Aer Lingus Fleet/Routes Discussion

Bussywussy

Deleted User wrote: »

Quite possibly but remember they have the ability to drawn down from the IAG order pool. As has been done for this years two A330's and next years two. Also their A350's are due for delivery in 2018. They have 7 A330/350's due in the next three years and two 757's at least.

true actually I never took into the account the whole IAG factor.....

It was reported last week that EI/IAG were looking at the 330NEO and 321NEOLR.

Yes the 757 should be replaced by the LR but with current full prices it's cheaper to have the 757 in the fleet than buy new aircraft, similar is happening around the world at the moment. Some airlines are delaying deliveries as it's cheaper to run current fleet.

IAG are going to look at fleet replacement of the EI SH fleet this year and place an order late this year or early next year.

zone 1

yes but older planes burn more full no... is AL fleet not pushing on in age.. 757 boeing need to get something new for that market as AIRBUS say they have the AC in the A321NEO.

zone 1

as of now if your order a330neo.. when would AL have them..

JCX BXC

zone 1 wrote: »

yes but older planes burn more full no... is AL fleet not pushing on in age.. 757 boeing need to get something new for that market as AIRBUS say they have the AC in the A321NEO.

They burn more fuel, but you dont get aircraft for free either. Currently its cheaper to keep the slightly less fuel efficient aircraft rather than purchase a new one. 757's won't last too much longer.

Boeing's replacement is the 737-900, but does not meet the criteria of the A321 NEO. Both aircraft are fine for most of the old 757 routes, but a handful of low yield Transatlantic routes require the range of the A321 NEO.

zone 1

yes boeing loseing out hard to understand how they made that mistake....A321neo looks to be the gamechanger so to speak

JCX BXC

Its really not though.
The amount of routes that fall within the barrier of being too long for the 737-900 and perfect for the 757 is actually quite small. The A320's and 737's replace the vast majority of 757 routes amply.

Boeing would likely lose money developing a special replacement for the 757, its not needed.

zone 1

but have boeing not said there looking at 75 replacement, i think some airlines are pushing for this maybe im wrong .......

Shannon757

zone 1 wrote: »

but have boeing not said there looking at 75 replacement, i think some airlines are pushing for this maybe im wrong .......

In 20-30 years time perhaps.

L1011

Shannon757 wrote: »

Timeframe?

5-6 years I'd imagine. No airline in IAG is likely to be in the melee for early slots, but once you're operating RR powered 350s, having a legacy fleet of (very legacy) CF6 powered 330s starts to become a bit illogical.

Tenger

Shannon757 wrote: »

Will we be getting any 330neos?

EI previously decided the A350 was a better aircraft for for them than the A330neo. IAG may think differently however IAG currently have no A330neo on order. And the IAG presentation last Oct indicated that EI were to accept A350's.

Locker10a wrote: »

In your informed opinion do you think they will decide any plans to replace the 757s over the next 2-4 years?

B757 contract is up until 2020. No need to replace if it is a cost effective situation.

Locker10a wrote: »

What is likely to be pulled out of the IAG pool in terms of short haul replacement ?

IAG currently have 120 A320 family on order for Vueling (Aug 2013) along with another 100 A320neo options for the group overall.
In late 2015 15 of those 100 options were firmed up, no indication so far of where those 15 will go to.

IAG orders breakdown from 2013:
http://centreforaviation.com/analysis/iags-aircraft-orders-are-like-waiting-for-a-bus-three-arrive-at-the-same-time-127053

IAG A333's to EI and A332s to IB, 15 firm A320neo orders:
http://www.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/news/market-news/market-news-detail/IAG/12569397.html

Maybe I'm not getting the right sources, but cant see any clear indication of another 2 A330 for EI in 2017.
EI will of course need the extra fleet units to allow network growth in 2017.
Another A330 would allow extra capacity, a 12th would allow expansion?
(Planned L/H fleet Winter 2016/17 = A330x10, B757x4)

zone 1 wrote: »

but have Boeing not said there looking at 75 replacement, i think some airlines are pushing for this maybe im wrong .......

There is not much of a business case. 90% of B757 range/capacity is covered by the B737-9 and the A320neo. The B787-8 also overlaps the top end of the B757 range/capacity. Hard to justify a new build airframe for only 150-250 possible orders.
The A321LR is an adaption of the existing A321neo design, so Airbus didn't need a huge R&D investment to create the aircraft.

Sorry it's a 5th 757 and it's to be used on either a Shannon-Chicago route or a Belfast-Boston route in 2017.

JCX BXC

Deleted User wrote: »

Sorry it's a 5th 757 and it's to be used on either a Shannon-Chicago route or a Belfast-Boston route in 2017.

That's intresting.
SNN-ORD is already served by United, (Albeit numbers are struggling somewhat) with the recent IAG takeover could this result in the further cutting of ties with United?

Belfast to Boston, don't EI serve BHD? A Boston route would need BFS due to runway constraints at BHD. Personally I do think there is an underserved market at Belfast though, so its well believable (Hi Owenc). Didn't EI also say they wouldn't serve transatlantic from Belfast? May have changed from IAG takeover.

Van.Bosch

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Sorry it's a 5th 757 and it's to be used on either a Shannon-Chicago route or a Belfast-Boston route in 2017.

