Ireland vs England, Sunday 1st March 3pm; RTE/BBC

phog

thomond2006 wrote: »

That was an awesome match. You don't need a match to be a Barbarians style for it to be riveting and this match was gripping. It was an arm wrestle from start to finish and Ireland fully deserved the scoreline. England made a crucial error in not taking the kickable penalty to make it 6-6 in the first half. It was absolutely the wrong call, in a tight match like this you have to take your points. Ireland took their points when they were camped on the England line earlier in the match. England's discipline let them down but Ireland forced many penalties from them. They were fortunate not to have a card for persistent infringement.

Not to have a go at Madigan, but the difference to Ireland when Sexton isn't on the pitch is very significant. Ireland lost a bit of direction after Henshaw's try (it wasn't helped with the surgery on the backline after JP went off) and (box) kicked the ball to England far too much. Now Ireland defended superbly but I think we could have kept the ball in hand a little more. I certainly think there is a place for Earls or Fitzgerald somewhere in the backline. I don't want to be negative after a great win but I'm concerned that when Ireland's backline need to manufacture a try that we could struggle. There's a lack of X Factor in the backs that Earls or Fitzgerald could deliver. Bowe and Zebo are excellent in the kickchase so they are un-movable for the moment but I think Payne needs to up his attacking game. We know he is a wonderful playmaker for Ulster but unfortunately he hasn't shown it yet for Ireland.

The semi-accurate ESPN stats: http://www.espn.co.uk/six-nations-2015/rugby/match/180687.html

Robbie Henshaw is our top tackler for a third game in a row. Take a bow son.

Missed 6 though, a blemish in what has been a great tournament for him.

TOD made 10 in the time he was on and of course Paulie tackles anything that moves.

Flipper22

Not sure why people are saying we played a kicking game again like against france? Minds made up in advance maybe? I thought we mixed it up nicely and looked very good at times going forward.

Anyway, great performance. We completely dominated the game until just about when Jonny went off. Couldn't believe the BBC saying it could have gone either way. The scoreline didn't reflect Irelands dominance imo.

lucky_luke

thomond2006 wrote: »

There was a millisecond, a millisecond, when I thought POC was going to gather the blocked box kick and run down the wing to score.

Think about it people. Our lives would be complete.

That would indeed have been epic and it was a good charge down

slingerz

I think Fitzgerald/Earls would offer more off the bench than Jones does but Jones is a very solid player that can be relied upon to do the right things which is probably why Joe keeps picking him

thomond2006

England

phog wrote: »

Missed 6 though, a blemish in what has been a great tournament for him.

TOD made 10 in the time he was on and of course Paulie tackles anything that moves.

I don't remember any howlers in defence from Henshaw, so I'm a bit surprised at that.

Gits_bone

ThisRegard wrote: »

It does, ultimately why would you care for aesthetics over results?

People were in here saying it was the best match of the tournament. It was an ugly match but we won and that's why they were saying it was the best.

Attacking play was non existent. Neither set of backs made an impact on the game in an attacking sense. 2 broken lines all game from the naked eye. Very few offloads.

Gits_bone

thomond2006 wrote: »

I don't remember any howlers in defence from Henshaw, so I'm a bit surprised at that.

He missed a few. One on Nowell and the one on Goode in their try zone are the ones that are obvious.

duckysauce

England

jesus Ireland win well and everyone is bitchin

**** me

metrosity

Gits_bone wrote: »

People were in here saying it was the best match of the tournament. It was an ugly match but we won and that's why they were saying it was the best.

Attacking play was non existent. Neither set of backs made an impact on the game in an attacking sense. 2 broken lines all game from the naked eye. Very few offloads.

I think it was the weather. The pitch was greasy from rain and snow. Last year, England was a more open and better match. I think Ireland have progressed further than they have since then though.

thomond2006

thomond2006 wrote: »

I don't remember any howlers in defence from Henshaw, so I'm a bit surprised at that.

They were mostly after kick chases and the likes. His channel was rock solid all game.

thomond2006

England

duckysauce wrote: »

jesus Ireland win well and everyone is bitchin

**** me

???

The comments are overwhelmingly positive!

walshb

duckysauce wrote: »

jesus Ireland win well and everyone is bitchin

**** me

What's new?

metrosity

duckysauce wrote: »

jesus Ireland win well and everyone is bitchin

**** me

Cheer up duckysauce. Some of us, me anyway, just don't want us getting too much of a big head.

