First Row Age Limit

dublindiehard

Can any of you guys tell me if an infant is allowed to sit on the first row of a short haul airplane, and if so point me to the rules outlining this?

Thanks

highlydebased

Short Haul has no bearing on it.

Age 14 for first row/exit row on Aer Lingus and 16 for Ryanair

http://www.aerlingus.com/travelinformation/planandbook/seatselectionoptions/
http://www.ryanair.com/ie/questions/which-seats-can-i-select/

dublindiehard

I saw the airline policy on it, but I just wondered if there was anywhere that states the airline must comply with it under EU / Travel laws.

LiamaDelta

The airline is complying with its own operating procedure. Law doesn't come in to it. The laws mandate an airline to have procedures in place to ensure safe operation (including orderly evacuation) of their aircraft. Hence the airlines decides what the best way to achieve that is. So most airlines would not allow under 14/16/whatever if they judge that it might restrict the ability to open the doors quickly in an emergency for example.

Tenger

dublindiehard wrote: »

I saw the airline policy on it, but I just wondered if there was anywhere that states the airline must comply with it under EU / Travel laws.

All airlines MUST comply with EU aviation regs. Thats how they keep their licence to operate. The actual airline may themselves impose a stricter interpretation of the regs. EG the example above with 14yrs and 16yrs as minimum age for exit rows.

When you tick the box that says "I agree to the T's&C's of carriage" you agree to compy with the airlines regs.

knockon

LiamaDelta wrote: »

Law doesn't come in to it.

Of course it does ... JAR's (Joint Airworthiness Regs) now JAR OPs (EU Regs), FAA Part 121 (US regs) etc....enforced in Ireland by the IAA .e.g. CAA in UK and FAR (Federal Aviation Rgs) say 16 years minimum.

LiamaDelta

knockon wrote: »

Of course it does ... JAR's (Joint Airworthiness Regs) now JAR OPs (EU Regs), FAA Part 121 (US regs) etc....enforced in Ireland by the IAA .e.g. CAA in UK and FAR (Federal Aviation Rgs) say 16 years minimum.

strange that EI have the limit at 14 then?

Tenger

LiamaDelta wrote: »

strange that EI have the limit at 14 then?

Not really. The JAAR/EU Ops are the minimum standards for EU airlines. The airlines itself can decide to be stricter on enforcement....to be "safer" in a sense.
I wouldn't trust some adults to open an overwing door....but the age limit is based on the weight of the doors/exits.

dublindiehard

Tenger wrote: »

All airlines MUST comply with EU aviation regs. Thats how they keep their licence to operate. The actual airline may themselves impose a stricter interpretation of the regs. EG the example above with 14yrs and 16yrs as minimum age for exit rows.

When you tick the box that says "I agree to the T's&C's of carriage" you agree to compy with the airlines regs.

That is all very well, but the reason I ask the question, is that on a recent flight I was on, there was no issue with allowing an adult, and a seat next to her an infant, to sit in row 1A and row 1B.

The crew allowed it, despite the fact the flight was little more than 75% full.

dublindiehard

Would I be right in saying I should complain to the IAA about this and other situations which developed on flight, or where else should I write?

Tenger

dublindiehard wrote: »

That is all very well, but the reason I ask the question, is that on a recent flight I was on, there was no issue with allowing an adult, and a seat next to her an infant, to sit in row 1A and row 1B.

The crew allowed it, despite the fact the flight was little more than 75% full.

Was it an exit row or a bulkhead row?

EG, Aer Lingus have a partition in front of row 1 on their A320's so row 1 is not an "Exit row" but rather a "restricted row". Ryanair do not have a partition at row 1 so their Row 1 is an "Exit row".

dublindiehard

What is the difference between the requirements for a restricted row and a exit row?

It was the first row.

Not going to comment on the airline at present, since I don't think it's relevant. But It's something I've seen happen on two airlines.

ProfessorPlum

There's no restriction on Aer Lingus flights as the first row is not an exit row. There is on Ryanair as the first row is an exit row. Depending on the airline you flew with, if the first row is also an exit row (ie direct access to the door) then there are restrictions.

dublindiehard

That's interesting about Aer Lingus (They're not the example I'm using here), since their own conditions say that the first row is restricted and their own website says the same.

Tenger

dublindiehard wrote: »

What is the difference between the requirements for a restricted row and a exit row?

It was the first row.

Not going to comment on the airline at present, since I don't think it's relevant. But It's something I've seen happen on two airlines.

True,no need to mention the airline.
A "restricted seating row" allows infants, an "exit row" does not.
A "restricted seating row" will have a partition/wall so that it does not directly access an exit. (Think RoW 1DEF on BA where the galley is in front of you)
As mentioned above some airlines may class both rows as Exit rows to simplify things. This would be over the EU minimum rules.

Exit rows: no bags on floor, no injured arms/wrists, no wheelchair users, no restricted mobility pax, age limit (both lower and upper) Pax must understand exit opening instructions given to them by crew and crew must be happy with their capability to open the exit.
Restricted seating row: no bags on floor, no age limit, no wheelchair users.

I may have missed a couple of things,but that's the gist of it.



As an aside if you had posted your first post similar to the above the point of your query would have be more obvious from the start. My initial impression was that you were unhappy with an instruction from a cabin crew member and wanted to be show the rules that were stated to you.

dublindiehard

Sorry, only had a few minutes to post that.

That would explain one of the incidents I spoke of, but not the other, thanks for the information.

olive20

Journo Alert or bit of Bitterness. Never heard of Row1A and Row1B? New to me.

cruais

First Row is slightly extra room, but is not classed as an exit row, therefore, there are no age restrictions in order to sit there.

Simon Gruber Says

Row 1 on an EI A320 has a partition between it and the door as can be seen in the pic. There's an FA seat beside the door, so it would be expected that they would handle the door in an emergency rather than a passenger.



The over wing exits are "self help exits" and the passengers seated at these exits would be required to operate them and therefore you'd often see some passengers being asked to move if the crew deems they may not be physically able to do it.

sailing

I noticed a customer of one of the airlines was posting on their social media who's site I happen to follow a couple of days ago about the very same question/complaint amongst a number of others as the OP above, threatening reporting to Regulator etc. I have a sneaky suspicion that there is a chequered history between whoever that passenger on the social media site is and the particular airline from reading between the lines of the post. An opening line of "I avoided you like the plague for three years" suggests as such and the real complaint seems to be over an issue of a seat that was paid for and not refunded or something to that effect. Of course they may be all unrelated to this particular question.

Fagashlil

*if* it was a FR flight, and they were sitting in the first row on the right side, it's actually row 2, and not considered an emergency exit row, so therefore infants are permitted to be seated there.

LoonyLovegood

FR have sat me in row 2 before. I booked row 1 by accident, had a broken ankle and needed the extra leg room. They just moved me across and there was no problems.

Pinch Flat

I flew with my 5 month old son about 8 years ago to lanzarote - it was an off season package, so can't remember the carrier.

We were put in row 1, he sat in my lap with his own belt clipped to mine. Maybe things have changed since then

Locker10a

Pinch Flat wrote: »

I flew with my 5 month old son about 8 years ago to lanzarote - it was an off season package, so can't remember the carrier.

We were put in row 1, he sat in my lap with his own belt clipped to mine. Maybe things have changed since then

Was there a bulkhead(wall) infront of you? If so then that's normal!

keith16

dublindiehard wrote: »

where else should I write?

Did you raise your concerns directly with the flight crew?