Not 100% happy with business partner

Vetoo

Hi folks,
I wanted to get some opinions on this one.

My business partner and I have been in business together for a couple of years. So far the business has been doing well - we're getting plenty of work and we're kept busy all the time. Overall the business is showing plenty of potential and while there have been problems we're gradually ironing them out.

The business is a new concept and my belief is that the main reason for our success is its uniqueness, rather than our particular ability/abilities - in essence once we were established we had to do very little to attract sales and get the work in, which is brilliant for a new business, but the reason I'm mentioning this is to establish the fact that we're not operating a more traditional business where our business acumen is the sole reason for our success.

Anyway, as per the title, I'm not 100% happy with my business partner. The one thing going for him is he is a hard worker, and he certainly puts in the hours. Note I said hard worker, not smart worker. To give a simplistic example, he would be too transfixed in resolving 10 identical problems one by one rather than work on a solution that will resolve all 10 in half the time.

Almost every element of the business is from my ideas and my work to realise same. The basic concept, our offering, our brand/identity, services, pricing models, client relations, networking, dealing with problems, team development, new opportunities etc etc. Essentially, any progression of the business is from my initiative.

My business partner tends to go with my lead, but it's frustrating to feel I'm trying to drag the business in to the future. It always takes a push for him to get behind the next progression, because he's too caught up in the immediate tasks/objectives and doesn't possess what one might call the entrepreneurial drive or vision.

He has also on a couple of occasions behaved highly unprofessionally, but since apologised and made efforts to correct his behaviour, although I don't trust that similar incidents won't reoccur due to his personality.

We have yet to sign our partnership agreement and for the reasons above I am hesitant. However if either of us were to leave, the business could easily fall apart. And doing anything drastic like leaving and setting up on my own, while probably doable, isn't really an option.

I have covered all the bad points but on the plus side he is a very hard worker, puts in the hours and is very dedicated to the business and really believes in it.

I wanted to post here to see what others thought of this kind of situation and might share their thoughts or experiences.

Any input much appreciated.

BabySlam

You should not enter a contract when you are not 100% happy

Lux23

I could be wrong but sounds like your expertise lie in innovation and his in operations. I think that's a good thing. It is a problem that he is not a smart worker so maybe you need to have a meeting to talk about efficiency, tell him he's a hard worker, but that if you took a step and examined issues together that you might be able to sort them out together.

Silverbling

You need to weigh up strenghts's and weakness's from both of you, if your partner had written a post would he say you forge ahead with the next project while he finishes the details on the existing ones?

If that is the case it sounds like a perfect match, two business partners will never think or work in the same way which is a good thing

bucketybuck

Lux23 wrote: »

I could be wrong but sounds like your expertise lie in innovation and his in operations.

Silverbling wrote: »

you forge ahead with the next project while he finishes the details on the existing ones?

If that is the case it sounds like a perfect match, two business partners will never think or work in the same way which is a good thing

But it sounds like he isn't good at operations. Operations is more than just putting in the hours.

If the business continues to grow his tendency to take far longer than is needed to do simple tasks will become even more of a problem. There are loads of hard workers out there, but a guy who can't organise his time and his work properly, or who can't see the bigger picture, thats not an asset for running a company.

racso1975

Lux23 wrote: »

I could be wrong but sounds like your expertise lie in innovation and his in operations. I think that's a good thing. It is a problem that he is not a smart worker so maybe you need to have a meeting to talk about efficiency, tell him he's a hard worker, but that if you took a step and examined issues together that you might be able to sort them out together.

Completely agree with. If you want somebody like you then you will probably end up with bigger probs.

elastico

Join nothing except the rosary.

The worst ship that ever sailed is a partnership.

There is a lot of sense in the above phrases.

antoinolachtnai

I take it that this is a 50-50 arrangement, or is assumed to be?

If you want to end this arrangement, you will ultimately have to buy out your partner.

Can you discuss this issue with your partner?

Not having a written partnership agreement does not necessarily mean you don't have a partnership. It is really very technical. If you have a dispute, and it goes legal, it will be very difficult, and won't necessarily go well for you.

I would get legal advice very soon, whether you plan to continue or to stop this arrangement. Generally speaking, ventures should not be structured as partnerships. You really need legal advice on this.

You also need to have a hard discussion with your colleague about the future of your business.

