Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 25/3

Hank Scorpio

Wonder what Dr Fuentes is up to these days

Donnielighto

Pro. F wrote: »

Your first sentence sounds like you agree with my valuation. I thought it was a fairly uncontroversial stance I'd taken on the subject myself. I still don't get how it has met with so much disagreement.

Nobody knows exactly what deals are available until they actually go and bid on each player, so yes I am talking from my general understanding of the market. But I'm not saying that we need to pluck somebody from obscurity to get better value, if that's what you're getting at. There are enough good players playing in the top seven leagues in Europe to make me think that £25m for Depay is not some special bargain.

Now, maybe LVG needs some very particular type of player to fit his system and Depay is one of the very few who meet those requirements. Cool. We're probably going to end up overpaying a bit then.

You didnt ssay what you valued him at unless I missed it beforehand. You wree so vehement that 25 was good value that he was worth much less.

Who in that bracket pricewise would you go for?

Regarding the amount of players that fit the system I'm not saying they're very rare, just that there are mandatory traits for specific positions and if you dont adjust thats that.

Giggsy11

Not sure why there is so much discussion on transfer fee. There is no set fee, it all depends on how loaded selling team is and how important the said player is to the team.

That's the reason Southampton can sell players for huge fee and Dutch clubs sell for reasonable price.

Also good that Depay is from Dutch club and not from Portuguese.

jayo26

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Not sure why there is so much discussion on transfer fee. There is no set fee, it all depends on how loaded selling team is and how important the said player is to the team.

That's the reason Southampton can sell players for huge fee and Dutch clubs sell for reasonable price.

Also good that Depay is from Dutch club and not from Portuguese.

True and he be even worse if he was with an English club

keane2097

That "pro soccer players know more than you" was a fairly weird and laughable tangent.

Hotblack Desiato

MagicMarker wrote: »

Wasn't this one of the first things LVG insisted on when he took over?

Yeah but took until now to get plans drawn up and get planning permission.

/apologies for dragging the thread off topic with Utd talk :pac:

bangkok

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/premier-league/fear-of-city-switch-forced-united-into-wayne-rooney-megadeal-31149634.html

must have been close, imagine rooney at city :eek:

Mitch Connor

bangkok wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/premier-league/fear-of-city-switch-forced-united-into-wayne-rooney-megadeal-31149634.html

must have been close, imagine rooney at city :eek:

sure what are you talking about? It has been said quite authoritatively on these Man United Super Threads that the "interest" from City was purely made up by the press and Rooney would never have signed for them. Everyone knows the press make up absolutely everything they write, not a spec of truth in it ever. Sure what would these so call 'journalists' know about football? they are only paid for clicks, and writing about football has to be the easiest job on earth.

Rooney to City was NEVER going to happen, made up paper lies. D'UH!

Cantona's Collars

While I'm on a roll,match thread here: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=95120796#post95120796

I reckon Jose will have the bus prepped and ready to park up,my feeling is that he'll be delighted with a draw against us.

MagicIRL

Of course he will. Chelsea just have to not lose, United need to keep wining to push up the table.

Mitch Connor

i'd be quite happy with a draw this weekend. 13 points from Spurs, Liverpool, Villa, City and Chelsea would be an amazing return.

Maximus Alexander

Mitch Connor wrote: »

i'd be quite happy with a draw this weekend. 13 points from Spurs, Liverpool, Villa, City and Chelsea would be an amazing return.

I won't cry over a draw, but I would absolutely love to beat them and see some of that smugness wiped of Jose's face. Plus, I'd love to see what madness LVG would come out with in the post match interview. Would he visit Wing's again?

20 Times 20 Times

I wonder how he sets the team up ? Will he go the Bridge looking for the draw or will he go for the win ? Surely confidence is at a high in the dressing room ad we should be going for the win ?

irishfeen

Mitch Connor wrote: »

i'd be quite happy with a draw this weekend. 13 points from Spurs, Liverpool, Villa, City and Chelsea would be an amazing return.