As I said before and I mean it, I'd prefer to win the 6N every year whilst losing to them every year. I wish we didn't have to make it about them.. but that's me.

ThisRegard

Gits_bone wrote: »

People were in here saying it was the best match of the tournament. It was an ugly match but we won and that's why they were saying it was the best.

Attacking play was non existent. Neither set of backs made an impact on the game in an attacking sense. 2 broken lines all game from the naked eye. Very few offloads.

Tactics and they being tailored for the team you're playing and their weaknesses may be too subtle for you.

And I don't think people have been saying it's the best game of the tournament so far, but it was a great game.

Gits_bone

ThisRegard wrote: »

Tactics and they being tailored for the team you're playing and their weaknesses may be too subtle for you.

And I don't think people have been saying it's the best game of the tournament so far, but it was a great game.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=94499363&postcount=474

Game of the tournament so far

For example.

walshb

thomond2006 wrote: »

???

The comments are overwhelmingly positive!

Positive, with a lot of excuses being given as well. That's what I see with many posts.

Posters on here moaning about "ugly" win. Ludicrous talk. What was ugly? Where in the rugby rule book did we play ugly or break any laws of the game..

KingBrian2

Excellent that the Irish team did not give away many penalties. A solid performance in that regard. Also very happy there was no ill will in the match. The build up is always intense with these matches. It was like that with France last year and occasionally with Wales. Lancaster comes across as a nice bloke.

Gits_bone

walshb wrote: »

Positive, with a lot of excuses being given as well. That's what I see with many posts.

Posters on here moaning about "ugly" win. Ludicrous talk. What was ugly? Where in the rugby rule book did we play ugly or break any laws of the game..

You are so blinkered by the result.

Watch NZ play. Are you saying we play as nice to watch style as them?

duckysauce

England

thomond2006 wrote: »

???

The comments are overwhelmingly positive!

jesus must be the beer so

Tox56

Gits_bone wrote: »

You are so blinkered by the result.

Watch NZ play. Are you saying we play as nice to watch style as them?

So unless you play like NZ you're playing ugly rugby, unbelievable

Gits_bone

Tox56 wrote: »

So unless you play like NZ you're playing ugly rugby, unbelievable

It's like trying to explain things to a 5 year old. So many facepalms.

walshb

Gits_bone wrote: »

You are so blinkered by the result.

Watch NZ play. Are you saying we play as nice to watch style as them?

What? So, you are trying to force your opinion of what is pretty onto me?

The result is great. I happened to enjoy Ireland's commitment today, their defence, their passion, enthusiasm, lineouts and scrums. It was obviously lots on you because you wanted to see magic, or whatever magic is on a rugby pitch with 15 opposing men trying to run you over.

walshb

Tox56 wrote: »

So unless you play like NZ you're playing ugly rugby, unbelievable

It really is. Beggars belief. We beat England convincingly, go 3/0 and have a chance to win a grand slam and the best some folks can come up with is that we won ugly, and that we aren't as pretty as NZ.

ThisRegard

Gits_bone wrote: »

It's like trying to explain things to a 5 year old. So many facepalms.

You're the one failing to see that the aim first and foremost, is to win.

philstar

Warren Gatland

KingBrian2 wrote: »

Lancaster comes across as a nice bloke.

yes he seems very down to earth and has no time for nonsense within his team....hence Ashton dropped

Gits_bone

walshb wrote: »

What? So, you are trying to force your opinion of what is pretty onto me?

The result is great. I happened to enjoy Ireland's commitment today, their defence, their passion, enthusiasm, lineouts and scrums. It was obviously lots on you because you wanted to see magic, or whatever magic is on a rugby pitch with 15 opposing men trying to run you over.

You're getting it finally.

It's why high scoring affairs are often great games to watch. Attacking play coming off is much more easy on the eye than defensive play coming off.

walshb

God forbid we win the slam and we'll end up being compared to Greece and their 2004 Euro soccer triumph!:rolleyes:

Gits_bone

ThisRegard wrote: »

You're the one failing to see that the aim first and foremost, is to win.

???

Where have I said I'd rather us play good rugby than win?

I'm saying that it's not the nicest to watch.

matthew8

England

Don't understand how today could be called negative play. We had plenty of nice moves in the backs and might have had a try if England didn't kill it. We only kicked either when in our own half or when the attack broke down, which is what most teams would do. Kicking isn't always negative either, we kicked to make full use of a penalty advantage, look at England just taking the drop goal.

walshb

Gits_bone wrote: »

You're getting it finally.