Duckett

You say he is a hard worker which is great however team working is more of an art then a process. The Chemistry has to be right and team working delivers both in the good and bad times. How much quality time do you spend together discussing the challenges faced by the business and does he share the stress of running the business?

pedroeibar1

Vetoo wrote: »

Hi folks,
My business partner and I have been in business together for a couple of years. So far the business has been doing well .........I'm not 100% happy with my business partner.......Almost every element of the business is from my ideas and my work to realise same. .....Essentially, any progression of the business is from my initiative........[he] doesn't possess what one might call the entrepreneurial drive or vision.........He has also on a couple of occasions behaved highly unprofessionally, but since apologised and made efforts to correct his behaviour, although I don't trust that similar incidents won't reoccur due to his personality........We have yet to sign our partnership agreement ......if either of us were to leave, the business could easily fall apart......... on the plus side he is a very hard worker, puts in the hours and is very dedicated to the business and really believes in it. ......Any input much appreciated.

Read the above summary of your OP again. Now reread it. It comes across as arrogant and totally against any realistic view of what a joint venture operation should be about. From what you have written and its phraseology there are no options, just one solution.
Put your money where your mouth is and buy him out.

PS... Is he happy with you and your performance?

bucketybuck

pedroeibar1 wrote: »

Read the above summary of your OP again. Now reread it. It comes across as arrogant and totally against any realistic view of what a joint venture operation should be about. From what you have written and its phraseology there are no options, just one solution.
Put your money where your mouth is and buy him out.

PS... Is he happy with you and your performance?

:rolleyes:

Its a very realistic position to take, because issues like these really do need to be sorted before the business goes any further. Whats realistic is the OP addressing the issue before any contracts are signed, whats realistic is a joint venture being between equal parties.

Whats unrealistic is carrying a guy when you knew from that start that his input was limited to taking far too long to do simple tasks. If its arrogance to identify and address the issue then perhaps arrogance is what is needed in business.

delahuntv

Have a weekly meeting outlining what each peson is planng to do for the week and where the otehr person can hep.

If very busy a daily meeting can be done.

Usually once everyone knows what is expected of them and know what is ahead of them, it is quite easy to operate as a team.

pedroeibar1

bucketybuck wrote: »

:rolleyes:

Its a very realistic position to take, because issues like these really do need to be sorted before the business goes any further. Whats realistic is the OP addressing the issue before any contracts are signed, whats realistic is a joint venture being between equal parties.

Whats unrealistic is carrying a guy when you knew from that start that his input was limited to taking far too long to do simple tasks. If its arrogance to identify and address the issue then perhaps arrogance is what is needed in business.

You can raise your eyes to heaven all you like, that does not make a subsequent contribution correct..

All good relationships, including business ones, are built on respect and trust. Both of those clearly are missing when reading what the OP wrote. OP has no confidence in the co-worker, does not respect their abilities, foresight or management skills. OP said s/he does not trust the colleague. The opening post reads like a list of supercilious comments.

Contrary to what you say, arrogance is not what it takes to succeed because that attribute has no place in business; what is needed is a certain amount of ego, but too much of that crosses the border into arrogance and that inevitably leads to failure.

The OP needs to examine his/her own attributes – at the moment s/he is doing “the great I am” and at the same time having a whine about a colleague who is, by own admission, is a very hard worker.

A joint venture could work, but it would take huge change in the outlook of the OP to make it a successful one. I rarely have seen such a change happening and usually it can do so only with outside intervention. If the OP believes s/he is carrying the business then s/he should buy it out.

Situation sounds like a mess.

In business for years already but no agreement? Very naive and careless. Business partner has put a lot of hard work in already - means very hard to force out, or change mentality.

Sounds like you either need to A. Leave the business to him, B. Buy him out, or C. Sign the partnership agreement and deal with the things you don't like about your partner and soldier on.

Not exactly ideal to be going into business with someone you have almost zero respect for. Thats why when you start a partnership you have a solid contract that provides for a variety of different scenarios should things go wrong, or respect for each other disappear. You only find these things out after the honeymoon period, so you need to prepare properly.

dbran

Hi OP

You say that neither of you could be a success on their own and if either was to leave, the business could fall apart. It may be all your ideas but is it the case that he is good at doing the grunt work, something that you are not particularly suited to. You also mentioned that he has acted unprofessionally in the past. Is this towards you or towards customers?

You also say that he is slow to embrace new ideas but usually goes with them in the end. Is this because he needs to think things through properly before rushing in? In this case is it really such an issue. After all, if it goes wrong he will also have take the hit as well as you. Having someone who is not just a yes man could prove very valuable in the long run.

It sounds like you have a great business and that you both are actually well suited. However what is lacking is communication between you both as to what is expected of each other and where the business goes from here.

Put in place a formal structure of regular meetings with agendas etc setting out what needs to be done short term, problems on certain jobs etc as well as long term goals and progress of the business. All successful partnerships are run this way and it is very seldom that one partner goes ahead and does their own thing unless it is agreed.

If there is a bit of friction between you then maybe get a independent third party to sit in for the initial few meetings eg your accountant, solicitor, other trusted party or mediator etc.