15 would be beautiful!

Mitch Connor

irishfeen wrote: »

15 would be beautiful!

True - and I hope we do win - I'm simply saying a draw would be more than acceptable.

bangkok

Mitch Connor wrote: »

sure what are you talking about? It has been said quite authoritatively on these Man United Super Threads that the "interest" from City was purely made up by the press and Rooney would never have signed for them. Everyone knows the press make up absolutely everything they write, not a spec of truth in it ever. Sure what would these so call 'journalists' know about football? they are only paid for clicks, and writing about football has to be the easiest job on earth.

Rooney to City was NEVER going to happen, made up paper lies. D'UH!

presume that is sarcasm?

Delboy5

20 Times 20 Times wrote: »

I wonder how he sets the team up ? Will he go the Bridge looking for the draw or will he go for the win ? Surely confidence is at a high in the dressing room ad we should be going for the win ?

Carrick out will affect things....

Nemanrio

Delboy5 wrote: »

Carrick out will affect things....

No doubt, I'd imagine he 'll play Rojo. Not sure if he would throw Shaw into the thick of things.

Mitch Connor

Delboy5 wrote: »

Carrick out will affect things....

Is he def out? was said he only went off with a stiff calf, so not a debilitating injury. Was some talk earlier in the week that he should make it but seen no proper updates.

MagicIRL

Assuming Carrick is out...

De Gea
Valencia - Smalling - Jones - Rojo
Blind - Herrera
Mata - Fellaini - Young
Rooney

If he's not, same team as last week.

Delboy5

Nemanrio wrote: »

No doubt, I'd imagine he 'll play Rojo. Not sure if he would throw Shaw into the thick of things.

Seeing strong rumours that hes defo out for one match, Rojo not fit to start so Shaw will be left back....

Cantona's Collars

Isn't it great going into weekends actually looking forward to games compared to the feelings of dread we had last season.We now actually have a functioning midfield and with Blind there,we don't have to panic about not having Carrick and depending on the likes of Fletcher and Cleverley.

Nemanrio

http://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/paul-scholes-angel-di-marias-red-card-against-arsenal-was-the-turning-point-for-manchester-united-10182575.html

Lithium93_

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/fosu-mensah-making-waves-manchester-united-9054854

Mitch Connor

MagicIRL wrote: »

Assuming Carrick is out...

De Gea
Valencia - Smalling - Jones - Rojo
Blind - Herrera
Mata - Fellaini - Young
Rooney

If he's not, same team as last week.

Its LVG, swap Rooney with Blind and play RVP up top.:pac:

Mitch Connor

Lithium93_ wrote: »

http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/fosu-mensah-making-waves-manchester-united-9054854

himself and Tuanzebe are very highly rated by the club.

TheDoc

Pro. F wrote: »

Your first sentence sounds like you agree with my valuation. I thought it was a fairly uncontroversial stance I'd taken on the subject myself. I still don't get how it has met with so much disagreement.

Nobody knows exactly what deals are available until they actually go and bid on each player, so yes I am talking from my general understanding of the market. But I'm not saying that we need to pluck somebody from obscurity to get better value, if that's what you're getting at. There are enough good players playing in the top seven leagues in Europe to make me think that £25m for Depay is not some special bargain.

Now, maybe LVG needs some very particular type of player to fit his system and Depay is one of the very few who meet those requirements. Cool. We're probably going to end up overpaying a bit then.

Clearly it's being lost in translation. But I'll try again.

Your stance is that your representation of "value" is based on your thoughts of potential, current ability and the other stuff you mentioned.

My stance is that, from the wealth of history we have, we simply know that is not how things work with this particular type of transfer "Highly rated sought after young player".