Can't see anything but DUB expansion, build out the hub etc. Less risk

IRLConor

Carnacalla wrote: »

Belfast to Boston, don't EI serve BHD? A Boston route would need BFS due to runway constraints at BHD.

BHD-SNN-BOS-BHD? Fuel up and pre-clear in SNN? The EI version of BA1?

(I'm joking, of course!)

Tenger

IRLConor wrote: »

BHD-SNN-BOS-BHD? Fuel up and pre-clear in SNN? The EI version of BA1?

(I'm joking, of course!)

EI used to do this in the distant past (I think it was when they had the MD-11?)
EI-111/112 went BFS-SNN-JFK-SNN-BFS.
This was in the 1990's when the road network meant driving from Belfast to Dublin was a 2-3 hours journey.

donvito99

I'm sorry but this Belfast (going back to Aldergrove?) to Boston business smells like nonsense to me. Goes against the Tatl mantra of recent years. Although, if they were to do it, it would be with ASL and the 75.

pclive

Would a fleet of 19 A330s for EI by 2019 be a little optimistic? A friend of mine who is transferring over from SH to LH as FO was told this the other day by the chief pilot.

donvito99

donvito99 wrote: »

I'm sorry but this Belfast (going back to Aldergrove?) to Boston business smells like nonsense to me. Goes against the Tatl mantra of recent years. Although, if they were to do it, it would be with ASL and the 75.

What mantra is that ? Aer Lingus have also suggested previously starting up ops outside of Ireland.

As for you comment about ASL and 757, please read my post I've quoted from earlier in the topic.

Deleted User wrote: »

Sorry it's a 5th 757 and it's to be used on either a Shannon-Chicago route or a Belfast-Boston route in 2017.

JCX BXC

pclive wrote: »

Would a fleet of 19 A330s for EI by 2019 be a little optimistic? A friend of mine who is transferring over from SH to LH as FO was told this the other day by the chief pilot.

19? In 3 years?
Doesn't seem possible to me, especially with possible restraints at DUB over the next few years due to only 1 RWY.

pclive

Carnacalla wrote: »

19? In 3 years?
Doesn't seem possible to me, especially with possible restraints at DUB over the next few years due to only 1 RWY.

Just to confirm that the total A330 fleet in 2019 was said to be 19

A319er

19 is the number but it's 19 long haul fleet
So 5 757 and 14 330 , all 300 s is the plan
Given this year

4 x757 and 10 X 330 , not too big a stretch !

Noxegon

I think we need another pier at DUB...

Tenger

pclive wrote: »

Would a fleet of 19 A330s for EI by 2019 be a little optimistic? A friend of mine .................... was told this the other day by the chief pilot.

Well it will be 10 A330 by Sept 2016, remains to be seen if they dispose of 1-2 of the older A332's.
I would be thinking perhaps that number is 19 aircraft L/H fleet by 2019 (5x B757, 14x A330/A350)

IAG did claim that they would double the EI L/H fleet by 2020. In mid 2015 that number was 3x B757, 8x A330.

So when EI take their 9x A350 on order, (Currently planned at 3 per year, 2018/19/20) while retaining the 2007+ A333's...that gives us 15 in total,
add the current B757s..... voila!! 19 in total.
This figure however, presumes no new A330/B757 in 2017.

Van.Bosch

Tenger wrote: »

Well it will be 10 A330 by Sept 2016, remains to be seen if they dispose of 1-2 of the older A332's.
I would be thinking perhaps that number is 19 aircraft L/H fleet by 2019 (5x B757, 14x A330/A350)
IAG did claim that they would double the EI L/H fleet by 2020. In mid 2015 that number was 3x B757, 8x A330.

So when EI take their 9x A350 on order, (Currently planned at 3 per year, 2018/19/20) while retaining the 2007+ A333's...that gives us 15 in total,
add the current B757s..... voila!! 19 in total.
This figure however, presumes no new A330/B757 in 2017.

Would be significant growth over a 5/6 year period but good to see. I think the benefits of being part of IAG or one world even will start to show through soon, routes which might not have made it such as Las Vegas will now be on the cards. TATL is where the focus is and where BA will look to push pax who currently use KLM from UK regions.

I was surprised to see Beijing being mentioned as I would have thought going east would be the priority but you never know.

Bussywussy

Latest I heard was an additional 2 A330 in Q1 2017 and holding onto -200s.

basill

Many of you seem to be assuming that the LH aircraft are all based in Dublin or even the Republic but I don't recall Willy ever giving any assurances over that.

Jamie2k9

basill wrote: »

Many of you seem to be assuming that the LH aircraft are all based in Dublin or even the Republic but I don't recall Willy ever giving any assurances over that.

They will be....

JCX BXC

basill wrote: »

Many of you seem to be assuming that the LH aircraft are all based in Dublin or even the Republic but I don't recall Willy ever giving any assurances over that.

So Aer Lingus are going to set up aborad are they?

Carnacalla

Carnacalla wrote: »

So Aer Lingus are going to set up aborad are they?

Don't forget

Gatwick
Belfast
Madrid

ALL bases outside the Republic that EI have very recently had both SH and LH aircraft.