Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2015 Mod Note in OP 9/4

Kirby

niallo27 wrote: »

Utd can afford to keep ****ing money at it until it works. They have a 60 million player on the bench and paying a player 300 grand a week to play reserve football. It's very hard for that strategy not to work.

And the Suarez money? Liverpool donated that to charity did they?

You aren't Burnley. Don't act like Liverpool have no funds to buy. Balotelli, Lovren, Lallana, Markovic have spent most of the season on the bench.

MD1990

The Gerrard abuse is worse than what Terry or Rooney both hated too get.
You got pathetic Chelsea fans singing about him during CL games & Man Utd fans singing about him during games where they are not playing Liverpool.

Soups123

Redmen Rafalution wrote: »

A lot of it is probably from Utd fans. Some of our fans absolutely lost the run of themselves when it came to taunting Utd fans last yr. It was as if they would never be competitive again. The Gerrard thing is a perfect chance for them to return the ''banter'' in spades.

I think that's about it, although it's not just United fans. Many had to feel the 'banter' last year and are revelling in the chance to return the favour

Slimity

MD1990 wrote: »

Lavezzi went in 2012. Higuain replaced Cavani. They spent more money than anyone else in Serie A since Rafa too over. He hasn't done well in the league at Napoli.

Yes, Lavezzi went to PSG for 12-13 season.

Not sure I want to get into a Rafa net spend argument :eek: but they spend roughly 100m euro in his first season and recouped 70m euro.

This season they've spent about 32m euro and recouped about 4m euro.

58m euro or about 40m sterling in 2 seasons to keep Napoli competitive in Serie A and Europe is a good return in my opinion.

Not sure what you expected him to do there?

LuckyLloyd

Kirby wrote: »

You claimed he was hated and intimated that's what the gifs are about.

Birthday gifs about Gerrard aren't demonstrating hate. When United were struggling and we were seeing funny gifs about them from Liverpool fans, that wasn't hate either. See it as the ribbing that makes football what it is.


Nobody worth talking to "hates" any football player.

I'm still claiming he's hated. Your last sentence is...naive. Not all football fans, but enough. More than enough.

Polo_Mint

niallo27 wrote: »

Well if it's not so much anymore why is it all over the Internet. Your post makes no sense.

because hes still Representing Liverpool and as I can see that it really gets to you it working perfectly

Stop worrying about it...... Stevie G is a big Boy


Balotelli gets it 10X worse but you havent mentioned him

Most likely because you have a closer connection to Gerrard

niallo27

Kirby wrote: »

And the Suarez money? Liverpool donated that to charity did they?

You aren't Burnley. Don't act like Liverpool have no funds to buy. Balotelli, Lovren, Lallana, Markovic have spent most of the season on the bench.

They are 5th after it. Very hard to compete with the top 4. Look at the Suarez money. You could argue that utd have that on their bench in one player every week. The players brought in have been poor though in fairness.

Kirby

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I'm still claiming he's hated. Your last sentence is...naive. Not all football fans, but enough. More than enough.

I think you need to google what naïve actually means. I'll repeat myself, nobody worth talking to "hates" a footballer. There is nothing naïve in that. The type of people who "hate" footballers are the same type of mouth-breathing morons that are best avoided.

LuckyLloyd

Slimity wrote: »

Not sure what you expected him to do there?

So long as Benitez doesn't win a league people will question him, that's the way it is.

JohnDaniels

MD1990 wrote: »

Don't think we would go for Rafa. He has taken Napoli backwards. They were challenging Juve 2 years & well ahead as the 2nd best team in Italy. This season they are 4th & unlikely to make CL unless they win the EL.

Well ahead as the 2nd best team in Italy? They finished 2nd once in the last six years before Rafa arrived? They then lost their best players.

07-08 Napoli 8th
08-09 Napoli 12th
09-10 Napoli 6th
10-11 Napoli 3rd
11-12 Napoli 5th
12-13 Napoli 2nd

After the year they finished second they sold their star player in Cavani. Apart from the first window in which still very little was spent net, Rafa hasn't had huge amounts of money to shape the team. They have the 5th highest wage bill in the league. (Just for context Juventus wage bill is double) I admit that this season has been a disappointment in the league but an EL victory along with the fact they look to be having a strong end to the season will see it as a big success.

