Full Irish Car Licence & Motorcycle advice

Robbielive051

Hi there,

Just wondering if anyone can clarify a few things for me.
I've was driving a 650 burgman scooter for the past 5-6 years up until about 3 years ago and i was thinking of getting back on the saddle and buying a larger tourer bike like a BMW.
I don't have a full bike licence and the provisional one expired around the same time i stopped driving the 650. Can i drive a larger bike on a full car licence without having to start from scratch regarding Provisional licence etc?

blackbird 49

Hi there, You cannot ride a bike on a car licence, since your provisional licence has expired you may have to start over again ( it depends how long it has expired by)
Theory test would have to be done and riding lessons, the same way as a car.

honda boi

As far as I know you can just reapply for your learner permit since its been under 5 years.
Depending on your age,if your over 24 you,ll get an A licence,which means you don't need to restrict your bike.
If your under 24 you,ll get an a2 licence which means your meant to restrict your bike to 35kw.
Your full car licence wouldnt cover you to drive a motorbike.

blackbird 49

Hi there, You cannot ride a bike on a car licence, since your provisional licence has expired you may have to start over again ( it depends how long it has expired by)
Theory test would have to be done and riding lessons, the same way as a car.

Topper Harley

I was in a similar situation. Seeing as it was about 8 years since you got your first motorcycle permit, you won't need to do most of the Initial Basic Training.

The first thing you need to do is renew you learner permit. You can do this as long as it is less than ten five years since it expired, however, if it's your third or subsequent permit, you need to apply for your test and have proof of this before you'll be given a new permit and the new permit will last only 1 year instead of two.

Now, here's where it get's interesting stupid. Your new permit will allow you to ride A, A2 & A1 motorcycles but unless you complete Module 5 of the IBT, you'll only be able to do a test for A2. You can do Module 5 after your test and progress on to an A licence without having to do another test though.

I did my test for A2 which is fine for my bike at the minute and I have the option to do Module 5 at any time in the future if/when I want a bigger bike. The reason I didn't do Module 5 before my test is simply that I didn't have the time and my bike fits into the A2 category anyway.

The most difficult part is getting a bike eligible to do an A2 test as it has to be under 35kW (which mine is) and over 395cc (which mine isn't). So you'd most likely have to find a bigger bike which is restricted. But not restricted too much, as if it's restricted by more than half it's power, it's also ineligible (e.g. the bike must be 70kW or less before being restricted).

When you apply for your test, you'll have about a 4-5 week wait, so if you have the time and can afford it do the Module 5 and do your test for Cat A (that way you can go straight for the BMW tourer). Otherwise, find a bike eligible for A2 (I borrowed a friends), get your A2 licence and then complete Module 5 in your own time.

And finally, regardless of which category you go for, since you have a full car licence you won't need to wear an "N" on your hi-vis after you pass your test. :cool:

I hope that clarifies things for you somewhat. I found that with the myriad of information about motorbike licences and how they effect people with licences from before the new rules came in to be difficult to decipher and just when I thought I knew what was what, it changed.

Good luck with it and I found the information on here to be a great help before my test also.

slimjimmc

Topper Harley wrote: »

The first thing you need to do is renew you learner permit. You can do this as long as it is less than ten years since it expired, however, if it's your third or subsequent permit, you need to apply for your test and have proof of this before you'll be given a new permit and the new permit will last only 1 year instead of two.

The renewal time limit is 5 years for a learner permit, 10 years is for a full licence.
https://www.ndls.ie/images/Documents/LearnerPermits/Learner%20Permit%20Application%20Guidance%20Notes.pdf

Driver Theory Test
For a first application for a learner permit in a particular licence category you will have to take and pass a driver theory test. It is considered a first application if you have not held the category in the last five years

Topper Harley

slimjimmc wrote: »

The renewal time limit is 5 years for a learner permit, 10 years is for a full licence.
https://www.ndls.ie/images/Documents/LearnerPermits/Learner%20Permit%20Application%20Guidance%20Notes.pdf

Correct, apologies. I thought it was five alright but after a quick google I saw ten years and obviously didn't look close enough.

Hal1

How long does the whole process take? Is there much of a waiting list? I remember when I had my B provincial license and it covered A/A1/W afaik. Then when I done the full B test (2008) they didn't carry over.

Topper Harley

Hal1 wrote: »

How long does the whole process take? Is there much of a waiting list? I remember when I had my B provincial license and it covered A/A1/W afaik. Then when I done the full B test (2008) they didn't carry over.

By the sounds of it, your provisional licence which included motorbikes would have expired over 5 years ago but if you ring up the NDLS with your driver number they'd be able to tell you where you stand.

If you do need to start at the beginning, you'll need to to the theory test, Modules 1-4 of IBT (which is 16 hours but can be done in one weekend, if you're so inclined) and then wait six months before you can do your test.

