for now, in the US camp so the US doesn’t interfere. Except for the Ukraine. Where it did.

As for China, imagine a world where China was such a belligerent power that it didn’t care for international law and had overthrown Iraq for its own imperialistic reasons, then supported the overthrow of Assad as a “dictator” by the most extreme Islamists (while simultaneously supporting the Saudis), and along with its allies orchestrated the overthrow of the Libyan leader because he annoyed them. Add to that a never ending war in Afghanistan. And imagine all of this belligerence killed millions.

And let’s say these actions destabilised the actual continent you were living in as well.

Moreover, in this other universe China is not finished because it’s now banging the war drums against Iran, a war that would further destabilise the Middle East, Asia and Europe.

Would you be supportive of this hegemony?

Irish Praetorian

server down wrote: »

I’m not sure why you are blaming Russia for areas that collapsed after the soviet empire. Why not blame Britain for modern Zimbabwe?

The US support of democracy overseas is contingent on whether those democracies support US policy. If they don’t the US supports or orchestrates a coup. See the history of Latin America. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Condor

In the case of Eastern Europe the countries are, for now, in the US camp so the US doesn’t interfere. Except for the Ukraine. Where it did.

As for China, imagine a world where China was such a belligerent power that it didn’t care for international law and had overthrown Iraq for its own imperialistic reasons, then supported the overthrow of Assad as a “dictator” by the most extreme Islamists (while simultaneously supporting the Saudis), and along with its allies orchestrated the overthrow of the Libyan leader because he annoyed them. Add to that a never ending war in Afghanistan. And imagine all of this belligerence killed millions.

And let’s say these actions destabilised the actual continent you were living in as well.

Moreover, in this other universe China is not finished because it’s now banging the war drums against Iran, a war that would further destabilise the Middle East, Asia and Europe.

Would you be supportive of this hegemony?

Well in the case of the regions I mentioned, it's because Russia (not the Soviet Union) is the state that dispatched its troops to those locations in order to annex them in the case of Donbass or provide support for the local regimes in the case of the Caucasus region. That is the practical distinction - at least when US troops invade the eventually head home.

As for US support of democracies, two points I would make; first we can't continue to have a debate where someone says 'well human rights in X aren't great' and it's considered an acceptable retort to go 'yes well the US invaded somewhere 40 years ago so stop complaining'. Secondly, I'm not buying the argument of 40 years ago applying today - what's the last South American democracy the US has overthrown?

To your Ukraine point - what exactly US intervention was Ukraine subject to? I've seen people say money was spent there, I've seen people say arguments were made there. I've yet to hear anyone say that US troops were sent in to secure a few provinces, which is what Russia actually did.

Finally to take your China argument, firstly I'm going to have to take you for your reading on history. Iraq we've already agreed was bad, no dispute there, Libya however was primarily a UK-France affair and to be fair to them there was the small issue of half the country wanting to be rid of Gaddaffi - as for Afghanistan I would merely submit the country has actually been quieter post the US led intervention than before and I could not conceive of any other outcome that was going to happen in the aftermath of what remains the worlds largest terrorist attack.

Assad similarly seems to want to outsource the idea that people don't like him onto the US - he is unpopular and the US certainly liked the idea of him being replaced with a more moderate regime. But as we both know those moderates are largely a chimera and have not achieved the kind of success the Islamist groups have. But the US hasn't been undertaking the kind of arms transfers or training that people seem to believe, being more in the realm of laughably incompetent than dark helicopters in the night. I presume you've heard of the multi-million dollar training programme that ended up training just five men?

I would also caution you against buying into all this 'War in Iran' nonsense, I've heard people going on about it since 2007 at least and here we are today.

So that's more or less my vision of the history - now as to your question of would I 'support this hegemony' - well support is going a bit far, and in any case it is not an option that presents itself. The real question is would I swap out this hegemony for something potentially more destructive, more violent and more damaging, to which I'm inclined to say no.

badabing106

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeS3Eq4e8Qs

tomwaterford

Vlad could be in bother here....looks like their covering up something??

