Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 25/3

jayo26

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

It's hilarious. Gerrard costs his team with a red card and all of the British journo's - especially ones with scouse sympathies - go on the defensive. The Mirror which panders to Liverpool because it's rival the Sun isn't sold up there - gave Gerrard a 4 in the ratings (to give that some context - De Gea got a 5) and had the headline "I apologise to the fans" despite him not being quoted as saying that in the article at all but merely danced around the word 'sorry'.

You learn to filter out a lot of the nonsense when you know what papers or writers to ignore the opinion of.

Ahh yhh I mostly ignore them but its one problem with thing like twitter and all now some gobsh*t decides just because he has a load of brainless followers that agree with everything he says decides he is now a journalist and he gets a platform to talk bullshi*t from its too easy now with sites like offside ect.

jayo26

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

It did happen ,and it was some of the best football seen from a Utd side in a long long time.

After being battered by Barcelona in the Champions league final that previous May ,Fergie obviously decided to play a more fluid short passing based game like Barcelona.

It was going very well until injuries broke the pairing up and the quality of football regressed.
Then in November ,Utd lost 6-1 to Man City and Fergie in a knee jerk reaction completely abandoned the more open attacking style of play he had embraced and went back to the more cautious defensive style with Carrick in a deep holding role.

Utd went on a very good defensive run after that loss and whilst it was effective it wasnt very pretty.

I do agree with you there I remember the start of that season when clev came on as a sub in the charity shield and the next few games after that we looked soo good but then he got injured but that was only a short period of time clev never built on That or never came remotely close to playing like that again and he got plenty of chances after that.

Mars Bar

Pro. F wrote: »

Yes to both points in my post.

Central midfielders tend to not play the final pass before a goal nearly as much as strikers, 10s and wingers do. There have been loads of examples of CMs having great seasons in terms of passing without a lot of assists to show for it.

Carrick and Blind both have unreliable first touches so they struggle to receive and turn on the ball in tight spots. That's why they do most of their work sitting deeper where there's space for them to pick their passes. Carrick is a good passer when he has that space.

Cleverley has a much better first touch than those two lads. That's why he is able to receive the ball and turn on it further up the pitch, where things are more crowded. He is also an accurate passer.

Now let me ask you a question, do you honestly believe that Carrick and Blind have the first touch required to receive a pass when tightly marked, turn on it and pass it on?

Carrick and Blind have adequate first touch. I don't think they'll ever be in the category of taking a player out of the game with a touch with their back to the opponents goal. They are playing from deeper and they do a very good job of distributing and recycling the ball as well as chipping in with goals and assists. Although Blind seems to have more of this in his locker than Carrick. I can't recall Cleverley receive the ball, turn and bring it further up the pitch apart from his breakthrough pre-season. Already, Blind has offered more in terms of movement with the ball than Cleverley ever did and Carrick has been consistently better than Clev. Clev would pass it off safe and then run ahead to hide behind his opponent giving the impression of him creating space. That space didn't open up because the opposing player wouldn't really have to follow Clev. He's not a dangerous player. His movement isn't going to worry anyone.

I certainly wouldn't consider myself a Clev basher. I thought he was going to be the real deal for us but unfortunately not. At this point, I'd much rather see him sold.

Clev doesn't even play the Carrick/Blind role anyway. He was supposed to be doing what Herrera is doing and he isn't a patch on our Ander.

keane2097

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

It did happen ,and it was some of the best football seen from a Utd side in a long long time.

After being battered by Barcelona in the Champions league final that previous May ,Fergie obviously decided to play a more fluid short passing based game like Barcelona.

It was going very well until injuries broke the pairing up and the quality of football regressed.
Then in November ,Utd lost 6-1 to Man City and Fergie in a knee jerk reaction completely abandoned the more open attacking style of play he had embraced and went back to the more cautious defensive style with Carrick in a deep holding role.

Utd went on a very good defensive run after that loss and whilst it was effective it wasnt very pretty.

That's pretty much exactly how I remember it also.

MisterAnarchy

jayo26 wrote: »

I do agree with you there I remember the start of that season when clev came on as a sub in the charity shield and the next few games after that we looked soo good but then he got injured but that was only a short period of time clev never built on That or never came remotely close to playing like that again and he got plenty of chances after that.

True,Cleverley had more than enough opportunities,he just didnt take them.
I wont defend him.