If your provisional licence has expired within the last five years, you're in the same boat the OP and the same conditions apply to you then.

Roadcraft

Topper Harley wrote: »

I was in a similar situation. Seeing as it was about 8 years since you got your first motorcycle permit, you won't need to do most of the Initial Basic Training.

He will have to do full IBT if he wants category 'A'

The first thing you need to do is renew you learner permit. You can do this as long as it is less than ten five years since it expired, however, if it's your third or subsequent permit, you need to apply for your test and have proof of this before you'll be given a new permit and the new permit will last only 1 year instead of two.

Now, here's where it get's interesting stupid. Your new permit will allow you to ride A, A2 & A1 motorcycles but unless you complete Module 5 of the IBT, you'll only be able to do a test for A2. You can do Module 5 after your test and progress on to an A licence without having to do another test though.

That is interesting & incorrect: His new permit if his old one is not expired by more than 5 years will only allow him to ride 'A1' or 'A2' without IBT the 'A' on it is not valid until full IBT for category 'A' is complete.

I did my test for A2 which is fine for my bike at the minute and I have the option to do Module 5 at any time in the future if/when I want a bigger bike. The reason I didn't do Module 5 before my test is simply that I didn't have the time and my bike fits into the A2 category anyway.

Did you complete IBT for 'A2' ? If not you would have to complete full IBT modules 1,3,5 to move to 'A' even with a full 'A2' licence as module 5 on its own is only for people who have already completed IBT and want to move up a category or from automatic to a bike with gears.

The most difficult part is getting a bike eligible to do an A2 test as it has to be under 35kW (which mine is) and over 395cc (which mine isn't). So you'd most likely have to find a bigger bike which is restricted. But not restricted too much, as if it's restricted by more than half it's power, it's also ineligible (e.g. the bike must be 70kW or less before being restricted).

When you apply for your test, you'll have about a 4-5 week wait, so if you have the time and can afford it do the Module 5 and do your test for Cat A (that way you can go straight for the BMW tourer). Otherwise, find a bike eligible for A2 (I borrowed a friends), get your A2 licence and then complete Module 5 in your own time.

And finally, regardless of which category you go for, since you have a full car licence you won't need to wear an "N" on your hi-vis after you pass your test. :cool:

I hope that clarifies things for you somewhat. I found that with the myriad of information about motorbike licences and how they effect people with licences from before the new rules came in to be difficult to decipher and just when I thought I knew what was what, it changed.

Good luck with it and I found the information on here to be a great help before my test also.

Hope this helps

Roadcraft

Topper Harley wrote: »

By the sounds of it, your provisional licence which included motorbikes would have expired over 5 years ago but if you ring up the NDLS with your driver number they'd be able to tell you where you stand.

If you do need to start at the beginning, you'll need to to the theory test, Modules 1-4 of IBT (which is 16 hours but can be done in one weekend, if you're so inclined) and then wait six months before you can do your test.

If your provisional licence has expired within the last five years, you're in the same boat the OP and the same conditions apply to you then.

If you need to start from the beginning, it would be IBT modules 1,3,5 (18-hours)

Topper Harley

Roadcraft wrote: »

He will have to do full IBT if he wants category 'A'

That is interesting & incorrect: His new permit if his old one is not expired by more than 5 years will only allow him to ride 'A1' or 'A2' without IBT the 'A' on it is not valid until full IBT for category 'A' is complete.

Did you complete IBT for 'A2' ? If not you would have to complete full IBT modules 1,3,5 to move to 'A' even with a full 'A2' licence as module 5 on its own is only for people who have already completed IBT and want to move up a category or from automatic to a bike with gears.

If you need to start from the beginning, it would be IBT modules 1,3,5 (18-hours)

That's fair enough, I stand corrected. I just checked an email from the RSA and to clarify I only need to complete module 5 to progress to category 'A' after holding an 'A2' licence for two years, otherwise I've to complete modules 1 & 3 as well or else do another test.

This suits me due to my bike but is obviously less suitable for someone wishing to use a bigger bike unless they want it restricted for two years.


EDIT: This is what the email from the RSA said, it can probably explain it better that me:

If you wish to do the Unrestricted Bike Test you must complete Modules 1, 3 and 5 of the IBT Training before you can sit this test.

If you decide to do a Driving Test For Category A2, sit and pass the Category A2 you can after 2 years holding the Category A2 full licence then progress to the Unrestricted Bike Licence by completing Module 5 on the Category A Motorcycle and presenting the IBT Certificate to the NDLS office with your Full A2 Licence. You will not have to resit your Test.

If you sit and pass your Category A2 Driving Test and obtain your A2 Full Licence and you decide to proceed to the Unrestricted Category A within the 2 years you must complete Module 5 on the Category A Motorcycle and resit your Driving test on the Unrestricted Category A Motorcycle.