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/worldviews/wp/2017/11/11/radioactive-cloud-that-covered-europe-might-be-from-russia-dont-worry-about-it-though/

Chrongen

pitifulgod wrote: »

You find killing political opponents to be a good leadership quality? Fair few on here seem to conveniently ignore this. If memory serves correctly, Russia is also the third most dangerous place for journalists to operate. Inspiring, eh?

Should'nt you be outside certain embassies protesting the murder of millions and the assassination of opposition leaders if you feel so strongly about it?

Tea drinker

tomwaterford wrote: »

Vlad could be in bother here....looks like their covering up something??

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/worldviews/wp/2017/11/11/radioactive-cloud-that-covered-europe-might-be-from-russia-dont-worry-about-it-though/

This is the second time we had a radioactive cloud over Europe in about 6 months. The last time the yanks sent over their nuclear sniffer plane and found... nothing. At least according to my research on the net!

https://theaviationist.com/2017/02/19/u-s-air-force-deploys-wc-135-nuclear-sniffer-aircraft-to-uk-after-spike-of-radioactive-iodine-levels-detected-in-europe/

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/radiation-europe-russian-missile-strike-radioactive-material-france-norway-iodine-131-irsn-a7591886.html

^That one is talking about iodine 131. This one is Ruthenium:
The Federal Office for Radiation Protection said Thursday that elevated levels of the isotope Ruthenium-106 have been reported in Germany, Italy, Austria, Switzerland and France since Sept. 29

Read more at: https://phys.org/news/2017-10-spike-airborne-radioactivity-europe.html#jCp

conditioned games

server down wrote: »

Honestly we’re i to play the troll game I could claim to be equally convinced you are a bot or shrill from the CIA or Israel. Nothing you say is particularly Irish related. Your entire search history is pro US shrilling.

You've hit the nail on the head. Years of constant pro American foreign policy and anti Russian rhetoric, even when faced with the actual realities of what is really happening, has raised the issue from numerous users that Gatling is a paid American troll spreading blatant lies.

weisses

conditioned games wrote: »

You've hit the nail on the head. Years of constant pro American foreign policy and anti Russian rhetoric, even when faced with the actual realities of what is really happening, has raised the issue from numerous users that Gatling is a paid American troll spreading blatant lies.

Lets see what the Russia apologists make of this one

https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/930386821401530368

https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/930389250574561280/photo/1

Hande hoche!

weisses wrote: »

Lets see what the Russia apologists make of this one

https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/930386821401530368

https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/930389250574561280/photo/1

Wouldn't be the first time computer games were mistake for footage.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-15082177

Elmer Blooker

weisses wrote: »

Lets see what the Russia apologists make of this one

https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/930386821401530368

https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/930389250574561280/photo/1

So Mr Eliot .. citizen journalist from Leicester ... Higgins is claiming that Russia is using computer game images as evidence that the US is working with ISIS.
Lets see what the NATO cheerleaders make of this one.
Raqqa's dirty secret
Some of IS most notorious members are not only given safe passage from Raqqa by the coalition/NATO but allowed to take "tonnes of weapons and ammunition" with them. We can only hope and pray that none of these weapons make their way to western European cities to be used against innocent civilians.
* Note that the source is not known to be Russia apologists.

Gatling

conditioned games wrote: »

Gatling is a paid American troll spreading blatant lies.

Bhaaaaaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaa


Unfortunately for me I've always presented Actual varified facts .


Unlike the others on here comrade

Gatling

weisses wrote: »

Lets see what the Russia apologists make of this one

https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/930386821401530368

https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/930389250574561280/photo/1

Sure look at the Putin documentary where he shows Oliver stone a video on his personal phone showing his amazing forces fighting Isis in Syria last year .

But unfortunately for oul Vladi the footage he claimed as russian forces In Syria was actually a video from a US Apache gunship guncam in Afghanistan several years earlier,

And who remembers the poor Muslim girl in London who was ridiculously attacked on social media after walking past the aftermath of the bridge attack In London ,
Promoted by an official russian Kremlin troll.

Jimmy Garlic

Gatling wrote: »

Bhaaaaaaaaaaaahaaaaaaaa


Unfortunately for me I've always presented Actual varified facts .