That start of the season was a refreshing change in the style of play though.
I'm not saying it was all down to Cleverley and Andersen,it wasnt ,it was primarily due to an obvious change of style by Ferguson and him allowing the players to be more expressive and play

Obviously if you are more open you will have the odd bad day ,like the City match ,which was a flattering result to City ,but I'd like to have seen Ferguson continue with that style of football for a few more months instead of jettisoning it immediately after the City loss.

After that loss Ferguson was dead set on stopping City from winning the league that season ,and reverted to his tried and trusted style .
It brought short term dividends but it may have caused long term issues ,ones which we saw in the last 2 seasons.

MythicalMadMan

bucketybuck wrote: »

His popularity pendulum has swung too far the other way though, he is doing grand in certain ways but still offers pretty much zero attacking threat. 1 goal and 1 assist this season? From 18 PL games. Thats not enough.

How many of them games where at lb and lwb? he has only played 3 games well 2 n half in current lwf role. How many chances has he created, which i think is a better stat than assists?

Pro. F

Mars Bar wrote: »

Carrick and Blind have adequate first touch. I don't think they'll ever be in the category of taking a player out of the game with a touch with their back to the opponents goal. They are playing from deeper and they do a very good job of distributing and recycling the ball as well as chipping in with goals and assists. Although Blind seems to have more of this in his locker than Carrick. I can't recall Cleverley receive the ball, turn and bring it further up the pitch apart from his breakthrough pre-season. Already, Blind has offered more in terms of movement with the ball than Cleverley ever did and Carrick has been consistently better than Clev. Clev would pass it off safe and then run ahead to hide behind his opponent giving the impression of him creating space. That space didn't open up because the opposing player wouldn't really have to follow Clev. He's not a dangerous player. His movement isn't going to worry anyone.

I certainly wouldn't consider myself a Clev basher. I thought he was going to be the real deal for us but unfortunately not. At this point, I'd much rather see him sold.

Clev doesn't even play the Carrick/Blind role anyway. He was supposed to be doing what Herrera is doing and he isn't a patch on our Ander.

I know Cleverley doesn't play the Carrick/Blind role. I said that he would be better as back-up in the Herrera role (ie further up the pitch where there's less space) than Carrick and Blind who aren't capable of playing that role.

I don't agree with the claim that Cleverley was hiding from the ball as you describe it. From what I saw he was getting on the ball a lot at the busy end of the midfield and linking up with his team mates. Often he received and played more passes in the opposition half than any other player on the pitch. His problem was a lack of incisiveness (ie playing riskier passes), a problem which was shared by the whole team, naturally followed from the managers instructions and which was exacerbated by the abuse he got from the fans.

Blind is a lesser version of Carrick imo. Similar strengths and weaknesses but without the range of passing. I don't recall him playing in the more advanced CM role and I've been unimpressed with his ability to receive and pass in tight spots.

Liam O

MythicalMadMan wrote: »

How many of them games where at lb and lwb? he has only played 3 games well 2 n half in current lwf role. How many chances has he created, which i think is a better stat than assists?

He got into plenty of crossing positions in the lwb role which was one of the most attacking positions in the formation. It's like he crosses with his eyes closed, been the same since he first got here, people thought he was great when he first came even though Nani outperformed him constantly.

Didn't take advantage of a very advantageous position at all on Sunday.

UnitedIrishman

Pro. F wrote: »

Blind is a lesser version of Carrick imo. Similar strengths and weaknesses but without the range of passing. I don't recall him playing in the more advanced CM role and I've been unimpressed with his ability to receive and pass in tight spots.

Carrick's ability to receive a ball in tight areas is one of the most underrated aspects of his game over the last few year years. He used to struggle a lot in his first few seasons when he was pressurized by sides and he'd struggle to retain possession when confronted by two or three opposition players. He's a lot more confident now at it and you only have to look at the run of form we've been in when he's started in that deep lying playmaker position this season.

TheDoc

Pro. F wrote: »

Oh shít sorry! I knew I shouldn't have trusted my memory.

You know if you told us you have been mixing up Britton with Pirlo, I think a lot of fears would be put at ease

MythicalMadMan

Liam O wrote: »

He got into plenty of crossing positions in the lwb role which was one of the most attacking positions in the formation. It's like he crosses with his eyes closed, been the same since he first got here, people thought he was great when he first came even though Nani outperformed him constantly.

Didn't take advantage of a very advantageous position at all on Sunday.