By my understanding, the same would apply to the OP as he would have had his first provisional before December 2010.

Roadcraft

Topper Harley wrote: »

That's fair enough, I stand corrected. I just checked an email from the RSA and to clarify I only need to complete module 5 to progress to category 'A' after holding an 'A2' licence for two years, otherwise I've to complete modules 1 & 3 as well or else do another test.

This suits me due to my bike but is obviously less suitable for someone wishing to use a bigger bike unless they want it restricted for two years.


EDIT: This is what the email from the RSA said, it can probably explain it better that me:


By my understanding, the same would apply to the OP as he would have had his first provisional before December 2010.

You cant do module 5 on its own to progress unless you have previously completed an IBT course.

carsQhere

What is it with people doing the A2? If you're over 24 it makes no sense whatsoever. Go for the full fat A license. Same theory/IBT/test, unrestricted license and no need to spend even more money later on doing a Module 5 which means you can put it towards doing a RoSPA instead.

franer1970

I just want to know how the OP was riding a Burgman 650 for years with only a provisional licence. It may "only" be a scooter but it's a bloody big one.
Even after I'd passed the A licence test in 2001 on a 250 I had to wait another two years before I could move on to a bigger scooter (i.e. more than 25kW).

gerrowadat

franer1970 wrote: »

I just want to know how the OP was riding a Burgman 650 for years with only a provisional licence. It may "only" be a scooter but it's a bloody big one.
Even after I'd passed the A licence test in 2001 on a 250 I had to wait another two years before I could move on to a bigger scooter (i.e. more than 25kW).

Given that he stopped 3 years ago and only had a provisional, I'd imagine the answer is 'illegally'. You could do that today with your learner and IBT, but the old style restricted you, as you say.

Roadcraft

franer1970 wrote: »

I just want to know how the OP was riding a Burgman 650 for years with only a provisional licence. It may "only" be a scooter but it's a bloody big one.
Even after I'd passed the A licence test in 2001 on a 250 I had to wait another two years before I could move on to a bigger scooter (i.e. more than 25kW).

On the old paper 'A' learner permit you could ride any size bike once it was restricted to 25kw. So 1000cc sports bike if you wanted restricted to 25kw.

alanca

ive rang the ndls a few times just to confirm this.

ive had a provisional A licence since before dec 2010 even though iv never ridden a bike iv only been on scoooters. im just about to renew my learner again but have to book a test as its my 3rd licence but and i want to do it for the a since why not. they have told me i am exempt from doing the ibt training as i had my licence before all of that came into effect

listermint

alanca wrote: »

ive rang the ndls a few times just to confirm this.

ive had a provisional A licence since before dec 2010 even though iv never ridden a bike iv only been on scoooters. im just about to renew my learner again but have to book a test as its my 3rd licence but and i want to do it for the a since why not. they have told me i am exempt from doing the ibt training as i had my licence before all of that came into effect

I'd be surprised if this was true.

alanca

listermint wrote: »

I'd be surprised if this was true.

Iv recorded them them saying it and rang 3 times to het different operators to confirm it in case they try to tell me otherwise when it co.es to me doing the test

listermint

alanca wrote: »

Iv recorded them them saying it and rang 3 times to het different operators to confirm it in case they try to tell me otherwise when it co.es to me doing the test

em.. did you get it on paper.

Roadskill

alanca wrote: »

ive rang the ndls a few times just to confirm this.

ive had a provisional A licence since before dec 2010 even though iv never ridden a bike iv only been on scoooters. im just about to renew my learner again but have to book a test as its my 3rd licence but and i want to do it for the a since why not. they have told me i am exempt from doing the ibt training as i had my licence before all of that came into effect

You will be exempt from ibt but only up to the A2 as this is the new restricted category. Your previous category A was restricted to 25Kw so to get an unrestricted A you will require a complete ibt. The NDLS will add the category A onto your permit as your over 24 but it is only valid with an ibt done on a category A motorcycle.

alanca

Thanks for the information i would assume you are correct purely on the basis that it makes sense. i just asked them are they sure i can go for the full a driving test and she said yes and that her superior agreed.

Green_Martian

Hi all,

Just piggy backing on this thread in stead of starting a new one.

Have a quick questions about the new licences, got mine in the door this week as I renewed full licence last week.

Under Cat A2 it shows start date as 2nd December 2016, is this because the category did not exist on my previous licence? I would have thought it would have same date as my other Cat A for example full A, AM, and A1 all have 16th Dec 2008.

On plus side I got Moped category back :P

Any ideas why A2 is different?

Colm17RvB

Because you didn't have the entitlement before, simples. Cat A overwrites all the other ones anyway.

Green_Martian

Colm17RvB wrote: »

Because you didn't have the entitlement before, simples. Cat A overwrites all the other ones anyway.

Cheers, that's what I was thinking