You have a golden goose, dont kill it.

Best of luck

dbran

pedroeibar1

dbran wrote: »

Hi OP

You say.....etc
............ maybe get a independent third party to sit in for the initial few meetings eg your accountant, solicitor, other trusted party or mediator etc.

You have a golden goose, dont kill it.

Best of luck

dbran

+1

The ol third party mediation is really a last resort in my opinion. Much better to sit down face to face and work out your differences even if you dislike each other. Once the arbitrator comes in to decide stuff, a line as been crossed.

kidneyfan

OP is there a reason that you are using the word partnership? Is this a company with two principals or something else?

BnB

pedroeibar1 wrote: »

You can raise your eyes to heaven all you like, that does not make a subsequent contribution correct..

All good relationships, including business ones, are built on respect and trust. Both of those clearly are missing when reading what the OP wrote. OP has no confidence in the co-worker, does not respect their abilities, foresight or management skills. OP said s/he does not trust the colleague. The opening post reads like a list of supercilious comments.

Contrary to what you say, arrogance is not what it takes to succeed because that attribute has no place in business; what is needed is a certain amount of ego, but too much of that crosses the border into arrogance and that inevitably leads to failure.

The OP needs to examine his/her own attributes – at the moment s/he is doing “the great I am” and at the same time having a whine about a colleague who is, by own admission, is a very hard worker.

A joint venture could work, but it would take huge change in the outlook of the OP to make it a successful one. I rarely have seen such a change happening and usually it can do so only with outside intervention. If the OP believes s/he is carrying the business then s/he should buy it out.

I agree 200%. The arrogance is just dripping from the OP's post

I am currently in a situation where I feel like I am the OP's business partner.

I have a business partner for the last few years and I think more and more that they feel about me like the OP feels about his partner.

Over the years my partner has made many mistakes and I have always supported him and often helped him get out of the hole. But when the shoe is on the other foot (and I make mistakes), he feels it is appropriate to give out to me, almost like a bold child.

We used to be very good friends but over the last few weeks I have had to seriously question that and wonder if he ever had any respect for me at all.

Anyway, I don't want to ramble on and hijack the OPs thread.

Basically, I think the OP should have a long serious look at himself before he makes too many decisions.

Vetoo

Thanks for the replies everyone, great to get your input.

Just to address the most contentious issue, that being how my post came across as arrogant.

Firstly by putting myself in your shoes I can see how it could come across that way however this wasn't my intention. Again, my biz partner is a hard worker, and is very dedicated. Objectively speaking these are two things that can make up for a lot of faults imo. Speaking of which, I'd be the first to admit (even to him, as I have done) to having plenty of faults myself.

Nonetheless the fact remains that I would be much more the ideas guy, and I have done most of the work to realise those ideas. I would be more proactive in improving/optimising the business, whereas he'd be more active in getting through the work on a day to day basis.

It was good to see the replies saying that this is actually a good combination - and in the same vein my ideal outcome here is that despite the flaws (that we both have), the business continues to grow and improve.

My gripe is the notion that I feel it's all down to me to drag the business in to the future. We have plateaued and getting past this hump is proving difficult, which leads to frustration, especially when I see repetition of the same problematic processes.

Duckett

nobody is perfect and it sounds like you have an arrangement that is delivering results. If your partner has integrity and is ethical then it sounds to me like you need to find a way to delegate some routine aspects of your work to allow you to focus on your key strengths. Whatever you choose to do be careful it does not lead to unintended consequences (he also has options and could start to make life difficult). Talk it out with him ..... sounds like he is sound and has lots of backroom ability while you play the front of house role - both are essential to deliver an excellent customer experience .......take advice, take a holoday and reflect before you act .........

Only consider bringing in a facilitator when all else fails .......

antoinolachtnai

You may be able to patch it up in the short term, but it may be that your partner can't grow to bring the business to the next stage. You have to face up to this and deal with it. However, this may not be the case at all, especially if the business doesn't have significant growth prospects.

pedroeibar1

Deleted User wrote: »

The ol third party mediation is really a last resort in my opinion. Much better to sit down face to face and work out your differences even if you dislike each other. Once the arbitrator comes in to decide stuff, a line as been crossed.