You make EL success sound unlikely when they are now huge 7/4 favs to win it. The major thing for me though is I think Rafa has bought well and future looks really bright for that team. He did the right thing in replacing Cavani with a big name in Higuain. That forward line which is now starting to really click is hugely exciting and if I was a fan I would be really looking forward to seeing Napoli next season, Mertens, Callejón, Higuain etc. The quality has relly shown through in Europe.

MD1990

Slimity wrote: »

Yes, Lavezzi went to PSG for 12-13 season.

Not sure I want to get into a Rafa net spend argument :eek: but they spend roughly 100m euro in his first season and recouped 70m euro.

This season they've spent about 32m euro and recouped about 4m euro.

58m euro or about 40m sterling in 2 seasons to keep Napoli competitive in Serie A and Europe is a good return in my opinion.

Not sure what you expected him to do there?

Challenge Juve for the title was expected given the money spent. 40m is huge money in Serie A. 100m in Serie in this era is huge even if they recouped 70m. Rafa is a very good manager but ive reservations about his league form. He took us from 2nd to 7th in 09 & spent 40m on Aquilani & Johnson back in 09 which was crazy.

LuckyLloyd

Kirby wrote: »

I think you need to google what naïve actually means. I'll repeat myself, nobody worth talking to "hates" a footballer. There is nothing naïve in that. The type of people who "hate" footballers are the same type of mouth-breathing morons that are best avoided.

There are plenty of football fans that fall within the net cast by your final sentence.

Redmen Rafalution

niallo27 wrote: »

Utd can afford to keep ****ing money at it until it works. They have a 60 million player on the bench and paying a player 300 grand a week to play reserve football. It's very hard for that strategy not to work.

But that's missing my point.

Van Gaal had them grinding out results when they were total muck. We didn't, and that's the difference between Rodgers and elite managers IMO. It comes back to establishing a solid defensive foundation. Van Gaal did it in a few months, Rogers hasn't done it in 3 years.
I am actually an admirer of Van Gaal and wish we had got him. He will have Utd competitive in the CL next season, and they won't be fannying about resting players if they are playing at the Bernabeu. I was very disappointed in our approach to the CL this yr.
At least if we were to get Rafa back, he would have us competing aggressively in Europe.

I don't want to make this a discussion about Rafa or Van Gaal - I was initially making the point that we still don't seem to have any resiliency about us. After 3 years, that is a worry.

Slimity

MD1990 wrote: »

Challenge Juve for the title was expected given the money spent. 40m is huge money in Serie A. 100m in Serie in this era is huge even if they recouped 70m. Rafa is a very good manager but ive reservations about his league form. He took us from 2nd to 7th in 09 & spent 40m on Aquilani & Johnson back in 09 which was crazy.

Challenge Juve?!

Nonsense! Juventus are in a league of their own in Serie A.

Napoli's wages are about 50m per year behind Juve and 30m behind Milan and Inter.

JohnDaniels

MD1990 wrote: »

Challenge Juve for the title was expected given the money spent. 40m is huge money in Serie A. 100m in Serie in this era is huge even if they recouped 70m. Rafa is a very good manager but ive reservations about his league form. He took us from 2nd to 7th in 09 & spent 40m on Aquilani & Johnson back in 09 which was crazy.

Rodgers will do something similar after spending £117m in the last transfer window. This game is loads of fun when you can just write stuff without any context

Will I Amnt

Kirby wrote: »

I'll repeat myself, nobody worth talking to "hates" a footballer.

