DC cinematic universe general stuff

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120777180#Comment_120777180

The words "superhero fatigue" is a trigger around these parts, but while I'd stop short to say there's audience fatigue as such, I think it's more credible to say the market is oversaturated. Not so much the genre is tiring, but studios have flooded the media with adaptations and crowbar attempts to make "shared universes". There are only so many comic movies audiences have the stomach for, and DC has discovered people won't storm the cinemas for any old guff in a cape.

Superhero films aren't on their last legs IMO - we've had 30+ years of them if we go back to Batman '89, hardly last legs - and much like the Western or Star Wars knock off, won't completely disappear. Only that what we'll eventually have are 1 or 2 mainstays, or that post deconstructionist phase when people start making films interrogating the genre as a baseline. Arguably that period has already begun, between the likes of Logan, or The Boys.

Slutmonkey57b

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120780472#Comment_120780472

Every comic book film and series since no way home has underperformed.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120777343#Comment_120777343

He was only announced as taking over (or at least didn't announce they were essentially going to be rebooting everything) after Black Adam came out, so he can't really be blamed for that one.

Either way, part of why he was brought on was because the Snyderverse failed. Don't get me wrong, some great movies, but once the original Justice League film hit cinemas, it was only a matter of time. WB panicked with what Snyder was doing and tried to turn what Snyder made into a Marvel movie. The Flash got stuck in development/Ezra hell. Wonder Woman 1984 came out during Covid but was horribly received. Affleck made it pretty clear he wasn't going to be staying on as Batman. Ray Fisher left due to Whedon & WB and wasn't going to be coming back. Birds of Prey seems to have been liked well enough but didn't do great numbers. Then you had Batgirl being cancelled just so they could get tax money back, which shows their level of confidence in what they were doing.

The DCEU had been circling the drain for near 5 years before Gunn & Safran were announced to be taking over. With losing half the main actors (who were playing some of DC's biggest characters), and having to deal with the jumbled mess left by WB execs due to what they did with Justice League and trying to turn what Snyder was doing into what Marvel was doing.... Gunn & Safran had little choice but to reset the universe and start again, even with Shazam 2, The Flash & the next Aquaman film still coming out.

The legacy characters are all but done anyway. WB completely fumbled them and their stories over 10 years. It's why they had to bring in Gunn & Safran in the first place. There was little point waiting until all the announced/in-production movies were out, because then they'd have to wait until early 2024 to announce Gunn, which would mean he wouldn't be able to properly start working on them until then, which means it'd be 2026 by the time the films started coming out. WB/DC don't want to have that gap.

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120780636#Comment_120780636

not actually watched the Boys yet , but when a genre starts to go down the subversion/parody route the best is behind it as noted with other genres in the past? going forward every decade or so a studio will still be able to make a new Batman or Superman trilogy and a few others, but it does look like the conveyor belt will need to be rejigged and slowed down especially the B tier films

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120780784#Comment_120780784

The Boys was originally a comic book which started in 2006. Sure, there had been a few successful superhero films out in the few years before that, but there were also still incredible superhero films coming out after The Boys comics started and ended (in 2012).

The Boys is as much a parody and commentary on general hero worship, media disinformation/manipulation, corporate greed etc as it is superhero films/comics.

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120780814#Comment_120780814

most film goers dont know comics so I guess they are on different timelines, the Boys would unlikely have been made into a show or movie 10 years ago though?

CastorTroy

And then we have the film that's always forgotten about, which doesn't bode well for it, Blue Beetle. Don't know why they decided it would be a good idea to give it a theatrical release after it was supposedly being planned for Max.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120780902#Comment_120780902

It's hard to know. I'd almost say the success of The Walking Dead had as much influence on The Boys being made as superhero films did. A successful comic run with a decent audience, more adult-orientated, not tied to the big two comic publishers. A lot of studios were looking at comic properties to adapt after the success of The Walking Dead as a show.

Definitely a big part of the audience probably gravitated to The Boys due to it being a parody of what Marvel & DC films & comics were doing, but I don't think it was the only factor or a sign that superhero films are on the way out just because a parody of same has been successful.

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120780784#Comment_120780784

Deconstruction shows a maturity of a genre, and doesn't mean "the best is behind it"; and while I've found The Boys deeply adolescent, it's not a parody. Far from it, even if the trappings seem to mock superheroes. It's a hyper-violent satire of both Superheroes, corporate dominance, social-media influence etc. etc. I don't especially like it, but what it is acts as that deconstruction of the myths and tropes of the genre.

Look again at the Western. When Clint Eastwood made Unforgiven, it basically announced the latter-day subversion and deconstructive phase of the genre. Not that those kinds of films didn't exist before then, but Eastwood's success with the film announced a new phase, one where suddenly the various myths and legends built up during the "golden era" of Western films were open for question and interrogation. But not at the expense of entertainment or drama.

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120780708#Comment_120780708

I think with cinema audiences not looking at getting back to pre covid levels I think the snyder verse may be the high point for the DCEU. Despite the success of the Batman I don't think there are crowds of people interested yet in seeing a new superman or wonder woman. It feels too son, like if they tried to reboot Iron-man.

Brief_Lives

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120782809#Comment_120782809

true...Batman vs Superman, should have been a slam dunk, and it was woeful.