El R, I would infer from the OP that there has been a meeting or two. The reason I suggested an outsider is that a 1 on 1 meeting would not accomplish anything and most likely would have a negative outcome, as the OP says he had "no intention of coming across as arrogant" yet I was not not alone in thinking this.
"Partnership" is not the correct way to go, if they do get together formally it shoud be a ltd co and a properly drawn up shareholder agreement would be a 'must'.

pedronomix

A lot of good comment on here from the usual suspects. I have refrained from posting on this ( Most odd!!) as my view is rather negative. It is very like going into a marriage, if you have doubts about the other, dont do it!! Things will always only get worse not better. If the chemistry etc is not right between you where you both can find your "satisfaction zone" with the other, in my experience it is doomed at some stage. So far you have only lived together, still time to sort it but the child needs to be preserved from rash actions!!

pedroeibar1

pedroeibar1 wrote: »

El R, I would infer from the OP that there has been a meeting or two. The reason I suggested an outsider is that a 1 on 1 meeting would not accomplish anything and most likely would have a negative outcome, as the OP says he had "no intention of coming across as arrogant" yet I was not not alone in thinking this.
"Partnership" is not the correct way to go, if they do get together formally it shoud be a ltd co and a properly drawn up shareholder agreement would be a 'must'.

Yeah agreed on partnerships, its a recipe for a disaster. Has to be a Ltd company.

pedronomix wrote: »

A lot of good comment on here from the usual suspects. I have refrained from posting on this ( Most odd!!) as my view is rather negative. It is very like going into a marriage, if you have doubts about the other, dont do it!! Things will always only get worse not better. If the chemistry etc is not right between you where you both can find your "satisfaction zone" with the other, in my experience it is doomed at some stage. So far you have only lived together, still time to sort it but the child needs to be preserved from rash actions!!

Ive some interesting experience in these kinds of situations with previous partners for real estate projects. I had a landowner partner in Asia for a project and it turned into a nightmare. I started to hate them with every fibre of my being! However, being composed, and mature about the situation I feel even with the worst of people, ways forward and amicable conclusions can be agreed through just manning up and having these meetings you dont want to have.
As long as the end goal is the same, a good and equal profit for both parties, the road can be paved to get there with some compromise, and acceptance of your own faults as well as the partners.

However, there was very much an end date in that instance off in the distance that I was working towards. In a situation where the business will keep going indefinitely it could well need an 'intervention' to make it work

Atomico

Vetoo wrote: »

Nonetheless the fact remains that I would be much more the ideas guy, and I have done most of the work to realise those ideas.

I would be more proactive in improving/optimising the business, whereas he'd be more active in getting through the work on a day to day basis.

It was good to see the replies saying that this is actually a good combination - and in the same vein my ideal outcome here is that despite the flaws (that we both have), the business continues to grow and improve.

My gripe is the notion that I feel it's all down to me to drag the business in to the future. We have plateaued and getting past this hump is proving difficult, which leads to frustration, especially when I see repetition of the same problematic processes.

It's an interesting topic

I think your concerns are legitimate - which I'll come to later..

Not everyone can be an ideas person and I would say most people really aren't. It's why most people are in jobs and only relatively few people are entrepreneurial at all.

Some people are just better suited to or wired to just get through a working day and that's enough for them to think about. So in that sense you could make it work with clearly defined roles and responsibilities.

He could continue to be the workhorse whilst you continue to take on the role of driving the business forward from the point of view of innovating and optimising it from a creative standpoint. This could also mean that you step back a bit more from day-to-day work to focus on strategy and 'creative director-y' stuff.

However, that is imo fine when one person is the founder / visionary / creative person behind the venture, and the other is maybe someone who was hired in early to get the day-to-day work done. I'm really not sure it works when the other person is a joint partner / 50% shareholder in the enterprise.

It could really be a recipe for disaster if you feel you are going to be the one driving everything forward from now until whenever, whilst they are doing the work that an early employee could do - but with 50% of the business. Hence your gripe.

This of course doesn't negate the value of the work the other partner is doing whatsoever. Rather it just frames it within the context of the situation and where the business is right now. If I were a co-founder of a business which I had conceived and brought to life, I would want my fellow co-founder(s) to be just as passionate about the venture not just in what they say but in what they do. Anyone can say they really believe in something, but actions always speak louder.

I think I'd just feel really resentful and that's not going to lend itself to a happy partnership in any shape or form. It has to be right if it's going to have a chance of growing and getting to the next level.

All that said, there could be other ways of looking at this. What about looking towards a third partner (in a general, not legal sense), who would have a similar outlook to you and could complement your approach to the business? That way you wouldn't feel you are doing everything on your own. Of course, that has to work from the point of view of your co-founder too.

In any case, I wouldn't 'sign anything' unless you are 100% happy and confident it's the right thing to do. Continuing with a more informal approach while you figure things out or come up with a solution to suit you both is the only option imo.

Duckett

came across the following article which you may find interesting - message is prepare as you go into the arrangement

https://seraf-investor.com/blog/you-split-i-choose-angel-investing-overview-key-founder-issues?utm_source=Seraf+MAIN+LIST&utm_campaign=eb2d416b6d-RSS_EMAIL_CAMPAIGN&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_be5504a29d-eb2d416b6d-283650225