Hate is all relative. I hate beetroot for instance.

chicorytip

Rodgers ought to be sacked in the morning an
d be replaced with somebody with a prolonged record of success i.e. winning trophies, as opposed to reaching a play- off final with Swansea, and, most importantly, has demonstrated good knowledge of players and sound judgement in transfer dealings.
Mourinho is the only candidate who fulfils these criteria. A fanciful notion?
If approached, I think he would leave Chelsea in a heartbeat. The prospect of transforming Liverpool F.C. back into the all-conquering force it once was is exactly the sort of challenge that he would relish at this
stage of his career. The resources and infrastructure are already in place.
Rodgers has been a complete failure, a prime example of somebody who has been promoted way beyond the level of their abilities.
His legacy? Balotelli, Lovren, Lambert, Borini, Mignolet, Markovic, Moreno............

Rayne Wooney

chicorytip wrote: »

Rodgers ought to be sacked in the morning an
d be replaced with somebody with a prolonged record of success i.e. winning trophies, as opposed to reaching a play- off final with Swansea, and, most importantly, has demonstrated good knowledge of players and sound judgement in transfer dealings.
Mourinho is the only candidate who fulfils these criteria. A fanciful notion?
If approached, I think he would leave Chelsea in a heartbeat. The prospect of transforming Liverpool F.C. back into the all-conquering force it once was is exactly the sort of challenge that he would relish at this
stage of his career. The resources and infrastructure are already in place.
Rodgers has been a complete failure, a prime example of somebody who has been promoted way beyond the level of their abilities.
His legacy? Balotelli, Lovren, Lambert, Borini, Mignolet, Markovic, Moreno............

If this is all sarcasm it's post of the year tbh

Kirby

There would have been a slim possibility of Mourinho taking the job when he left Madrid. Very slim, but it was there. Now? Not a chance.

Are you honestly suggesting he'd leave Chelsea to go to Liverpool? That's insane.

MD1990

Slimity wrote: »

Challenge Juve?!

Nonsense! Juventus are in a league of their own in Serie A.

Napoli's wages are about 50m per year behind Juve and 30m behind Milan and Inter.

Any link for this.

JohnDaniels wrote: »

Rodgers will do something similar after spending £117m in the last transfer window. This game is loads of fun when you can just write stuff without any context

You can't compare PL spending to Serie A spending. The EL will determine if Rafa was a success or failure at Napoli if he most likely leaves in the summer.

Demosthenese

MD1990 wrote: »

Don't agree with that. Benteke would beat anyone in the air. Can was one of our better players today. Certaintly at only 20 he hasn't found his level & I think he will be a very good player for us.

To elaborate, i am a big fan of him and i think he possesses the tools to be a good player in a number of positions - but - he was playing well above the level he is now if you go back 12 odd games when he was looking amazing at times. I do think he is still raw and unfinished and has kind of found a plateau especially in his last few games in the right sided defence.

My critisisms of him are that he gets caught in no mans land quite alot as a defender, he drifts too far forward (Obviously likes to get forward!) and at times he goes for the same tackle/header as his centre half which i find annoying ass both are to blame. For a guy that has only played that system for this season though again ... he's had a decent start to his Liverpool career.

He is indeed young though and surely the best is yet to come.

Benteke won every header today even against Skrtel so again no disrespect to Can over that side of it.

Mr Alan

Not sure why anyone would try and belittle Rafa. Simple fact is he is an infinitely better manager than our current manager.

Maybe Rodgers will improve immeasurably and surpass him at some stage but at this moment, it looks incredibly unlikely.

mylefttesticle

MD1990 wrote: »

Challenge Juve for the title was expected given the money spent. 40m is huge money in Serie A. 100m in Serie in this era is huge even if they recouped 70m. Rafa is a very good manager but ive reservations about his league form. He took us from 2nd to 7th in 09 & spent 40m on Aquilani & Johnson back in 09 which was crazy.

Still 21 points to play for and as we know Rafa finishes seasons really well. Certainly his Napoli side is looking awesome at the moment, a well oiled machine. Plus he has been there two seasons and won a trophy and is favourite to win another this season. Napoli is not a big team in Italy probably more like spurs and you wouldn't expect them to challenge for the title would you? Most chairmen are afraid to employ Rafa that's really it, he is outspoken and honest which is a rarity in modern football.

MD1990

Mr Alan wrote: »

Not sure why anyone would try and belittle Rafa. Simple fact is he is an infinitely better manager than our current manager.