It's why high scoring affairs are often great games to watch. Attacking play coming off is much more easy on the eye than defensive play coming off.

You aren't saying anything. You somehow seem annoyed and frustrated that we won "ugly." Whatever that is to you. Your answer seems to be that we aren't NZ, hence we win ugly. You do know that rugby encompasses so many elements to it? Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, though I am guessing had we won with "magic and Flare" and genius you would moan that we didn't do it with guts and heart and passion and intensity.

Some of the best matches to watch are high scoring and flowing and attacking, but sometimes other matches with less of that and more rugged and rough and tough and intense moments are better. It depends on the occasion and the viewer. That's rugby. It is full of everything, The good, bad and "ugly."

Lapin

Warren Gatland

Gits_bone wrote: »

People were in here saying it was the best match of the tournament. It was an ugly match but we won and that's why they were saying it was the best.

Attacking play was non existent. Neither set of backs made an impact on the game in an attacking sense. 2 broken lines all game from the naked eye. Very few offloads.

We lead from start to finish, dominated the kicking game, scored the only try of the match, held our lines towards the end when England pushed forward, kicked more points over the bar, outsmarted our opponents psychologically in every position and never gave them an opportunity to get under our skin.....

Yeah you're right Gits, we were crap.

Zzippy

England

Who cares if it wasn't Barbarians-style rugby? That was one of the most riveting games I've ever watched - the intensity was absolutely incredible in the opening 20 minutes. I was amazed more players didn't get stretchered off. Anyone complaining about ugly rugby just doesn't realise that international rugby defences are just too organised in these days of detailed video analysis, GPS tracking and superior conditioning - there just isn't the space for clean breaks and champagne rugby with offloads aplenty... it's all about holding possession and forcing penalties, or kicking for territory and forcing mistakes.

Gits_bone

Lapin wrote: »

We lead from start to finish, dominated the kicking game, scored the only try of the match, held our lines towards the end when England pushed forward, kicked more points over the bar, outsmarted our opponents psychologically in every position and never gave them an opportunity to get under our skin.....

Yeah you're right Gits, we were crap.

Thanks for making stuff up. I'd rather you didn't do it in future thanks.

metrosity

walshb wrote: »

It really is. Beggars belief. We beat England convincingly, go 3/0 and have a chance to win a grand slam and the best some folks can come up with is that we won ugly, and that we aren't as pretty as NZ.

And it was greasy weather too. You're not going to see too much magic from any team in that weather.

tritriagain

As a life long rugby player/supporter I have to say that the game of rugby in the northern hemisphere is becoming a bore to watch. Yes if your team is winning its great but if you were to watch any of the nine games so far as a neutral how many would you consider good matches.I really think it is time to bring bonus points into 6 nations.

walshb

Gits_bone wrote: »

Thanks for making stuff up. I'd rather you didn't do it in future thanks.

Nobody is making stuff up. The win today frustrated you. You are struggling to find anything positive to say, just like Hook. The best you can come up with to defend your position is to compare our style of play to NZ.

ThisRegard

Gits_bone wrote: »

Thanks for making stuff up. I'd rather you didn't do it in future thanks.

So none of that is true, such as we didn't score the most points, the only try in the game?

SaveOurLyric

Swiwi. wrote: »

But man, Ireland look so well-coached. So well.
[/LIST]

Someone licking their lips at what the next AB coach will achieve for them?

metrosity

SaveOurLyric wrote: »

Someone licking their lips at what the next AB coach will achieve for them?

Noone knows rugby like the AB's. As a nation they punch way over their weight in sports generally, way more than Ireland even.

Ireland suffers from the David and Goliath syndrome with England on it's shoulder.
Even though, Ireland have in my opinion better players in most positions, pound for pound than England, there will always be that complex with many Irish people.

It's a pity, as we're just better than them right now and there will always be periods in history when we're better than them, just have to put them to the sword, and cut out their spin doctors.

secman

Watched the game today having listened to the hype all week..... riveting is definitely not a word I would use. The commentator on Rte said at one point it was " like a live chess match", couldn't agree more, it was as exciting as a chess match. Free flowing running rugby is good to watch but that today was anything but .......