Do u want to give me them numbers so? Not sure what plenty is? Chances created would be good too since u only replied to half my post

Pro. F

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

Carrick's ability to receive a ball in tight areas is one of the most underrated aspects of his game over the last few year years. He used to struggle a lot in his first few seasons when he was pressurized by sides and he'd struggle to retain possession when confronted by two or three opposition players. He's a lot more confident now at it and you only have to look at the run of form we've been in when he's started in that deep lying playmaker position this season.

The way I see it PL teams don't tend to press that high up the pitch and so there's more space provided to players sitting deep in midfield. Spurs and Pool are two teams who try to press up more, but they give the ball away so cheaply they end up not having the energy to press consistently.

But I do agree that he has been important to the recent up turn in form. I think that Carrick is a much better player than Blind.

Vic Vinegar

I see Squirtle is contesting the FA charge. Hope they stick another on for good luck.

Your Airbag

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

It did happen ,and it was some of the best football seen from a Utd side in a long long time.

After being battered by Barcelona in the Champions league final that previous May ,Fergie obviously decided to play a more fluid short passing based game like Barcelona.

It was going very well until injuries broke the pairing up and the quality of football regressed.
Then in November ,Utd lost 6-1 to Man City and Fergie in a knee jerk reaction completely abandoned the more open attacking style of play he had embraced and went back to the more cautious defensive style with Carrick in a deep holding role.

Utd went on a very good defensive run after that loss and whilst it was effective it wasn't very pretty.

Fergie may have decided to do that? What evidence do have for this? A few nice exchanges in MF doesn't equal changing to a Barca style of play especially when the opposition allows time and space to do so. I remember a lot of reactionary stuff in the press being written about our need or perceived change after the final defeat but it was nonsense, the reality ws Fergie carried on as he always did.

UTD never played a possession/pressing game like Barca that season and in those games.

UnitedIrishman

Pro. F wrote: »

The way I see it PL teams don't tend to press that high up the pitch and so there's more space provided to players sitting deep in midfield. Spurs and Pool are two teams who try to press up more, but they give the ball away so cheaply they end up not having the energy to press consistently.

But I do agree that he has been important to the recent up turn in form. I think that Carrick is a much better player than Blind.

Yeah that's true. It only occurs a few times a game really depending on the opposition but he deals with it well. It's something he really struggled with in his first few seasons though - teams knew that if they pushed up on him or sat a player close to him that he'd cough up possession and thus I think he himself regressed a bit to shying away from it.

TheDoc

Vic Vinegar wrote: »

I see Squirtle is contesting the FA charge. Hope they stick another on for good luck.

Is there an immediate ruling for when an appeal fails you get another game ban(so to mitigate people appealing everything) or am I just imagining that?

greendom

TheDoc wrote: »

Is there an immediate ruling for when an appeal fails you get another game ban(so to mitigate people appealing everything) or am I just imagining that?

I think they look at how plausible the appeal was. If they feel that time is being wasted then they could add on an additional match, but not if they believe that the appeal had some worth, even if eventually rejected

UnitedIrishman

Being linked in Italy with Stefan De Vrij for €25m from Lazio.

No doubt it's probably just a case of another Dutchman being linked with United.

Vic Vinegar

TheDoc wrote: »

Is there an immediate ruling for when an appeal fails you get another game ban(so to mitigate people appealing everything) or am I just imagining that?

Yeah, some frivolous appeal rule. I remember Rio getting stung for an extra game suspension a few years ago.

Vic Vinegar

Vic Vinegar wrote: »

Yeah, some frivolous appeal rule. I remember Rio getting stung for an extra game suspension a few years ago.

Skrtal deserves another match ban for attempting to defend stamping

Shanotheslayer

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

Have you got a link to the shortlisted players?

As promised

http://www.sportsmole.co.uk/football/man-utd/news/kane-hazard-among-pfa-fans-potm-nominees_213031.html

MisterAnarchy

Your Airbag wrote: »

Fergie may have decided to do that? What evidence do have for this?

Ferguson spoke about it himself at the time,saying he wanted the team to play more like Barcelona.

UTD never played a possession/pressing game like Barca that season and in those games.

I suggest you go back and watch those early season matches and you will see that the change in style was startling.

adox

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Skrtal deserves another match ban for attempting to defend stamping

Will most likely get an extra game for contesting the charge but he's obviuosly not defending stamping(which you probably know).

adox

adox wrote: »

Will most likely get an extra game for contesting the charge but he's obviuosly not defending stamping(which you probably know).