Maybe Rodgers will improve immeasurably and surpass him at some stage but at this moment, it looks incredibly unlikely.

Lol belittle:pac:. All Ive said that it was expected he would be alot closer to Juventus in the league with the money Napoli have spent. Good 1st season but a very poor 2nd season in the league which would be reversed if they win the EL. He has taken them from 2nd to 4th in Serie A unless they catch Lazio.

Slimity

MD1990 wrote: »

Any link for this.

http://www.violanation.com/2014/9/8/6120679/serie-a-clubs-salaries-players-spending

Sorry actually forgot about Roma who also spend more than Napoli to the tune of 24m per year.

Look, I'm done with this. Bottom line, Rafa has done a good, solid job with Napoli.

In broader terms he's certainly more successful than our current manager at present, and I'd have grave doubts about that changing into the future aswell.

Kirby

Net spend talks. Yay!

LuckyLloyd

Slimity wrote: »

http://www.violanation.com/2014/9/8/6120679/serie-a-clubs-salaries-players-spending

Sorry actually forgot about Roma who also spend more than Napoli to the tune of 24m per year.

Look, I'm done with this. Bottom line, Rafa has done a good, solid job with Napoli.

In broader terms he's certainly more successful than our current manager at present, and I'd have grave doubts about that changing into the future aswell.

Great link there. So the whole 'Napoli should be winning the league given their investment, he's done terrible' argument I've been hearing is a total pup. Yep, solid job is right. I'll be supporting them the rest of the way in the EL anyway.

MD1990

Slimity wrote: »

MD1990 wrote: »

Any link for this.

http://www.violanation.com/2014/9/8/6120679/serie-a-clubs-salaries-players-spending

Sorry actually forgot about Roma who also spend more than Napoli to the tune of 24m per year.

Look, I'm done with this. Bottom line, Rafa has done a good, solid job with Napoli.

In broader terms he's certainly more successful than our current manager at present, and I'd have grave doubts about that changing into the future aswell.

Nice link. Juventus being the only team who own there own stadium is a huge advantage. Napoli look to doing similar to us as apart from Higuain there are not paying huge wages despite spending plenty on transfers. Still think they should be doing better in the league though.

Knex*

Mr Alan wrote: »

Not sure why anyone would try and belittle Rafa. Simple fact is he is an infinitely better manager than our current manager.

Maybe Rodgers will improve immeasurably and surpass him at some stage but at this moment, it looks incredibly unlikely.

"Simple, yet ridiculously hyperbolic, opinion"

Osmosis Jones

Will I Amnt wrote: »

Hate is all relative. I hate beetroot for instance.

Ah here, leave Rickie out of it.

MD1990

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Great link there. So the whole 'Napoli should be winning the league given their investment, he's done terrible' argument I've been hearing is a total pup. Yep, solid job is right. I'll be supporting them the rest of the way in the EL anyway.

So 5th is good for us too since we have the 5th highest wages in the PL too yeah?

Mr Alan

Knex. wrote: »

"Simple, yet ridiculously hyperbolic, opinion"

Genuinely don't think anyone could disagree.

rossie1977

are people seriously comparing rafa to rodgers.

one guy has two spanish titles with a club not named real or barca. a champions league and another final appearance, two europa leagues and the others guys claim to fame is keeping swansea in the premier league...something gary monk has done with ease these past two years.

theoneeyedman

Only saw the 2nd half today, but a hugely disappointing performance. Huge lack of energy, urgency and will to get back in the game. Maybe the players are tired, but the thought did enter my head that the players levels of effort was less than full. Did anyone else think this? Maybe I'm wrong, but "something is rotten in the state of Denmark '

theoneeyedman

Only saw the 2nd half today, but a hugely disappointing performance. Huge lack of energy, urgency and will to get back in the game. Maybe the players are tired, but the thought did enter my head that the players levels of effort was less than full. Did anyone else think this? Maybe I'm wrong, but "something is rotten in the state of Denmark '

Agent Coulson

theoneeyedman wrote: »

Only saw the 2nd half today, but a hugely disappointing performance. Huge lack of energy, urgency and will to get back in the game. Maybe the players are tired, but the thought did enter my head that the players levels of effort was less than full. Did anyone else think this? Maybe I'm wrong, but "something is rotten in the state of Denmark '

Have you been talking with Agger

Knex*

Mr Alan wrote: »

Genuinely don't think anyone could disagree.