Joss Whedon ruined Justice League (ZS version = amazing)

Wonder woman 82,or 84 whatever its called, has ruined wonder woman. I thought both Suicide Squad movies were rubbish.

they might be forcing the next few movies on us with Gunn leading the charge.

But the MCU have released a load of turkeys since Endgame.

pixelburp

Ah I still have a soft spot for Wonder Woman 1984: an absolute mess, but the committment to its sincerity, its colourful Donner-adjacent style more arresting than many or most superhero films these days. It was like a proper cinematic adaptation of the CW superhero shows, all goofy positivity and borderline childish glee - at least at the start. It kinda lost its nerve a bit through the middle act and while was probably a terrible movie on balance, it had personality and fun energy when it worked.

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120780976#Comment_120780976

best as defined by box office success ie popularity, with Westerns they peaked somewhere in the mid 60's , Blazing Saddles for instance coming out in the early 70's representing the parody stage, there would certainly be notable westerns after that and no doubt going into the future, but the zeitgeist moved on , kids more interested in the Space race etc.

Hard to see another Marvel film doing better than End Game so I dont think we will see that kind of energy being captured again.

The White Wolf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120780708#Comment_120780708

There is only 3 "true" Snyderverse films, and they are Man of Steel, BvS, and Wonder Woman. None of them truly bombed at the box office (at worst disappointing but not outright failures) so I never understood this idea that Synder doomed everything.

The worst performing films, both in terms of financial and creatively, of the DCEU came far and away after he was gone (and I include Justice League in that as it's hardly his film).

The guy is absolved of blame for me; yes he was partisan and did a lot of stuff that I didn't like, but I would have preferred seeing his vision finish than the absolute state of what WB have done with the franchise since they canned him. The blame is squarely at their feet and it's crazy that they only set up a separate division to manage these films in 2022.

Snyder didn't put them in the crazy debt they're in.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120784408#Comment_120784408

Oh I'm definitely not saying Snyder ruined everything. Like I said, the main issue with what happened was WB trying to turn Snyder's Justice League into a Marvel movie. Having seen ZSJL, it's clear that you could never turn even a 3 hour cinema-cut of that into a 2 hour Marvel-type movie. They panicked after BvS. Nearly everything that happened after that was the snowball effect of that decision.

I have my issues with BvS, ZSJL, and the leaked summaries of what Snyder's plans for the DCEU (aka Snyderverse as it following the same cast of characters even if Snyder himself hasn't been involved in years) were, even though I would have been curious to see how the films turned out. Snyder was trying to fly before he could walk; rushing to the end of the story without earning the audience's connection to the characters/story. But the blame definitely lies with the WB/DC execs for not working with Snyder to help do that, instead completely upturning what he was trying to do, even before Snyder had to leave due to the death of his daughter.

dublinman1990

Black Adam will be available on Sky Cinema next week on the 7th of July.

I wonder how many Sky Cinema viewers would watch it then if the box office results for this movie were a huge disappointment for WBD. Do you think there would be better numbers when it goes on one of it's channels or as a download to buy or rent on the Sky Store?

EoinMcLovin

https://youtu.be/4wxyy8Rcz4k

____

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120839050#Comment_120839050

I might actually bring my son to that

Slydice

Looks fun 🙂

EoinMcLovin

https://deadline.com/2023/07/superman-legacy-adds-nathan-fillion-isabela-merced-edi-gathegi-1235434727/

Nathan Fillion will portray Guy Gardner — one iteration of the superhero Green Lantern — with Isabela Merced as Hawkgirl and Edi Gathegi as Mister Terrific in Superman Legacy

JP Liz V1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120780536#Comment_120780536

Brother Bill would be a better Lex imho

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120839050#Comment_120839050

If that doesn't flop, I'll be shocked. Not that I'm down on what I've seen - fairly ambivalent about it, but looks to have a fun, younger energy - but the DC films seem cursed at this stage.

Drumpot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840266#Comment_120840266

I think it looks like a movie not made for me. I appreciate it’s just a trailer but it looks like my 9 year old might enjoy it, maybe that’s the target audience.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840367#Comment_120840367

Yeah, my 9yo will love it

Drumpot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840477#Comment_120840477

Can you take mine to see it with you both?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840504#Comment_120840504

We can discuss rates, for stress!

pixelburp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840367#Comment_120840367

Oh it clearly is aimed at a younger audience, the whole vibe of the thing screams, as you say, "not made for me". But because of that I can't see it kicking the doors down & becoming another DC flop.

You know what I'd go see? Some of the animated universe style stories.

The DC animated universe owned the 1990s through to the 2010s then went off a cliff.

Some of those classic stories with no "forced angst"® (The CW) or "Funny moments"® (DCEU) would be great.

Batman SubZero with a proper tragic Freeze and no "Ice to see you" crap

Full_Circle_81

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120840705#Comment_120840705

The old DCAU was totally my jam!

pixelburp

Well, you know James Gunn is in charge cos he's already pulling out the weird and niche characters from the DC catalogue: Anthony Carrigan is gonna play "Metamorpho" in the new Superman movie; could be a cameo, could be a character immediately offed to establish the danger of the Big Bad - I guess we'll see!

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/superman-legacy-casts-anthony-carrigan-metamorpho-1235533648