Unlike the others on here comrade

Verified ''facts'' garnered from buzzfeed and the like.

Gatling

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Verified ''facts'' garnered from buzzfeed and the like.

No .

el diablo

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Verified ''facts'' garnered from buzzfeed and the like.

Buzzfeed, Vice. WaPo, BBC, CNN and Snopes are his main sources of information apparently.

Jimmy Garlic

Fantastic to see Vladimir Vladimirovich overseeing the restoration of Russias glory.

Symbolic as this is the resting place of another great Russian, Generalissimo Alexander Vasilyevich Suvorov.

Gatling

el diablo wrote: »

Buzzfeed, Vice. WaPo, BBC, CNN and Snopes are his main sources of information apparently.

Wrong ,

Next

Gatling

Can we speak to a supervisor at the factory .

Shocking standards lately .

Irish Praetorian

Jimmy Garlic wrote: »

Fantastic to see Vladimir Vladimirovich overseeing the restoration of Russias glory.

Symbolic as this is the resting place of another great Russian, Generalissimo Alexander Vasilyevich Suvorov.

Wouldn't mention that name to any Poles you encounter on your daily travails

Chrongen

Regarding the massive threat from Putin and Russia....I was in Tallinn and Riga last week. No fear there.

I sometimes think that all this fear is made up.

There was no hunkering down awaiting the Russian invasion. People were doing their thing.

JenovaProject

Chrongen wrote: »

Regarding the massive threat from Putin and Russia....I was in Tallinn and Riga last week. No fear there.

I sometimes think that all this fear is made up.

There was no hunkering down awaiting the Russian invasion. People were doing their thing.

Russia is invading nobody...The US is desperately clinging on to their status as world superpower.
Watch and see the scare stories coming out about China in the next few years.

World superpowers are needed to keep each other in check.

Chrongen

In Tallinn people would take the ferry from Helsinki in Finland but also Russians would come over and stay the weekend "on the beer". People I spoke to routinely drove to St. Petersburg the same way that people from Munich drive to Prague.

Russian invasion? I didn't see it and the people of the Baltics laugh at the notion.

el diablo

Chrongen wrote: »

In Tallinn people would take the ferry from Helsinki in Finland but also Russians would come over and stay the weekend "on the beer". People I spoke to routinely drove to St. Petersburg the same way that people from Munich drive to Prague.

Russian invasion? I didn't see it and the people of the Baltics laugh at the notion.

True, it's fake news and propaganda and I'm amazed that so many people still fall for it. The warmongering Yanks are a far bigger threat to world peace than the Russians ever were.

Irish Praetorian

Yeah I always shudder to think of those big slices of Ukraine annexed by the Americans, or the parts of Georgia carved up by the Americans, or that statelet in Moldova occupied by all those Americans....


In all seriousness, there is nothing preventing people from disliking both US and Russian foreign policy, its not an "either or" situation.

el diablo

Irish Praetorian wrote: »

Yeah I always shudder to think of those big slices of Ukraine annexed by the Americans, or the parts of Georgia carved up by the Americans, or that statelet in Moldova occupied by all those Americans....


In all seriousness, there is nothing preventing people from disliking both US and Russian foreign policy, its not an "either or" situation.

The Yanks and their EU lapdogs are responsible for destabilizing Ukraine and installing a puppet government there. Of course Russia were never going to take this lightly. Similar story in Georgia in 2008.

Kermit.de.frog

Gatling

el diablo wrote: »

The Yanks and their EU lapdogs are responsible for destabilizing Ukraine and installing a puppet government there. Of course Russia were never going to take this lightly. Similar story in Georgia in 2008.

But you had no issues with the russian puppets in ukraine , following with the occupation of Eastern Ukraine and the Crimea and exactly like the 2008 military assault on Georgia and subsequent occupation in 2008

Might want to do a little reading .

one world order

Remember it was the Americans supporting a neo nazi group in Ukraine that led to the overthrow of a legitimately elected government. With IMF help, Ukraine have being engaged in a civil war, attacking Russian speaking people in the east. For ever they will be slaves paying interest to the US run IMF and that's US democracy the western media looks up to.