You used the word infinitely, in a supposed fact.

Yeah, I think some rational folk might raise an eyebrow at that, Alan.

MD1990

rossie1977 wrote: »

are people seriously comparing rafa to rodgers.

one guy has two spanish titles with a club not named real or barca. a champions league and another final appearance, two europa leagues and the others guys claim to fame is keeping swansea in the premier league...something gary monk has done with ease these past two years.

When was the last time u posted something positive? Probably not since Rafa was manager. Rafa was a great manager & is a great man. But he left 5 years ago. Time to move on.

tok9

Rafa and net spend seem to go hand in hand no matter where he goes. :P

brevity

https://twitter.com/Carra23/status/589851681468370944

Pretty much how i feel.

dfx-

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

So long as Benitez doesn't win a league people will question him, that's the way it is.

Win another league Napoli are doing fine, they've slipped up while Lazio are powering on ahead of both them and Roma. They also seem happy to keep him by accounts, it would be his decision to go...

Meanwhile there are massive questions over Rodgers. Even if were given a blank cheque, who would you buy for him? I would say Dani Alves is perfect for the wingback style role in his 343, but then he has ditched it, so it would be an incredible waste of money. If you buy a striker, there's still the problem about creating chances for him - Liverpool are hardly breaking the door down. Centre-half? He has swapped between what he has already so many times that I have no idea what he's looking for in a centre back.

He's making too much up as he goes ten weeks of this formation, ten weeks of this polar opposite formation.

DVDM93

As per his usual Sunday ritual, my Grandad was watching some Western on RTE1 or TG4 or something earlier today. I came in at 3pm and asked him to throw the game on. He replied; "Sure what's the difference? Brendan Rodgers is only a cowboy too".

As usual, he was right.

Ardent

How would folks here feel about Koeman at LFC? Been impressed myself with what he's done at Soton. Would certainly sort out the Keystones cops defending we've been subjected to over the past couple of seasons.

Demosthenese

Ardent wrote: »

How would folks here feel about Koeman at LFC? Been impressed myself with what he's done at Soton. Would certainly sort out the Keystones cops defending we've been subjected to over the past couple of seasons.

We did have a period where Sahko was a regular when we conceded barely a goal in 7 away games. So it's not always that bad. I just think that this season was always gona be a comparison to last - and we lack goals big time. We have no cutting edge. Sterling has been hot and cold - he is not a striker and certainly not prolific.

Koeman himself i have no problem with. Do i consider it a gamble ... as much as anyone else. I mean, lets be realistic here - Klopp is not going to be knocking down our door.

In either case can't see the board chuck Rodgers right now. It wouldn't be the thing to do.

Listening to Gerards interviews of the past few months, he does go out of his way to stress that he wished he'd met BR earlier in his career. Wonder what he'll say of him when this sorry season is over.

shotamoose

Mr Alan wrote: »

Genuinely don't think anyone could disagree.

Didn't you previously say something about Moyes being infinitely better than Rodgers, or words to that effect, before the facts proved otherwise? I mean, before Moyes was sacked for incompetence and Rodgers brought us to 2nd and was voted manager of the year by his peers?

klose

Dub13 wrote: »

The New Fan culture. Football as we know it is dying.

Each to their own I guess but all I see here is an act of good parenting, child wanted to dress up with his father who played along most likely. Bit of an ott reaction.




Anyways, after sleeping on it I'm still seething after the game yesterday. A ****e Monday awaits ...

the kelt

So we get beat and we have the usual....