I'm not calling you out as a lunatic, I genuinely get where you are coming from. My take on it though, in the specific example of Depay at 25m(which is still speculation by the way) represents a brilliant deal, in the context of this type of transfer.

I'm not disagreeing with the evaluations you are making, I'm disagreeing with the totalitarian tone your taking with how you are putting fees on players, as if anything higher is bad business.

In the case of Hummels. you've outlined I believe 25m presents meh value, 20m would be the height of his value in your opinion. That's fine. But when it comes to an actual transfer, in the real world, Dortmund will roll out loads of stuff to justify their asking price, not forgetting the likes of Thiago Silva, David Luiz and other CB's transfers in recent seasons which were vastly higher in fees.

I'm not disagreeing with how you are making your evaluations, I'm disagreeing with how authoritative you are being making them, indicating things like bad business or "represents meh value". I get the feeling if you were in Woodwards shoes, you wouldn't be able to seal any type of deal.

Also you calling me out now twice about being able to put a decent figure on a potential transfer( havn't gone back to check, but feel I was relatively spot on last summer) is baffling. It doesn't take a genius to put a rough figure on what a transfer will be. Or am I some form of wizard?

Depay 23m-25m
Hummels 30m-33m
Clyne 8m-12m

There are three transfers that are hotly linked, and what I'd expect them to go through for. We can save the post and come back to it after the transfer window. Not in anyway shape or form a gloating measure, but to show that it's not outrageously difficult to put a accurate value onto a transfer. I don't see why you are taking such exception to it.

As matter of interest, and maybe you need to pretend you are an Arsenal fan, what evaluation would you have put on Welbeck, before the transfer happened?

Cantona's Collars

Just an aside,watching the build up on SSN, Iwan Roberts is gone full hipster:eek:

Cookiemunster

MagicIRL wrote: »

Assuming Carrick is out...

De Gea
Valencia - Smalling - Jones - Rojo
Blind - Herrera
Mata - Fellaini - Young
Rooney

If he's not, same team as last week.

If only.......

Manchester United ‏@ManUtd 5m5 minutes ago Louis van Gaal tells #MUTV that Carrick, Rojo, Jones & Blind will miss Saturday's game at Chelsea. Evans still suspended. Shaw available.

Delboy5

Cookiemunster wrote: »

If only.......

Manchester United ‏@ManUtd 5m5 minutes ago Louis van Gaal tells #MUTV that Carrick, Rojo, Jones & Blind will miss Saturday's game at Chelsea. Evans still suspended. Shaw available.

****e!!!

homerjay2005

ah b*llix....who is going to be center half now, Mcnair???

jaysus, big losses to the team, this changes everything now

MagicMarker

****.

ElChe32

Falcao to start up top and score a hattrick.

You heard it here first lads.

Delboy5

Rooney back to midfield maybe?

killwill

Cookiemunster wrote: »

If only.......

Manchester United ‏@ManUtd 5m5 minutes ago Louis van Gaal tells #MUTV that Carrick, Rojo, Jones & Blind will miss Saturday's game at Chelsea. Evans still suspended. Shaw available.

Ah does this mean 3-5-2 for the Chelsea game?
Or bring McNair in to partner Smalling?

FutureGuy

Cookiemunster wrote: »

If only.......

Manchester United ‏@ManUtd 5m5 minutes ago Louis van Gaal tells #MUTV that Carrick, Rojo, Jones & Blind will miss Saturday's game at Chelsea. Evans still suspended. Shaw available.

Jaysus. Disaster. Gaping hole at CB. No Rojo, Jones and Evans. Blind and Carrick, who could fill in during an injury crisis, also out.

Lord TSC

Yikes. Good thing Jose is parking the buss then :P

MagicIRL

Things just got interesting!

So, what are we looking at then?