What I really mean how on earth could he oppose the ban. He stamped and there's no denying it. Unless his counter argument is the De Gea assaulted him in the build up :rolleyes:

I expect a 4 match ban now if the FA have any sense

QuantumP

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

Ferguson spoke about it himself at the time,saying he wanted the team to play more like Barcelona.



I suggest you go back and watch those early season matches and you will see that the change in style was startling.

There's also evidence in how he began to freeze out Berbatov that season, because he "was too slow" for the new, quicker style of play.

Vic Vinegar

The faces on Rojo & Di Maria!

Hococop

Vic Vinegar wrote: »

The faces on Rojo & Di Maria!

Di Maria looks disgusted while rojo's face screams I will end you for hurting Herrera

Whatsisname

Hococop wrote: »

Di Maria looks disgusted while rojo's face screams I will end you for hurting Herrera

While Falcao is still looking to see who got sent off



:pac:

Mars Bar

Vic Vinegar wrote: »

The faces on Rojo & Di Maria!

Di Maria looks like the Chloe meme

Will I Amnt

I'd say they were waiting for him to pass by and then burst out laughing.

MagicIRL

The thrashing of Liverpool has made this thread too lovey-dovey. We need Nani back or something.

brinty

MagicIRL wrote: »

The thrashing of Liverpool has made this thread too lovey-dovey. We need Nani back or something.

Yea you're right Magic we need some of this.....
Welbz is 5h1t3
Anderson is phat
Mike Phelan's shorts are too tight
Cleverly is a

IvySlayer

brinty wrote: »

Yea you're right Magic we need some of this.....
Welbz is 5h1t3
Anderson is phat
Mike Phelan's shorts are too tight
Cleverly is a

Evra is lazy :mad:

Trigger

brinty wrote: »

Yea you're right Magic we need some of this.....
Welbz is 5h1t3
Anderson is phat
Mike Phelan's shorts are too tight
Cleverly is a

Berbatov was useless

MagicIRL

MagicIRL wrote: »

The thrashing of Liverpool has made this thread too lovey-dovey. We need Nani back or something.

Not really we had a full blown debate about TC23 again

MagicIRL

astradave wrote: »

Berbatov was useless

There's a line, buddy, and you've crossed it.

LOOK AT HIM.

Trigger

MagicIRL wrote: »

There's a line, buddy, and you've crossed it.

LOOK AT HIM.

One of my Favourite goals in recent times was as a result of this beauty, i don't think there was many players that could make the game look so easy

Liam McPoyle

Juvenile and crude, but I love it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_6j_YNmcAYI

v3ttel

Vic Vinegar wrote: »

The faces on Rojo & Di Maria!

Rojo's face is a glorious mix of:

"That's right, keep walking"
"I'm going to end you"
and "U MAD BRO?"

bucketybuck

Just seen that Skrytles reason for contesting the charge is that his stamp on De Gea wasn't intentional, he claims the contact was accidental.

Lying toerag. Hope the FA does the right thing and gives him an extra ban for taking the piss.

Kerrigooney

MagicIRL wrote: »

The thrashing of Liverpool has made this thread too lovey-dovey. We need Nani back or something.

2-1 is a thrashing now?

O..........k.

Kerrigooney

Kerrigooney wrote: »

2-1 is a thrashing now?

O..........k.

Should have been more, thrashing for sure

Kerrigooney

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Should have been more, thrashing for sure

Heh heh. You're a funny one.

Run Forrest,run.

Kerrigooney

Kerrigooney wrote: »

Heh heh. You're a funny one.

Run Forrest,run.

I'll be doing more running than stampy g for the next couple of weeks

mewe

Kerrigooney wrote: »

2-1 is a thrashing now?

O..........k.

Maybe he was talking aggregate score and meant 5-1

Kerrigooney

mewe wrote: »

Maybe he was talking aggregate score and meant 5-1

He wasn't.

mewe

Vic Vinegar wrote: »

The faces on Rojo & Di Maria!

It's uncanny!

mewe

Kerrigooney wrote: »

He wasn't.

Yeah and I wasn't takin the piss

Whatsisname

https://twitter.com/UtdReport/status/580500251225796609

https://twitter.com/UtdReport/status/580500707100508162

https://twitter.com/UtdReport/status/580501081865756672

https://twitter.com/UtdReport/status/580501566748250112

Maximus Alexander

Kerrigooney wrote: »

He wasn't.

Thrashing?