Rodgers out, terrible transfers, never won anything, over £100m spent, talks too much, last year all Suarez, no proven track record, Rafa in, Klopp in etc etc

versus

Rodgers the man, transfers the committees fault, check the net spend, whos signing the players, restrictive wages, Klopp flopped this year, Rafa's had his chance etc etc.

Its like Groundhog day. The fact is the truth is somewhere in the middle. I like Rodgers, i think he has done a good job, people need to remember where we were before he took over, a Club on the slide with an ever decreasing points finish in the league for 3 years until he took over and he took us as close to winning the title as we have ever have, playing some of the best football ive seen since the days of Aldo, Rush and Beardsley. That doesnt happen by luck or through the actions of just one or 2 players, anyone who thinks that is quite dumb to be honest. Behind the scenes i think things are a mess at the Club, the FSG method doesnt work, committees where the MD has as much say as the manager on who to sign doesnt work. People talk about changing the manager as if its some sort of panacea to solve all our ills, unbelievably short sighted.

Having said that the manager has his faults and lots of them. His insistence on playing a certain way despite the opposition has hampered us on more than one occasion. His denial of the need for a genuine DM in the team another issue, ignoring players like Sakho for example for long periods of time whil the likes of Lovren struggled, transfers are a funny one as i dont hold him wholely responsible but while there are some players we missed out on and we have signed players the manager didnt want there are a lot he did want that havent worked out. While i think of Rodgers as a talented manager there is still that niggling feeling that the job is one that came too early for him, that he needed more experience, more clout in the game.There has to be doubts over his experience and the fact he is learning on the job, in many ways he mirrors his team on the pitch.

Its all irrelevant either way, the owners will decide that and have shown in the past that domestic cups mean very little to them, speaking of issues, a lot of emphasis needs to be put on them.

What annoyed me about yesterday though was the players and its seems in the midst of the pro v anti Rodgers ranting they get overlooked and a free pass. What i saw yesterday was a team good enough to beat Villa but what we got was cowardice in the extreme and gutless. This was a big game again where the players on the pitch failed to step up, flopped, mentally weak in the extreme. Villa wanted it more, we were like a team of star struck teenagers each one looking to the next man to do something. In short no fcuking guts. Thats what annoyed me the most, that same team would play a league game against a similar team and perform but on the big stage didnt, again. Personally i dont blame the manager for that but at latter stages of seasons when cups and titles are on the line you need leaders on the pitch and maybe more experienced leaders off the pitch, big names who have been there and done it, characters who lead through actions. We had one on the pitch yesterday and he is so past it at the minute its scary. Thats a worry and something that needs to be addressed in the summer no matter who the manager is.

Young players on low wages with limited monetary loss potential are great on balance sheets but proven big name players are whats required to win things.

What will our esteemed owners do, ive no idea, back him or sack him but unless a lot of other things change at the Club this is Liverpool FC for the forseeable future no matter who the manager is in my opinion.

Talisman

Demosthenese wrote: »

In either case can't see the board chuck Rodgers right now. It wouldn't be the thing to do.

Just to play devil's advocate ...

FSG spoke to Frank de Boer in early December and since then he has made a few sounds in the media about how he would consider a job like Liverpool if it became available.

The team did not give a good account of themselves yesterday, the truth is they haven't done so since the Man City game at the start of March. Given the schedule at the time, the performance in that game was pure adrenaline and since then the team have been flat.

Rodgers set a goal for himself and the team of winning a trophy this season, he failed to achieve that. FSG know that nothing is guaranteed in sport but they will question the manner in which the team limped out of both the Europa League and FA Cup.

If Rodgers doesn't stop the rot now he will in effect have got his players playing for less than 3 months of the season - FSG won't accept that. The league form from now until the end of the season will be the measure of Rodgers as a manager. I said after the Man Utd game that all that mattered was how Rodgers and the team reacted, in truth they haven't yet and that has to be a worry for Rodgers.

Tipsy McSwagger

Rodgers has lost the dressing room. The players neither fear or respect him and they certainly don't give their all for him, time to go.

NukaCola

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

Rodgers has lost the dressing room. The players neither fear or respect him and they certainly don't give their all for him, time to go.

You just made all that up though.....