De Gea
Valencia - Smalling - McNair/Blackett - Shaw
Rooney? (Uh oh) - Herrera
Mata - Fellaini - Young
Falcao

And people were arguing we shouldn't sign De Jong on a free. Perfect game for him to save the day! :P

Edit: Here's Rafael doing his best to keep Shaw out of the team, too.
https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfa1/t31.0-8/10575415_10152903355987746_861016370796346721_o.jpg

homerjay2005

killwill wrote: »

Ah does this mean 3-5-2 for the Chelsea game?
Or bring McNair in to partner Smalling?

we dont have 3 center backs unless he goes on a mad one and plays Mcnair and Blackett :eek::eek::eek::eek:

im going with.

---

DDG

---

Valencia--Smalling

---

Mcnair

---

Shaw

---

Herrera

---

Rooney

---

Mata

---

Young

---

Fellaini

---

---

Falcao/RVP

---

ElChe32

I think he could start Young ahead of Shaw and put Di Maria left mid.

TheDoc

Can I put on my tinfoil hat and think Van Gaal has leaked bogey information to trick Mourinho into going for the win rather then the draw/counter attack?

That's a massive set of injuries for this game.

Lithium93_

From United's Twitter page

Louis van Gaal reveals injuries elsewhere may require Wayne Rooney to play as a holding midfielder at Stamford Bridge. #mufc

Mitch Connor

FutureGuy wrote: »

Jaysus. Disaster. Gaping hole at CB. No Rojo, Jones and Evans. Blind and Carrick, who could fill in during an injury crisis, also out.

Ok, so a draw would be an AMAZING result.

---

De Gea
Valencia--Smalling-McNair(?)-Shaw

---

Rooney-Herrera-Fellaini
Mata

---

RVP

---

Young

Lindegard, Rafael, Blacket Thorpe, Di Maria, Januzaj, Falcao?

Another option would be to drop Mata for Rafael and play Valencia on the wing, making it a bit mroe defensive overall.

I certainly think Rooney will be played in midfield.

Lord TSC

God knows what happens now.

Sure since everyone else is going nuts....why not move Val into CB and play Raf? :pac:

MagicIRL

Be graaaaaaaaaaand lads! 1-1. We're going to Europe!

killwill

homerjay2005 wrote: »

we dont have 3 center backs unless he goes on a mad one and plays Mcnair and Blackett :eek::eek::eek::eek:

im going with.

---

DDG

---

Valencia--Smalling

---

Mcnair

---

Shaw

---

Herrera

---

Rooney

---

Mata

---

Young

---

Fellaini

---

---

Falcao/RVP

---

Would it not make sense to drop Fellaini deeper and play Rooney in the hole?

sky88

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Ok, so a draw would be an AMAZING result.

---

De Gea
Valencia--Smalling-McNair(?)-Shaw

---

Rooney-Herrera-Fellaini
Mata

---

RVP

---

Young

Lindegard, Rafael, Blacket Thorpe, Di Maria, Januzaj, Falcao?

Another option would be to drop Mata for Rafael and play Valencia on the wing, making it a bit mroe defensive overall.

I certainly think Rooney will be played in midfield.

its going to be rooney cm as i cant think of another way of working the team so falcao or rvp up top disaster with carrick and blind being out

bangkok

I know van gaal doesn't do much bull****, but anyone else think all those players will be available?

normally there is pictures of the players training during the week and there is none this week?

also there didn't seem to be a bother on Blind during the game after that tackle from Kompany...

van gaal playing mourinho at his own tricks?

ha, just as I post that training pictures are released!! we are ****ed

Lord TSC

sky88 wrote: »

its going to be rooney cm as i cant think of another way of working the team so falcao or rvp up top disaster with carrick and blind being out

Could got with a 4-4-2?

Val - Smalling - McNair/Blackett - Shaw
Mata - Herrera - Fellaini - Young
Rooney - RVP/Falcao

Cantona's Collars

killwill wrote: »

Would it not make sense to drop Fellaini deeper and play Rooney in the hole?

Enough of your sense during this bout of panic.