Bridge93

England

I'm quite enjoying reading some of the nonsense being spouted. A game can't be entertaining or good to watch unless you're flashing the ball around?

Apart from the obvious impracticalities and limitations on this from the modern game/opposition/ our own ability/the weather, a game can be incredibly gripping when it's two teams battering each other for every inch on offer. Quins v Leinster in 2009 was even tighter than today yet what makes rugby different is the physicality and they enjoyment fans can get from watching players put their bodies on the line.
It's a results business and the same people would be in here whinging if we had lost playing like Australia.

theboy1

ThisRegard wrote: »

So none of that is true, such as we didn't score the most points, the only try in the game?

Are you being disingenuous on purpose? It really devalues your argument (which I agree with)

Git is objecting to 'You're right, we are crap'

Nowhere did he suggest Ireland played badly or that he wouldn't choose an Ireland win over attacking rugby.

walshb

theboy1 wrote: »

Are you being disingenuous on purpose? It really devalues your argument (which I agree with)

Git is objecting to 'You're right, we are crap'

Nowhere did he suggest Ireland played badly or that he wouldn't choose an Ireland win over attacking rugby.

He hasn't flat out said that, but IMO it's what he means.

metrosity

secman wrote: »

Watched the game today having listened to the hype all week..... riveting is definitely not a word I would use. The commentator on Rte said at one point it was " like a live chess match", couldn't agree more, it was as exciting as a chess match. Free flowing running rugby is good to watch but that today was anything but .......

Was it just me that noticed that it snowed before the match. I think it played out the way you'd expect after snow.

vienne86

England

tritriagain wrote: »

I really think it is time to bring bonus points into 6 nations.

I don't think that is on when you don't play each team home and away.

S12b

Henshaw missed a fair few tackles towards the end but they were all in broken play chasing kicks and the like....he was clearly shagged and had nothing in the tank.

He was rock solid in the 12 channel throughout, not just making hits, but making dominant hits. He also beat 6 defenders, more than any other player this weekend!!

Few Connacht fans talking on twitter, apparently Mark McHugh was the last Connacht player to score for Ireland, back in 03 against Tonga???.....just to explain why some of us might be getting a tad carried away with Robbie's performance!!

Bridge93

England

Rugby in general has an issue with how it's going towards physicality over skill, I don't think you can blame Ireland for not being more expensive. It's just the way of the modern world.
The two international teams who go against this trend are New Zealand and Australia. We don't have the backs either of these do to vindicate playing an open, expansive game in the modern world and get the desired results.

theboy1

Bridge93 wrote: »

I'm quite enjoying reading some of the nonsense being spouted. A game can't be entertaining or good to watch unless you're flashing the ball around?

Apart from the obvious impracticalities and limitations on this from the modern game/opposition/ our own ability/the weather, a game can be incredibly gripping when it's two teams battering each other for every inch on offer. Quins v Leinster in 2009 was even tighter than today yet what makes rugby different is the physicality and they enjoyment fans can get from watching players put their bodies on the line.
It's a results business and the same people would be in here whinging if we had lost playing like Australia.

Yeah but without donning the faux purist cap, positive offensive play is what makes great matches.

When I think of the greatest matches of modern times I think of Abs vs Oz 2000,2001...Ireland vs France 2009...SA vs Lions second test..Munster vs Wasps 2004...Toulouse vs Leinster 2006 all loaded with great attacking play.

I accept some matches can have very few tries or scores and still be entertaining but those matches would have examples of great attacking play.Could you name me some great matches that don't?

*Note this is no comment on today's game, just a point about the purist argument.

shuffol

Isn't it great how we did and we were missing 4 backrows by halftime. Murphy did what he was picked for, head in every ruck.

5 if you want to include ferris.

Bridge93

England

theboy1 wrote: »

Yeah but without donning the faux purist cap, positive offensive play is what makes great matches.

When I think of the greatest matches of modern times I think of Abs vs Oz 2000,2001...Ireland vs France 2009...SA vs Lions second test..Munster vs Wasps 2004...Toulouse vs Leinster 2006 all loaded with great attacking play.

I accept some matches can have very few tries or scores and still be entertaining but those matches would have examples of great attacking play.Could you name me some great matches that don't?

*Note this is no comment on today's game, just a point about the purist argument.

I would agree with that but sadly this is becoming rarer in the modern game. If people are holding out for that and want to win tournaments it just won't happen. The issue is more with rugby as a sport than Ireland i feel